Do you have a copy of the article/report you got this information from? It sounds interesting and I have never heard of ot... It sounds a lot like what the Quakers did to the Pagans back in the day: persecution because of one's religion. How awful...

love & light
m

Excellent point Tamara. Also I once heard that u can't pray unless u have a bible. PLEASE someone tell me this isn't true! If som then what does a dying mother do with God? She cann't pray to God because she left her bible at home? That makes my heart hurt!!

love & light
m

Well, Symphony has already expllained where church and state separation comes from. Have you honestly never heard of it before? I find that very interesting. Plus, think about Pagans releasing something claiming that we as a nation, should be under Gaia. Wouldn't that offend you?

Just offering both sides of the story, as usual

love & light
m

True that Blackeyed!

And Tibby I have a question myself:  If you think we should stop using the English language, then why are you still using it?

Well, even if it was true, it's called "separation of church and state".......

The only issue I have at this point is trying to understand what has been said. Almost everyone is using these 40-word sentences. Break it down into stupid people terms so that I can understand it. Plus I can't understand scriptures with all the "thees" and "thous" and "smiteths" and "smoteths".

*pop*

lol

Oh gosh blackeyed I'm sorry, I didn't make that clear I didn't mean that YOU specifically were making threats, rather any Christian that says, "You are going to hell". That is a threat, and an offensive one to those who prefer freedom of religion. Sorry about that!!

And you said that you are trying to inform the "lost" that Christianity is wonderful and to accept Jesus as their personal savior etc. etc... Well what if other people see Jesus differently than you? I personally am afraid of the Christian religion. No matter what ANYONE says, I will most likely never be turning back to Christianity. My new question is: would God rather I say I believe in him just so i don't go to hell? If someone doesn't believe in something, they just don't. And sometimes it takes proof to make someone believe. That is why I don't believe. You can't just say, "believe in God and Jesus or burn in hell," because essentially, you are telling me to believe in something as real as the tooth fairy. Sorry; I wish I could believe sometimes, but honestly, I LOVE my life as an atheist.



Love and light

Good day to you Asaph:

Much of what you said is arguable. It is things like what you have said that confuse me. Jesus himself is not a religion, yet he does belong to one. That's just they way it goes! I mean if he doesn't belong in Christianity, then where does he belong?

Also, you said something along the lines of if I was floating down the river and about to go over a waterfall that you would warn me. It is unnecessary. I know Christianity exists; who doesn't with all the churches everywhere and people trying to convert everyone into Christianity? In my mind, hell is inevitable if you want to view my future through Christian eyes. But you know why I'm not crapping a brick right now? Because IIII personally do not believe that hell exists. Here's how that is put together: It is MY life. If I don't believe in hell, there's no point in saying that it exists over and over and over to me. There is no way at all to prove that hell does exist, and this is true to matter what ANYONE says. We know that death exists because we see it. We do not know hell exists because we do not see it. So when you said hell is real, death is real, that is only partly true. So that being said, when you tell me that basically I will go to hell if I do not accept Jesus into my heart, and I don't believe in hell, there's no need to insist that I am going. And no matter what anyone says, unless you can dig a hole in the earth and reveal a firey chasm encapsulating tortured souls and the devil, sorry. There's no way I will believe.

AND furthermore, you said you felt sorry for me that I was going to hell. You were trying to warn me about hell, not judge me. But your statement in and of itself is judgmental. It became that way as soon as you said "you are going to hell". Anyone who tells me I am going to hell, no matter what form it's in, is being judgmental. This is also just a fact of life.

So continue to worry that I am going to hell. I will have no worry about it and live without worries such as: I can't have premarital sex. I can't say certain things because they are blasphemous. I can't sleep in because I have to go to church. My life is without worry because I do not believe in hell. Your life is full of worry because hell exists in the mind of a Christian. Does that make sense as to why there are so many non-Christians?

Again, PLEASE do not take this the wrong way I am only voicing what I believe, just as you have. If someone finds something wrong with what I have said above, then you have a problem with both sides of reality, and need to do some soul-searching. That is the only judgment I will pass.  

I want world peace.

love & light

OK but Blackeyed, do consider the fact that without the explanation of Satan dished out by christians, these people (Pagans) worshipped, in their eyes, a god or goddess. They knew nothing about Satan because Satan was explained in the bible, which came out long after Pagans were doing their thing. Now you may think that they were worshiping the devil because they were worshiping some deitie(s) that were not the god you speak of, but THEY didn't know any better. They decided a nature goddess was what they wanted to worship and to this day that is what many Pagans do. And to this day, no matter how much you parade the idea that they are worshiping the devil, your threats will be falling on closed ears. Pagans don't listen to christians for the most part for many different reasons. There's not much that can be done about that. I realize that you weren't trying to hurt my feelings, but it just makes no sense to me, no matter how it's explained, that one who doesn't even know the devil exists, is worshiping the devil. I see how in your eyes that makes sense, but since I don't believe in the devil myself, I personally disagree. But you did explain why Christians say that heathens worship the devil, so thank you for that.

As for the other explanations, they were also extremely helpful. Very good scenarios to help me understand.

*sigh*   OK the next issue is this: we are all undoubtedly sinners. Unfortunately this is something that will never change. And why? Because we are all human. Essentially to be 100%sin-free, you must be perfect, like Jesus. Jesus was a deity in a human body during his time on this earth. Are we to make ourselves into deities? This is impossible so why crap a brick when you have sinned? You are a human being! Jesus was sent to Earth to die for out sins. He was perfect because he was a deity supposedly on earth as a human. It's good to try to make yourself like Jesus, but impossible to make yourself exactly like Jesus. It's good to try, but sin is inevitable. And no matter what anyone says to me, I will knowingly sin probably for the rest of my life just because I don't believe, so what is the point of trying to get everyone to stop sinning? You obviously know that not everyone is going to want to. So I guess my question is this: what do you hope to do with us heathens?



love and light

Right, I understand. It just seemed confusing at first when everyone was like, "Don't judge!" Blah Blah... It seemed like the same thing to me. But now I understand! Yay!

Well about the screenname, I am not representing myself as being evil; just different. That's all. I like the way that name sounds to be honest with you. I didn't want to pick something gay like "qtpie" or "gurliegurl." Ya dig?

;P

But it kind of makes sense. The bible is really hard for me to translate sometimes, but after all the decifering I did I figured out what it means. I don't agree with it, but I don't have to; I came here simply to figure some stuff out. Thanks so much guys!


Also I was wondering something about the feeling you have as a Christian. And I mean one who seriously believes in it, not one who says they are for fear of going to hell if they don't say they are (hehe)... I am happier than I've ever been in my entire life. Happier than when I was a Pagan, happier than when I was a Christian. I am not really an Atheist right now. I have beliefs that no one else would probably understand. I don't have a set religion right now. So why do I feel so free and happy without God in my life? Am I SUPPOSED to feel this way?


Wandering, but not lost

OK Blackeyed thanks for your insight! That totally clears up a lot of things that have been said to me then. But even though the Pagan religion has historical proven roots that it has been around since BEFORE Christianity, anything that is Pagan is now the devil? Even though it's been around since before the time of the devil?

Do you see where I'm coming from? In my eyes it's almost like Christianity saw someone else's product and slapped their own negative image on it because this "new religion" (at the start of Christianity) made God feel threatened (I guess). If God is so powerful, why does he demand that everyone worship Him? Because they're his creations? Do parents demand that their children respect them? Yes, many do. But when their children (their creations) turn against them, do the parents kill their children or banish them? No way (unless the parents are troubled mentally). And why would God send his own beautiful creations; his children, into hell if they are merely confused and not sure what to believe? It seems as if he is punishing those who are even confused. To be honest, I know of some people that are not Christians because they hear too much hypocricy from Christians (i.e. some Christians think homosexuality is OK, others definitely don't. Some think you can pray without a bible, others say there's no way you can pray without a bible). These are only a few of the things I have heard. So until everyone decides who God really is, only then will we all be able to follow in His footsteps.

Love and light

Excellent replies guys thanks so much. Now I understand where Christitans are coming from. Special thanks to Ralph I think you made it most clear. Than you thank you!!

LOL....LOL

That's what I mean! Doesn't it seem like that to anyone else?!



love and light