HEALING CHECK IT OUT

[rapha777]

John Wesley

John Wesley ( the founder of the Methodists ) described numerous miracles of healing through his own prayers. He even tells of a story of how he prayed for his horse who had become lame on the way to a preaching engagement. He placed his hand on the horses leg and prayed that it might become well. A little later the horse revived and together they were able to journey to their destination.


Rapha

[Brother Love]

John Wesley

John Wesley ( the founder of the Methodists ) described numerous miracles of healing through his own prayers. He even tells of a story of how he prayed for his horse who had become lame on the way to a preaching engagement. He placed his hand on the horses leg and prayed that it might become well. A little later the horse revived and together they were able to journey to their destination.


Rapha

I prayed for my dog and it lived 2 more years.

Brother Love

[Ambassador4Christ]

John Wesley

John Wesley ( the founder of the Methodists ) described numerous miracles of healing through his own prayers. He even tells of a story of how he prayed for his horse who had become lame on the way to a preaching engagement. He placed his hand on the horses leg and prayed that it might become well. A little later the horse revived and together they were able to journey to their destination.


Rapha

I prayed for my dog and it lived 2 more years.

Brother Love

KOOL

[smartinez1984]

As someone else mentioned beforehand, this topic has a bit of history for me, actually a lot of history and I have yet to understand it. As a precursor: my parents were pastors of a Penticostal church for over 40 years, until my mom became blind due to glaucoma. My father passed away a few years ago after suffering through a few strokes, a couple of heart attacks, and lung cancer. I am considered borderline deaf due to the lack of ear drums and partial eardrums, the result of my parents not taking me to doctors when I was young while I suffered through multiple ear infections. Their belief in faith healing superseded their belief in doctors.

So, with that said, here are some of my questions: If God heals today, what is required for the healing to take place?

Is it faith and only faith?

Is it faith combined with God's will?

Is it faith combined with God's will combined with a sinless life?

What is it?

If it's only faith then we must assume my parents had no faith.

If it's faith with God's will then it really doesn't matter if you have faith or not, God's will determines the outcome.

If it's faith with God's will with a sinless life then forget it, I'll never be healed. Will I? Will my mom?

-Samson

[Brother Love]

As someone else mentioned beforehand, this topic has a bit of history for me, actually a lot of history and I have yet to understand it. As a precursor: my parents were pastors of a Penticostal church for over 40 years, until my mom became blind due to glaucoma. My father passed away a few years ago after suffering through a few strokes, a couple of heart attacks, and lung cancer. I am considered borderline deaf due to the lack of ear drums and partial eardrums, the result of my parents not taking me to doctors when I was young while I suffered through multiple ear infections. Their belief in faith healing superseded their belief in doctors.

So, with that said, here are some of my questions: If God heals today, what is required for the healing to take place?

Is it faith and only faith?

Is it faith combined with God's will?

Is it faith combined with God's will combined with a sinless life?

What is it?

If it's only faith then we must assume my parents had no faith.

If it's faith with God's will then it really doesn't matter if you have faith or not, God's will determines the outcome.

If it's faith with God's will with a sinless life then forget it, I'll never be healed. Will I? Will my mom?

-Samson

Good message smartinez1984

Brother Love

[Ambassador4Christ]

As someone else mentioned beforehand, this topic has a bit of history for me, actually a lot of history and I have yet to understand it. As a precursor: my parents were pastors of a Penticostal church for over 40 years, until my mom became blind due to glaucoma. My father passed away a few years ago after suffering through a few strokes, a couple of heart attacks, and lung cancer. I am considered borderline deaf due to the lack of ear drums and partial eardrums, the result of my parents not taking me to doctors when I was young while I suffered through multiple ear infections. Their belief in faith healing superseded their belief in doctors.

So, with that said, here are some of my questions: If God heals today, what is required for the healing to take place?

Is it faith and only faith?

Is it faith combined with God's will?

Is it faith combined with God's will combined with a sinless life?

What is it?

If it's only faith then we must assume my parents had no faith.

If it's faith with God's will then it really doesn't matter if you have faith or not, God's will determines the outcome.

If it's faith with God's will with a sinless life then forget it, I'll never be healed. Will I? Will my mom?

-Samson

Now that is some truth

Amen

[4JC]

Hi Samson,

Sorry to hear about the all the sickness in your family, and your Father passing on. I would say the answer to your question is faith in Gods will. I hope that you would never give up on asking in prayer though. God has many reasons that we should ask Him in prayer, but more importantly, that we trust in Him, whatever His will is for us (see Psalm 13). I don't want to get into my own personal sicknesses, or my families, but the other people I was talking about was a couple that I knew. We were all attending a Pentecostal Church at the time. I was new there, and they were there for twenty years. The husband became terminally ill with cancer. For a year and a half they prayed believing if they only had enough faith God would heal him. When he passed on, the wife walked away from everything and everyone, basically, she's an apostate. It was a very sad thing to see happen and it really makes you think, I mean, this is not essential doctrine, healing that is, but the effects of this teaching when taken out of its Biblical context can be very damaging, as your testimony confirms.

I can tell you this much though, I have never been miraculously healed directly from God, or at least not that I am aware of, as I have said before, and maybe I didn't stress it enough, this is really, really, really rare. And I don't believe the gift of healing is for today, and it was never for the purpose of keeping Christians healthy. But, having said that, there have been times when my back has been so bad that I could barely move, and I prayed to God for healing, and most of the pain disappeared, not 100%, and only for a time. This happens all the time for me (not every time). This took me by surprise because I thought God only healed with miracles, but these healings were not miracles. This opened my eyes to Gods providence. I believe this is where all the confusion comes into play. I think some of the time (not always), in the middle of all this hocus pocus stuff going on, someone actually drops to their knees and prays and God, through His providence relieves some of the pain or heals people through normal means, maybe even speeding it up a bit. Then right away everyone is calling it a miracle, when it's not, it's God's providence. God is active in every aspect of our lives and not just the events that appear dramatic or spectacular. You honor God most when you see that, when you see God working in your life in every detail of it. We don't always understand God's will in every detail, and it doesn't always seam fair to us, but there is a greater purpose involved. I am almost positive I would have never accepted Jesus into my heart or even considered doing so had it not been for my illness(Depression/anxiety). He used this to draw me to Him. Providence.

Eph.1:11
In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:

Romans 8:28
And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.

Proverbs 16:33
The lot is cast into the lap; but the whole disposing thereof is of the LORD.

And so on.

Again, I'm sorry to hear about you and your families hardships.

God bless
4JC

[smartinez1984]

Hello 4JC,

Thanks for your kind words. You bring up an interesting point, one that extends beyond the topic of healing. That is the point of God's sovereignty, or providence. I have never seen a healing (other than some skeptical "evidence" on TV) that I would constitute a miracle. I had this discussion with another gentleman a few days back about the definition of a miracle. For example, we know a gospel singer who's been suffering all his life from degenerative kidneys. He recently received a transplant which he testifies as a miracle. I told my friend that I didn't consider it a miracle, maybe a blessing from God, but not a miracle. He disagreed. I told him a miracle would have been for his ailing kidneys to be completely restored without human intervention. He is now confused ...

Anyway, I digress...

If God's providence is in play in miracles then does that mean it's also in play everywhere else, like salvation? In other words, does that mean that even if I have faith that I am saved I could actually NOT be saved because it depends on his will? Or does that only apply to everything else like healing, spiritual gifts, etc.

God Bless,

-Samson

[4JC]

Hi Samson,

Thanks for your kind words. You bring up an interesting point, one that extends beyond the topic of healing. That is the point of God's sovereignty, or providence. I have never seen a healing (other than some skeptical "evidence" on TV) that I would constitute a miracle. I had this discussion with another gentleman a few days back about the definition of a miracle. For example, we know a gospel singer who's been suffering all his life from degenerative kidneys. He recently received a transplant which he testifies as a miracle. I told my friend that I didn't consider it a miracle, maybe a blessing from God, but not a miracle. He disagreed. I told him a miracle would have been for his ailing kidneys to be completely restored without human intervention. He is now confused ...

Amen. That's the problem. To say something is not a miracle is not to say that God didn't do it. I think some people refuse to come to terms with that. It's important to note, that miracles from above are usually acts of judgment. So if someone asked "can God heal with a miracle today?", I would say that He can do whatever He wants to do, but He will not do anything that goes against what His word says. So I wouldn't close that door on that, I would just keep in mind that this was never His pattern.
 

Anyway, I digress...

If God's providence is in play in miracles then does that mean it's also in play everywhere else, like salvation? In other words, does that mean that even if I have faith that I am saved I could actually NOT be saved because it depends on his will? Or does that only apply to everything else like healing, spiritual gifts, etc.

Good question Samson. Once saved, always saved, so if you have faith and you are saved, this "is" God's will for you. The Bible tells us of many indicators that give evidence of true faith. The lady I mentioned in my last post who walked away was never saved to begin with; she showed that by turning her back on God, if in fact, that's what she did. Only she knows that for sure. Election is something to be grasped; I don't know that anyone can fully understand it. I'm sure there is another thread on this subject (Election) somewhere in this forum. If not, we'll have to start one. But I think what you are talking about is election.
 

God bless
4JC

P.S. One of my sisters just walked though the door and the first thing out of her mouth was about hospital studies being done about "healing rooms" in Churches. Iye yie yie. (Shaking my head side to side with my hand over my face).

[rapha777]

Recently, I have been meditating on the healing testimony in Luke 13 : 10 - 17.

10 And he was teaching in one of the synagogues on the sabbath. 11 And, behold, there was a woman which had a spirit of infirmity eighteen years, and was bowed together, and could in no wise lift up herself. 12 And when Jesus saw her, he called her to him, and said unto her, Woman, thou art loosed from thine infirmity. 13 And he laid his hands on her: and immediately she was made straight, and glorified God. 14 And the ruler of the synagogue answered with indignation, because that Jesus had healed on the sabbath day, and said unto the people, There are six days in which men ought to work: in them therefore come and be healed, and not on the sabbath day. 15 The Lord then answered him, and said, Thou hypocrite, doth not each one of you on the sabbath loose his ox or his ass from the stall, and lead him away to watering? 16 And ought not this woman, being a daughter of Abraham, whom Satan hath bound, lo, these eighteen years, be loosed from this bond on the sabbath day? 17 And when he had said these things, all his adversaries were ashamed: and all the people rejoiced for all the glorious things that were done by him.

Several questions come to mind. In particular they are :-

1. This woman was afflicted with a spirit of infirmity which is an evil spirit. If someone went to the normal doctors today could they cure this condtion with drugs and normal medical practice?

For example, last Saturday, while street preaching, I met a man who was hearing voices on a continual  basis ( and it wasn't the Holy Spirit! ).  In my opinion, he needs Christian deliverance .

2. Who are the sons and daughters of Abraham today? Answer - see for example, Galatians 3, verses 7 and 29.

7 Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham.

29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Any Comments?

Rapha

[smartinez1984]

Yes, comments:

1. No. Doctors today, tomorrow, or yesterday could not cure this woman. Doctors today, tomorrow, or yesterday could not cause new kidneys to appear, cannot replace my middle ear to the same condition that God created it.

That's why it's called a miracle. The nature of the need doesn't matter, it's what man can do as opposed to what God can do. It doesn't matter who the daughters and sons of Abraham are. Can they get miracles today is the question, not WHO can get the miracles. Or is it?

Again, no one is questioning who can cure who of what. Neither is the question "CAN God cure anyone of anything". The answer to that question is yes. The questions are, again:

1. What is required for the healing to take place?

Is it faith and only faith?

Is it faith combined with God's will?

Is it faith combined with God's will combined with a sinless life?

What is it?

If it's only faith then we must assume my parents had no faith.

If it's faith with God's will then it really doesn't matter if you have faith or not, God's will determines the outcome.

If it's faith with God's will with a sinless life then forget it, I'll never be healed. Will I? Will my mom?

Comments?

[rapha777]

Generally speaking, if you cannot heal yourself and the doctors cann't do it, it leaves only the Lord Jesus Christ / God as your option.

Because certain people believe that healing is only for Israel, I mentioned the seed of Abraham above to show that healing is for Christians ( Jew or Gentile ).

Also came across the following healing miracle which is well worth reading / listening to!

The Story of Betty Baxter is True. She was a dying cripple but she had faith that Jesus Christ would heal her. After revealing the exact day and hour that He would, (Sunday August 24th, 1941 at 3:00 PM) Jesus did heal her completely. She has since taken up the call of God to go and tell her story all over the world.

The URL link is @

http://www.geocities.com/bettybaxterstory/index2.html

Shalom,

Rapha

[Brother Love]

EVERYONE WANTS TO GO TO HEAVEN, BUT NOBODY WANTS TO DIE

Brother Love

[GeorgiaBoy]

Saw an interesting Non-hyped (what a change!) program on healing on TBN called A Night of Miracles.  It played Thanksgiving Day.  Man, that was something to be thankful for!  It had two great testimonies that really moved me -- a lady healed of environmental illness (allergic to everything) and a British rocker with a bad heart healed at a church service.   The ministry, Pleasant Valley Church, teaches about sanctification's role in healing.  Strong meat.  The Pastor is Henry Wright (do a Google search) and his book, "A More Excellent Way" really changed my theology on healing.  We have a part too.  I guess it answers the question of what we do when prayer alone isn't working.  true, God hears us.  But, will he heal us if we have unforginess or fear or bitterness??

Also caughtPastor Wright on Sid Roth's website too.  Mr. Roth has many healing testimonies on his shows.

Anyone else catch this TBN special?

[rapha777]

Saw an interesting Non-hyped (what a change!) program on healing on TBN called A Night of Miracles.  It played Thanksgiving Day.  Man, that was something to be thankful for!  It had two great testimonies that really moved me -- a lady healed of environmental illness (allergic to everything) and a British rocker with a bad heart healed at a church service.   The ministry, Pleasant Valley Church, teaches about sanctification's role in healing.  Strong meat.  The Pastor is Henry Wright (do a Google search) and his book, "A More Excellent Way" really changed my theology on healing.  We have a part too.  I guess it answers the question of what we do when prayer alone isn't working.  true, God hears us.  But, will he heal us if we have unforginess or fear or bitterness??

Also caughtPastor Wright on Sid Roth's website too.  Mr. Roth has many healing testimonies on his shows.

Anyone else catch this TBN special?

Many thanks for your post.

Also MAY BE some are not healed because they have "flabby faith ".( NOTE I DID NOT SAY ALL! )

see very good testimony about this @ : - http://www.christcorner.com/testimonies/testimonies1-8.html

Shalom,

Rapha.