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Ambassador4Christ
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« on: April 30, 2003, 04:36:39 PM »

Once Saved, Always Saved

Is it possible to lose your salvation? This is a very important question that we must consider carefully. If it is possible to lose salvation, it is of tantamount importance that we understand just what we must do to stay saved. If it is not possible to lose it, it is our duty to point this out to those who say it is.

First we must understand the basis of our salvation. Is salvation based on what we do?

Rom 4:5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

Titus 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

These scriptures, and countless others, make it clear that salvation is not based on what we do for God. In fact, it is just the opposite. Our salvation is based on what God did for us (Rom 5:8; 1 Cor 15:3,4; 2 Cor 5:21).

Since we can't do anything to be saved, how can we be expected to do anything to stay saved? The scriptures teach that we are secure in Christ and that nothing, not even our own unbelief, can separate us from the love of God once we have trusted in Christ's sacrifice for our sin. (Rom 8:33-39; Phil 1:6; 2 Tim 2:11-13)

The argument that we must work to stay saved often stems from an unclear understanding of all we have been given in Christ.

We are members of the body of Christ (1 Cor 12:27; Eph 1:22,23, 5:30)
Does Christ cut off parts of his body?

We are sealed with the Holy Spirit (2 Cor 1:22; Eph 1:13,14, 4:30)
Is anyone strong enough to break God's seal?

We are a purchased posession (1 Cor 6:20, 7:23; Eph 1:14)
Does God throw away that which he purchased with his own blood?

We are adopted sons of the Father (Rom 8:15-23; Gal 4:5; Eph 1:5)
Does God disown his sons?

It can be easily seen that salvation cannot be lost since, from beginning to end, it is dependent on the work of Christ, not the works of men. Our works can't get us saved, and our works can't keep us saved.

But don't scriptures such as Heb 6:4-6, 10:26,27 and 2 Pet 2:20-22 teach that salvation can be lost if we don't continue in good works? Yes, they do! However, these scriptures are not written to the body of Christ in the dispensation of the grace of God. They are written to believers under the Jewish dispensation

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« Reply #1 on: April 30, 2003, 10:59:47 PM »

      Ambassador4Christ;
    AMEN!!!!! Thankyou.
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« Reply #2 on: May 01, 2003, 12:07:38 AM »

Ephesians 4:30
And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are  sealed  unto the day of redemption.


sealed

Once Saved, Always Saved

Live4Christ
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« Reply #3 on: May 01, 2003, 02:32:47 AM »

     Ambassador4Christ;
    AMEN!!!!! Thankyou.

Thanks Bro  Grin
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Ambassador4Christ
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« Reply #4 on: May 01, 2003, 02:35:01 AM »

Ephesians 4:30
And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are  sealed  unto the day of redemption.


sealed

Once Saved, Always Saved

Live4Christ

AAAAAAAAMEN!!!!

For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain.  Philippians 1:21

And AAAAAAAAAAAMEN!!!
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« Reply #5 on: May 01, 2003, 04:18:21 AM »

Not aw!  It's by our filthy rags called works and strict adherence to the LAW!!!  Just ask John the baptist and Micheal.  Christ's finished work on the cross (it is finished) isn't good enough to save us.  We have to become good little boys and girls or santa won't bring us any gifts.  I mean God won't save us.

Have a good one!    Cheesy
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« Reply #6 on: May 01, 2003, 05:07:22 PM »

Quote
Ambassador4Christ said:

Once Saved, Always Saved

Is it possible to lose your salvation? This is a very important question that we must consider carefully. If it is possible to lose salvation, it is of tantamount importance that we understand just what we must do to stay saved. If it is not possible to lose it, it is our duty to point this out to those who say it is.

First we must understand the basis of our salvation. Is salvation based on what we do?

Most definitely, we must have faith. To have faith we must believe. Once we believe we must act on that belief so that the Holy Ghost can be given to us.

Rom 4:5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

Titus 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

Acts 2
37   Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
38   Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
39   For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the LORD our God shall call.
[/i]

 
Quote
These scriptures, and countless others, make it clear that salvation is not based on what we do for God. In fact, it is just the opposite. Our salvation is based on what God did for us (Rom 5:8; 1 Cor 15:3,4; 2 Cor 5:21).

See above. And our obedience to His Word.

John 14:15
If ye love me, keep my commandments.

John 15:9-10
As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love. If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.
[/i]

Quote
Since we can't do anything to be saved, how can we be expected to do anything to stay saved? The scriptures teach that we are secure in Christ and that nothing, not even our own unbelief, can separate us from the love of God once we have trusted in Christ's sacrifice for our sin. (Rom 8:33-39; Phil 1:6; 2 Tim 2:11-13)

‘once we have trusted’ means we had to do something, in this case, in your own words: ‘trusted’. So are you now saying there is something we need to do to be saved?

Quote
The argument that we must work to stay saved often stems from an unclear understanding of all we have been given in Christ.

True, but if we have no works then our faith is dead.

James 2:17
Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.


Quote
We are members of the body of Christ (1 Cor 12:27; Eph 1:22,23, 5:30)
Does Christ cut off parts of his body?

Romans 11
19   Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be grafted in.
20   Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear:
21   For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
22   Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.
[/i]

Quote
We are sealed with the Holy Spirit (2 Cor 1:22; Eph 1:13,14, 4:30)
Is anyone strong enough to break God's seal?

No of course not. God’s seal is our promise of salvation but it’s still our choice whether we enter in or not.

Quote
We are a purchased posession (1 Cor 6:20, 7:23; Eph 1:14)
Does God throw away that which he purchased with his own blood?

See above; Romans 11

Quote
We are adopted sons of the Father (Rom 8:15-23; Gal 4:5; Eph 1:5)
Does God disown his sons?

See above; Romans 11

Quote
It can be easily seen that salvation cannot be lost since, from beginning to end, it is dependent on the work of Christ, not the works of men. Our works can't get us saved, and our works can't keep us saved.

But don't scriptures such as Heb 6:4-6, 10:26,27 and 2 Pet 2:20-22 teach that salvation can be lost if we don't continue in good works? Yes, they do! However, these scriptures are not written to the body of Christ in the dispensation of the grace of God. They are written to believers under the Jewish dispensation

These scriptures are written to Christian as we see in these verses below:

2 Peter 1
Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:

Hebrews 3
Wherefore, holy brethren, partakers of the heavenly calling, consider the Apostle and High Priest of our profession, Christ Jesus;
[/i]

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« Reply #7 on: May 01, 2003, 05:28:46 PM »

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« Reply #8 on: May 01, 2003, 11:26:00 PM »

 Honestly, I'm not sure about this O.S.A.S. stuff.
There are many people who used to believe, and now no longer do. There is one such person on this forum who admits that he was once a believer and now he is volatile toward God, he mocks God and insults Christians.

Jesus said the following...
 Rev 22:11  He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.  
   
    Rev 22:12   And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward [is] with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.

 Some feel as though once they become believers they don't have to "love thy neighbor" in other words, there are some greedy, uncaring Christians among us. Jesus tells us to be involved with our fellow brothers and sisters. We must be charitable, we must offer help and counseling. And Jesus said He will Judge His own according to their works, and those who have done great work in His name shall have a greater reward than those who do little.

But Jesus also said this...

Mat 7:20   Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.  
   
    Mat 7:21  Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.  
   
    Mat 7:22   Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?  
   
    Mat 7:23   And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

 Why would Jesus teach us to pray by asking God the Father to "forgive us our trespasses" if we were already eternally secured?

 I'm not saying O.S.A.S. is wrong, I'm just not sure that it is. I believe we must fight the good fight against temptation and sin, and pray the way Jesus instructed us to. I also know that there is nothing we can do to on our own merit to be saved, we need to accept Jesus' sacrifice for that. But I know there are many people who once believed and now don't.
 The argument that, "well, they were never true believers in the first place" is very assumptive.
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« Reply #9 on: May 04, 2003, 10:13:19 AM »

Gods love is manifest to us today by the gospel of God. The gospel of God is His good news to mankind. His good news for us today is His Son, Jesus Christ, dying on the cross for our sins, being buried, and risen again on the third day. This death, burial and resurrection is good news because it is by this sacrifice of God that we have available to us today the opportunity to be saved from eternal punishment for our sins. God set His Son forth to be the complete sacrifice for our sins. Gods sacrifice of His Son is good news to us because it is by His sacrifice that we have eternal life. When Christ rose and revived from the dead He was given a new glorified body that would live eternal and glorified in Heaven. Through His life we too can have eternal life. When we believe the truths of Christs death, burial and resurrection for our sins we are placed in a status as children of God. As a child of God we are promised many wonderful blessings. God is true to His word and His promises. As a child of God we are secure in those promises. As we look into the truths about the gospel or good news of God please understand what is offered and accomplished through His gospel; salvation, eternal life, and so much more. Understand that the good news is just what it says it is "GOOD NEWS"! Please understand how salvation comes to us as a free gift of God and that we receive these blessings not because of anything weve done. We believe and then we receive. Therefore, nothing anyone can do will separate us from the salvation we have secured in Christ Jesus if we have believed in the gospel of God.
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« Reply #10 on: May 04, 2003, 02:03:18 PM »

Everytime someone says Jesus said this and Jesus said that, I keep coming to this one conclusion that Jesus said also.

Matthew 15
23   But He did not answer her a word. And His disciples came and implored Him, saying, "Send her away, because she keeps shouting at us."
24   But He answered and said, "I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel."
25   But she came and began to bow down before Him, saying, "Lord, help me!"



So what I have no choice to believe is that Jesus was speaking his comandments to them, the lost sheep of the house of Israel and He helped a few outside the House of Israel, very few.

But His sacrifice has been extended to the gentiles by Gods Grace and His Grace alone.  And that these wonderful things that Jesus said, although so wonderful and I try my best to follow His wonderful teachings, the Salvation issue is settled once and for always by his Sacrifice not His words, Which I might add were spoken to the lost sheep of the house of Israel
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« Reply #11 on: May 04, 2003, 06:41:28 PM »

Many things are accomplished by the gospel of God, one of which is:

A.) By the gospel we are "called" unto salvation. What I mean by that is this; if not for God calling us unto salvation, salvation would not be possible. In other words, if it were left up to us we would never have any chance at escaping Gods wrath upon sin. In fact, if it were not for the gospel of God we would never even call upon God to save us. Our natural state as humans is to go apart from God. We do not seek Him. Actually, we do just the opposite of seeking God, we go away from God. In Romans 3:11 and 12, God through Paul says regarding ALL HUMANS "There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God. They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one." Therefore, we must realize that God through His Love reaches out an arm of long suffering to us and offers to us salvation through His Son Jesus Christ. God calls us unto salvation. Not because of anything good we do but because of His unabounding love. He manifests His glory to us by setting forth His Son Jesus Christ to die on the cross for our sins, to be buried, and to be risen again on the third day (I Corinthians 15:1-4). It is by Jesus Christ that God calls us unto salvation (I Cor. 1:9) and He gives us that good news by His word. Romans 10:17 says "So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God." Gods word is His way of communicating His gospel to us today. We must read the Bible or hear the gospel from someone who has read the Bible in order for us to be called and in order for us to accept and believe it. One very important thing to know about the calling of the gospel is that it is available to every human being on the face of the earth. There is not a chosen few who will be saved while the rest are left to burn in eternal wrath. Romans 3:22 says "Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference". This verse is clear that salvation is offered to all but is only given to those who believe in the gospel of Jesus Christ dying on the cross for our sins, being buried and resurrected on the third day.
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« Reply #12 on: May 05, 2003, 01:07:08 PM »

Once we believe the gospel of God we are saved. Despite our past sins and continual sins we are justified in Gods eyes because Jesus paid our sin debt. Jesus was the complete and perfect sacrifice for our sins. When He shed His blood on the cross our sins were no longer laid to our account. When He arose from the dead life became possible to those who believe Gods good news. Romans 1:16 says "For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek." Through Gods gospel we are offered salvation.

 

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« Reply #13 on: May 05, 2003, 05:16:31 PM »

As a result of believing the gospel and being saved we receive life and immortality.

B.) It is by the gospel of God that we are given eternal life. II Timothy 1:10 says "But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, Who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel". After Christ died on the cross for our sins He was buried in the tomb and arose from the dead on the third day following His death. Forty days later He then ascended into Heaven to sit on the right hand of God the Father where He lives and reigns eternally today. Acts 1:3 says "To whom also He (Jesus) shewed Himself alive after His passion by many infallible proofs, being seen of them forty days, and speaking of the things pertaining to the kingdom of God". Acts 1:9 "And when He had spoken these things, while they beheld, He was taken up; and a cloud received Him out of their sight." We must give great attention to the fact that Christ LIVES today. Romans 14:9 says "For to this end Christ both died, and arose, and revived, that He might be Lord both of the dead and the living". There is a possibility for something to be risen and not be alive. Something can be physically risen but that doesnt necessarily mean that it is alive. God wants us to have no doubt that Christ is alive today. Thus His statement, "Christ both died, and rose, and revived". Not only was He risen but He was REVIVED. He is alive never to experience death again. Romans 6:9 says, "Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over Him." He will live eternally! As Christ lives today those who have believed the gospel of God so too have eternal life. Romans 6:5 says, "For if we have been planted together in the likeness of His death, we shall be also in the likeness of His resurrection". Verse 8 "Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with Him". As Christ will never again experience death so to we as believers will never experience spiritual death. We are dead unto sin and alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord (Romans 6:11). Make no mistake about it, if we believe the gospel of Jesus Christs death, burial and resurrection, we can count it to be so that as Christ lives today eternally so do we live eternally. Colossians 3:3 says "For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God". What a comforting verse that proves that a believers eternal life is hidden or laid up in store in Christ. How much more secure and eternal can anything be than to be hid in Christ?
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« Reply #14 on: May 06, 2003, 03:03:45 PM »

Once a person makes a true decision to believe the gospel then they, at some point later in their life, CAN NOT choose to not be saved. Once theyve made the decision to believe they are secure in their salvation. They cannot then choose to abandon their standing as a Christian. To reinforce this statement let us look at II Timothy 2:11, 12, 13. Verse 11, "It is a faithful saying: For if we be dead with Him, we shall also live with Him." When a person believes the gospel they become identified with Christs death (Romans 6:3). Since we are identified with Christs death we cannot become unidentified because we are sealed in our identification by the Holy Spirit (Ephesians 1:13). Lets continue with II Timothy 2:12, "If we suffer, we shall also reign with Him: if we deny Him, He also will deny us". If we as believer suffer with Him we will get to reign with Him. However, if we deny Him He will deny us reigning with Him (Romans 8:17, 18). II Timothy 2:13, "If we believe not, yet He abideth faithful: He cannot deny Himself." Notice here that Paul, the human writer of this verse says, "If we believe not". Paul is including himself in this hypothetical situation. Paul is obviously saved and yet he says, "If we believe not, yet He abideth faithful:". If Paul for some reason had stopped believing he would still be saved because God would still be faithful and so Paul concludes the verse by telling why he would still be saved. "He (God) cannot deny Himself." To better understand this let us be reminded that once a person is saved they are placed and sealed by the Holy Spirit into the Body of Christ. Ephesians 5:30, "For we are members of His body, of His flesh, and of His bones." Thus, Paul can make the statement by the inspiration of God: "He (God) cannot deny Himself." God cannot deny the Body of Christ, which are the believers in this age (dispensation) of grace. Therefore, we conclude by the verses that once a person makes a self-conscience decision to believe the gospel of Jesus Christ they become saved and they cannot choose to anytime thereafter to not be saved. God will remain faithful to His children and will not deny Himself (the body of Christ). It is important to point out the fact that the statement that God cannot deny Himself refers to not being able to deny the Body of Christ, His children. He can and will deny those who have not been saved which are those who have not believed in the gospel of Jesus Christ.

 

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