Do calvinists know for sure they are saved?

[asaph]

I have oftened wondered how a calvinist can know for certain that they are saved. I do not want to cast doubt on any bro or sis but I really do wonder how you know that you know that you are saved?

asaph

[ollie]

Good Question.

When one hears the good news of Jesus Christ they may or may not believe it. It is a choice to choose God. If one believes it and obeys the Lord, one knows he is saved because God's word declares it.

[Sower]

Those Calvinists who genuinely believe, repent, and receive Christ must know that they are saved. However, TULIP does distort everything, and the focus shifts from God's marvelous, infinite grace, goodness and mercy to His sovereignty and election of some to salvation and others to damnation. This, in my estimation, is another gospel.

[oholiab]

   Becase the Holy Spirit tells us so:"The Spirit himself testifires with our spirit that we are sons of God"(Rom 8:16)

[Photogrunt]

Never mind Calvanists...and I'm not sure why you would pick this one sect to ask the question.  For everyone, regardless of what title you put on it, choosing salvation through Jesus Christ is the way to know if one is saved or not.

As far as the 'elected' is concerned, my arguement is that God knows who will be saved and who won't before they are born.  Those of us who choose to be saved are the 'elected' as described in scripture.

We will never understand how the Allmighty works, thinks, or does things.  Faith is what He asks of us.  I place my faith in Him, His Son, and His Holy Spirit.  My name is written in the Lamb's Book of Life.  Now all that's left for me to worry about is living the best life I can with Jesus as my example, and to work the harvest as Jesus charged to his disciples.

Amen!  Blessed be His Name!

[asaph]

I have no doubt that all of you that have posted are genuine believers saved and washed in the blood of the the Lamb. I rejoice with you. The reason I singled out the Calvinists is because we are all touched by this doctrine in one way or another. Parts of its tenets are in most of the church today.

Here is TULIP:

Total Depravity
Unconditional Election
Limited Atonement
Irresistible Grace
Perserverance of the Saints

If unconditional election is true how does one know that he is saved? What about those who think they are saved but really are not? Later they backslide and turn away from the faith proving that they were never really saved. In other words if God has determined beforehand who will be saved and who will be lost, how does one absolutely know which group he belongs to? I think that I am saved but the doubt still lingers that maybe I am just deluded and perhaps when persecution or some traumatic experience happens or some temptation comes along , or the fact that I am harbouring sin in my heart, in the end it will be proven that I really am not saved.
Or I think I am saved but unconditional election dominates my thinking, and knowing God's just punishment of the wicked who are not of the elect, and seeing I have sin in my life daily, I have legitimate doubts about my status before God. After all I may not be one of the elect.
I said to you who have posted above that I have no doubt that you are saved, but if the "u" of Tulip is true then really I have a basis to doubt, and so do you. There is really no security in the tulip.
Our security is in Christ alone, not in unconditional election or in any other of the tenets of the tulip.

asaph

[asaph]

Good Question.

When one hears the good news of Jesus Christ they may or may not believe it. It is a choice to choose God. If one believes it and obeys the Lord, one knows he is saved because God's word declares it.

I like your answer.

asaph

[asaph]

Those Calvinists who genuinely believe, repent, and receive Christ must know that they are saved. However, TULIP does distort everything, and the focus shifts from God's marvelous, infinite grace, goodness and mercy to His sovereignty and election of some to salvation and others to damnation. This, in my estimation, is another gospel.

I agree.

asaph

[asaph]

  Becase the Holy Spirit tells us so:"The Spirit himself testifires with our spirit that we are sons of God"(Rom 8:16)

That is a good answer. It is too bad that the tulip tends to steal this assurance away.

asaph

[asaph]

Never mind Calvanists...and I'm not sure why you would pick this one sect to ask the question.  For everyone, regardless of what title you put on it, choosing salvation through Jesus Christ is the way to know if one is saved or not.

As far as the 'elected' is concerned, my arguement is that God knows who will be saved and who won't before they are born.  Those of us who choose to be saved are the 'elected' as described in scripture.

We will never understand how the Allmighty works, thinks, or does things.  Faith is what He asks of us.  I place my faith in Him, His Son, and His Holy Spirit.  My name is written in the Lamb's Book of Life.  Now all that's left for me to worry about is living the best life I can with Jesus as my example, and to work the harvest as Jesus charged to his disciples.

Amen!  Blessed be His Name!

I hear what you are saying. Jesus is committed to His faithfulness. He will take care of you. You do not have to worry one bit. Keep trusting His promises. Do not rely on your self or your works. But keep working the work of faith, and labor of love, and patience of hope.

asaph

[Photogrunt]

Amen bro.  

[Ambassador4Christ]

Amen bro.  

DITTO  

[Petro]

Posted by Sower as reply #2

Those Calvinists who genuinely believe, repent, and receive Christ must know that they are saved. However, TULIP does distort everything, and the focus shifts from God's marvelous, infinite grace, goodness and mercy to His sovereignty and election of some to salvation and others to damnation. This, in my estimation, is another gospel.
 

Sower,

You seem to focus quite a bit on Calvinism, and seem to overshadow the sovereignty of God, in putting forth your position, as thou man, by his own inate desire or ability is able to believe to the saving of the soul, apart from the miraculeous intervention  by God himself in drawing men who are called, to Christ.  
While having a correct understanding that Election is also a perogative of God, you  state the Calvinism teaches that only the elect can be saved; while this is true, in the end, Calvinism does not teach the Gospel is only for the elect; it is apparent when studying scripture, one can conclude that once a person becomes saved (regenerated by the Holy Spirit) that, that person is identified to be one of the elect, and this truth is made after the fact, and then one finds out he was also chosen in Him, from before the foundation of the world.  (Eph 1:4)

You appear to deny the very teaching of scripture that "no one comes to the father except by me" (Jhn 14:6) and "No man comes to me except the father draw him" (Jhn 6:44),  again "....and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him."  (Mat 11:27) And in the end, the elect are those who were chosen and predestinated in Him unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, (Eph1:5) according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will: (Eph1:11)

Grace is Gods business, it is He who imparts it to whomsoever He desires, it has nothing to do with man at all, other than salvation is offered to all men by this Grace which is Gods and Gods alone, to do with it what He pleases.

True Calvinists, who understand the teachings well, place the teaching in it's rightful place, "with God".

Calvinism explains Total Depravity in a nut shell in the following paragraph, you don't seem to understand it, allow me to give it to you, and then if you are unable to understand it, please feel free to raise your point, we will see if perhaps we can clarify it for you.

Total Depravity -  When man fell, sin permeated every part of his personality. This includes his thinking, emotions, and will. Total depravity does not mean he is necessarily intensely sinful, it only means that sin has encompassed to his entire being.
The unregenerate (unsaved) man is dead in his sins.
This is why 1Cor 2:14 states; "But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned."  
Any man while in the fallen state is unable to "know nor receive, Christ"
Without the power of the Holy Spirit, the natural man is blind and deaf to the message of the gospel. Man will never seek God on his own (he is in bondage to sin, and has no free will as many contend); he will never have a desire for God or righteousness.
 
This is why Total Depravity has also been called "Total Inability." Since man is totally incapable of seeking God, he will never find salvation through Jesus Christ on his own. The only time a person seeks this salvation is when God inserts a "desire for God" in his heart.

If this is not your understanding of the condition of fallen man, and what the scriptures teach concerning him,  then please explain??

And while you are at it, explain to me, how any man in his natural state, comes to Christ, whithout God the Holy Spirit first working in his heart to break down his resistance to the Gospel of Grace in him.??

On the other hand;

If you agree with the Calvinsts teaching of Total Depravity, then what credit do you give  man which allows him receive GRACE, that he might be saved by faith??

We see Salvation as a work of God, the natural man is unable, and has no power to answer in the affirmative towards Christ in order to be saved, this is only wishfull thinking, by proud men.

Please note; All of those who believe they somehow received Grace by a faith they conjured up from within themselves, and are unable to recognize that it was God working in them to will and to do of HIS good pleasure, believe they can also lose it by sinning, go figure....

This idea only reimforces to those who know and believe the truth, that these remain in their sin of unbelief.

Give God the Glory, don't glory in yourselves!!

Blessings,

Petro

[Petro]

By the way, to answer asaph's question, while not being necessarily a rigid Calvinist, since I believe, the points do not necessarily limit those who believe what Calvinism teaches in it's totality (it is not limited to 5 simplistic points).

Those of us who agree with the teaching which Calvinism proposes, KNOW without a doubt, that we are ETERNALLY SECURE in our faith, because the blood which bought us, paid for ALL, that is the TOTALITY of ALL of the SINS WE HAVE EVER COMMITTED and WILL COMMIT until the day we die in this body made from the cursed dust of this earth.

We do not deny the blood that bought us..

On the other hand stout Arminians, deny the blood that bought them, claiming, sin can undo what Grace accomplished for them, let me remind these, that this position is heretical according to scripture.

Having said this, I would qualify my statement by saying that among the goats who teach this lie, are sheep, who have been deceived by the father of lies who leads these teachers, who after saying this "that they can lose their salvation", expose their error, by then claiming they can be re-saved by the same blood, which they claim, was insufficient in that it was not able to cover the sin that caused them to fall away.

I say to these deceived sheep, think about your position which you embrace, it is obvious you are being lead around by the nose, desiring to hear these false teachers, rather than the Word which saved them.

Blessings,

Petro

[Drake]

Those Calvinists who genuinely believe, repent, and receive Christ must know that they are saved. However, TULIP does distort everything, and the focus shifts from God's marvelous, infinite grace, goodness and mercy to His sovereignty and election of some to salvation and others to damnation. This, in my estimation, is another gospel.

Proverbs 16:4.  The Lord has made all things for Himself, Yes, even the wicked for the day of doom.

Petro that was a good post, thanks.  I would like to add something from J.I. Packer:
You give God thanks for your conversion. Now whydo you do that? Because you know in your heart that God was entirely responsible for it. You did not save yourself; He saved you. You did not put it down to chance or accident that you came under  Christian influence when you did. You do not put it down to chance or accident that you attenred a Christian church, that you heard the Christian gospel, that you had Christian friends and, perhaps, a Christian hame, that the  Bible fell into your hands, that you saw your need of Christ and came to trust Him as your Saviour. You do not attribute your repention and believing to your own wisdom, or prudence, or sound judgment, or good sense. Perhaps, in the days when you were seekong Christ, you laboured and strove hard, read and pondered much, but all that outlay of effort did not make your conbersion your own work.
Your act of faith when you closed with Christ was yours in the sense that it was you who performed it; but that does not mean that you saved yourself.
You would never dream of dividing the credit for your salvation between God and yourself. You have never for one moment supposed that the decisive contribution to your salvation was yours and not God's. You have never told god that, while you are grateful for the means and opportunities of grace that He gave you, you realize that you have to thank, not Him, But yourself for the fact that you responded to His call. Your heart revolts at the very thought of talking to God in such terms. In fact, you thank Him no less sincerely for the gift of faith and repentance than for the gift of a Christ to trust and turn to.
You give God all the glory for all that your salvation involved, and you know that it would be blasphemy if you refused to thank Him for bringing you to faith.