Suicides

[Symphony]

"Sin" rates are sometimes affiliated with certain other types of social behaviors or realities in an attempt to explain them - like, for instance, suicides happen more frequently in certain age groups, or, in one I heard recently, divorce among the different church groups seems to be most common among Baptists, etc.

Some years ago I heard suicides among church groups were highest in a certain denomination.  I don't want to name that denomination here, since I never heard any confirmation of it, but have only wondered since then.

Does anyone know if there is such a statistic, how the study was done - if one was done, and maybe any conjecture on what it might be that would cause people in a particular denomination to sustain a higher rate of suicide?

[nChrist]

Symphony,

I only have very general information about suicide, but I'll share what I have. This is generic, and not specifically tied to a church.

People who commit suicide fall into several very general categories:

Those who feel useless and worthless.

Those who feel like a total failure at everything.

Those who don't feel a sense of belonging anywhere.

Those who have unbearable pain and incurable suffering.

Those with severe forms of mental illness.

Those with long-term self-destructive problems like drug addictions and alcohol abuse.

Those with unbearable guilt about something they have done.
____________________________

A Christian can easily see Biblical help and answers for many of the above problems. As an example, the absolute assurance for forgiveness of sin would help many people. As another example, the absolute knowledge that Jesus loves us, regardless of what we have done in the past would help many people. Here's a big one:  the absolute assurance of Salvation and belonging to Jesus would help many people.

Some religious teachings actually push some people further and further into depression and thoughts of suicide. If someone is taught that they must be perfect and without sin to be saved, sooner or later they will discover that they can't belong to Jesus because they fail. Some churches actually teach that committing a sin results in loss of Salvation and going to hell. I could easily see how that would cause deep depression and thoughts of suicide for some people. They don't realize the teaching is false, they simply know that they failed and give up their hope. I could easily see that false teaching of many types would be more than many people could bear, especially when they give up hope with total failure.

On the other side of the coin, the reality of the GOOD NEWS can and does help a lot of people who are miserable and suffering. I'm talking about the pure and simple preaching of Jesus Christ and the Cross, HIS unconditional love for us, HIM forgiving our sins, and HIM being our Lord and Saviour forever. The preaching of Jesus and the Cross can give a person the ultimate knowledge of belonging and worth. Jesus Christ knew that we were worth dying for, and He wants to adopt us as children, giving us an eternal inheritance of joy and life with HIM.

It's very sad that many false teachers drive the suffering further into depression and thoughts of suicide. Jesus Christ does the opposite. I think that the answer to your original question involves many churches, not just one.

Love In Christ,
Tom

[MalkyEL]

I agree with you, BEP.  I have also run into many people who are told [by the church] that if they suffer from depression, suicidal thoughts, and a broad range of emotional and mental disorders that they are not really saved.  If they were saved, then Jesus would have taken care of it.

These same people have been rejected and kicked out of church [across all denominational venues].  Their view is that God does not love them; that He should have rescued them and didn't - therefore what use is He; why should they want to turn to Jesus when the church who is supposed to be His Hands and Feet, have turned on them and refused to help them - and have judged them as pagans.

And of course, last but not least - these people are told if they commit suicide they will go to hell.

Can't you feel the love? . . .

Shalom, Nana

[nChrist]

MalkyEL Said:

I agree with you, BEP.  I have also run into many people who are told [by the church] that if they suffer from depression, suicidal thoughts, and a broad range of emotional and mental disorders that they are not really saved.  If they were saved, then Jesus would have taken care of it.

Sister Nana,

Yes, some churches do that and worse. Some of the examples are sickening:

i.e.

You're sick because you haven't yielded yourself to God or you haven't given enough money to God.

AND, you might see the preacher that said the above wearing glasses. I wonder if his eyes were weak for a reason.  

This really isn't a laughing matter at all. Some people believe everything they are told. AGAIN, that's why I love the plain and simple preaching of Jesus and the Cross. It's a proven fact that all people will suffer some degree of an emotional or mental problem of some sort during their life. Grief and suffering are reality sooner or later in this short life. All of those preachers who teach Christians you are sick because you are lost all eventually get sick and die.

The health and wealth by giving preachers also make me pretty sick. I know elderly people who do without medicine to send money to someone living in many mansions and driving 50 thousand dollar cars. Please don't get me wrong - I believe in giving. I just don't view five 3,000 square foot mansions and a Rolls Royce as God's work for a preacher.

When someone is hanging from their last thread of hope, I pray that they find Jesus and not someone selling a counterfeit.

Love In Christ,
Tom

[Symphony]

Thank you, bep.  Some good points.

[Saved_4ever]

I don't think that if you get depressed you are not saved but more often than not I feel one should look towards Jesus for help before medicine.  I mean seriously look towards Jesus.

Before I was saved I was depressed and even suicidal at one point.  It's been easier since being saved though.  I don't know how to explain it though except it's just different.

Even when my father died last year it was different.  I was definatley filled with sorrow for many reasons but I never once contmeplated suicide.  I did however get greatly peturbed with the LORD because I wasn't understanding his plan and I felt he wasn't giving up any answers.  It's kind of hard too when even you Pastor who is older than you father (my dad was about to turn 46 last year) still has his own father.  It seemed like noone had any good advice and the answers I got seemed empty.  I know BEP knows I kind of snapped at him before. (sorry BEP) Even after going though it all though I can't say I know what to say or do for someone else except I understand how the feel somewhat, but I really have no advice to give either.

It seems the LORD has blessed my family with several things and I think Him for them all, but part of my is still greaty distraught to think that my fathers death was only for a monetary gain.  I'd give it all back if I could, especially because I feel like I failed to really get on my father about salvation.

Ok anyhow now that I am done rambling I'm not a fan of medication it is only like a bandaid to a problem.

I am also curious about the divorce rate amongst baptists.  Does that include all "baptists" and is the divorce rate before or after salvation?

[nChrist]

Saved_4ever,

Brother, I'm very happy that you are back with us. I understand what you mean about not knowing what to say to help others, even though you have recently endured grief. I agree completely that the only right answers are in Jesus. Many here have prayed for both of us, and both of us have prayed for each other. I believe strongly in the power of prayer, and I also believe that is part of our joy in fellowship with each other.

I have reflected many times on the past and wished I could have helped someone better or more. The prayers of others during times of illness and loss have helped me more than anything else. I consider it to be a matter of love and joy to pray for my brothers and sisters in Christ.

There is something else that is hard to understand unless you have actually stood in the shoes of someone else during a time of great trial, illness, or sorrow. These times can be times of being the closest to our Lord and Saviour. They can and do many times result in more Grace, more Love, and more Strength in Jesus. Brother, I hope and pray that happened for you. It did happen for me when I faced the possibility of my own death twice, and I give thanks for the many blessings God has bestowed on me and my family. Knowing that I didn't deserve His Blessings was simply more cause for thanks.

Brother, you and your family are still a matter of prayer here. And, our sweet Christians here are still praying for me. It's just another reason to give thanks for sweet Christian friends who love each other.

Love In Christ,
Tom