Secular Music

[BDoggy]

I have never thought that music is automatically wrong just because the band is not labeled as a 'Christian' band. I think it is wrong, however, to listen to any music that has obscene lyrics or that deals with specifically unChristian themes (sexual immorality, drugs, violence, etc.). however, I have heard some bands who's music for the most part is not in any way obscene, and whose lyrics are not specifically 'Christian' nor are they in any way 'unChristian', yet there lifestyles and beliefs are definitely unChristian, and are no secret to the world, but are made clearly known to all their fans. My question is; is it wrong to listen to their music because of their lifestyle's even though there is nothing wrong with the lyrics themselves, or is it only wrong when the lyrics are obscene, perverse and unChristian?

[Sapphire W34P0N]

*Sigh.*

This topic has been brought up before, and all that happens is people yelling at people. Or, more specifically, me yelling at people. I don't believe that it is wrong to listen to secular music, but I know several users here have greatly differing opinions than I. And, since I don't want to get any more involved than I already have, I will leave my opinion there, and you may say as you wish about it. Ta.

[Symphony]

BDoggy, everything here is a potential "siren" song.  Remember Ulysses, having his seaman strap him to the mast but leaving his ears unplugged, so that he could have his cake and eat it too--listen to the Siren beauties sunning themselves on the shoals, but not fall victim to their wiles...

Everthing here, not just the vississitudes of music, is a siren song, luring you away from the beat of a different drummer--getting you to think about other things, getting you to change your plans, getting you to change your priorites.

We must walk to the beat of a different drummer, to the song of a different "siren", the man Jesus Christ.

I think when you make that comparison, between what you know to be true, and what you are listening to or indulging, you'll be able to spot the difference(s).

Of course, Sapphire, like the rest of us, is working through all of this too.  So you have stuff like, um,  "people suck" on his masthead there, for instance...

...um...

Ahem.

[BDoggy]

sapphire-um, actually i have no intention of turning this into an argument in any way. why in the world would i get angry at someone simply because they share their opinion, that is the whole reason i asked the question; because i want to get other people's perspectives on the issue. if you don't like people yelling at people (and neither do i) then here is a simple solution; don't yell at them. besides, my question was not weather it is right or wrong to listen to secular music, as i myself said i dont think music is wrong simply because the artist is not labeled, 'Christian'. my question was more specific than that.

here, let me give you an example; i really didn't want to mention a specific band, but i think it will help to make my point; i have always been a big fan of 'Tool'. i dont know if any of you guys are familiar with their music, but i can almost gaurantee that you have all heard of them. Tool's most recent album, 'Lateralus' contains no obscene or offensive language at all. not one swear, and the songs on the album have, in my opinion, pretty positive messages. some of the issues that are addressed in the album are; forgiveness towards others, communicating with others & not keeping your feelings to yourself, keeping hope & not giving up in the midst of life's trials, and embracing life & being thankful for each moment that you have. i personally dont find any of these subjects to be the least bit offensive or immoral, but i also know that the members of Tool are professing atheists, and are very actively involved in drugs; this is just an example, but in this case, the lyrics are fine, but the lifestyles & beliefs of the band is not consistent with a Christian world view, so would it be wrong to listen to this music or not? i will greatly appreciate anyone who cares to share their opinions, and i can assure you that nobody's opinion will make me angry in any way.

[Whitehorse]

I would say that if the music doesn't contain immorality *and* it doesn't lead you away from the Lord in your thought life, then it sounds pretty harmless. (Another consideration are the images that come with the album.) I personally like the band Creed, which you would think is a Christian band if you didn't know more about them personally. They're not, but there are a lot of Christian themes in there because Scott Stapp's parents were Baptists, if I'm remembering it right. Well, actually I can't remember if it was Baptist, but it was a Christian church. I can't remember offhand. (Stapp is the lead singer.)

But these days I listen to Christian music almost exclusively, because I think it's more beneficial to me, not just to have lyrics that don't lead me away from God, but ones that lead me directly to His heart. Not that one is wrong, it's just the other is more beneficial to me in coming closer to my Lord. But that's my personal decision. If you need a break and want to take some downtime, if the music doesn't put your thinking in a way that offends God *and* the lyrics don't wear on His ears, then why not?

[Symphony]

Yep, as long as you're "walking in the Word", you'll be taking things on a case by case basis, called "discernment".    

"Only take care lest this liberty of yours somehow become a stumbling block to the weak."  I Corinth. 8:9

Few things are really that "evil" in and of themselves.  'Tho of late increasingly it seems much of the popular media, including entertainment, is literally laced with perversion.  

But, you'll have to look at the context.  In order to examine the "context", you'll have to practice discernment.

And in order to know discernment, you'll have to know Who gives that disernment("The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge..." Prov. 1:7)--and the better you know Him, through study of HIs Word and daily obedience, the better you'll become at spotting these things.

"Caught doing good" or "What Would Jesus Do" is a good governing principal.

But it's very difficult--tho tempting--to categorically dismiss this practice, or that practice.  The danger is becoming legalistic, or dogmatic, or "religious"...

And for those who are, perhaps we need to be patient, or kind...

[Sapphire W34P0N]

if you don't like people yelling at people (and neither do i)

I never said that. I enjoy it sometimes.

Anyway. Tool, huh? I've been contemplating whether or not to get 'Lateralus' because I know Tool has a darker image. I think I will now. My thanks.

Symphony...'People suck?' I see no 'People suck' anywhere...

[Symphony]

You're a sight, Sapphire.

[Tibby]

I see nothing wrong with secular music. Nothing that isn’t wrong about Christian music. The only Christians bands that actually sing songs about god and how great he is are the bands like the former DC Talk and all their spin offs, and to these bands, it is all about manipulating the emotions of the Christian public for money. The other Christian band spend have their time being goofy and remaking Veggietales songs and don’t even talk about God in their music half the time! Christian music, give me a break, there is no suck thing anymore!

[Whitehorse]

It's really, really important to be careful when attributing negative motives to people, especially without knowledge. Because if we're wrong....

[BDoggy]

wow! thanx so much for all your insights.

whitehorse-yeah, i thought creed was a christian band for the longest time, until i saw (or maybe read) an interview where the lead singer was asked if they were a christian band, and he actually started laughing because of the comment. creed has some beautiful imagery in their songs though. i'd have to say my favorite of their songs is, 'my own prison'. and good point also about listening to music that isn't merely non-offensive, but beneficial as well.

symphony-you're right. the more we fill our minds with God's word, the better we'll know what not to put into our minds.

sapphire-yeah, i would definitely recommend lateralus. it is dramatically different than their other albums. they almost sound like a completely different band all together. all the dark imagery, the excessive swearing(Aenima), the drugs(My Third Eye), the anti-Christian lyrics(Eulogy) is all gone. lateralus actually has alot of positive, uplifting songs, and personally, although i'm sure it was not Tool's intentions, when i listen to this album, i almost cant help but to reflect on my relationship with God. trust me, it's a great album.(track 8 kinda sux, but thats it)

tibby-good point about the bands who call themselves, 'Christian'. not that i am in any way judging the people in the band(s), but it's true, we need to use discernment not just with secular music, but 'Christian' music as well.

well, again thanx to all you guys. i think this has helped me out.

[Symphony]

You're welcome.

[Tibby]

Creed actually started out Christian, but went secular.

Don't worry, I only judge bands that I know about. the reason I used DC Talk, because they are clearly all about money, and emotional maniplation of the Christian public to get it. Power and money can do all kinds of thinks to a person, and they don't even see it half the time. DC Talk is a sell-out band, they changed genra, and for what? Money, it is all about money! At least Tool admitts they are a corprate band!

[Whitehorse]

I'd be curious to know why you think that about DC Talk. I've met them, Michael a couple of times, and I thought they were very sincere.

[Tibby]

Please! Have you heard their music when they first started? Have you seen pictures of them when they first started. I mean old school 80’s rap! And then they just up and switch to rock, when old school Rap goes out of style. There is only one reason you change genre that drastically, Money! I mean, Rap is, and rock is cool, but when you switch, you sell out, and you sell out for ONE reason, you want to stay around. And you do that for one reason. MONEY!