"The Passion"

[JudgeNot]

Allinall –
I couldn’t agree with you more.  

MalkyEL –
When I read your posts yesterday I was left a little off-balance.  I got the overall impression that Mr. Gibson is being condemned for making money, and is seeking fan adoration (or idol worship?)  I see it differently.

I have many conduits to the Lord – first and foremost is prayer, followed by the Bible.  If I pay money for my bible and take care of it – does that mean I idolize it?  I think not.  

Another conduit to the Lord is the teaching I hear every Sunday from a man who I admire very much.  Does that mean I idolize him?  Hardly.  Because my teacher studies and puts his best into every message – and teaches an interpretation of the Bible that he was taught and agrees with - does that make him evil if someone else disagrees with him?  Not to me.  

I read many, many Christian books, with many different points of view and find something of value, which brings me closer to Jesus, in everyone of them.  Since someone makes money every time I buy one of those books, does that make the book evil?  Not to me.  It is just another conduit to the Lord.  

Mr. Gibson’s movie taught me many things about Christ’s suffering.  Yes, Mr. Gibson took some “artistic license” – but he is the artist and he is allowed to do so.  The “Holy artworks” done my Michael Angelo are not even close to being biblical – does that make them any less beautiful?  Should he be condemned since his paintings are not scriptural to my interpretation?  I could go on and on – but I guess I can’t make my point any more clear…

[Allinall]

Judgenot, all I can say is amen.  We need to stop worshipping practices.  We've got a Person far more worthy of our adoration.  

[MalkyEL]

Allinall wrote:
MalkyEL –
When I read your posts yesterday I was left a little off-balance.  I got the overall impression that Mr. Gibson is being condemned for making money, and is seeking fan adoration (or idol worship?)  I see it differently.

Nancy:  Help me out here, not sure what you are referring to.  My post addresses the issue of scriptural errancy in the film - I only posted the article about the Jesus Nail Sale to point out that the movie is not just about some ethereal gospel message, but at the root - was developed to make money for Mr. Gibson, which was one point to understand that the movie was not made with the purest of intentions, in spite of what he said.

[MalkyEL]

Allinall wrote:
I have many conduits to the Lord . . .

Mr. Gibson’s movie taught me many things about Christ’s suffering.  Yes, Mr. Gibson took some “artistic license” – but he is the artist and he is allowed to do so.  The “Holy artworks” done my Michael Angelo are not even close to being biblical – does that make them any less beautiful?  Should he be condemned since his paintings are not scriptural to my interpretation?  I could go on and on – but I guess I can’t make my point any more clear…
==================================
Nancy:  Is there something about His Word that is not enough?

[JudgeNot]

Whoa!
Who is 'Nancy' and why are you discrediting our brother Allinall with my opinions?  (Mr. Allinall may not appreciate being lowered to my level of raw cranial production.)  

Anyway:

Nancy:  Help me out here, not sure what you are referring to.  My post addresses the issue of scriptural errancy in the film - I only posted the article about the Jesus Nail Sale to point out that the movie is not just about some ethereal gospel message, but at the root - was developed to make money for Mr. Gibson, which was one point to understand that the movie was not made with the purest of intentions, in spite of what he said.

So is it wrong to be so good at what you do, and to be so much in demand, that you make a lot of money? Also, you (or whomever your source is) can read Mr. Gibson's mind and determine him to be something much less than what God expects him to be?  I'm glad I don't have that ability - it would drive me insane.

Nancy:  Is there something about His Word that is not enough?

Is there something about reading, or watching, or looking at or listening to someone else's interpretation of His word that is too much?  Sorry - I must have my fellow saint's points of view, verbal aspirations and visual works to help me understand my own ideas of Him and His wonderfulness.  (I think that is what God intended - I believe that "fellowshipping" is a sort of 'prime directive'.)  

[MalkyEL]

Judgenot - oops, sorry - credit where credit is due, my sincerest apologies to both you and Allinall.  I saw your post start out with Allinall and erroneously thought it was him/her.  And I am nancy/MalkyEL

Judgenot wrote:
So is it wrong to be so good at what you do, and to be so much in demand, that you make a lot of money? Also, you (or whomever your source is) can read Mr. Gibson's mind and determine him to be something much less than what God expects him to be?  I'm glad I don't have that ability - it would drive me insane.

MalkyEL:  Mr. Gibson has edified himself.  He does not really need my ability to judge him.  His views about himself are for public consumption.  I am just regurgitating what he has said in numerous reviews and TV specials.

Judgenot wrote:
Is there something about reading, or watching, or looking at or listening to someone else's interpretation of His word that is too much?  Sorry - I must have my fellow saint's points of view, verbal aspirations and visual works to help me understand my own ideas of Him and His wonderfulness.  (I think that is what God intended - I believe that "fellowshipping" is a sort of 'prime directive'.)  

MalkyEL:  The "prime directive" is #1) the Holy Spirit will lead and guide you into all truth".  #2) 1 John 2:27 [you need no man to teach you].  I am willing to let others share their thoughts and opinions, however; a movie that is produced by a secular movie star who has theology that is far removed from correct Biblical application and has made a movie by which Christians, who normally would not be taught by such a standard, are now opening up their hearts and minds to be affected by a gospel that is not the Word of God.

[JudgeNot]

Thanks for clarifying Malky (Nancy).    For a minute there I thought you were involking the spirit of Mary's sister or something!!  

Isn't it amazing - three perfectly sane people can listen to someone give a speech or make a statement, and all three will come away with a totally different interpretation of what was said?

I know your opinion - you know mine.  I think we could probably exchange interpretations 'till our fingers are raw and our keyboards are worn out and I could not change your opinion, nor could you change mine.

Your opinion is noted and "banked" for future reference - thanks for sharing!

JN

[MalkyEL]

Judgenot wrote:
Thanks for clarifying Malky (Nancy).    For a minute there I thought you were involking the spirit of Mary's sister or something!!  

Malky EL:  Hahahaha, now ya did it - you made me laugh  

Judgenot wrote:
Your opinion is noted and "banked" for future reference - thanks for sharing!

MalkyEL:  awwwww - I was just getting my sword unsheathed - you disappoint me - white flag duly noted and accepted  

[JudgeNot]

MalkyEL:  awwwww - I was just getting my sword unsheathed - you disappoint me - white flag duly noted and accepted

Oh noooooo! It is not a surrender - not even close.  Just a respect of a differing opinion.  Now - if you wanted to "surrender" to my opinion we could talk...    

Sorry to disappoint - there are others on this sight who are very good at debate - me - I have my opinion, I put it on the table - If you agree I love you, if you don't... well - I love you anyway!  

(All I ask is for mutual respect.)  

[MalkyEL]

JudgeNot wrote:  Oh noooooo! It is not a surrender - not even close.  Just a respect of a differing opinion.  Now - if you wanted to "surrender" to my opinion we could talk...

MalkyEL:  not a chance   - surrender is not part of my vocab - one exception - fully surrendered to God      

Judge Not:  . . . I have my opinion, I put it on the table - If you agree I love you, if you don't... well - I love you anyway!

MalkyEL:  ditto  

JudgeNot:  (All I ask is for mutual respect.)  

MalkyEL:  ditto  
What perfect ambiance for discussion - you first  

[MalkyEL]

I found this while doing some research on "The Passion":

"Among the pro Mel Gibson's movie, The Passion of The Christ advocates, comes the inevitable comments like, "God can use anything".

While it is true that God can use anything and anybody, because He is God and able to accomplish things well beyond our understanding, the issue isn't at all about what God can or cannot use to accomplish His most perfect will.

The issue is....Can Christians use and embrace anything, including another gospel and another Jesus, which are lies, in order to share the Truth of Jesus Christ?"

Here is the rest of the article:

http://www.seekgod.ca/gibsonadvocates.htm

[Raphu]

I found this while doing some research on "The Passion":

"Among the pro Mel Gibson's movie, The Passion of The Christ advocates, comes the inevitable comments like, "God can use anything".

While it is true that God can use anything and anybody, because He is God and able to accomplish things well beyond our understanding, the issue isn't at all about what God can or cannot use to accomplish His most perfect will.

The issue is....Can Christians use and embrace anything, including another gospel and another Jesus, which are lies, in order to share the Truth of Jesus Christ?"

Here is the rest of the article:

http://www.seekgod.ca/gibsonadvocates.htm

That was a very thoughtful and balanced article you posted the link for IMHO. I noticed the inaccuracies in the movie, but wasn't bothered by them as they did line up with the rest of scripture to a degree, and I remember the line of scripture that says that books would fill the world describing the "other things" Jesus did. So we are left with either the Spirit that gives life to the very things we say and do, knowing the scripture, or the dead letter of scripture which the Pharisees were pleased to cram down people's throats.
I feel that Mel Gibson took a major risk of losing millions of dollars on this movie but ended up heroically being God's servant by sticking to the truth and the Spirit of scripture. We are left to judge whether his film was of the God's Spirit or not. The Word alive in Mel produced the film, and it was his "passion" to risk it all to make it as a witness to the verse. in Isaiah that says that no son of man has ever been as marred as Jesus was.
I hope Mel uses that 300 million the movie has made at the ticket office wisely for the Lord's work, as his movie broke all records and is still playing at the local theater in my community. To whom much is given, much is required.

John 21:25  And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen.

Isaiah 52:14  As many were astonied at thee; his visage was so marred more than any man, and his form more than the sons of men: