tattoo

[Chesed]

Melody -

I'm not judging you. I am judging the act of tattooing our bodies. The question was asked if it is a sin. The Bible clearly says it is - there is no need for "interpretation"  because it is obvious. If you happen to have a tattoo, I don't think the less of you. One of my best friends has a tattoo and got it while she was a Christian.

The Pharisees and Sadducees also tried to interpret God's law for His people rather than worrying about their own relationship with God

Jesus' contention with the Pharisees and Sadducees was not about their law keeping, but about their law breaking hypocrisy and traditions of men: Mark 7:13 "Thus, with your tradition which you had handed down to you, you nullify the Word of God! And you do other things like this."

We need to be careful that we don't nullify the Word of God by our traditions and interpretations. We should be cautious not to "turn the grace of God into licentiousness" (Jude 1:4).

I can understand if you don't want to discuss this further. I don't want to frustrate you. If you already have a butterfly tattoo on your ankle, I wouldn't even suggest you remove it. But Gheetam asked about tattooing and if it is a sin. Maybe she is considering getting one. I would try to convince her not to. That's all.

Take care,
Chesed

 

[Homeskillet]

Hi there  

I just wanted to respond to this one statement even though it wasn't directed at me, if that' sok.

What reason is there for getting a tattoo? What is at the heart of it? Is it not vanity? Proverbs 31:30 -Charm is deceitful and beauty is vain, {But} a woman who fears the LORD, she shall be praised.

I can tell you that my reasons are not vanity. You may not believe it, but it's true.   That's all...I just wanted to point out that while some people get tattoos out of vanity, not all do.

Vanity is definitely not an issue I struggle with--those who know me, know this to be true. I don't wear makeup, get my nails done, or mess with fancy hair do's. Appearances really mean zilch to me.

My next tattoo will be done as a witnessing tool...don't knock it either. You'd be surprised how well it works.

[Melody]

If you already have a butterfly tattoo on your ankle, I wouldn't even suggest you remove it. But Gheetam asked about tattooing and if it is a sin.

Actually, my sister has the tattoo and it is of the dancing Snoopy with 2 Samuel 6:14 underneath.  Based on the questions she gets from perfect strangers, I would guess that it, along with her character, are a wonderful witness for the Lord...for a couple reasons.  First, by having a tattoo many people consider her approachable and, second, they'll ask about the tattoo and it leads into a discussion on God and the Bible.  btw...her tattoo was not done for vanity.

I believe that when the Bible talks about cutting or tattoos it may very well have been intended to warn the people against defacing their bodies with the marks of idols or other religions.  That is why I say it is in how you translate it.

[Luke O]

Well, there are also those who seriously doubt that homosexuality is a sin too, but it plainly says so in the Bible. I'm not trying to equate tattooing to homosexuality, but the Bible is very clear about both.

Am i the only one who thinks this is so cruel to homosexual people or people who have tattoo's, i hane nor am neither, but still i find this offensive.  I don't wanna sound like i'm 'having a go at religion' but i just find it so hard to buy into beliving everything that the bible says .......i doubt anyone feels the same way though.


Yo who is that guy with the butterfly tattoo on his ankle, cause Molly has the same tattoo, can someone give a brief definition of what the guy did n stuff, thanxs a lot guys

[Chesed]

Luke O -

Yes, some people find the Bible offensive. I make no apologies. If you are offended by Christians believing their Bible, maybe you're on the wrong forum.

Homeskillet and Melody -

Because of your posts, I am convinced that I should rob my local bank and give the booty to God as an offering. I figure He won't mind my stealing as long as I'm doing it for Him, right?

Well, you know I am speaking in jest. I am using an extreme example to point out your error.

Melody, if we use your way of interpreting the Bible, we can manipulate it to say anything we want it to say.

I think that using tattoos as a witnessing tool, is like offering to God a "sacrifice" that He didn't want -- and "To obey is better than sacrifice." (1 Samuel 15:22)

Take care,
Chesed

[Homeskillet]

And I will agree to disagree with you

Well, not about finding the Bible offensive, there isn't one part of God's word which offends me. It's my sword!

It's always nice getting others opinions, isn't it?  

Anyway, for anyone who may be interested here's an example of what I think I would like my next tattoo to be. (Still undecided)



Galations 6:17 reads "From now on let no one trouble me, for I bear in my body the marks of the Lord Jesus."

God bless.  

[Chesed]

Homeskillet -

Agree to disagree? Sure that's fine.

Hey that's a nice picture you posted of the tattoo. Can you get it as a press-on?

Take care,
Chesed  

[Homeskillet]

One press on coming up...Just for you!  

Hey--a question or two if I may--just to get your take and not necessarily to debate....k?

Do you shave your facial hair? (If you are not male then please ignore the question.  )

And...here is Lev 19:28 (the verse in question) in a couple different versions:

28   Ye shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print any marks upon you: I am the LORD. (KJV)

28 " 'Do not cut your bodies for the dead or put tattoo marks on yourselves. I am the LORD . (NIV)

28You shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor tattoo any marks on you: I am the LORD. (NKJV)

I interpret that the same way many scholars do--that we aren't to make cuttings or tattoo for the dead. (This was a pagan ritual in those times) So, if we're not doing it 'for the dead' then how does this verse really apply to us?

Just wondering what your take is, that's all.

[Chesed]

Homeskillet -

Well, I'm not a bearded lady - and I'm very thankful that I don't have facial hair to contend with... lol My husband, however, does have a beard/mustache.

I interpret that the same way many scholars do--that we aren't to make cuttings or tattoo for the dead. (This was a pagan ritual in those times) So, if we're not doing it 'for the dead' then how does this verse really apply to us?

Yes, the context of this chapter and verse is related to the prohibition of pagan rituals. I think the reason the commandment not to tattoo is lumped together in the same sentence with cutting our flesh is because both are related to skin. In the verse before it, it gives 2 prohibitions regarding the head: "(1)You shall not round off the side-growth of your heads (2)nor harm the edges of your beard. " Then it gives 2 prohibitions regarding skin: "(1)You shall not make any cuts in your body for the dead (2)nor make any tattoo marks on yourselves." Notice how the 2 verses read similarly.

Take care,
Chesed

[Homeskillet]

Nice to meet you SISTER

God bless.

[Melody]

Melody, if we use your way of interpreting the Bible, we can manipulate it to say anything we want it to say.

Chesed,
Yes, but if you are going to take the Bible literally, then you can't just pick and choose the parts you want...which you are doing.  If you take some of the laws of Leviticus literally, then you must take them all....or you are manipulating the bible to suit your motives.

Galatians has quite a bit to say about the laws of the Old Testament.  Paul wrote that our salvation is only through accepting Christ as our Saviour and Lord and that following the laws won't do it.  I don't have my Bible with me at the moment, but will be happy to forward some quotes about it.

[Brother Love]

TATTOOS & THE BIBLE

http://www.biblebelievers.com/watkins_tattoos/bible.html


The above link has a lot of info on this subject



<))><

[Melody]

TATTOOS & THE BIBLE

http://www.biblebelievers.com/watkins_tattoos/bible.html


The above link has a lot of info on this subject
<))><

Well I'll certainly admit they have a powerful lot of quotes from people who obviously agree with them.

Personally, I find it a little scary that some Christians believe they speak for God and are using the literal translation of the Bible (which btw has already been proven to have numerous errors of translation - both mistaken and politically motivated) as their basis of proof...and pick and choose which parts they adhere to.

[oneBook]

Melody,

in Hebrew, the latter part of the verse (Lev. 19:28) says  "u'ktovet ka'aka lo titnu bachem- ani YHVH"
which means-
and you (plural) shall not make in yourselves tatoos- I am the LORD.

Now I would guess that you don't read Hebrew, but this is a great time to start learning how.  I think it is a shame that all churches don't offer and strongly ephasize original language learning. The only reason that the text has survived this long is that there were those who did make a strong emphasis on learning the original languages.  (I'll get off my "original language" soapbox now).

As far as taking it literaly, are you saying that God didn't tell Israel not to tatoo themselves?  If you were part of Israel and Moses taught you not to tatoo yourself, how would you understand that?

When reading the text, you need to take the literal parts literally (though they may have deeper symbolic meaning etc), the poetic parts as poetry, narritive as narritive, etc.
In other words, genre plays into how a verse is to be understood as well as textual and historic context.

If you don't have the original language understanding, then you need to consult other people who have that understanding. I would recommend that you find some Bible scholars, and consult them before accepting the current practices of Christian youth (or what I am telling you).  Just because someone is a Christian, doesn't make what they do right as you pointed out.  

God speaks for himself through His word, but in translation is where we get bogged down.  I think that experientialism has been replacing our Biblical foundation for some time now.  Experience is good, and all believers will have experience with God to draw upon, but we also need to heed and take seriously (literally) what God says. If the word is not the foundation, then we will never be one in Messiah, but each man will do what is right in his own eyes (Deut. 12: worshipping God however they want.  This has led to the rise of such things as snake handling, and "Christian" nudist colonies!!

In all fairness, I realize that most believers who do get tatoos, just do it for fun, or to be a "witness", however misguided this may be.

If one does use it as a witness, and then the person one is witnessing to starts to read the Bible from front to back, it will then become clear that there is a conflict between the life of the witnessing person and the Bible, and that will just confuse them.  Besides, God doesn't need us to think of gimicks to attract people to Him, He draws them Himself and appoints the people He desires to talk to them.

BTW, Galations doesn't deal with the Biblical law, but the rabbinic law of conversion through circumcision.

If you are ever in need of a Bible while posting, use one of the online Bible search tools-
http://biblestudytools.net/OnlineStudyBible

They have several versions, and you can search for a phrase, etc.  They also have some study tools available as well.

I want to emphasize that I am only discussing tatoos and the Bible, I'm not judging you or anyone else on this matter.

As far as your comment that it is full of errors, are you saying the Bible is full of errors? Who were you saying was using the literal translation, the writer on the link, or Chesed?

Peace and Blessings,
-oneBook

[Brother Love]

TATTOOS & THE BIBLE

http://www.biblebelievers.com/watkins_tattoos/bible.html


The above link has a lot of info on this subject
<))><

Well I'll certainly admit they have a powerful lot of quotes from people who obviously agree with them.

Personally, I find it a little scary that some Christians believe they speak for God and are using the literal translation of the Bible (which btw has already been proven to have numerous errors of translation - both mistaken and politically motivated) as their basis of proof...and pick and choose which parts they adhere to.

OK Melody, enjoy your own religion and write yourself a new bible. I just posted the link.

Have a GRRRREAT Day