baptist faiths

[sincereheart]

Guys, we're either part of the church or we aren't.  Each knows where he stands with God, regardless of denominational standing.

This is the best statement I've read in a loooooong time.... Now if only it started with 'Guys AND Gals'....  

[Tibby]

Guys, we're either part of the church or we aren't.  Each knows where he stands with God, regardless of denominational standing.

This is the best statement I've read in a loooooong time....

You could have read it sooner... in the Catecism

[ollie]

"Whats in a name? A rose by any other will smell just as sweet!

[ollie]

What does this statement have to do with my wondering why Christians do not identify themselves with the head of the body, Jesus Christ, instead of identities devised by men?

It is simple, once you figure out who I am referring to. THat sky Tibby, so vague in his posts

Ok, for real, I was simply making a funny at why we are not one church.

I admitt, it was lame, but I don't think it was hart to understand what I was referring, too.

The drifting away from the one church and unity in the faith started long before "Martin". In fact it started in the first century during the time of the apostles etc.

Before or after the bible was put together in the 3rd century

Ok really, when did the loss of unity start, Ollie? What caused it?

"Before or after the bible was put together in the 3rd century "

Before.


"Ok really, when did the loss of unity start, Ollie? What caused it?"

Paul gives a hint of it in his letter to the church at Corinth and Galatia.

 1 Corinthians 1:10. Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.
 11.  For it hath been declared unto me of you, my brethren, by them which are of the house of Chloe, that there are contentions among you.
 12.  Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ.
 13.  Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul?


1 Corinthins 15:12.  Now if Christ be preached that he rose from the dead, how say some among you that there is no resurrection of the dead?

Galatians 1:6.  I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel:
 7.  Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.


The causes always seems to be man in the vanity of his own will instead of God's.


Ollie

[Tibby]

You're so cute with your Independent beliefs, ollie. There was a little bit of a issue, yes, but, this issue was addressed by Paul. The verse you quoted WAS Paul addressing the issue! A little disagreement between a few baby Christians (babies, as in still young, still immature in the faith, as Paul stated earlier in the book) is a FAR, FAR, FAR cry from a complete church drift.

[ollie]

You're so cute with your Independent beliefs, ollie. There was a little bit of a issue, yes, but, this issue was addressed by Paul. The verse you quoted WAS Paul addressing the issue! A little disagreement between a few baby Christians (babies, as in still young, still immature in the faith, as Paul stated earlier in the book) is a FAR, FAR, FAR cry from a complete church drift.

Whether mature or immature in the faith it is examples of how even in the first century there were those trying to preach a gospel other than Jesus Christ's and pull the assemblies in another direction.
Secular history shows it happened. The two predominate churches that eventually came out of the first, second, and third centuries were and are so far removed from the inspired word's of Peter, Paul, and others that one can see from Paul's reprimands to the young Christians in the first century that it was all very possible for this falling away to have started in Paul's time.

One could say I became independent from these secular churches and dependant on God and His Christ,though not always.
Dependency on God's word and God's word only became apparent when it was discovered from much Bible study that these secular churches did not always tell it as God revealed it.

Ollie

[Allinall]

Guys, we're either part of the church or we aren't.  Each knows where he stands with God, regardless of denominational standing.

This is the best statement I've read in a loooooong time....

You could have read it sooner... in the Catecism

I didn't realize even the entire Catholic Church listened to and followed what I believe!  

[Tibby]

Secular history shows it happened. The two predominate churches that eventually came out of the first, second, and third centuries were and are so far removed from the inspired word's of Peter, Paul, and others that one can see from Paul's reprimands to the young Christians in the first century that it was all very possible for this falling away to have started in Paul's time.

And what were these Churches? Heretics came out, yes, but I have never read of these two predominate churches so far removed. If you are going to make claims like this, cite them.


Actually, Allinall, you just went the long way around by coming to this belief on your own You could have just saved yourself the time and talked to a Catholic

[Allinall]

Actually, Allinall, you just went the long way around by coming to this belief on your own   You could have just saved yourself the time and talked to a Catholic  

Naaah.  I like my version better.  

[Tibby]

I'm sorry to here that.

You sound like a friend of mine the other day. He is blind, and needed help finding his class. I said

"Aaron, want me to guide you to the class? I have been to that room a lot, and I'm sure I can help you find it"

"No," he said "I prefere to find my own way"

He finally found the class, but by then the rest of us where already in our next class!  

[I_Believe]

For this analogy to be accurate you would have to add 2000 years of detours along the way.   Many times "religion" does more to distract from the truth than it does to clarify it.

Since each of us shall give account of himself to God we better be fully convinced in our own mind of the truth and not someone else's religious agenda.

(Rom 14:4-12 NKJV) []bWho are you to judge another's servant?[/b] To his own master he stands or falls. Indeed, he will be made to stand, for God is able to make him stand. {5} One person esteems one day above another; another esteems every day alike. Let each be fully convinced in his own mind. {6} He who observes the day, observes it to the Lord; and he who does not observe the day, to the Lord he does not observe it... But why do you judge your brother? Or why do you show contempt for your brother?... So then each of us shall give account of himself to God.

(Heb 10:16-19 NKJV)  "This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, says the LORD: I will put My laws into their hearts, and in their minds I will write them," {17} then He adds, "Their sins and their lawless deeds I will remember no more." {18} Now where there is remission of these, there is no longer an offering for sin. {19} Therefore, brethren, having boldness to enter the Holiest by the blood of Jesus,

(1 Tim 1:3-8 NKJV)  As I urged you when I went into Macedonia; remain in Ephesus that you may charge some that they teach no other doctrine, {4} nor give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which cause disputes rather than godly edification which is in faith. {5} Now the purpose of the commandment is love from a pure heart, from a good conscience, and from sincere faith, {6} from which some, having strayed, have turned aside to idle talk, {7} desiring to be teachers of the law, understanding neither what they say nor the things which they affirm. {8} But we know that the law is good if one uses it lawfully...

[Allinall]

I'm sorry to here that.

You sound like a friend of mine the other day. He is blind, and needed help finding his class. I said

"Aaron, want me to guide you to the class? I have been to that room a lot, and I'm sure I can help you find it"

"No," he said "I prefere to find my own way"

He finally found the class, but by then the rest of us where already in our next class!  

Nah.  In truth, it's not my way, your way, the Catholic or Baptist way.  It's His way.  And in the round about, God takes us His way often through our own stubborness to teach us truths we'd never learn the easy way with the clarity we do the hard way.  

[Tibby]

Hey, it isn't my school, nor is it Aarons, but I still got to class before he did, now didn't I? Yes, we all take the same class, but we got there different ways. It just so happens my way got me there is time to hear the lecture.

[I_Believe]

my way got me there is time to hear the lecture

Maybe it was divine providence...the lecture was on evolution.


'These people draw near to me with their mouth, And honor me with their lips; But their heart is far from me.  And in vain do they worship me, Teaching as doctrine rules made by men.'... "Every plant which my heavenly Father didn't plant will be uprooted.  Leave them alone. They are blind guides of the blind. If the blind guide the blind, both will fall into a pit." (Mat 15:8-14 WEB)

[Tibby]

Maybe it was divine providence...the lecture was on evolution.

Man, that was close, good thing I believe in Theistic
evolution! Actually, for sake of the example, it was Grammer & Comp class (please, save the sarcasm for later )

'These people draw near to me with their mouth, And honor me with their lips; But their heart is far from me.  And in vain do they worship me, Teaching as doctrine rules made by men.'... "Every plant which my heavenly Father didn't plant will be uprooted.  Leave them alone. They are blind guides of the blind. If the blind guide the blind, both will fall into a pit." (Mat 15:8-14 WEB)

Man, another close one! Good thing I'm Catholic!