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I think President Bush is a liar. I think he lied about being a Christian and other things. I think he mislead many Christians. What do you think about him?

On the option thing I meant 5 & 6.

I VOTED #2

He is a lot better than Slick Willy

Brother Love :)

I think Mr George W. Bush is another name for disaster. His mission is not against terrorism. He is spreading western values by force and based on his single minded christian point of view. He might be honest with his christianity but his christianity is far too narrow minded in order to help him to understand what for example in Near-East is really going on.

 :) John here:
Do not Clinton & Bush both claim to be Born Again?? How can one judge or want to get into their mind?? Both are still in membership of their denominations right? And are in good standing, huh? (wheat, tares, & [open] sin, all grow together???)

But, if you are talking about the Caesar part of Rom. 13's responsibility?? then one might try to keep Christ & Caesar seperate as Christ did. Unless you are thinking that the USA is a church, which I doubt that you are?

---John

 

I really don’t think we need this topic in more then one thread, but ok…

Defense: He is spreading us to thin. MAYBE he could have pulled it off if his Predecessor hadn’t cut Defense spending to drastically. For now, the majority of our troops are in the States still, but we need to stop playing the Interational Cops. No one likes cops!

Economy: I’m a laissez-faire Economist, and I think he is doing poor job, just by don't something!

Religion: I have to ask why you guys don’t think he is a Christian? What has he done?

Intelligence: You don’t graduate from 2 Ivy League’s and a State accredited University and train to fly a Fighter Jet with a low level of intelligence.

He is main problem is he is trying to please all of the people all of the time. He needs to stop that, and just be the President, don’t his job. His job is to help run the country, not please the ignorant masses.

OK: Have it your way! ;) My taxes to send your kids to your church school & all, huh?

What on earth are you talking about.  Christian schools are private schools and DO NOT get federal funds.  Unless, you just missed the comma, and mean that your taxes (like everyone else's) pay for public things.  It certainly makes sense to me that public taxation, pays for public things.

I'm SOOOO curious what exactly is your "job"?

I Love You Brother Jason :)

Brother Love

He lied about the weapons of mass destruction; the hole reason we practically went to war.  And he just doesn't act very Christianly. I bet he just tried to fake being a Christian to get all the Christians to like him.

The found weapon in his armors that he should not have had. Maybe they didn’t find the Anthrax tips Super Atomic Warhead, but we did find clear evidence that they had a program for manufacturing weapons banned by the UN.

What else does he do that isn't very christian? Why don't you think he acts very Christian?

Ok, here is another thing when he was running for office he said that he would get vouchers for Christian parents that send they're child to a Christian school and not have to pay taxes for public schools.
He just probably made up the part about him being a Christian to get all of the Christian people's votes.
And I've heard that he did some things that just aren't Christian like.

Do you think he is King Bush or something? He can’t just snap his fingers and make it happen. It has to go thru the house, and the Senate, and there are a lot of people who believe it is a violation of “separation of Church and State”  who are trying to stop him. It takes time to get things passed. He has been pushing, see here:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,90845,00.html

And that was less then a month ago! Check you facts. The man is kind of busy dealing with people blindly hating him, and causing others to lose there support for him, and Muslims attacking American’s lately, but he is still pushing this issue of School Vouchers

Anythign else that he does that is unchristian? What are this things you "heard" about him?

"The found weapon in his armors that he should not have had. Maybe they didn’t find the Anthrax tips Super Atomic Warhead, but we did find clear evidence that they had a program for manufacturing weapons banned by the UN"

What they found were missiles that went about 12 miles further than they were supposed to.  Is that really going to war over?  The fact is, this war was billed on the presence and potential use of actualy, physical, extant WMD.  None have been found.  I suggest you check your facts.

Weapons of mass destruction??? You don't think that they will find them??? Just forget Caesar completely for the time being.
We are suppose to have a brain right?

It is not a question of do they have them, but when will they find them? You might just as well take a break, be still & be patient. For THEY ARE THERE, according to the evidence? OR WHERE DID THEY GO???? (regardless of who you vote for :))
---John

I did, you didn’t read my post correctly. I never said we found any   “WMD” but we did find proof that he had them, such as Biological Weapons Laboratories, and all kinds of things of that nature. Are you telling me you think Saddam has been behaving him self and following the rules set forth by the US and UN?

+++++++++++
No:
That is not what 'i' am saying. The posting was speaking to a MIND/SET. Not any individual person per/say! Surely not you.

My bottom line concern is not Saddam behaving .... .
By CONCERN is the eternal loss of souls in the SECOND DEATH. (see Obad. 16) Can you understand that remark??

The first concern is to be Caesars. (Rom. 13) The first & second concern is to be BOTH that of Christians, but with the SECOND death a first priority. (see Matt. 22:36-40)

---John
 

Um, right...  ;D

I don't agree with everything Bush has said and he has certainly lied, but I do know that the word tells me to pray for those in athority so I will pray for him daily.

Let me ask you all this.  If someone you trusted came up to you and said they were on this really cool news archive site and they saw an article that in 1972 there was this man who had run for President that came from Gobbler's Knob, Tennessee.  You would more than likely believe that person.  Because you trust them, and what they are reporting is not outlandish or anything is it.  But later on you find out the information is false.  Does that make this person a liar?  If you went out and told someone about it before you found out, does that make you a liar?  Certainly not!

We had intelligence to suggest that Iraq had weapons.  Intelligence we trusted as accurate.  It is impossible for anyone to independantly verify every piece of information they get.  You have to rely on someone elses interpretation of things, and our gment is the same way.  There is no way we could go out and verify everything there is that we hear about.  And the reports we received fit with Saddam's actions and his words over the past years.

I like Bush for the most part.  He has tried many things that would better the country out....ANWR was one that was shot down...now look at the near $3/gallon we are paying ( I know we would still be paying it now cause ANWR would not be going).  Tax cuts are great and we have gotten more of a break now than ever.  Low interest rates as well.  It has been a stupendous 6 years so far.  I can only hope he leaves a great legacy.

Sincerely
Brother Jerry

Amen brother. A liar he is not. He based is information and decisions on the same imformation that all governments everywhere had. As it has turned out that information was correct and has been substantiated by documents recovered from the prior Iraqee regime and from prior Iraqee Generals and diplomats.

If the ANWR were approved the gas prices would drop just on the speculation of it, long before it would be activated.

Yeah I know ANWR would have still been 10+ yrs down the road and we would still be paying high prices right now.  However once we become less dependent upon foreign oil the less affected we are when the mid east countries decide to have neighborly disputes ;)

Well I have built a still, (moonshine) starting tomorrow. I will have to buy only 1/4 of the gas, I would normally have to buy.  I am buying the yeast from the goverment.  117.00 for 112 lbs. of red yeast, course that is marked for ethanol, some type of posion added in it. It will make the octane about 89 octane. ;D

And when the prices come back down are you going to make a few slight modification to that still and start playing Dukes of Hazzard?  :D

Nope, it is working out nicely, no I don't drink moonshine.  I am using it as fuel, for my car.  I will keep on using it, till gas prices drop below what it cost me to make.  ;D  I don't see that happening very soon though.

I have a personal friend on his staff. President Bush is definitely a Christian. He did not lie about WMD...they have indeed been discovered. Besides, the connection between Iraq and Al Queda has been proven.

If you are the Christian you claim to be, you should know better than to spread rumors. That's all your posts on thus thread are is rumors.

Last year I read Tommy Franks's book.  Some good insight!  ;)

Brothers and Sisters,

I voted that I fully support President Bush. I'm going out on a limb and share a thought with you that is the opposite of what folks do who make up conspiracy theories. But, it's just a thought, and I can't prove it.

My wild thought not supported by evidence of any kind. BUT hard evidence is being kept secret. SO, mark this simply as a WILD THOUGHT.

We have tons of proof about Saddam's WMD's and it hasn't been released to the public.

The reason it hasn't been released to the public is because it would make criminals and liars out of many world powers, some being our allies. We can't afford to expose them because it would turn world politics inside-out. In fact, it could isolate the U.S. and cause global chaos. The players who would be humiliated include France, Germany, Russia, and China - not to mention Syria, North Korea, Iran, and others. It would probably mean the end of diplomacy as we know it, and releasing the information would light a fuse on a powder keg that couldn't be stopped.

End of wild thought not supported by evidence of any kind.

Wild thought or perceptive discernment.  ;)

Oh I forgot, I voted I fully support President Bush.

A senior moment.

 ;D ;D ;D

 ;D  I haven't had one of those senior moments in over.....................

Oops? I can't remember?

I'd say you are in the same zip code as the truth.

Course you should know, whats coming brother.


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 ;D ;D ;D ;D

the slimey smiley (anagram)  ;D ;D ;D ;D

And heres yours sister...............................


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Eek! Mad cow disease!

Hmmm.............................
                                  Dinner..................................

I dont want to get anyone angry here, but George Bush admitted being a member of "the skull snd bones" society. whats christian about that? If you do not know what "the skull snd bones" society is....I strongly urge you to look it up. if you still have no clue, I'LL fill you in.

i know politics are a sticky subject ( like religion ) and some people loose there cool over this stuff....Lets all try to act like christians.

3 pages and still very peaceful and Christian like  ;D

If you do a search on "the skull and bones" you will find the subject discussion. ;D

W got saved many years after college.

I used to curse, drink, and sell marijuana. Not anymore. Christ changed me.

You DO KNOW He changes people, don't you? You DO KNOW salvation is not for the sinless but for the forgiven, don't you?

Amen Len!

Accepting CHRIST changes everything! AND, I doubt that anyone would want to be judged by the things they did when they were lost.

Love In Christ,
Tom

Mark 10:14-16 NASB  But when Jesus saw this, He was indignant and said to them, "Permit the children to come to Me; do not hinder them; for the kingdom of God belongs to such as these. "Truly I say to you, whoever does not receive the kingdom of God like a child will not enter it at all." And He took them in His arms and began blessing them, laying His hands on them.

Oh boy... poor Mr. President. I voted saying that I don't believe our President is a Christian, I'll stand by that opinion. I don't. But that doesn't mean that I hate him or strongly dislike him, there are only things that he does and allows to happen that make me lose my respect for him. We just HAVE to continue praying for him and believe that he is in God's hands, because he is. And also remember this, if it was God's will that Kerry win the election, then he would have won, even if Mr. Bush makes bad decisions for this country, God always takes what Satan means for evil and turns it around for good. Remember that we are living in the end times, and this current war we're involved in was probably pre-destined: if it wasn't Bush that started it, it would have been another president.

JesusFreak

Hello Jesus Freak,

GOD knows those who belong to HIM, and I give thanks that it won't be based on politics. As we both should know, acceptance of JESUS CHRIST as Lord and Saviour also means the forgiveness of sins, even for a President, and JESUS CHRIST is no respecter of persons. There is no condemnation for those who are in JESUS CHRIST, so our judgments are for politics alone.

Love In Christ,
Tom

Colossians 1:13-14 NASB  For He rescued us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son, in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.

I know President Bush is Christian. I know as a President being totally forthright at all times is impossible.
 
Let me give you a little story

For those of us who sometimes find ourselves having doubts about our President, here is an excellent piece -- worth every minute it takes to read it. This story is from Bruce Vincent of Libby, Montana who had gone to the White House with others to receive an award from the President.

  He writes:
 
I've written the following narrative to chronicle the day of the award ceremony in DC.  I'm still working on a press release but the White House press corps has yet to provide a photo to go with it. When the photo comes I'll ship it out.  When you get done reading this you'll understand the dilemma I face in telling this story beyond my circle of close friends.
 
Stepping into the Oval Office, each of us was introduced to the President and Mrs. Bush.  We shook hands and participated in small talk. When the President was told that we were from Libby, Montana, I reminded him that Marc Racicot is our native son and the President offered his warm thoughts about Governor Racicot. I have to tell you, I was blown away by two things upon entering the office.
 
First, the Oval Office sense of 'place' is unreal. The President later shared a story of Russian President Putin entering the room prepared to tackle the President in a tough negotiation and upon entering, the atheist muttered his first words to the President and they were "Oh, my God."
 
I concurred.  I could feel the history in my bones.  Second, the man that inhabits the office engaged me with a firm handshake and a look that can only be described as penetrating.  Warm, alive, fully engaged, disarmingly penetrating.  I was admittedly concerned about meeting the man. I think all of us have an inner hope that the most powerful man in our country is worthy of the responsibility and authority that we bestow upon them through our vote.
 
I admit that part of me was afraid that I would be let down by the moment -- that the person and the place could not meet the lofty expectations of my fantasy world.  This says nothing about my esteem for President Bush but just my practical realization that reality may not match my 'dream.'
 
Once inside the office, President Bush got right down to business and, standing in front of his desk, handed out the awards one at a time while posing for photos with the winners and Mrs. Bush.  With the mission accomplished, the President and Mrs. Bush relaxed and initiated a lengthy, informal conversation about a number of things with our entire small group. He and the First Lady talked about such things as the rug in the office. It is traditionally designed by the First Lady to make a statement about the President, and Mrs. Bush chose a brilliant yellow sunburst pattern to reflect 'hope.'  President Bush talked about the absolute need to believe that with hard work and faith in God there is every reason to start each day in the Oval Office with hope.  He and the First Lady were asked about the impact of the Presidency on their marriage and, with an arm casually wrapped around Laura, he said that he thought the place may be hard on weak marriages but that it had the ability to make strong marriages even stronger and that he was blessed with a strong one.
 
After about 30 or 35 minutes, it was time to go.  By then we were all relaxed and I felt as if I had just had an excellent visit with a friend. The President and First Lady made one more pass down the line of awardees, shaking hands and offering congratulations.  When the President shook my hand I said, "Thank you Mr. President and God bless you and your family." He was already in motion to the next person in line, but he stopped abruptly turned fully back to me, gave me a piercing look, renewed the vigor of his handshake and said, "Thank you -- and God bless you and yours as well."
 
On our way out of the office we were to leave by the glass doors on the west side of the office.  I was the last person in the exit line. As I shook his hand one final time, President Bush said, "I'll be sure to tell Marc hello and give him your regards."
 
I then did something that surprised even me.  I said to him, "Mr. President, I know you are a busy man and your time is precious.  I also know you to be a man of strong faith and I have a favor to ask of you."
 
As he shook my hand he looked me in the eye and said, "Just name it." I told him that my step-Mom was at that moment in a hospital in Kalispell, Montana, having a tumor removed from her skull and it would mean a great deal to me if he would consider adding her to his prayers that day.  He grabbed me by the arm and took me back toward his desk as he said, "So that's it.  I could tell that something is weighing heavy on your heart today.  I could see it in your eyes.  This explains it."
 
From the top drawer of his desk he retrieved a pen and a note card with his seal on it and asked, "How do you spell her name?"  He then jotted a note to her while discussing the importance of family and the strength of prayer.  When he handed me the card, he asked about the surgery and the prognosis.  I told him we were hoping that it is not a recurrence of an earlier cancer and that, if it is, they can get it all with this surgery.
 
He said, "If it's okay with you, we'll take care of the prayer right now.  Would you pray with me?"  I told him yes and he turned to the staff that remained in the office and hand motioned the folks to step back or leave.  He said, "Bruce and I would like some private time for a prayer."
 
As they left he turned back to me and took my hands in his.  I was prepared to do a traditional prayer stance -- standing with each other with heads bowed.  Instead, he reached for my head with his right hand and pulling gently forward, he placed my head on his shoulder. With his left arm on my mid-back, he pulled me to him in a prayerful embrace.
 
He started to pray softly.  I started to cry.  He continued his prayer for Loretta and for God's perfect will to be done.  I cried some more. My body shook a bit as I cried and he just held tighter.  He closed by asking God's blessing on Loretta and the family during the coming months. I stepped away from our embrace, wiped my eyes, swiped at the tears I'd left on his shoulder, and looked into the eyes of our president. I thanked him as best I could and told him that me and my family would continue praying for him and his.
 
As I write this account down and reflect upon what it means, I have to tell you that all I really know is that his simple act left me humbled and believing.  I so hoped that the man I thought him to be was the man that he is.  I know that our nation needs a man such as this in the Oval Office. George W. Bush is the real deal.  I've read Internet stories about the President praying with troops in hospitals and other such uplifting accounts.  Each time I read them I hoped them to be true and not an Internet perpetuated myth.  This one, I know to be true.  I was there. He is real. He has a pile of incredible stuff on his plate each day -- and yet he is tuned in so well to the here and now that he 'sensed' something heavy on my heart.
 
He took time out of his life to care, to share, and to seek God's blessing for my family in a simple man-to-man, father-to-father, son-to-son, husband-to-husband, Christian-to-Christian prayerful embrace. He's not what I had hoped he would be.  He is, in fact, so very, very much more.
 
NOTE:  If you decide to forward this story... please do not add to it. Let Mr. Vincent's encounter stand as he wrote it.

I think Bush is an OK president. I don't think he's as bad as some would make him out to be, but I don't support him like a single-minded zealot.

I think the economy is doing fine, and after the disaster that was 9-11, I think he helped the nation get back on its feet with his tax cuts for businesses. If you look at the data, new jobs have been created almost every month of his presidency, and things seem to be pretty good economically, IMO.

Fiscally I absolutely DESPISE his policies. I like his tax cuts, but the amount of spending he's doing is NOT what I envision as "conservative". I think if you are going to slash tax revenue, you should also slash spending, not double it! That really irritates me, and I believe that when I go to buy a house in a few years, interest rates are going to be through the roof because of the deficit, and I'll have President Bush to thank for that.

Foreign policy wise I think he has done some good and some bad. I think our operations in Afghanistan have gone well, and we've wrecked the Taliban there, which I think is good. Iraq I supported initially, but only because I had NO IDEA about the different tribal issues and conflicts between the Sunni, the Shiite and the Kurds. After becoming more educated on Middle-Eastern history and relations, I think the idea of ousting Saddam is a mistake. I just think it is impossible to bring any type of order to a country that has been at war with itself for the past 2000 years. With that said, I don't believe Bush lied about WMDs, I just think he was misinformed. I get irritated when people say that he lied or that he misled the country intentionally, I really don't think he did. I think he is honestly doing what he thinks is best for our country and the world, and you can't fault him for that.

Religiously I think he is a good man. He claims to be a Christian and has used his position to preach the gospel, and I don't know anything otherwise, so I take him at his word that he is a Christian man.

Hello Ltrey33,

I think that most Christians have mixed emotions about politics in general AND in individual people serving. Overall, I think that President Bush has done a good job with a list of horrible things to handle. With or without the difficult situations to handle, I know that all Christians should pray for our leaders every day. This should be regardless of whether we like them or not.

I do think that President Bush has faced a lot of unfair criticism, and he's also been on the receiving end of more dirty politics than any I can remember during my lifetime. I also have some disagreement with some of the things that were done or undone,  but overall I don't know how he could have tried any harder. I think that history will reflect this, but that's simply my opinion. I would vote for him again, even with some of the things that I disagreed with.

The main point that I wanted to make is the need for all Christians to pray for our leaders. In this case, I know that President Bush appreciates our prayers, but it really doesn't matter what the leader appreciates - we should still be praying for our leaders even if we can't stand anything about them.

Love in Christ,
Tom

1 Peter 1:3 NASB  Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to His great mercy has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, to obtain an inheritance which is imperishable and undefiled and will not fade away, reserved in heaven for you, who are protected by the power of God through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.

I don't trust him, I got bad feeling about him or just me. However I don't trust other who aganist Bush as well.

^Yes I do think we need a change but until that happens I'm going to pray for him and pray for him eveyday. He has lots of decisions to make  ones that I don't think  I would want to make. I am also praying that when the next election comes that the right person will be elected :)

President Bush seems a lackey and a front man for others IMHO. Influenced by special interests and big business. He seems to lack the intelligence and brain power needed for the position he fills, that of president of the United States. When listened to, it is hard to believe that such a one is in this highest office of the land and leading the formost power in the world.

He reminds me of Captain Queeg in the novel "The Caine Mutiny", who took his shipmates under his command down the path to mutiny and possible court martial, due to someone taking a few strawberries out of the ship's galley for personal consumption. What is like Queeg here is the obsession to stay the course even though it is shown him it is wrong and meanwhile personal lives are at stake.

I lack respect for him out of his manipulations to avoid action in the Vietnam war.

We must pray for our government. God's will be done.

ollie

Don't underestimate the Presidents intelligence, reasoning and leadership abilities just because of the way he speaks.

The President can hardly be equated to Captain Queeg. The situations he has faced and the actions taken are way more than the results of the pilfering of a few strawberries. The lives of many people cannot be equated to those strawberries.



I have somewhat of a problem with this also but at least he didn't run to Canada nor did he colloborate with the enemy during Viet Nam.

I fully support President Bush. He is not perfect but I believe he is right on about most of his ideas.
I do believe he is a Christian and his actions support this in my opinion. Has he made mistakes,sure he has, but who hasn't? I make them every day, as does anyone who has ever drawn breath with the exception of One.

I cannot believe that people still believe that if we had just let Hussein carry on he would not have at sometime in the not so distant future been behind the terrorists with all he had to bring war to our land,and to others. He is a madman!

We have never backed down and should never start.

Our President is ordained of God - Rom 13 - and has a tough row to hoe for the last 2 years of his term.  He needs our prayers for Heavenly wisdom as the job just became 10 times harder.  I would not want nasty Nancy breathing down my neck all the time.  The dems succeeded because they lied, exaggerated, maligned and missrepresented practically everything to regain congress.  Well, God gave it to them - we will see the results just like we did during the Clinton admin.

The liberal media assisted the dems in their quest and the reps stood around  - did not clean house when they should have, and did not fight dirty in return.  They reserved their war for Iraq, not home - and we're winning, but you wouldn't know it from the press.

The serious issue of Supreme Court appointments is where I will be investing my prayer time.

Amen Doc!

Good points Brother! I will pray for whoever is in office, and I really do consider that to be a duty for every Christian. Many good things have been done, and many other good things were tried. This is one reason why President Bush is absolutely hated by so many. He certainly isn't perfect, and he did do some things that I'm against, but that doesn't change my overall appreciation of him. He took some horrible heat for some of the good things that he tried to do, and that should be expected in the current society we live in. In terms of intelligence, that's not even a question. He was smart enough for a Christian to serve two terms as President of the United States during a time when the devil is running rampant. Further the devil running rampant doesn't even bother with a disguise any longer, he runs with his horns sticking out and is proud of his evil deeds.

Love In Christ,
Tom

Revelation 1:7-8 NASB  BEHOLD, HE IS COMING WITH THE CLOUDS, and every eye will see Him, even those who pierced Him; and all the tribes of the earth will mourn over Him. So it is to be. Amen. "I am the Alpha and the Omega," says the Lord God, "who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty."

Same page BEP,

We have some instructions from this little (in physical weight) book I follow:

"Be at peace among yourselves.  Now we exhort you, brethren, warn those who are unruly, comfort the fainthearted, uphold the weak, be patient with all.  See that no one renders evil for evil to anyone, but always pursue what is good both for yourselves and for all.  Rejoice always,  pray without ceasing , in everything give thanks; for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus for you."

I got to agree with the positive things about Mr. Bush. And I thank God that He gave us a President like Mr. Bush to take care of business like a true leader after the 9/11 event. Radical Islamic terrorism has been on-going long before Mr. Bush got in the White House. The previous administration was very weak in handling that problem. We need to remember that.

What worries me is how much influence over him so-called White House experts weild. But that working concerns me with all our Presidents we've had in my generation. I cannot blame Mr. Bush with all the policies passed I disagree with. We have a Congress and a Senate, many lobbyists, judicial activists who are reinterpreting the law against our Christian heritage, Federal Reserve private bankers controlling our U.S. economy, and so-called foreign policy think-tank experts like the Council On Foreign Relations (CFR) that must all be stirred into the mix of powerful Capitol Hill influences. One man cannot fend off all those influences all the time.

The U.S. media has bashed Christianity, and Mr. Bush and his Faith, as also other faithful ones in his administration, like Attorney General John Ashcroft. The mainstream media machine is primarily a Leftist propaganda operation today, so why should any true American listen to the Leftist media about Mr. Bush? That witness by the guy from Montana would never make it to public via the mainstream Leftist media machine. In short, we are living in a time when we cannot trust that many U.S. news sources.

God bless.