But..........,what in the world does that mean? "

[ARPEL]

Beacuse of a conversation I had been having with a friend of mine, I have now added another Interlinear to my collection of study materials.

The Green Interlinear, is considered very good especially in helping to understand "some" hard to "understand"  passages of scripture.

New breakthroughs in linguistics especially in greek and latin interpretations from the original biblical acient languages helps to shed lite and shape a better understanding of hard to comprehend, what has been considered to be, hard to understand biblical texts.

One is;


2 Thessalonians 2: 6-7
And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.
For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

The following exert is taken from a 1999 commentary written by Darroll Evans on 2 Th 2, where he references the Green Interlinear.

Quote;

Verse 6 has to do with the proper timing of the lawless one's uncovering. Everything has a proper time in Christ.
Paul then tells us that the "mystery" of iniquity is already at work in society. Why would he tell us something that is so obvious?

The mystery of iniquity is not obvious to those caught in its trap. To them it is "normal" life.

Why can't they see the truth of the effects of sin? No person can see that unless the Holy Spirit opens his/her eyes.

Let me offer a controversy in verse 7b. It says, "he who now restrains will do so until he is taken out of the way." Or does it say that?

This is where we run into linguistic and theological problems.

Let's look first at the Greek. This section in Greek is, "EwV ek mesou genhtai." Most translators would translate it as, "until he is taken out of the way."

I think we all could agree that this refers to the Holy Spirit.
That may be where the agreement ends.
If you have read much of my work, you already know that I do not always agree with the majority. This is another of those times.

Jay P. Green also does not agree with the majority. Green's translation is, "until it comes out of (the) midst." (page 895 of His Hebrew-Greek-English Interlinear Bible, published by The Book Factory-Lafayette, IN) *If you do not have Green's Interlinear, I suggest you get it.

The problem lies with the translation of geneetai-genhtai. "Taken out of the way" is just a very poor translation. It has led much of Christianity into a false expectation. Geneetai is the 3rd person, singular, aorist, subjective form of ginomai. It means to come into being, to be birthed, to come into the midst, and many other things EXCEPT What the KJV says it does.

The literal may be "Until out of the midst he may come." That translation will gain it's own controversy. But, what in the world does that mean? "

End of Quote.


So if there is substance to what he has said;

2 Th 2:6-7 should read as follows;

And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.
For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, Until out of the midst he may come.


Now since I had never heard of this until recently, I never focused on this portion of the text because, I assumed the "he" in the portion addressed by Mr. Evans was the same "He" in the portion imediately preceding the text in question.


I have always understood that the "He who letteth" at the very least was the third person of the trinity though my first choice has always been it was the Father Himself. Who restrians or allows every good or evil work by the working of His Word through His Will.

For He has said;

So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.  
                                                                       Isa 55:11


Anyone have an opinion about this?

[Bronzesnake]

"He who letteth" is the Holy Spirit within the Church.
The verse is saying that satan can not personally appear, until the Church is taken out of the way (Raptured)

"the mystery of iniquity doth already work" - satan's evil influence is at work, and has been from the begining of man.
However, satan can not personally appear on earth, until the Church is Raptured (taken out of the way)

[one sheep]

Arpel-

What you will find here is that most people do not want definition. This particular topic was looked at over twenty times. One person responded. This is really good information that you brought to the table and I agree that we should seek more than a pat answer to satisfy us. Interlinear bibles and parsing guides are not popular, because that means that people would actually have to study for themselves. But isn't that what we are supposed to be doing? And for that matter how long? I'm thinking that it's a lifetimes work, something to keep us focused on God, instead of self.
God is able to hide things in plain sight fro people, and has all throughout the entire bible. Thank you for giving me something to think about.

Bronzesnake. If satan can only appear on earth when to church is taken (raptured) taken out of the way. Then
where do you suppose he is now? Who or what is coodinating the darkness of this world? What is the spiritual wickedness in high places? He can't be in Heaven, because he's been cast out. So where is he if he's not on earth?

[ARPEL]

Whereever there is a hard to understand passage of scripture there is controversy.

My intent in sharing what is not obvious to the casual reader, or someone who occasionally studies scripture in the light of established particular chuch doctrines is not is to create more controversy but to unravel what is hard to understand, if anything for my own understanding, if others can be edified by sharing, then Praise God.

Got many years I believed what bronzesanke has stated that;

"He who letteth" is the Holy Spirit within the Church.

I disagree with this argument for the simple reason that the  the Holy Spirit came into the world according to Jesus, was to;

"reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:"  Jhn 16:8

and again He says;

" .....he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will show you things to come.
 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall show it unto you."  Jhn 16:13-14

Note that both verses have to do with revealing Jesus, and rebuking or convicting the world, neither of which "restrains".

It could be said that these influences brought on by the Holy Spirits activities by there convincing and convicting results in mens hearts, might restrain evil in the world and in the believer it can be said that the work does restrain evil however, it is clear the Comforters principle workings is for the benefit of Gods elect, not to restrain evil in th world.

While praying to the Father Jesus said, at;


Jhn 17
13  And now come I to thee; and these things I speak in the world, that they might have my joy fulfilled in themselves.
14  I have given them thy word; and the world hath hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.
15 ;b' I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil.[/b]
16  They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.
17  Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.
18  As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world.
19  And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth.
20  Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;

Note verse 15, that inspite of evil in the world Jesus specifically prayed that those who had been given to Him of the Father "be not taken out of this world."

Certainly all honest readers of verse 20, would agree that allTribulation Saints are included in this request to the Father.

"The verse is saying that satan can not personally appear, until the Church is taken out of the way (Raptured)"

"However, satan can not personally appear on earth, until the Church is Raptured (taken out of the way)"

"cannot persoanlly appear on the earth, until the church is taken out"

This theologoy can only be supported by applying the doctrines of dispensationlism, which lead one to misunderstand what is written for our edification.

The Church has not been given the power to obstruct or restrain the coming of the Antichrist.

I've had to question dispensationlism, because of its teachings, I see Gods chosen and elect as one people; while dispensationlism divides Gods people into; them and us.

The same Gospel which was preached to Abraham was preached to Moses, and those who died during the 40 years of wonderings in the desert, and while the scriptures are careful to give is a record of those who came to faith in the same Lamb of God we believe in, also, tells that those who died without faith in Him, perished because of unbelief.  

One of the errors that has been exposed recently is the very teaching of what bronzesanke has stated this verse means.

According to those who espouse this same understandimg as bz of the passage refered to (2 Th 2:3)

"Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;"

in affect would change the verse to read as follows;

"Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a rapture first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;"

While the word "falling away" maybe defined;

As Departure; it is not used in this verse refering (time space) to spatial but rather;

Is defined as "APOSTASY  (that of deoarture of a religious belief)

While the argument is being made that apostasy is ongoing,
it is clear it is, brought upon those who allow themselves to be deceived and it is God who sends them a strong delusion to be belive a (specific) lie.  2 Th 2:11

Who ever HE is, that withholdeth (2 Th 2:6), what should  be clear to us, is that the believers at Thessolinica new who HE was.

In the end I see this as Gods working in ultimately putting all things under His feet.





God Bless,