Getting Baptized

[Willowbirch]

Amen, Ollie!  

[Ambassador4Christ]

1. If you make baptism necessary for salvation, then Paul thanked God he saved so few.
2. If you make baptism essential to obedience, then Paul thanked God that he made so few obedient.
3. It should be apparent that Paul was indifferent to baptism during his 18 month stay at Corinth.
4. It should also be apparent that Paul never, in his ministry, saw himself as working under the commissions of Matthew 28:19 and Mark 16:16, given to the Twelve.
5. At this stage in Paul's ministry, little emphasis or importance was placed on baptism.
6. Paul's commission from the glorified Christ differed from the commission given to the Twelve at the point of water baptism (Paul's commission did not include water baptism).;
7. If God had commanded Paul to baptize , as He did the Twelve, he would not have stopped baptizing under any condition. Paul would not have allowed the abuses of man to prevent him from carrying out God's direct command to him.
8. The Corinthians also abused the Lord's Table, but Paul did not say that because of the abuse of the Lord's Table I will not celebrate the Lord's Table any longer.
9. If Baptism had ever been a command of God to Paul, as it had been to the Twelve, he could never have said: "God sent me not to baptize." V.17.
10. The Bible , nor Paul anywhere tells us that Paul delegated the less important task of baptizing to others. This is not in the Bible. Paul did not delegate his authority. Jesus did delegate His authority to baptize to others John 4:12, but Jesus was still said to have baptized. That is they were baptized by His authority. This could also be true of Paul , but it is not since we have no scriptural record of it. And if baptism was as important as people think it was, then we would surely have some mention of it in the word of God.
11. The fact remains , baptism is not an ordinance of the church, the Body of Christ after 62 ad when the Jews were set aside and when "the revelation of the mystery" completed the Word of God. From that point on, we have a dispensation that is purely of grace and the operation of the Spirit. Spirit baptism is now the order of the day.
Eph. 4:5; 1 Cor. 12:13.
12. We must recognize the truth of both the "Go.baptize" of Matt. 28:19 and "Christ sent me not to baptize" of
1 Cor. 1:17 . Both are true and while many struggle with the conflicting statements, it does not seem to occur to very many that the risen and glorified Christ gave further revelation to Paul which replaces or takes precedence over His first commands.
(a). Most feel that Matt. 28:19 and Mark 16:16 are perpetual commands and hence the obligation of the church. This would have been the case had their been no further revelation. And why can't be believe in progressive revelation??? The Lord rescinded or changed the Matthew 10:5 command; He told the Apostles "Go not in the way of the Gentiles", then later He said, "Go make disciple all nations [Gentiles]." It is a fact that our Lord changed many of His first teaching and commands.
(b). Many today suffer the "red letter bible syndrome." Are the words of our Lord in the four Gospels more binding upon us than His words in the epistles of Paul? Paul said, "the things I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord." 1 Cor. 14:35. All of Paul's writings should be in red letters as they were received by direct revelation of the Glorified Christ. Gal. 1:11,12; 2:1-9; Eph. 3:1-9. Did not Peter refer believers to Paul's revelation and epistles
2 Peter 3:15,16 ? In carrying out his mission to the Gentiles Paul did not work under the Kingdom program of the Twelve Apostles, but the new dispensation of grace which God had given him.
(c). The correct answer is a dispensational one -----the Twelve were working under the Kingdom program and they had their commissions which included water baptism. And Paul was working under the Grace program of the Body Church and the new dispensation of the mystery in which Spirit baptism was the means whereby believers were placed into the Body Church 1Cor. 12:13.

[Brother Love]

1. If you make baptism necessary for salvation, then Paul thanked God he saved so few.
2. If you make baptism essential to obedience, then Paul thanked God that he made so few obedient.
3. It should be apparent that Paul was indifferent to baptism during his 18 month stay at Corinth.
4. It should also be apparent that Paul never, in his ministry, saw himself as working under the commissions of Matthew 28:19 and Mark 16:16, given to the Twelve.
5. At this stage in Paul's ministry, little emphasis or importance was placed on baptism.
6. Paul's commission from the glorified Christ differed from the commission given to the Twelve at the point of water baptism (Paul's commission did not include water baptism).;
7. If God had commanded Paul to baptize , as He did the Twelve, he would not have stopped baptizing under any condition. Paul would not have allowed the abuses of man to prevent him from carrying out God's direct command to him.
8. The Corinthians also abused the Lord's Table, but Paul did not say that because of the abuse of the Lord's Table I will not celebrate the Lord's Table any longer.
9. If Baptism had ever been a command of God to Paul, as it had been to the Twelve, he could never have said: "God sent me not to baptize." V.17.
10. The Bible , nor Paul anywhere tells us that Paul delegated the less important task of baptizing to others. This is not in the Bible. Paul did not delegate his authority. Jesus did delegate His authority to baptize to others John 4:12, but Jesus was still said to have baptized. That is they were baptized by His authority. This could also be true of Paul , but it is not since we have no scriptural record of it. And if baptism was as important as people think it was, then we would surely have some mention of it in the word of God.
11. The fact remains , baptism is not an ordinance of the church, the Body of Christ after 62 ad when the Jews were set aside and when "the revelation of the mystery" completed the Word of God. From that point on, we have a dispensation that is purely of grace and the operation of the Spirit. Spirit baptism is now the order of the day.
Eph. 4:5; 1 Cor. 12:13.
12. We must recognize the truth of both the "Go.baptize" of Matt. 28:19 and "Christ sent me not to baptize" of
1 Cor. 1:17 . Both are true and while many struggle with the conflicting statements, it does not seem to occur to very many that the risen and glorified Christ gave further revelation to Paul which replaces or takes precedence over His first commands.
(a). Most feel that Matt. 28:19 and Mark 16:16 are perpetual commands and hence the obligation of the church. This would have been the case had their been no further revelation. And why can't be believe in progressive revelation??? The Lord rescinded or changed the Matthew 10:5 command; He told the Apostles "Go not in the way of the Gentiles", then later He said, "Go make disciple all nations [Gentiles]." It is a fact that our Lord changed many of His first teaching and commands.
(b). Many today suffer the "red letter bible syndrome." Are the words of our Lord in the four Gospels more binding upon us than His words in the epistles of Paul? Paul said, "the things I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord." 1 Cor. 14:35. All of Paul's writings should be in red letters as they were received by direct revelation of the Glorified Christ. Gal. 1:11,12; 2:1-9; Eph. 3:1-9. Did not Peter refer believers to Paul's revelation and epistles
2 Peter 3:15,16 ? In carrying out his mission to the Gentiles Paul did not work under the Kingdom program of the Twelve Apostles, but the new dispensation of grace which God had given him.
(c). The correct answer is a dispensational one -----the Twelve were working under the Kingdom program and they had their commissions which included water baptism. And Paul was working under the Grace program of the Body Church and the new dispensation of the mystery in which Spirit baptism was the means whereby believers were placed into the Body Church 1Cor. 12:13.

RIGHT ON!

AMEN!!!!

Brother Love

[Brother Love]

The Scriptures contain several water baptism ceremonies which we believe are related to God's earthly kingdom purposes concerning Israel and the nations (Acts 2:36-38; 13:24), but the Apostle Paul, whom Christ sent not to baptise (1 Cor 1:17), explicitly states concerning the Body of Christ, "There is one baptism" (Eph 4:5), which is administered by the Holy Spirit and not by human hands (Col 2:11,12), which results in the permanent union of every believer as a member of the Church which is His Body (1 Cor 12:13). Therefore this Church does not practise the ordinance of water baptism BUT recognising the differences in understanding on the part of sincere believers in this Church and from other denominations who are our beloved brother and sisters in Christ, grants the liberty to its members in grace to adhere to their own convictions on the subject, as long as they do not invest any saving merit in water baptism, or make the subject a matter of contention in the Church.

I agree with the above doctrine

Brother Love

[Jabez]

Ephesians 4
4 [There is] one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,6 One God and Father of all, who [is] above all, and through all, and in you all
***************
Iam not sure this can be considered the Spirit Baptism?Look at verses 4 one body and spirit meaning the Holy Spirit,then verse 5 One Lord,One Faith,One Baptism meaning Jesus,then verse 6 One GOD and Father meaning GOD.WHat i see there is the trinity.Now how is the conclusion drawn that the one baptism is that by the spirit?

[Ambassador4Christ]

Ephesians 4
4 [There is] one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,6 One God and Father of all, who [is] above all, and through all, and in you all
***************
Iam not sure this can be considered the Spirit Baptism?Look at verses 4 one body and spirit meaning the Holy Spirit,then verse 5 One Lord,One Faith,One Baptism meaning Jesus,then verse 6 One GOD and Father meaning GOD.WHat i see there is the trinity.Now how is the conclusion drawn that the one baptism is that by the spirit?

For a Start Read 1 Corinthians 12:13

[Jabez]

I need more than that,there are verses that could conclude water baptism and spirit work in unisen.

[Ambassador4Christ]

I need more than that,there are verses that could conclude water baptism and spirit work in unisen.

Like I said start with 1 Corinthians 12:13

Question Who is the Baptiser?
Does Jesus Baptise?
Or does the Holy Spirit Baptise?
Read Acts Chapter 2 over and over until you see what Gods Word says, NOT what you have been taught what it says.
Read Acts Chapter 10 Over and Over until you see what it says, NOT what you have been taught what it says.

Grow in Gods Grace

P.S. "Christ sent me not to baptize" 1 Cor. 1:17

[Jabez]

Water Bapism-Old Covenant(OT)?
Spirit Baptism-New Covenant

What do you think?

[Jabez]

Any thoughts?Anyone?

[Willowbirch]

Water Bapism-Old Covenant(OT)?
Spirit Baptism-New Covenant

What do you think?

Circumcision was basically an old covenant rule; in the new covenant, we realize that circumcision of the heart is acceptable to God, whereas the bodily circumcision is merely an outward expression. But as far as I know, water baptism was not ruled out as an outward display that could be discarded; throughout the book of Acts and much of the New Testament regarding new believers, we find that baptism was a prominent element in the early church. You believed on Jesus, and then you were baptized. "Here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized?" "They that gladly received his word were baptized;" "And he commanded them to be baptized..." "Arise, and be baptized, and wash away they sins..." What we read here is a physical immersion in water, other than the baptism of Spirit.
My personal opinion on why Paul was relieved he had "baptized so few": Christians were saying, "I follow Paul"; "I follow Apollos"; they were forgetting that they were following One Lord, and were causing division in the church by holding to one preacher instead of the Word that was preached.

[Jabez]

I hear ya,i beleive that spirit baptism is part of the new covenant,i say new because in acts 2 we see the spirit come to dwell with us on a regular basis.In the OT the spirit would come and go,and not always be with the person.Now the spirit dwells in us.For water baptism iam not certain,iam thinking is was part of the old covenant,since Jesus had not died yet water baptism was used for the forgiveness of sins.I feel it is very important for us to understand the new covenant.Ive never been taught about the new covenant,ive always known the new testament.

[Ambassador4Christ]

The baptism of the Holy Spirit into Christ of believers, making them part of the church, which is Christ's Body. All (but two references) by Paul in his epistles refers to this baptism which identifies believers as part of Christ and his church. Cf. Romans 6:3-15; I Cor. 12:13; Gal. 3:27; Eph. 4:5; Col. 2:12 But there is much more than this….

NO WATER!!!!

[The Crusader]

The baptism of the Holy Spirit into Christ of believers, making them part of the church, which is Christ's Body. All (but two references) by Paul in his epistles refers to this baptism which identifies believers as part of Christ and his church. Cf. Romans 6:3-15; I Cor. 12:13; Gal. 3:27; Eph. 4:5; Col. 2:12 But there is much more than this….

NO WATER!!!!

Once again Ambassador, I must agree.

The Crusader

[Jabez]

What verse says NO WATER?Think about it,Jesus was Baptised to fulfill all righteousness,to start his ministery,are we not to minister the word of God?