Hello,
Understood, I'm interested in the conversation.  With regards to admin and moderators, I stand corrected.  My intent, was that it was posted by a person with authority to do so, and I was making sure that either the link or the posted information would be acceptable.  It was in deference to the moderators / admins of this important site.  I am appreciative of your stand.
Sincerely,
Mangoman (Mango Man)

Here's the intro to a series of 13 articles that Ambassador Alan Keyes has recently written.  I will also post the first article.  I invite conversation and thoughts on this.  I am by no means moderating this.  I want to participate in this.

The crisis of the republic
An introduction

The 2008 presidential election cycle is well under way, hurried along by decisions of more populous states like New York and California to move their primaries to February 5, 2008.

For some time now, I have been receiving emails asking my view of the election and the candidates who are competing for nomination, both Democrats and Republicans. Some people have urged me to get involved as I did in 1996 and 2000. Since I ran against him in Illinois in 2004, some of the media have sought my comments on Barack Obama's campaign and personality.

Frankly though, I don't think it's constructive to discuss candidates and personalities until we have a good sense of what is at stake this time around in the choice the American people will make.

Turning point

For a long time, I have believed that the 2008 election would be a turning point for the survival of the American republic--our nation's system of constitutional government based on the sovereignty of the American people and respect for their inalienable rights.

During the past several decades, the trend in American life and politics has been adverse to just about everything needed to sustain American liberty. In our intellectual life, we have embraced theories and concepts that are simply incompatible with the ideas of human equality and inalienable rights that shaped our institutions of self-government. In the moral realm, we have legitimized attitudes and practices incompatible with the self-reliance and self-discipline that make limited government practicable. We have lived with policies on taxation and our economic life that destroy the rights, self-sufficiency, and initiative of the people. We have thoughtlessly adopted--and allowed our elites to implement--an understanding of political life that destructively erodes the sovereignty of the people.

The end result is a crisis so pervasive that our preoccupation with its many symptoms and manifestations keeps us from appreciating its overall extent.

Train of abuses

In many ways, the American people are like a monarch whose legitimacy, character, and resources are being systematically eroded by those who mean to replace his rule with their own.

One advisor tells him that the borders are under assault, and that parts of his kingdom must be sold off or surrendered in order to defend them. Another encourages him to kill off members of his family who might challenge him for the throne, while seducing him to waste his time in lustful pursuits with willing partners procured for the purpose. A third assuages his guilt over these crimes and vices by convincing him to abandon the stern morality of his ancestors, and turn from the religion that required it.

Distracted, demoralized, by turns arrogant, resentful, ashamed, and confused, he stumbles from one preoccupation to another, never realizing the truth--that each issue and temptation is only one part of a train of abuses that will end in his removal from the throne.

Upcoming series of articles

In a series of articles over the next several weeks, I will examine this crisis and its bearing on the choice we face in 2008. In the course of this examination, I will deal with a wide range of issues, but my main purpose will be to place each and all of them in the larger context of the threat to our sovereignty as a people.

I hope that by the end of this effort, those like myself who deeply cherish the hope for humanity America is supposed to represent will be moved to view the 2008 election with the same sense of urgent foreboding that I do. I hope they will realize that the American people must create and seize the opportunity to break free from the grip of the ambitious, self-serving elites who have been manipulating them toward destruction.

We must find a voice that can rally us to implement the vision of restored faith, self-discipline, and self-government that alone can save our sovereign constitutional power and America's identity as the land of the free.

© 2007 Alan Keyes

Hello,
I was wondering if we could post the link to Ambassador Alan Keyes' website which has 13 articles which might be pertinant to good political discussion.  If we can't post the link, can we copy the articles and credit them to him to avoid plagarism.  I think he has some good ideas.  I am aware of the rules concerning website links.  I ask, because of the link posted at the start of the Biblical Creation vs. Evolution thread by the admin to get people to engage in intelligent conversation.
Sincerely,
MangoMan

Hey,
I'd like to visit the website that was mentioned at the start of this thread.  Bronzesnake had put a lot of effort into it.  Unfortunately, the link is bad.  Has his sight moved.
Sincerely,
MangoMan

Good Morning,
There is no verse in the Bible that says Rock music is dead wrong.  I guess where I got my dander up was that the man was speaking from the pulpit making a declarative statement.  I agree we make our own opinions on this one, be they along generational lines or personal preference.  I am open to wise instruction.

I can see with my own eyes what bands have sacrificed to make it to the top in the secular world and the price being at the top has been.  I know that lyrics are messages that can get stuck in this head of mine.  To borrow an engineering phrase GIGO garbage in garbage out.  It's a fine line where you draw that line.  I will say that I have enjoyed many a secular tune.

I know that Satan is the Great Deceiver.  I have learned on my quest that the first musical instrument was created prior to the dawn of man.  According to the Bible, when God created Satan, he was created with a tabret and pipes in hand.  I would surmise that Satan has great prowess in music, as I'm sure God wouldn't have wanted to listen to unskilled drum play and squeaky pipes a blowing.    I also know that according to the Bible, there is nothing new under the sun, music is not new.  We ourselves are keenly affected by music and God made us.  Satan knows that music can be used for ill-work.

With regards to Christian Rock...  I firmly believe that if it was created to honor and glorify God, then amen, go for it.  Doesn't mean I have to enjoy it.  I personally look for sincerity in music.  Sometimes I wonder if the intent is to honor God or make Christian music because it sells, but that too is again subject to personal opinion.  God knows the heart.

BTW, I really appreciate your tagline Brother Jerry.

Thanks for engaging me in this conversation.  My musical tastes run the gamut.  I love many of the olde hymns.  Many of the new worship songs are well loved as well.  Keith Green's music blows me away with his sincerity.  Have a good day.

Sincerely,
MangoMan 

Hey Everyone,

I've finished Safely Home by Randy Alcorn, and I was moved by it.  It centered around the persecuted church in China.

I thought I'd mention Stu Weber's Tender Warrior.  Good book for men.  I'm an expert at reading books and putting them down before finishing them to start another.    Alas, I need to go back and finish this one.

Sincerely,
MangoMan

[Am disappointed with her sudden divorce and remarriage. Am disappointed with her conversion to mainstream (secular) music.]

I enjoy her older songs.  I feel they are very sincere... love El Shaddai.  Am disappointed with her sudden divorce and remarriage.  Am disappointed with her conversion to mainstream (secular) music.  Kathy Traccoli seems to have music that both Christians and mainstream like.  I also have heard her testimony rocks.  Still single, and trusting the Lord.  Heard that she would like to be married, but is secure in her singleness.  I know we're all human, and those of us who are Christians are sinners saved by grace.  I believe in supporting other Christians when their actions and words demonstrate their love for God.
Just my 2 cents worth,
MangoMan

[**** MangoMan in '08 - Free Mangos for Everyone ****]

Hello Everyone,

I'm a noob here.  Have already enjoyed the good natured banter here.

I go to a conservative church and like the teaching.  I moved out to SoCal from the Midwest where I had attended a church that had peppy music.  I don't have a problem with peppy worship music, but I can see where some think it might be used to hype the people.  The true intent should be to honor and glorify God.  It should be heartfelt for sure, we've been blood bought.  We had an associate pastor step in at the church I'm going to.  He's older and an elder in the church.  I like him.  I respect him, but he succeeded in getting my dander up.  During his sermon from the pulpit, he made an unsubstantiated claim that Rock music is bad... of the devil.  I've been told that includes Christian Rock.

I treat this subject delicately, because I don't want it to spiral into a vitrolic spittin contest.  I talked with a friend who goes to the church, and they affirmed the associate pastor, but based it on personal opinion that secular rock was bad, therefore Christian rock having been derived from the secular was equally as bad.  My dander was starting to get the best of me.

I approached another friend outside of that church, but a Christian as well.  She said something pretty cool.  Delve into the Word on a Biblical Quest, so I'm kind of like on a journey now.  It's been fun.  I use web tools for referencing the Bible, and I found a site that referenced Hebrew musical instruments.  I want to continue this journey, please pray for me.

I briefly looked at what other people on the web had to say about Christian rock and was sorely disappointed.  We're some example to the world on that account.  Both sides are strongly opinionated and have not conducted themselves wisely in my eyes.

I know that this is a tough issue the Christian church faces today.  I've heard that churches have split over this.  It seems to be drawn on generational lines.  At my old church, a member of the band got an earful from one of the older guys... that because the older people had most of the money, the younger people should remember that and not forget the hymns.

What can we do about this, before it rips about the church.  So much for the Devil ripping away, let the Christians do it for him.

Sincerely,
MangoMan

**** MangoMan in '08 - Free Mangos for Everyone ****