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Author Topic: 70 WEEKS PROPHECY...  (Read 3819 times)
Bronzesnake
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« on: January 17, 2005, 10:44:17 PM »

 The following bold printed paragraphs were taken from a rapture web site which Paul2 provided a link for.
 Following that I have added some interesting facts...

Seventy 'sevens' are decreed for your people and your holy city to finish transgression, to put an end to sin, to atone for wickedness, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the most holy. (DANIEL 9:24)

Gabriel spoke the 70 weeks prophecy to Daniel. Daniel was praying to God (DANIEL 9:1-19) asking him what is his future plan for Israel because the 70 years of captivity of Israel by Babylon (JEREMIAH 25:11-12) were drawing to an end. God sent Gabriel to reveal his plans for Israel. Daniel 9:24 reveals that the 70 WEEKS were for ISRAEL ONLY. Look at the scripture - SEVENTY SEVENS ARE DECREED FOR YOUR PEOPLE (Daniel's people - Israel) AND YOUR HOLY CITY (Jerusalem). Seventy sevens are 490 years on Israel's prophetic timeline. After this Israel's transgression will be finished, Israel's sin will be put to an end, everlasting righteousness will be brought in, vision and prophecy will be sealed, and the most holy (Millennial Temple) will be anointed. All this will happen after Jesus Christ comes back and the Jews will look on the one "whom they pierced. (ZECHARIAH 12:10)"

Know and understand this: From the issuing of the decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until the Anointed One, the ruler, comes, there will be seven 'sevens,' and sixty-two 'sevens.' It will be rebuilt with streets and a trench, but in times of trouble. (DANIEL 9:25)

The decree to rebuild and restore Jerusalem is none other than the one given to Nehemiah in Nehemiah 2:1-10 by Artaxerxes. Here Nehemiah asks the Persian king if he can go to Jerusalem and rebuild it. Sir Robert Anderson in his book THE COMING PRINCE said, "The Persian edict which restored the autonomy of Judah was issued in the Jewish month of Nisan. It may in fact have been dated the 1st of Nisan, but no other day being named, the prophetic period must be reckoned, according to a practice common with the Jews, from the Jewish New Year's Day. The seventy weeks are therefore to be computed from the 1st of Nisan B.C. 445." Later Sir Robert Anderson computed the date to be March 14, 445 B.C. FROM THE ISSUING OF THE DECREE TO RESTORE AND REBUILD JERUSALEM UNTIL THE ANOINTED ONE, THE RULER, COMES, THERE WILL BE SEVEN 'SEVENS,' AND SIXTY-TWO 'SEVENS.' So exactly 483 prophetic years (7 X 7 = 49 years; 62 X 7 = 434 years; 49 + 434 = 483 years) the Anointed One will come. The Messiah was of course JESUS CHRIST and the only time in his three year ministry that he was publicly proclaimed as Messiah or King was when he rode into Jerusalem on a young donkey (colt or foal of a donkey) riding alongside his mother not knowing that the one that her son is carrying is the KINGS OF KINGS AND LORDS OF LORDS. When Jesus came into Jerusalem and people were putting palms on the floor, it fulfilled Zechariah 9:9 and Daniel 9:25 to the date (April 6, A.D. 32). Later Jesus wept because the Jews didn't recognize the time of the Messiah's visitation (70 weeks prophecy) and because of this Jerusalem was destroyed in A.D. 70 according to Jesus' prophecy in Luke 19:41-44.

After the sixty-two 'sevens,' the Anointed One will be cut off and will have nothing. The people of the ruler that is to come will destroy the city and the sanctuary. The end will come like a flood: War will continue until the end, and desolations have been decreed. (DANIEL 9:26)



490 years after the birth of Abraham the Passover occurred -  490 years after Passover, Solomon's temple was built - 490 years later, the rebuilding of Jerusalem took place - exactly 483 after that, Jesus died on the cross... Where's the missing seven years? the final "week" from Daniel's prophecy is the tribulation period. The prophetic clock stopped when Jesus died on the cross. The clock will not start the final seven year countdown to His second coming until after the rapture takes place.

 Discuss...

 Bronzesnake
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« Reply #1 on: January 17, 2005, 11:32:53 PM »

Whats to discuss, God said it, I believe it. Smiley
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BigD
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« Reply #2 on: January 18, 2005, 08:04:52 AM »

Bronzesnake posted:
"490 years after the birth of Abraham the Passover occurred -  490 years after Passover, Solomon's temple was built - 490 years later, the rebuilding of Jerusalem took place - exactly 483 after that, Jesus died on the cross... Where's the missing seven years? the final "week" from Daniel's prophecy is the tribulation period. The prophetic clock stopped when Jesus died on the cross. The clock will not start the final seven year countdown to His second coming until after the rapture takes place."

BigD responds:
FYI, the prophetic time clock did not stop when Jesus died on the cross.

The prophetic time clock stopped when God set the nation of Israel aside after the stoning of Stephen in Acts 7. God then raised up the Apostle Paul, in Acts 9, to usher in this present dispensation of grace. Then God showed Peter in Acts 10 that the Jews and Gentiles were now on equal footing and that the Jews could no longer consider the Gentiles "unclean". (The Jews are now set aside just as the Gentiles were at the Tower of Bable in Genesis 11. That is what put the Jew and Gentile on equal footing and without distinction. (See Romans 11:7-12).

The 70th week of Daniel (the Tribulation) started at Pentecost as per Acts 2:15-20. Peter is quoting Joel 2:28-32 almost word for word. Joel, in those verses, is speaking of the Tribulation spoken of in Daniel 9.

The Tribulation will resume with the rapture of the Church, the Body of Christ. Christ will return after the Tribulation period had run its course.

God Bless:
Live Well, Laugh Often and Love the Lord!
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Bronzesnake
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« Reply #3 on: January 18, 2005, 11:00:57 AM »

Bronzesnake posted:
"490 years after the birth of Abraham the Passover occurred -  490 years after Passover, Solomon's temple was built - 490 years later, the rebuilding of Jerusalem took place - exactly 483 after that, Jesus died on the cross... Where's the missing seven years? the final "week" from Daniel's prophecy is the tribulation period. The prophetic clock stopped when Jesus died on the cross. The clock will not start the final seven year countdown to His second coming until after the rapture takes place."

BigD responds:
FYI, the prophetic time clock did not stop when Jesus died on the cross.

The prophetic time clock stopped when God set the nation of Israel aside after the stoning of Stephen in Acts 7. God then raised up the Apostle Paul, in Acts 9, to usher in this present dispensation of grace. Then God showed Peter in Acts 10 that the Jews and Gentiles were now on equal footing and that the Jews could no longer consider the Gentiles "unclean". (The Jews are now set aside just as the Gentiles were at the Tower of Bable in Genesis 11. That is what put the Jew and Gentile on equal footing and without distinction. (See Romans 11:7-12).

The 70th week of Daniel (the Tribulation) started at Pentecost as per Acts 2:15-20. Peter is quoting Joel 2:28-32 almost word for word. Joel, in those verses, is speaking of the Tribulation spoken of in Daniel 9.

The Tribulation will resume with the rapture of the Church, the Body of Christ. Christ will return after the Tribulation period had run its course.

God Bless:
Live Well, Laugh Often and Love the Lord!

 That was taken straight from the bible of BigD because God's bible has a completely different, true version.

 
Quote
The Jews are now set aside just as the Gentiles were at the Tower of Bable in Genesis 11. That is what put the Jew and Gentile on equal footing and without distinction.


 Ask yourself this question BigD... What is the difference between a Jew and a gentile? then ask yourself this question...who were the Jews and where were they at the time that the "gentiles" were "set aside" at the tower of Babel?

 
Quote
The 70th week of Daniel (the Tribulation) started at Pentecost as per Acts 2:15-20. Peter is quoting Joel 2:28-32 almost word for word. Joel, in those verses, is speaking of the Tribulation spoken of in Daniel 9.

 So the tribulation isn't seven years as God has told us? according to your "BigD" bible, it's been over 2,000 years.

Quote
The Tribulation will resume with the rapture of the Church, the Body of Christ. Christ will return after the Tribulation period had run its course.

 Oh, wait a minute... if the tribulation started over 2,000 years ago, and now your telling me it will "resume" with the rapture...when did it stop?  Huh Where does God tell us that the tribulation starts then stops?  Huh

You are seriously confused my "young whipper snapper" friend.

Bronzesnake
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Reba
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« Reply #4 on: January 18, 2005, 11:30:16 AM »

Often times when i ask questions in prophecy thread they are just plainly ignored. Being stubbern i will try again. Tongue


In the above time lines which dates are used? the date of completation of  Solomon's temple the begining  the dedication?

How long did it take to rebuild Jerusalem?

Seems the building of Solomon's temple took about 7 years...


 
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« Reply #5 on: January 18, 2005, 12:03:42 PM »

question...if the seventieth week has begun, then when was the signing of the covenant between the antichrist and Israel for a period of one "week". It hasn't happened yet...and following Daniel's timeline. the 69th week ended on the day of Christ's triumphal entry. The prophetic time clock actually stops when the 69 weeks are up. Notice Daniel says NOTHING of the Church during that time...and remember that the OT prophets were in the valley and could not see the church age. When daniel was given his 70 weeks prophecy, he was sure that the 70th week would continue right on track...however, if that's the case, then i ask again where is the Antichrist...we should already be in the Millenial kingdom. YET, from the period of the decree to rebuild the wall and Jerusalem there is only one decree in Scripture that fits the 69 weeks and that is the decree from Artaxerxes to Nehemiah in 444 b.c. In Nehemiah 2:1--8 i believe. that gives 483 years until the 'cutting off' of the messiah, referring to His death. Notice the decree was in the month of Nisan, which coincides with the month of Jesus' death. so 483 years after the decree, based on a 360 year prophetical calender as the prophets used, it brings us to the day of the Triumphal entry into Jerusalem.  Thus ending the 69th week.

Reba, the decree to rebuild the temple and the decree to rebuild Jerusalem, look in Nehemiah 2:1-8 where Nehemiah petitions Artaxerxes. Artaxerxes grants his petition in 444 b.c. i believe...i've read 445 b.c. also, but i'm sticking with 444. From that period based on 360 prophetical years as Daniel always uses. We see that in Daniel that there are 2 princes. Messiah the Prince, and the prince who is to come in verse 26. these are two different people. verse 26 coincides with the destruction of the temple in 70 a.d. HOWEVER that was NOT the beginning of the 70th week. It says the PEOPLE of the prince...not the prince himself. We see in verse 27 that the focus shifts the the prince who is to come...speaking of the antichrist. and he confirms a covenant with many for one week...thus BEGINNING THE 70TH week of daniel. And then breaks the covenant with the abomination of desolation in the middle of the 7 years. Note the parallels with the antichrist. Alot of people say this person was Titus the roman, but It was not, because Titus never signed a treaty with the Nation of Israel. He couldn't have because the Nation of Israel DID NOT EXIST at that time. Thus blowing the 70th week beginning 2000 years ago out of the water. Another proof that this isn't the 70th week is Christ relates the main events of this final week with His Second Coming....and we see that He hasn't come yet. Thus the time frame from the end of the 69th week and the beginning of the 70th week must have a period for the Church.  So thus the 70th week has yet to begin, and the 69thj week has long been over...to give us Gentiles a time to be saved. Hope this has been helpful. God Bless

Joshua
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BigD
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« Reply #6 on: January 18, 2005, 01:03:04 PM »

Bronzesnake:
BigD posted:
FYI, the prophetic time clock did not stop when Jesus died on the cross.

The prophetic time clock stopped when God set the nation of Israel aside after the stoning of Stephen in Acts 7. God then raised up the Apostle Paul, in Acts 9, to usher in this present dispensation of grace. Then God showed Peter in Acts 10 that the Jews and Gentiles were now on equal footing and that the Jews could no longer consider the Gentiles "unclean". (The Jews are now set aside just as the Gentiles were at the Tower of Bable in Genesis 11. That is what put the Jew and Gentile on equal footing and without distinction. (See Romans 11:7-12).

The 70th week of Daniel (the Tribulation) started at Pentecost as per Acts 2:15-20. Peter is quoting Joel 2:28-32 almost word for word. Joel, in those verses, is speaking of the Tribulation spoken of in Daniel 9.

The Tribulation will resume after the rapture of the Church, the Body of Christ. Christ will return after the Tribulation period had run its course.

Bronzesnake responded:
That was taken straight from the bible of BigD because God's bible has a completely different, true version.

BigD replied:
The Bible I use as my primary Bible is the old Scofield KJV. (I have 5 other translations that I also use occasionally,)  Many that study the Bible use the old Scofield. Its the one I grew up with.

According to my Scofield Bible, Daniel 9:20-27 speaks of the 70th week (Tribulation period).

In Joel 2, we have Joel speaking of that period. Verse 31 calls it "the great and terrible day of the Lord" (Tribulation).
28  And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions:
29 And also upon the servants and upon the handmaids in those days will I pour out my spirit.
30 And I will shew wonders in the heavens and in the earth, blood, and fire, and pillars of smoke.
31The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and terrible day of the LORD come.
32 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the LORD shall be delivered: for in mount Zion and in Jerusalem shall be deliverance, as the LORD hath said, and in the remnant whom the LORD shall call.

Luke 24:45 "The opened he (Jesus) their (disciples) their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures."

In Acts 2, at Pentecost, we read in verse 4: "And they were ALL filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance."

So we have Peter, at Pentecost, telling his listeners what is happening. He is quoting Joel 2:28-32 almost word for word.
15 For these are not drunken, as ye suppose, seeing it is but the third hour of the day.
16  BUT THIS IS THAT WHICH WAS SPOKEN BY THE PROPHET JOEL;
17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:  
18 And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:
19 And I will shew wonders in heaven above, and signs in the earth beneath; blood, and fire, and vapour of smoke:
20 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and notable day of the Lord come:

Looks to me like the signs of the Tribulation were already beginning to appear. With Peters understanding of the Old Testament Scriptures, that Jesus gave him, he knew exactually where he was in the time table of prophesy. After all, wasn't he speaking "as the Spirit gave him utterance"?
-----------------------------------
BigD posted:
(The Jews are now set aside just as the Gentiles were at the Tower of Bable in Genesis 11. That is what put the Jew and Gentile on equal footing and without distinction. See Romans 11:7-12).

Bronzesnake responded:
Ask yourself this question BigD... What is the difference between a Jew and a gentile? then ask yourself this question...who were the Jews and where were they at the time that the "gentiles" were "set aside" at the tower of Babel?

BigD answers:
At the time of Genesis 11 (when God set the Gentiles aside) there was no such thing as a Jew. God raised up Abram (Genesis 12:1-3) and made an unconditional promise to him that the families (nations) of the earth would be blessed through his seed (Israel). The Israelites (Jews) became God's chosen people, and if Gentile wanted to serve the true and living God, that Gentile had to become a Jew (proselyte.) Before the nation of Israel was set aside, there was a "middle wall of partition" between the Jew and Gentile. Before Israel was set aside, The Gentiles were "...aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promis and having no hope, and without God in the world" (Eph.2:12).
---------------------------------
BigD posted:
The 70th week of Daniel (the Tribulation) started at Pentecost as per Acts 2:15-20. Peter is quoting Joel 2:28-32 almost word for word. Joel, in those verses, is speaking of the Tribulation spoken of in Daniel 9.

Bronzesnake responds:
So the tribulation isn't seven years as God has told us? according to your "BigD" bible, it's been over 2,000 years.

BigD replies:
I said it started. However, the prophetic time clock stopped with the setting aside of Isreal. That didn't happen until after the stoning of Stephen in Acts 7. That is when the Tribulation was interrupted. Then God raised up Saul/Paul, in Acts 9, and ushered in this dispensation of grace.
----------------------------------
D posted:
The Tribulation will resume with the rapture of the Church, the Body of Christ. Christ will return after the Tribulation period had run its course.

Bronzsesnake responds:Oh, wait a minute... if the tribulation started over 2,000 years ago, and now your telling me it will "resume" with the rapture...when did it stop?   Where does God tell us that the tribulation starts then stops?  

BigD responds:
Yes, the prophetic time clock stopped after the stoning of Stephen, and the setting aside of the nation of Israel.
------------------------------
Bronzesnake continues:
You are seriously confused my "young whipper snapper" friend.

BigD responds:
I will be more then happy to change my views if you can SHOW ME from Scripture that Joel in chapter 2:28-32 is not speaking of the Tribulation and that Peter in Acts 2:15-20 is WRONG in what he said.

Brother, I am still in the learning mode, so TEACH ME. I'm still young enough to learn.  (It sure feel good to have someone refer to me as a "young whipper snapper"). THANKS.

God Bless.
Live WEll, Laugh Often and Love the Lord!
« Last Edit: January 18, 2005, 07:48:43 PM by BigD » Logged
Jemidon2004
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« Reply #7 on: January 18, 2005, 04:17:08 PM »

Thanks for the history lesson at_the_cross

I have nothingagainst what you said...you're right Scripture does point to the voice of one crying in the wilderness...however, the voice of the one crying out in the wilderness is the forerunner of the Messiah...the FIRST time He came. I've yet to see waht connection John the Baptist had with the Second coming of Christ. It doesn't say in Scripture that there is a 2000+ year gap...however it seen in the OT prophets that they did not see the period known as the times of the Gentiles. That's clear in Daniel's prophecy. You're right it does say in Daniel 9:24, however it says 70 weeks are determined upon the people Israel and the City of Jerusalem. Notice it says "To finish the transgression, to make an end of sins, to make reconciliaiton for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness. To seal up vision and prophecy. the only thing that has been done is the end of sins has been accomplished with the death of Jesus Christ. The forgiveness of sin has been accomplished...however, everlasting righteousness (The Kingdom) has yet to be established with Christ as the Anointed. This hasn't happened, because the Times of the Gentiles has yet to finish. Also known as the dispensation of the age of Grace. When this age finishes (the church age) God will then turn His attention back to Israel and His prophetic clock and the 70th week will begin with a signing with the covenant of the nation of Israel. Revelation does use the same numbering system in describing 3 1/2 years. This is evident in the number of days the Two Witnesses have to preach. 3 1/2 years they will preach. Then according to Scripture, they will be killed, then ressurected. I gotta run now, but i'll be back to check on this later on. God Bless

Joshua
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Reba
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« Reply #8 on: January 18, 2005, 10:32:44 PM »

Thanks for the history lesson at_the_cross

I have nothingagainst what you said...you're right Scripture does point to the voice of one crying in the wilderness...however, the voice of the one crying out in the wilderness is the forerunner of the Messiah...the FIRST time He came. I've yet to see waht connection John the Baptist had with the Second coming of Christ. It doesn't say in Scripture that there is a 2000+ year gap...however it seen in the OT prophets that they did not see the period known as the times of the Gentiles. That's clear in Daniel's prophecy. You're right it does say in Daniel 9:24, however it says 70 weeks are determined upon the people Israel and the City of Jerusalem. Notice it says "To finish the transgression, to make an end of sins, to make reconciliaiton for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness. To seal up vision and prophecy. the only thing that has been done is the end of sins has been accomplished with the death of Jesus Christ. The forgiveness of sin has been accomplished...however, everlasting righteousness (The Kingdom) has yet to be established with Christ as the Anointed. This hasn't happened, because the Times of the Gentiles has yet to finish. Also known as the dispensation of the age of Grace. When this age finishes (the church age) God will then turn His attention back to Israel and His prophetic clock and the 70th week will begin with a signing with the covenant of the nation of Israel. Revelation does use the same numbering system in describing 3 1/2 years. This is evident in the number of days the Two Witnesses have to preach. 3 1/2 years they will preach. Then according to Scripture, they will be killed, then ressurected. I gotta run now, but i'll be back to check on this later on. God Bless

Joshua
  You dont believe Jesus Christ is annointed?   Do you believe He is the High Priest?

I have always found this odd..... much talk of 3 1/2 years in 'prophecy' but it is never connected with the 3 1/2 years of Christ's earthly ministry....
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« Reply #9 on: January 19, 2005, 12:01:21 PM »

Jesus Christ is anointed by God...however the usage of the words in Daniel gives hint that the Jews would be the ones to Anoint Him King. Notice the list of things that Israel has to accomplish by the end of the 70 weeks. To Anoint the Most Holy. Jesus has been anointed by God, However, Israel doesn't see HIm as Messiah, so they as a nation have yet to anoint the Holy One. That's evident in the fact that there is no one in Israel to Anoint...at least in their present State. That's why the Nation of Israel must come to repentance and be restored, then they can see Christ as Messiah and Anoint Him the Holy One, the leader of their nation. Another thing, the 3 1/2 years of Jesus ministry had none of the wonders that Revelations speaks about. So I don't see a connection. Maybe someone else can and provide enough Scripture to support this connection, but i don't see it at the moment...Didn't mean to cause any  confusion. God Bless

Joshua
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Reba
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« Reply #10 on: January 19, 2005, 12:31:11 PM »

John 12:13

13 Took branches of palm trees, and went forth to meet him, and cried, Hosanna: Blessed is the King of Israel that cometh in the name of the Lord.
KJV

Mark 11:9-10

9 And they that went before, and they that followed, cried, saying, Hosanna; Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord:

10 Blessed be the kingdom of our father David, that cometh in the name of the Lord: Hosanna in the highest.
KJV

Matt 21:4-9

4 All this was done, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, saying,

5 Tell ye the daughter of Sion, Behold, thy King cometh unto thee, meek, and sitting upon an ass, and a colt the foal of an ass.

6 And the disciples went, and did as Jesus commanded them,

7 And brought the ass, and the colt, and put on them their clothes, and they set him thereon.

8 And a very great multitude spread their garments in the way; others cut down branches from the trees, and strawed them in the way.

9 And the multitudes that went before, and that followed, cried, saying, Hosanna to the Son of David: Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord; Hosanna in the highest.
KJV




Joshua,

Does the land make a nation? Or as the Word says in Peter...

1 Peter 2:9-10

9 But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:

10 Which in time past were not a people, but are now the people of God: which had not obtained mercy, but now have obtained mercy.
KJV

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« Reply #11 on: January 19, 2005, 01:27:06 PM »

Brothers and Sisters,

YEAH! We have the makings of another excellent and hopefully peaceful discussion.

I simply want to add two cents worth now and enjoy the discussion.

1 - The Kingdom of God and the Millennial Kingdom on earth are two completely different truths. Christians already belong to the Kingdom of God, and the Kingdom of God lives in our hearts. For Christians, JESUS is already the LORD OF LORDS AND THE KING OF KINGS. JESUS will most definitely rule and reign over the earth from the Throne of David at His appointed time, and that time is called the Millennial Kingdom or the Rule and Reign of Jesus Christ. It will be a literal Throne in Jerusalem and a literal 1,000 years starting after the end of the Tribulation Period. The devil will be locked away during this time.

2 - THE CHURCH WHICH IS THE BODY OF CHRIST and Israel are two separate entities which must not be confused. Almighty God has made specific promises to both entities, and understanding the difference is critical in understanding Bible prophecy.

Love In Christ,
Tom

1Corinthians 2:9  But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.
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« Reply #12 on: January 19, 2005, 01:45:32 PM »

 BigD quote...
Quote
show me

 I'll show you, but I can't make you see.

 70 weeks begin ...

  Artaxerxes gives commandment to  Nehemiah to rebuild Jerusalem Neh 2:8  March 444 B.C.  70 weeks begin.  “Going forth of the commandment”  Dan 9:25

 483 years later..

   33 AD Messiah is cut off Dan 9:26 Suffering Messiah  Isa 52:13-53, Ps 22

 This leaves seven years. (I'll adress this seven years later)

Dan 9:26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: ...

 So, in 33 A.D. the messiah is cut off - that is 483 years after
Artaxerxes gives commandment to  Nehemiah to rebuild Jerusalem...with me so far?

 Dan 9:26 continued...and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof [shall be] with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.

 From Daniel’s perspective, we are viewing the (future) destruction of Jerusalem after the restoration mentioned in Daniel’s pray and accomplished by Nehemiah.  This destruction will occur by "The people of a prince who shall come".   Daniel, at this point, is praying for the restoration of Jerusalem. The city was destroyed by the Babylonians when he, Daniel, was in Babylon 586 BC.  The angel Gabriel is informing Daniel that the city of Jerusalem will be destroyed again after it is rebuilt by the commandment given by Artaxerxes in Daniel 9:24.

  In the year 70 AD, roman general Titus, son of the Emperor Vespasian, laid siege to Jerusalem. Today in the city of Rome, the Arch of Titus stands as a nearly 2000 year old monument to the victory of the Roman armies.  Engraved on the arch are the treasures taken from Jerusalem including a sculpture of the gold Menorah taken from the Temple.

 Only 69 weeks of years have passed on the Jewish People up to this point.  From the time the "Commandment was given" to restore and build Jerusalem unto " Messiah the Prince" was 483 years.  However, the number of years determined on Daniel's people were 490 years. Seven years are left to be fulfilled of the 490.  Did the seven years follow the death of Messiah?

      In Dan. 9:26  the, "Cutting off of Messiah"  occurred in 33 AD, to be followed by "The people of a prince who shall come"  who would destroy the city and temple. “The people”, who came were the Romans under Titus in 70 AD, but also mentioned is “A prince who shall come”. The people and prince are connected but separate. The people who destroy Jerusalem and the Temple would be descendants of the future prince.  The prince therefore would be of Roman or European origin.  At the end of the 69th week which ended with the death of Messiah the prince there was a period of 37 years before the rest of the 26th verse was fulfilled.  We can see that the 70th week would not immediately follow the 69th week. There is a gap between the 69th and 70th week. The question here BigD, is when does this final seven years begin?


 Dan 9:27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make [it] desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

 The temple and city of Jerusalem were destroyed following the death of  Messiah the Prince, thirty seven  years later.

This sequence is important for four reasons;

1.   The 70th week is part of the 490 years but would not      immediately follow 69 weeks.

2.   The remaining 7 years will  focus on Israel and the future Jewish Temple.

3.   The  future "Prince who shall come" is linked to the Jewish people and Temple sacrifice.

4.   Titus and the Romans destroyed the Temple in 70 AD and there is no temple today.

 So a future Jewish Temple must be built.  

  This prince is Roman  because Gabriel identifies him as a future prince of the people that would destroy the city of Jerusalem and the Temple.  The "Prince who shall come" was in the future tense. What function will this prince serve?  We find the answer in the 70th week (Dan 9:27) The Temple and city were destroyed in 70 AD.  The city has been restored but the temple to this very day remains destroyed.

 Today  the third most holy site to Islam, The Dome of the Rock, occupies  the spot where Temple stood. The last remaining vestige of the Temple is the Wailing Wall.  In Dan. 9:27 we are told that someone (he ), the "Prince who shall come" will make a covenant agreement to start up the sacrificial system of worship which has been stopped since the Temple was destroyed by the Roman armies.

 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week:  This is the start of the final seven years my friend. During that time, the temple will be rebuilt...So why does the verse says he shall confirm the covenant with many ?
  I don't need to go into the political/religious problems surrounding the temple mound. If the Jews attempted to rebuild the temple there today there would be bloody war - that's why "he" makes a covenant with "many"

 The final seven years begins when satan makes the seven year covenant.

Bronzesnake
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Bronzesnake
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« Reply #13 on: January 19, 2005, 01:48:10 PM »

  The length of a year in terms of days in biblical accounting is different than the present Gregorian system used today. The biblical system was lunar while the Gregorian is Solar. A month was 29 days and 30 days every other month with some adjustments every so often. We can see from Genesis 7-8 that the flood continued for 5 months or 150 days, a month was 30 days.  A day was 24 hours in Daniel’s day and in our day.  By using days, instead of years, we can reconcile the two methods.

1. We know there are 360 days to a biblical year.

      360 x 483=173,880 days

2. There are 365.242 days to a year in our calendar.          

3. If we divide our days 365.242 days into 173,880 days we  have 476 years and 24 days .  

4.  Subtract 476 years from 444 BC we  arrive at 33 AD and add 24 days (year 0 being 1)  

The command was given in the month Nissan. Nissan corresponds with March/April in our calendar. Therefore, 69 weeks ends on 24th day of Nissan or about  March 29th 33 AD.

Bronzesnake

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Reba
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« Reply #14 on: January 19, 2005, 01:51:32 PM »

Brothers and Sisters,

YEAH! We have the makings of another excellent and hopefully peaceful discussion.

I simply want to add two cents worth now and enjoy the discussion.

1 - The Kingdom of God and the Millennial Kingdom on earth are two completely different truths. Christians already belong to the Kingdom of God, and the Kingdom of God lives in our hearts. For Christians, JESUS is already the LORD OF LORDS AND THE KING OF KINGS. JESUS will most definitely rule and reign over the earth from the Throne of David at His appointed time, and that time is called the Millennial Kingdom or the Rule and Reign of Jesus Christ. It will be a literal Throne in Jerusalem and a literal 1,000 years starting after the end of the Tribulation Period. The devil will be locked away during this time.

2 - THE CHURCH WHICH IS THE BODY OF CHRIST and Israel are two separate entities which must not be confused. Almighty God has made specific promises to both entities, and understanding the difference is critical in understanding Bible prophecy.

Love In Christ,
Tom

1Corinthians 2:9  But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.

Mr. Bepster my ol buddy  Tongue


 We don't all agree on the points you listed above.  I believe Israel and the Church to be one in the same which ... stated in an over simplistic way... to be His people... This is not 'replacement theology' but understanding the scripture to see HE has always had 'peoples' a continuation of His Holy nation as listed in ....

Ex 19:5-6

5 Now therefore, if ye will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine:

6 And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of
Israel.
KJV

1 Peter 2:9-10

9 But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:

10 Which in time past were not a people, but are now the people of God: which had not obtained mercy, but now have obtained mercy.
KJV


If my posting in this thread makes for too much infighting ... just say the word and i will  shut up  Lips Sealed and read...

your sister in Him even when we disagree... Smiley
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