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Shammu
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« on: March 30, 2004, 01:07:29 AM »

Various groups continue to push Jerusalem even closer to its foretold role in the End Times. Private efforts are underway to not only rebuild the temple but to restore Israel to its original borders. Even more ominous, new plans for a Palestinian peace settlement may even herald the arrival of the Antichrist.
Standing today in what Jews believe is the historical location of the first two, is the Al-Aqsa Mosque  - the third holiest site in Islam . To recognize it as the only possible rebuilt Temple, or to even seriously attempt to tear it down to replace it, both constitute seemingly unresolvable religious and thus political problems. Nonetheless, the idea of rebuilding some Temple somewhere is difficult to abandon entirely:
For the last 1900 years, Jews have prayed that God would allow for the rebuilding of the Temple. This prayer is a formal part of the thrice daily Jewish prayer services.
However, not all rabbis  agree on what would happen in a rebuilt Temple. It has traditionally just been assumed that some sort of animal sacrifices would be reinstituted, in accord with the rules in Leviticus  and the Talmud . However there is another opinion, beginning with Maimonides , that God  deliberately has moved Jews away from sacrifices towards prayer, as prayer is a higher form of worship. Thus, some rabbis hold that sacrifices would not take place in a rebuilt Temple. Rabbi Abraham Isaac Kook , the first chief rabbi of the Jewish community in pre-state Israel , holds that sacrifices will not be reinstituted.
A few very small Jewish groups today support constructing a Third Temple today, but most Jews oppose this, for a variety of reasons. Most religious Jews feel that the Temple should only be rebuilt in the messianic era, and that it would presumptuous of people to force God's hand, as it were. Further, there are many ritual impurity constrictions that are difficult to resolve, making the building's construction a practical impossibility.
Additionally, many Jews are against rebuilding the Temple due to the enormously hostile reaction from all Arab and Muslim nations that would likely result - even were the building to be complementary to those holy to Islam , there would be high suspicion that such a building project would ultimately end with the destruction of these and the rebuilding of the Temple on its original spot.
Some fundamentalist and evangelical Christian  groups, especially those who follow a dispensationalist  theology, believe that the Jewish people will build the Third Temple shortly before, or perhaps after, "true" Christians have been raptured

As you know my brothers and sisters, Jerusalem temple must be rebuilt to fulfill prophecy.

Brothers and sisters, I would like to hear your input please.
« Last Edit: November 19, 2007, 01:01:01 AM by Pastor Roger » Logged

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« Reply #1 on: April 04, 2004, 06:43:36 PM »

Various groups continue to push Jerusalem even closer to its foretold role in the End Times. Private efforts are underway to not only rebuild the temple but to restore Israel to its original borders. Even more ominous, new plans for a Palestinian peace settlement may even herald the arrival of the Antichrist.
Standing today in what Jews believe is the historical location of the first two, is the Al-Aqsa Mosque  - the third holiest site in Islam . To recognize it as the only possible rebuilt Temple, or to even seriously attempt to tear it down to replace it, both constitute seemingly unresolvable religious and thus political problems. Nonetheless, the idea of rebuilding some Temple somewhere is difficult to abandon entirely:
For the last 1900 years, Jews have prayed that God would allow for the rebuilding of the Temple. This prayer is a formal part of the thrice daily Jewish prayer services.
However, not all rabbis  agree on what would happen in a rebuilt Temple. It has traditionally just been assumed that some sort of animal sacrifices would be reinstituted, in accord with the rules in Leviticus  and the Talmud . However there is another opinion, beginning with Maimonides , that God  deliberately has moved Jews away from sacrifices towards prayer, as prayer is a higher form of worship. Thus, some rabbis hold that sacrifices would not take place in a rebuilt Temple. Rabbi Abraham Isaac Kook , the first chief rabbi of the Jewish community in pre-state Israel , holds that sacrifices will not be reinstituted.
A few very small Jewish groups today support constructing a Third Temple today, but most Jews oppose this, for a variety of reasons. Most religious Jews feel that the Temple should only be rebuilt in the messianic era, and that it would presumptuous of people to force God's hand, as it were. Further, there are many ritual impurity constrictions that are difficult to resolve, making the building's construction a practical impossibility.
Additionally, many Jews are against rebuilding the Temple due to the enormously hostile reaction from all Arab and Muslim nations that would likely result - even were the building to be complementary to those holy to Islam , there would be high suspicion that such a building project would ultimately end with the destruction of these and the rebuilding of the Temple on its original spot.
Some fundamentalist and evangelical Christian  groups, especially those who follow a dispensationalist  theology, believe that the Jewish people will build the Third Temple shortly before, or perhaps after, "true" Christians have been raptured

As you know my brothers and sisters, Jerusalem temple must be rebuilt to fulfill prophecy.

Brothers and sisters, I would like to hear your input please.
Why a physical temple? Christ was given once for all and has gone into the true holy of holies in heaven. Why would God want another temple built on earth to resume animal sacrifices after Christ's once for all sacrificial fullfillment?
« Last Edit: April 06, 2004, 02:46:53 PM by ollie » Logged

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« Reply #2 on: April 04, 2004, 07:49:37 PM »

Brother Ollie –
I’ve been taught the same prophesy as Dreamweaver.  The temple will be rebuilt (by the Jews) and the Jews will resume animal sacrifices.  While we, as Christians, know the Blood of The Lamb was the last and ultimate sacrifice that saved us all, obviously the Jews don’t yet recognize that fact – although they will soon enough.  Smiley

I’m a dollar short when it comes to knowing much about current Judaism, but don’t they believe they must rebuild the temple before their “true messiah” will come?

May the Lord give us the open hearts and minds to receive His true word.  

JN
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« Reply #3 on: April 04, 2004, 09:09:40 PM »

JudgeNot
and dreamweaver i tend to think your thoughts are close.

   In Lukes version of the Olivet discourse ( mathew 24-25 the most important two chapters on prophecy, for our times in the bible), jesus prophesied that " jerusalem will be trampled by gentiles until the times of the gentiles are fulfilled"(luke 21:24). In the next four verses, the lord himself put a time frame on the " times of the gentiles," which began with the babylonian captivity in 606 b.c. and will continue to the end of tribulation and the coming of christ.
   
  How close are we to the end of " the times of the gentiles"? just a miricle away .  that the jews even exist today is a miracle , but it is just as miraculous that in 1967, for the first time since the babylonian captivity, they took chargeof jerusalem. that hes to be the most impressive fulfillment of bible prophecy in twenty centuries!

                         the butcha
   
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« Reply #4 on: April 04, 2004, 09:20:33 PM »

more on the subject Wink

In Isreals six day war, the war hero general,(moshe dayan) did a strange thing . after planting the israeli flag on the muslim dome of the rock ( wich now occupies the place where the jews must rebuild their temple), he decided to be concilietory toward his muslim captives. instead of keeping this site, coveted by every orthodox jew in the world, he decided to take down the flag and give the muslims control over that sacred spot.this would have started a holy war if the jews had dismantled the dome.
     
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« Reply #5 on: April 04, 2004, 09:25:31 PM »

cotinued

the last 50yrs. has seen a world wide  regathering and reestablishment of the nation of isreal which is now poised in precisely the setting requirred for the revealing of the antichrist and the start of the tribulation.
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« Reply #6 on: April 04, 2004, 09:27:16 PM »

cotinued

HOW IT CAME ABOUT

The gradual growth of the isreal nation from scattered skeleton to full body development is startling. As Ezekiels prophecy indicates"there was a noise, and ... a shaking ,and the bones came together, bone to bone"(37:7,kjv).

follow this,       " the sinews and the flesh came up upon them, and the skin covered them above: but there was no breath in them " ( 37:8kjv,).from a earth shaking advent (world war 1), the seemingly dead nationof isreal wasto gradually formulatea body, after which the spirit would be breathed in to it.

                     more later must tend to the chidren  Cheesy
« Last Edit: April 04, 2004, 09:40:34 PM by BUTCHA » Logged
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« Reply #7 on: April 04, 2004, 09:43:35 PM »

Why a physica;temple? Christ was given once for all and has gone into the true holy of holies in heaven. Why would God want another temple built on earth to resume animal sacrifices after Christ's once for all sacrificial fullfillment?

So that prophecy might be fulfilled, so that the Antichrist might be revealed, and so that the Lord can come the second time in power and great glory to crush the Beast, the False Prophet, and the Devil once and for eternity.

We cannot understand the rebuilding of the temple at Jerusalem without first turning to the book of Daniel , then to the book of Revelation, and then to 1st and 2nd Thessalonians. Matthew 24 ties everything together.

The Antichrist will allow animal sacrifices for 3 1/2 years, then bring them to an end when he sets up an image of himself in the temple and claims to be God, and demands worship as God. This is when God's judgments begin in earnest and the Day of the Lord is fulfilled, during which the wrath of the Lamb is revealed.
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« Reply #8 on: April 05, 2004, 03:07:50 AM »

Dan 9
27  And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

Mat 24
15  When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)

If one considers these two key scriptures, concerning the rebuilt temple and temple sacrifices, it is clear that only because of a peace treaty, would sacrifice be allowed on an alter at a rebuilt temple at the present site...................or...........it could be that the temple to be rebuilt is not built at what is presently considered to be the present Holy Site.  Where it is presummed Solomon's temple was built.

Besides it is not Solomon's temple that God's prophecy promises to rebuild, the fallen tabernacle of David (Amos 9:11), and it was not at what is considered the Holy Site today.

When King David, purchased Ornan's threshing floor  (at 1 Chr 21:15-29) for the site of the House of God, which Solomon, built, the Tabernacle of the Lord which Moses made in the wilderness, and the altar of the burnt offering, was at Gibeon.

After Solomon built the House of God, the Tabernacle (also Known as "the Tabernacle of David) was moved from Gibeon to Jerusalem, it was later moved to the City of David which is refferred to as Zion (2 Chr 5:1-2).

It could be, that this house of God, may not be on what is called the Holy Place on temple mount, it could be a hundred yards from the present location, this could be very significant, since Israel could use their desire to build a temple to enter into an peace treaty, which would allow them to resume sacrificial worship.

Whether there is something to this or no, either way, I think we all recognize, there will be somekind of sacricifial worship being conducted at the Holy Place (whereever it is) as per Daniel's prophecy..




Blessings,

Petro
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« Reply #9 on: April 06, 2004, 03:02:52 PM »

Why a physica;temple? Christ was given once for all and has gone into the true holy of holies in heaven. Why would God want another temple built on earth to resume animal sacrifices after Christ's once for all sacrificial fullfillment?

So that prophecy might be fulfilled, so that the Antichrist might be revealed, and so that the Lord can come the second time in power and great glory to crush the Beast, the False Prophet, and the Devil once and for eternity.

We cannot understand the rebuilding of the temple at Jerusalem without first turning to the book of Daniel , then to the book of Revelation, and then to 1st and 2nd Thessalonians. Matthew 24 ties everything together.

The Antichrist will allow animal sacrifices for 3 1/2 years, then bring them to an end when he sets up an image of himself in the temple and claims to be God, and demands worship as God. This is when God's judgments begin in earnest and the Day of the Lord is fulfilled, during which the wrath of the Lamb is revealed.
"The Antichrist will allow animal sacrifices for 3 1/2 years, then bring them to an end when he sets up an image of himself in the temple and claims to be God,"

Will the rebuilding of the temple then be through "the antichrist's manipulations in order for him to achieve the things you mention? Will these animal sacrifices, image, and claiming to be God be abominations. Will the rebuilt temple be an abomination?

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« Reply #10 on: April 06, 2004, 03:07:03 PM »

Dreamweaver,

Do you have any contributions to add to this?
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« Reply #11 on: April 08, 2004, 10:40:11 PM »

Why a physica;temple? Christ was given once for all and has gone into the true holy of holies in heaven. Why would God want another temple built on earth to resume animal sacrifices after Christ's once for all sacrificial fullfillment?

So that prophecy might be fulfilled, so that the Antichrist might be revealed, and so that the Lord can come the second time in power and great glory to crush the Beast, the False Prophet, and the Devil once and for eternity.

We cannot understand the rebuilding of the temple at Jerusalem without first turning to the book of Daniel , then to the book of Revelation, and then to 1st and 2nd Thessalonians. Matthew 24 ties everything together.

The Antichrist will allow animal sacrifices for 3 1/2 years, then bring them to an end when he sets up an image of himself in the temple and claims to be God, and demands worship as God. This is when God's judgments begin in earnest and the Day of the Lord is fulfilled, during which the wrath of the Lamb is revealed.
"The Antichrist will allow animal sacrifices for 3 1/2 years, then bring them to an end when he sets up an image of himself in the temple and claims to be God,"

Will the rebuilding of the temple then be through "the antichrist's manipulations in order for him to achieve the things you mention? Will these animal sacrifices, image, and claiming to be God be abominations. Will the rebuilt temple be an abomination?


OLLIE DO YOU KNOW THE ANSWER TO YOU QUISTIONS
WHAT DO YOU THINK?
       god bless ,sorry for yelling again
                butcha
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« Reply #12 on: April 08, 2004, 10:42:14 PM »

Why a physica;temple? Christ was given once for all and has gone into the true holy of holies in heaven. Why would God want another temple built on earth to resume animal sacrifices after Christ's once for all sacrificial fullfillment?

So that prophecy might be fulfilled, so that the Antichrist might be revealed, and so that the Lord can come the second time in power and great glory to crush the Beast, the False Prophet, and the Devil once and for eternity.

We cannot understand the rebuilding of the temple at Jerusalem without first turning to the book of Daniel , then to the book of Revelation, and then to 1st and 2nd Thessalonians. Matthew 24 ties everything together.

The Antichrist will allow animal sacrifices for 3 1/2 years, then bring them to an end when he sets up an image of himself in the temple and claims to be God, and demands worship as God. This is when God's judgments begin in earnest and the Day of the Lord is fulfilled, during which the wrath of the Lamb is revealed.
"The Antichrist will allow animal sacrifices for 3 1/2 years, then bring them to an end when he sets up an image of himself in the temple and claims to be God,"

Will the rebuilding of the temple then be through "the antichrist's manipulations in order for him to achieve the things you mention? Will these animal sacrifices, image, and claiming to be God be abominations. Will the rebuilt temple be an abomination?


OLLIE DO YOU KNOW THE ANSWER TO YOU QUISTIONS
WHAT DO YOU THINK?
       god bless ,sorry for yelling again
                butcha
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« Reply #13 on: April 12, 2004, 12:32:35 AM »

Dreamweaver,

Do you have any contributions to add to this?

Ha!!

Everything I could add has been covered.  Cry
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« Reply #14 on: July 27, 2004, 02:12:12 AM »

"If you don't use it, you lose it," explained Nachman Kupietzky when asked why he brings Jews to the Temple Mount.

The Chief Rabbinate is on record as banning Jews from treading on the mount due to its sacredness, but Kupietzky, like other observant Jews who habitually visit there, says he is careful to avoid that part of the mount which includes the Dome of the Rock, traditionally delineated as the area that contained the ancient Temple.

Channel 2 reported Monday that the present and past chief rabbis had reiterated the standing Chief Rabbinate ban on Jews ascending the mount, though spokesmen said they were not aware of any such declaration.

The Temple Mount was closed to non-Muslim visitors
last August at the onset of the Aksa Intifada.
Since the Temple Mount was reopened to non-Muslims, tourists and Jews have made 65,000 visits, according to police.

The Muslim Wakf does not permit Jews to pray on the Temple Mount. Rabbi David Elboim, head of Yeshivat Torat Habayit in Geula and a frequent leader of visitors to the Temple Mount, claims that Israeli police humiliate Jews as they check them for contraband prayer books, pulling out papers and asking if they are not prayer sheets.

He said that Internal Security Minister Tzahi Hanegbi's warnings that unspecified Jewish extremists might attack the site to upset the political process were driven by the desire for more funds and personnel.

"In the year since the Temple Mount reopened, there hasn't been as much as the sound of a flea. Instead of giving us a medal for good behavior, Hanegbi besmirches our good name. Jews around the world face the direction of the Temple Mount when they pray, yet on the site itself we are not allowed to pray."

Kupietzky says that he asks the groups he leads to wear caps and to look as much like tourists as possible. "Once my son joined one of my groups, and his kippa wasn't covered. We were delayed 20 minutes until a special police escort was found."

The years in which Jews were banned from visiting the Mount were the same ones in which Wakf construction wreaked havoc on the ancient site, said Elboim, pointing out that piles of destroyed antiquities could still be seen.

Elboim is one of the few haredim who ascend the Temple Mount, but he insisted that many rabbis do permit Jews to go up, so long as they immerse first in a mikva (ritual bath) and wear non-leather shoes.

He noted that even as mainstream a figure as Rabbi Moshe Tendler, son-in-law of the late leader of American Orthodoxy Rabbi Moshe Feinstein, planned to visit the Temple Mount next week.

From the kitchen in her Mount of Olives home, where she can see the Temple Mount as she cooks, Zipporah Piltz agrees with Elboim that there has been a discernible rise in the number of observant visitors to the mount. But she would like to see a greater representation of women.

Among those rabbis that do allow their congregants to ascend the mount, a majority do not allow women to do so, notes Piltz, because the rules of purity regarding their ascent are more complex.

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