I know I'm new here,but...

[nChrist]

Oklahoma Howdy to Mick,

You said:

You see,my "denomination" is the Lord Jesus Christ HIMSELF:)

(PS:-Petro,as usual i look at the shotgun spread of different versions and try to use a reasonable centre of gravity to quote contexturally in modern english,it seems the logical way)

Mick, there's a larger problem here somewhere. How can you have the Lord Jesus Christ as your denomination if you don't believe HE IS GOD? Jesus Christ is the core of Salvation, so not believing HE IS GOD leaves you with nothing, modern English or otherwise. You've tried numerous times to prove that Jesus is not God, so what do you have?

I have Jesus Christ as my LIVING LORD AND SAVIOUR, VERY GOD, THE CREATOR, ALMIGHTY GOD, THE LORD OF HOSTS. Without this, you have nothing.

Love In Christ,
Tom

[Mick]

Speaking of Judgment Day,Jesus said :- "No one knows about that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father." (Mark 13:32)

So if he WAS God,why would he say that?

[nChrist]

Speaking of Judgment Day,Jesus said :- "No one knows about that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father." (Mark 13:32)

So if he WAS God,why would he say that?

Mick,

There's a whole thread already devoted to that with tons of Scripture. However, if you don't believe in studying your Bible, I guess you'll never figure it out. Mick, I'm afraid you're going to have to open your Bible. It's time to wake up.

Love In Christ,
Tom

[Petro]

Speaking of Judgment Day,Jesus said :- "No one knows about that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father." (Mark 13:32)

So if he WAS God,why would he say that?

mick,

Look, you didn't hatch from an egg, you were born and are a product of your father and mother.

As a son you never new the appointed time when your father would decide to come nor go someplace from home, and for you claim that Jesus needs to know, the whole of His fathers work throughout eternity, is nonsense.

Jesus is fully God, while fully a man, As God He possessed Gods Spirit, the bible is clear about this, as a man He possessed all of the attributes of man, He wasn't born into this earth knowing everything, in order to be fully representative of men, he needed to possess all of there attributes including their limitations, we can see this clearly as we study scriptures, ask yourself did Jesus sleep at night, did he get tired as normal men do, the bible says he did, look at Jhn 4:6 tells us Jesus was tired after the journey and sat on the well at about the sixth hour, He was wore out from the journey.  Did He cry, the bible says He cried at according to the shortest verse in the bible, Jhn 11:35.

Did He fear and show anxiety, the scriptures describe His last night prior to His crucifixion at Luke 22:39-44, that he sweated as it were great drops of blood, such was His agony , being strengthened by and Angel.

And of course we read at Mathew 27:50,

"Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost."


In simple english, this means He died.

So the scriptures tells us;

Lk 24
46  Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:

Phil 2
6  Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
7  But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
8  And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
9  Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:
10  That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;
11  And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

Note verse 11, clearly it says at this verse, "Jesus Christ is Jehovah" to the glory of God the father.

So mick, ole buddy;   It is not important that you believe the trinity to get yourself saved, but if God grants you repentance and saves you (which He desires to do), you will believe the teaching of GODS WORD.



Blessings,
Petro

[ravenloche]

But why do we need different denominations anyway?
I belong to none,hence i'm free of the shackles they impose on people by way of ritual,ceremony and rigid doctrines.


Heb 10:25 Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.
Do not go to services as you put it because of rituals,ect-or
is it because the minister points out this thing call sin? We do
not impose anything on anyone, we simply exhort people to
obey the will of God, and follow the teachings of Messiah.
"rigid doctrine."----Indeed we have a rigid doctrine: it is based
upon the words of Jesus, who summed up to laws written by
the hand YHVH in two rigid doctrines.
 1)Love God with your whole heart, mind soul, body, and will
 2)love your neighbor as you do yourself
these are surely some terrible and rigid requirements, and are
much too difficult to follow!


I think denoms appeal to people because they do their thinking and teaching for them,and give them a sense of security through belonging to a group.

That has got to be the most assinine thing you have had the
audacity to say so far!!!!!deamons rely upon the baser
aspects of humanity, and use them to manipulate both those
they possess, and those around them..
The scriptures say that the thief(satan) cometh to rob, kill,
and destroy;but I(Jesus) have come to give you life and that
more abundantly.

Nothing wrong with that of course as long as the denom doesn't corrupt the Word,but sadly many DO,and millions are wrongly led up the spout!

So long as the deamon doesn't corupt the word??? but sadly
many do!!   DUH


Personally i prefer to be free to think for myself and it feels great!
I simply try to follow the young carpenter from Nazareth,just as he instructed:-"You have ONE teacher, the Christ" (Matt 23:10)

I have no idea what perversion of the scriptures you are
misusing, but here is what Matt 23:10 says:
Mat 23:10 Neither be ye called masters: for one is your Master, even Christ.
Mat 23:11 But he that is greatest among you shall be your servant.
To catch the full intent of this verse you need to read the
whole chapter, but I will summarize briefly.  Jesus told us not
to look for recognition, or positions of honor before men.


And he's simplicity itself to understand:-
"And the common people heard him gladly" (Mark 12 :37)
the above is another example of how you attempt to pervert
the scriptures: let us see what the whole of mark 12:37 in
context has to say:
Mar 12:32 And the scribe said unto him, Well, Master, thou hast said the truth: for there is one God; and there is none other but he:
Mar 12:33 And to love him with all the heart, and with all the understanding, and with all the soul, and with all the strength, and to love his neighbour as himself, is more than all whole burnt offerings and sacrifices.
Mar 12:34 And when Jesus saw that he answered discreetly, he said unto him, Thou art not far from the kingdom of God. And no man after that durst ask him any question.
Mar 12:35 And Jesus answered and said, while he taught in the temple, How say the scribes that Christ is the son of David?
Mar 12:36 For David himself said by the Holy Ghost, The LORD said to my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, till I make thine enemies thy footstool.
Mar 12:37 David therefore himself calleth him Lord; and whence is he then his son? And the common people heard him gladly.

And I need no denom or clergy to mediate for me:-
"There is ONE mediator between God and men,- the man Jesus Christ" (1 Tim 2:5)

You see,my "denomination" is the Lord Jesus Christ HIMSELF:)

(PS:-Petro,as usual i look at the shotgun spread of different versions and try to use a reasonable centre of gravity to quote contexturally in modern english,it seems the logical way)

[Allinall]

mick,

Look, you didn't hatch from an egg, you were born and are a product of your father and mother.

As a son you never new the appointed time when your father would decide to come nor go someplace from home, and for you claim that Jesus needs to know, the whole of His fathers work throughout eternity, is nonsense.

Jesus is fully God, while fully a man, As God He possessed Gods Spirit, the bible is clear about this, as a man He possessed all of the attributes of man, He wasn't born into this earth knowing everything, in order to be fully representative of men, he needed to possess all of there attributes including their limitations, we can see this clearly as we study scriptures, ask yourself did Jesus sleep at night, did he get tired as normal men do, the bible says he did, look at Jhn 4:6 tells us Jesus was tired after the journey and sat on the well at about the sixth hour, He was wore out from the journey.  Did He cry, the bible says He cried at according to the shortest verse in the bible, Jhn 11:35.

Did He fear and show anxiety, the scriptures describe His last night prior to His crucifixion at Luke 22:39-44, that he sweated as it were great drops of blood, such was His agony , being strengthened by and Angel.

And of course we read at Mathew 27:50,

"Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost."


In simple english, this means He died.

So the scriptures tells us;

Lk 24
46  Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:

Phil 2
6  Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
7  But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
8  And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
9  Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:
10  That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;
11  And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

Note verse 11, clearly it says at this verse, "Jesus Christ is Jehovah" to the glory of God the father.

So mick, ole buddy;  It is not important that you believe the trinity to get yourself saved, but if God grants you repentance and saves you (which He desires to do), you will believe the teaching of GODS WORD.



Blessings,
Petro

Amen Brother Petro!!

[Mick]

I notice some people in the forum have begun calling me insane and demonic,but this is only to be expected from those unused to my bright and breezy style, and even Jesus was called the same thing :-
"..they went to take charge of him, for they said, He is out of his mind.  And the teachers of the law who came down from Jerusalem said, He is possessed by Beelzebub," (Mark 3:21/22)

It seems two things have upset traditionalists here (who incidentally are fond of twisting my postings out of context); firstly when i said Jesus is NOT God,and secondly when i said too much Bible study can be counter-productive.
I wish people who disagree with me would state their case intelligently instead of resorting to childish name-calling!

This verse (among others) makes it perfectly clear Jesus wasn't God when he spoke about Judgement Day:-
"Of that day no-one knows,not the angels nor the Son,but only the Father" (13:32  )  
Therefore how can anyone logically believe he was God?
I challenge you to put forth your argument please!

Regarding too much Bible study,I have an evangelist friend and team-member with a schizophrenia problem,and we're worried about him because he's making himself worse by relentlessly studying the Bible every waking moment,even when his mind is too dog-tired to take it in.
He's trying to commit to memory every tiny little detail of every verse of the entire Bible,and has even enrolled in Theology College and sadly his condition is deteriorating.
I challenge you to give me advice to pass on to him  

[JudgeNot]

God is a Holy Trinity, Mick.

"Of that day no-one knows,not the angels nor the Son,but only the Father" (Mark 13:32) Was said as God the Son (in the form of man).  This is only one of dozens of examples – sometimes Jesus spoke as a man, others as God.  Jesus forgave (forgives) sin – only God can forgive sins.

As Mr. BEP pointed out – it is time to open your bible (your eyes) and pray for understanding (sight) as you read.  The entire New Testament is dedicated to explaining and confirming Jesus as Lord.  Not “A” Lord but THE Lord.  The Lord God and the Lord Jesus are one.

[Mick]

Sorry Judgenot,but the weight of scripture and commonsense is against you.

For example,let's assume he WAS God.This means that according to your reasoning he was lying when the Chief Priest asked him "Are you the Son of God?",and he replied "I am". (Mark 14:62)

If he WAS God the truthful answer would have been "No I'm not the Son of God,I AM God".

Also,check out this verse where God speaks from above:-
"This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased. - We ourselves heard this voice that came from heaven when we were with him on the sacred mountain." (2 Peter 1:17/18)
You see,Jesus was standing there on earth,whereas Gods voice was a SEPARATE thing.

Oh,and remember,Jesus described himself as "the Messiah" (to the woman at the well),which means "Anointed",so here again we have two distinct persons,the anointer (God) and the anointed (Jesus)

Remember,a lot of people share my view that Jesus wasn't God in the physical sense,I'm not the only one!
But sadly far too many people are Trinity-obsessed to the point where it blinds them!

PS:-Re my assertion that too much intensive Bible study is counter-productive,its the same as constantly replaying your favourite piece of music nonstop hour after hour day after day,it'd soon lose its beauty.
 Far better to take a break and come back to it in a refreshed receptive frame of mind later!
A sip of the "living water" offered by Jesus is far more refreshing if taken time to time rather than bloat youself with endless drinking.
Likewise,the mustard seed of faith isn't going to grow if over-watered and saturated!
Again,a commonsense approach is all that's needed  
 

 

[ravenloche]

But why do we need different denominations anyway?
I belong to none,hence i'm free of the shackles they impose on people by way of ritual,ceremony and rigid doctrines.

I think denoms appeal to people because they do their thinking and teaching for them,and give them a sense of security through belonging to a group.

Nothing wrong with that of course as long as the denom doesn't corrupt the Word,but sadly many DO,and millions are wrongly led up the spout!

And I need no denom or clergy to mediate for me:-
"There is ONE mediator between God and men,- the man Jesus Christ" (1 Tim 2:5)

I belong to none,hence i'm free of the shackles they impose on people by way of ritual,ceremony and rigid doctrines.

Those of us who follow Jesus most definitely have a rigid
doctrine to follow; let me see if I can post it here(so long as
putting scripture up to be read isn't considered demonic)
Jos 22:5 But take diligent heed to do the commandment and the law, which Moses the servant of the LORD charged you, to love the LORD your God, and to walk in all his ways, and to keep his commandments, and to cleave unto him, and to serve him with all your heart and with all your soul.
Yep, real rigid, love God .


I think denoms appeal to people because they do their thinking and teaching for them,and give them a sense of security through belonging to a group.

Demons do not think for or teach their subjects. They appeal
to their baser nature until they have control. If you  put a
frog in hot water he will jump out; but if you put him in a pan
of water where he is comfortable, and then slowly heat up the
water he will reman in the pan until he is dead.
If a demon came to a person and told them the truth of what
they were, and their intent; the person would run; however,
if the person is slowly led into deception they remain comfort-able.

Nothing wrong with that of course as long as the denom doesn't corrupt the Word,but sadly many DO,and millions are wrongly led up the spout!
 
DUH!

That is perhaps the most asinine thing that you have had the
audacity to say so far! Nothing wrong with a person yeilding to
the influence of a demon-I seriously question the validity of
your savation sir.I strongly suggest that you have a loooong
talk with your pastor, you definitely neeeeed help.

And I need no denom or clergy to mediate for me:-
let us look at the book of Eph. to see the purpose of the
clergy with in the church

Eph 4:11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
Eph 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

Are you perfect ?(aright everyone no more snickers)Have you
reached the measure of the statre of the fulness of Christ?
No? Then surprize, surprize! you need clergy! What you seem
to fail to understand is that the word minister means to meet
the need. A true minister is a servant both of God, and of
his flock!

I strongly think that you need to spend some time with the
Master, until he becomes not only your messiah, but your
closest friend. I love your soul, and will pray for you, but I do
not, and will not tolerate the erronious falacies that you have
perpetrated upon these pages, and will continue to refute
such falacies with the truth of the word of God.

Rev. Joseph E. Barnhouse Sr.

[JudgeNot]

For example,let's assume he WAS God.This means that according to your reasoning he was lying when the Chief Priest asked him "Are you the Son of God?",and he replied "I am". (Mark 14:62)

Dude - you just don't understand the Holy Trinity.

As for common sense?  I will let that slide.

[Tibby]

For example,let's assume he WAS God.This means that according to your reasoning he was lying when the Chief Priest asked him "Are you the Son of God?",and he replied "I am". (Mark 14:62)

Dude - you just don't understand the Holy Trinity.

As for common sense?  I will let that slide.

hahaha, well said. Mick, what you are talking about isn’t proof, but semantics.

[Mick]

Am i the only one to talk straight in this forum? How can i answer some of you if i can't even tell what you're talking about in your long over-complex convoluted posts or your short one-liners that make no sense to anyone except yourselves?
Please listen to Paul:-
"I'm worried lest you be led astray from the simplicity of Christ" (2 Cor 11:3)

[Tibby]

Jesus is God, that is the basic foundation of the Christian Faith. Without that fact, everything that Christianity is goes to the birds.

Simple enough for you?

[nChrist]

Am i the only one to talk straight in this forum? How can i answer some of you if i can't even tell what you're talking about in your long over-complex convoluted posts or your short one-liners that make no sense to anyone except yourselves?
Please listen to Paul:-
"I'm worried lest you be led astray from the simplicity of Christ" (2 Cor 11:3)

Mick,

You want it straight, so here it is. You don't have even a beginner's understanding of the Holy Bible, and I doubt you are saved. A small child in Sunday School knows more about Jesus than you do. You don't understand our posts because you have no knowledge or understanding of the Holy Bible. I might add that is completely your fault since you say that it is satanic to study your Bible. As a result, you remain completely ignorant of the things of God, His Word, Jesus Christ who IS THE WORD, Jesus Christ who IS THE LORD, Jesus Christ who IS THE LORD OF HOSTS, Jesus Christ who is THE LORD AND SAVIOUR, and Jesus Christ WHO IS EQUAL WITH ALMIGHTY GOD BECAUSE HE IS ALMIGHTY GOD.

Your bragging of knowledge in Christ is not reality when you prove with your statements that you understand nothing. Simple Biblical truths are over your head right now. That's why you don't understand the posts from the people trying to help you. You really need a Sunday School teacher because you are not ready for an adult Bible teacher. I don't mean this to be insulting at all. I say this in Christian Love in an effort to wake you up.

Mick, you are also probably lost. If this isn't plain enough for you, please let me know. Mick, this was said in Christian Love and for your benefit. There are plenty of sweet Christians here who are willing to help you. It is time for you to start from the beginning, learn who Jesus Christ is, and study your Bible so you will understand the bare bones basics. If it is too much effort on your part to study the Holy Bible, I doubt that anyone will be able to help you.

Love In Christ,
Tom