Hypocrisy - Clothes.

[sincereheart]

What if your *best* doesn't meet the standards of *good enough* for the rest of the congregation?  

Should a believer not attend services until they have the finery that the congregation deems acceptable? Or do we patronizingly accept them until they *can do better*?  

Why is it that we KNOW that Christ says clothes don't matter but we say, "I think... and I believe..."  

Are those that are better dressed more saved?  

Are we to only worship on only ONE morning?  

Must we also *dress-up* in our "prayer closet"?  

What of those Christians in other countries who are imprisoned for sharing the Good News? Are they dressed-up enough for Christ?  

Are we really worshipping on Sunday morning if we're worried about the clothing of others?  

Matthew 23:27-28
"Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You are like whitewashed tombs, which look beautiful on the outside but on the inside are full of dead men's bones and everything unclean. In the same way, on the outside you appear to people as righteous but on the inside you are full of hypocrisy and wickedness.

Sounds like the outside just isn't what's important!  

Colossians 3:12
Therefore, as God's chosen people, holy and dearly loved,
clothe yourselves with
compassion,
kindness,
humility,
gentleness and
patience.

 

[Shylynne]

I'm pleased someone sees part of what I'm getting at. In no way do I believe that "dressing up" makes us more or less effective as Christians, or more or less acceptable in God's sight. Like silver said, its a question of respect and effort. Its a personal thing. But what Silver mentioned about the way people wore "rock t shirts" was a good example of the teen culture that has invaded church these days. As you might have gathered I have a great dislike for the spirit of this age.. the age of compromise, at least thats how i see it. I wonder how many times I've seen teenagers wearing t shirts promoting some heavy metal band in a church service. A band that dishonours God and is an abomination in His sight.

Wow, I really do sound like an old man don't I? lol

The reason that "teen culture" and all that goes along with it, gets to me so much, is because I see all its effects in churches in my area all the time.  They aren't positive effects either. It seems to just go another step towards the permissiveness towards sin.

But ok the original thread was a lighthearted one about clothes.. so.. lol I wont get sidetracked here.

I seen what you were "getting at" from your first post, seeing doesnt mean agreeing  

If its as you say: "its a question of respect and effort. Its a personal thing" , then why do we then make it our personal business how others dress  

No you dont sound like an old man. (I am perfectly old fashioned according to my teens   )  BUT you do sound like you are talking out of both sides of your mouth  

I have to wonder why its OK for "good" christian men and women to dye thier hair black or whatever "accceptable" color, but its just WRONG if  someone chooses to go blue or pink  

I wonder why we`ve been sticking earrings in our ears for centuries, yet stick it some other place and our standing before God is questioned  

I wonder why we presume to decide what is "acceptable" in attire    When did that stop being Gods judement call, and become ours    

Truth as I see it is, if we spent as much time examining ourselves as we really need to, we wouldnt be troubling ourselves much over what someone else "looks" like.

"teen culture" and all that goes along with it, gets to me so much, is because I see all its effects in churches"

I`m sorry that made me laugh!  If the teen culture is "effecting" the church, then the "church" needs examined to see if theres any life changing power of God within its fellowship,  thats not something the teens are responsible for!

[Shylynne]

"What bothers me about the church today is that people intentionally dress down "

Funny, what bothers me is that people intentionally dress up!  


"But what is this saying to the Lord?"

It`s saying I believe your Word Lord, that I can come to you just as I am, that giving you my "best" has nothing to do with my apparel, for they are all as much rags as my righteousness!

[sincereheart]

It’s not about our ‘best’ meeting the standards of anybody; it’s about respecting the Lord with the best of our ability.

But the Bible establishes that our *best* has nothing to do with our attire.  
So it really is about dressing to impress those that attend.  
1 Samuel 16:7  But the LORD said unto Samuel, Look not on his countenance, or on the height of his stature; because I have refused him: for the LORD seeth not as man seeth;
for man looketh on the outward appearance, but the LORD looketh on the heart.

I do follow what you guys are saying. I was raised in the same man-made traditions. But I have noticed that the more affluent the area, the more *dressing up* that is expected.

Sincereheart, you said, “the outside just isn't what's important,” I understand why you say that because God sees the heart.  But also realize that the outside is a reflection of the inside if it’s done intentionally, and Christians today intentionally dress down because they think they have a right to do it in an age of grace.  In reality, this is hurting the church more than helping it, but that’s another topic.

Or maybe they just dress the way they do because they focus on what's important - and it's NOT the clothing.  
I am curious as to how you *know* the thoughts of others?

Here’s another thought:  There are many people who dress very nice for their job during the week, but when it comes to Sunday morning they intentionally dress down.  When I hear them talk about it they say, “Well I have to play dress up all week, I don’t want to do it on Sunday too.”  But what is this saying to the Lord?  That the person’s work is more important and more respected than the God who gave them life?  Because that’s exactly what their actions are saying.  

Yes, there are *many* who are required to dress a certain way for their jobs.
Matthew 22:21
Then saith he unto them, Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar's; and unto God the things that are God's.

"Clothes" are NOT the things of God.  

My husband is a retired Marine. According to your logic, he SHOULD have worn camouflage when he attended church on active duty? Now that he's retired, he works full-time and wears jeans to work. So he SHOULD wear jeans?   Or do you mean that those that are required to dress-up for work are required to dress up to worship?   Or maybe those that aren't required to dress-up for work should dress-up for services even though God doesn't require it?  

I'm really not trying to be difficult.   But I have attended 'churches' all over and have been amazed at what man requires of people that God doesn't.  

Wouldn't it be an amazing thing if we just looked at those unkempt people and those teen things and see them the way God does?

I met the wife of a pastor who thought overalls were a sin. Didn't matter if they were velvet or denim. It's a sin and that's that.   Yet, this particular woman weighed over 300 pounds and was literally the first in line at 'eating meetings' and her manners were atrocious.   But she thought dressing up with clothes from Wal-Mart made her more spiritual. The Bible covers gluttony and clothing.
She dismissed it all because she *thought*......

Another area we were stationed in was a high-dollar area. The people there thought clothes from Wal-Mart were an insult to God. So you had to spend X number of dollars and have X brand to avoid sinning.  

Where does it all end? Why can't God's word suffice?  
 

[Shylynne]

Who? Adam and Eve
What they wore: Nothing

Genesis 2:25 and 3:7, 21
When God first made people, they didn’t wear any clothes - they didn’t need to. They lived in a warm climate and because there was no sin they didn’t feel ashamed about being naked. God had created them perfect; it wasn’t until they disobeyed God that they felt ashamed of their bodies. The first clothes were made from leaves, until God made them some more permanent garments from animal skins. God made us clothes to cover our shame, not to improve the way we look.

According to some of you, God SHOULD have FASHIONED something a little better, leaves dont make the BEST clothes!

Who? King David
What he wore: Linen ephod

2 Samuel 6:12-22
David was a man who was totally in love with God. He was so excited about God’s presence coming into his town that he worshipped God, dancing with all of his strength wearing only an ephod (the undergarments of a priest), rather than the flash royal gears he could have worn. David wasn’t at all concerned with what people thought of him; he was totally focused on praising God. David’s wife, Michal, was not at all impressed and she laid into him about it. She was thinking only of how David’s appearance might reflect on her instead of rejoicing in God’s blessing on their city. For her pride and her judgement of David, God did not let her have any children after that (doesn’t sound like she would have been a very good mum anyway!) David was more interested in what God thought than the people around him.

According to some of you, David should have been utterly ASHAMED before God and all His people!

Who? John the Baptist
What he wore: Camel hair

Matthew 3:4
John the Baptist was the man God called to pave the way for Jesus coming to earth. John lived in the desert, ate locusts and wore crusty clothes made of camel hair. John didn’t care about his clothes or what he looked like - he cared about people turning away from sin and back to God. And the people didn’t care about John’s clothes - they flocked to him in droves to hear him preach and to be baptised by him. John attracted people by the quality of his life and the integrity of his speech rather than by his appearance.

According to some of you, John should have went home and got DRESSED UP before he dared stand in a pulpit!

Who? Us
What we wear: Rags of righteousness
Rom 13:14  But put on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make not provision for the flesh, to fulfil the lusts thereof.

Still going to preach give me that showtime religion?  

[Soldier4Christ]

I have seen and heard the topic of clothes and physical appearance in every forum and every church that I have gone to.

Why are we more concerned more with the outward appearance than we are the inward appearance. It is a concern of worldly things and not spiritual that we are putting our emphasis on.

2Co 5:12  For we commend not ourselves again unto you, but give you occasion to glory on our behalf, that ye may have somewhat to answer them which glory in appearance, and not in heart.

2Co 10:7  Do ye look on things after the outward appearance? If any man trust to himself that he is Christ's, let him of himself think this again, that, as he is Christ's, even so are we Christ's.

[ollie]

On the other hand, do we need to look like we just finished slopping the hogs? The outer self is a reflection of the inner being and they should be in unison in Christ unless one is a hypocrite and shows substance on the exterior while being shallow in the interior.

ollie  

[Shylynne]

why yes ollie,  I think we can even worship WHILE slopping the hogs!

The outer self is a reflection of the inner being

ah...not what Jesus said...but if that were true...what finery many poor saints  should be attired in!  

[sincereheart]

The outer self is a reflection of the inner being and they should be in unison unless one is a hypocrite and shows substance on the exterior while being shallow in the interior.

Hmmmm..... Sad. While Christ walked on earth, what did He wear? I don't remember mention of Him having the finest clothing from the finest materials. Jewels sewn into the hem, maybe?  
So with so much substance on the INTERIOR of Christ, why wasn't He clothed outwardly in the same fashion? I know He isn't a hypocrite.  

[sincereheart]

Here's a revolutionary concept:
All those who think clothing is important could maybe go out and buy a brand new wardrobe for a homeless family. Of course, the family would still be homeless - but at least they'd look nice walking the streets.  

What would happen if the over-indulged used their clothing budget to actually serve the Lord? I don't mean giving away all the clothes they've outgrown while they go and buy a new warddrobe. I mean actually GIVE that money to a place that's needed? To help feed a hungry family? To give out Bibles to those who don't have one - whether saved or unsaved?

God wants our hearts. Period! He doesn't need us to parade around like peacocks and call it worshipping Him.  

If how I dress is important, then I guess I can just pop on an evening gown and be the best Christian around.  

Why is it that those who say it's unimportant have posted much Scripture while those that say it is, haven't posted any?

[Soldier4Christ]

Here's a revolutionary concept:
All those who think clothing is important could maybe go out and buy a brand new wardrobe for a homeless family. Of course, the family would still be homeless - but at least they'd look nice walking the streets.  

What would happen if the over-indulged used their clothing budget to actually serve the Lord? I don't mean giving away all the clothes they've outgrown while they go and buy a new warddrobe. I mean actually GIVE that money to a place that's needed? To help feed a hungry family? To give out Bibles to those who don't have one - whether saved or unsaved?

God wants our hearts. Period! He doesn't need us to parade around like peacocks and call it worshipping Him.  

If how I dress is important, then I guess I can just pop on an evening gown and be the best Christian around.  

Why is it that those who say it's unimportant have posted much Scripture while those that say it is, haven't posted any?

AMEN!


James 2: 1-7

[nChrist]

Sincereheart,

AMEN SISTER!!!

I would say only one thing about clothing worn to church - it should be modest, especially for women. That would obviously apply to men too. "Modest" should be a term that is applied by Christians to much more than just clothes.

A clothing contest about who has the most expensive or best looking is really pretty sad when we all know there are people who are hungry, sick, and without shelter. "Modest" could also be a term that describes what it costs to wear something when someone else is starving to death.

Love In Christ,
Tom

Psalms 119:133  Order my steps in thy word: and let not any iniquity have dominion over me.

[Shylynne]

well the girl  done started a revolution!

I knew  someday she would!  

[LennyToo]

If you spend more time worrying about what to wear to church, than you do on getting there early (or on time) then I think you need some time on the knees. Myself, I like to be comfortable, and as long as what I have on is clean, then I wear what I can worship God in without fear of exposure least I should fall out in the Spirit. Save the lap robes for someone else.
As Christians, we need to not obsess with the physical; we are after all just visiting this earth, and even our bodies are put on....

[sincereheart]

Yes, modestly!  

1 Timothy 2:9-10
I also want women to dress modestly, with decency and propriety,
not with braided hair or gold or pearls or expensive clothes,
but with good deeds,
appropriate for women who profess to worship God.

"Modest" should be a term that is applied by Christians to much more than just clothes.

Wow! I had never thought of this!  

Thank you!  

Hmmmm... So is it 'modest' (i.e. 'in moderation') to spend money on new clothing while so many are in need?  

Matthew 25:42-45 For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.'
"They also will answer, 'Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?'
"He will reply, 'I tell you the truth, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.'