Spiritual Gifts?

[AVBunyan]

If I remember correctly Paul says all who are in Christ are complete and lacking nothing now that the perfect man has been reveales:

Col 2:10  And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:

Also in - Eph 4:11  And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
Eph 4:12  For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
Eph 4:13  Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

The gifts were in the early Acts period while the body of Christ was forming - the body has been formed and revealed by Paul after Acts 29.  The perfect man has been presented (Christ in Ephesians) so the gifts and gifted men are no longer needed.

The good news - all the saints are equal when it come to what God has for them - all have the Holy Spirit available.

So, this discussing of what gift each has or hasn't is irrevelant - if you are saved you are complete in Christ - no excuses for not doing something because you don't have the gift - and no pride for thinking your gift is better than the next guy or for one who does not have a gift!

Quit being concerned what you have or don't have and get to work - you have been equipped - bless God!

[bluelake]

OK...here's my two cents in answer to the original question. I do have spiritual gifts. I have the gift of teaching, preaching, counseling, leadership, pastoring, and caring. I do not have the gift of tongues...i have never spoken in tongues and I do not feel the Lord has bestowed upon me that gift. I have prayed about my gifts and I am quite certain what I have listed above are my gifts according to Scripture...again I do not have the gift of tongue...and I never have spoken in tongues...so I am still a Child of God...and am still saved for those who believe if you do not speak in tongues you are not saved. Anywho...just answering the question...i got something i got to work on typing up. God Bless

Joshua

I just read about gifts today in Rom.12:3-21 v.6 says that we have gifts that differ according to the grace given to us.

Peace,
bluelake

[MalkyEL]

silver wrote:
Christians have an obligation to understand and use the gifts that God has given them; it is how we can become complete lacking nothing.  I wish more Christians today would seek guidance from the Lord about their gifts and then use them, so that we wouldn’t have so much complacency in the church today.  


nana:
Amen to that!  Too often people are either pew sitters or the other extreme, running around involved in everything under this heavy guilt complex that they are not doing enough for God.  Their gifts are truly not used, as they are heading towards burn out.

also, just because someone is not involved in church - ie serving, does not mean they are not using their gifts in another way and in another venue - one of the reasons I stopped going.  if you do not "support" the church by getting involved, you are shunned as a non-christian who does not love the Lord because you are not serving the flock in the brick building.

shalom, nana

[The_8th_Person]

Just to clear up something, that Jemidon2004 posted about, incase anyone is wondering. I don't think you have to speak tongues to be saved. Also in respond to an earlier comment I don't think you can lose your salvation.

[felix102]

Thanks for sharing brothers and sisters.

To answer the question: at one point God gave me the grace to give. I believe that God gave me the gift of teaching the day I was born.

When I was a child I told God that I wanted the truth no matter what cost.  As a child I've always known that knowledge, science,  and nature expressed the works of God. I've always found people debating topics involving science vs religion slightly amusing because people were misunderstanding a simple truth. But I knew why, "What may be known to them may be plain, because God has made it plain to them." My perspective of science has always been man's attempt to discover the work of God. This has been going on for thousands of years and we still don't understand, nor have we discovered, everything. But God made everything in far less than a thousand years! In this way, man's understanding and wisdom is foolish in the eye's of God.

About spiritual gifts
Gifts were meant for a ministry. A ministry is a service to others. God gave each one a gift according to his will to serve others. These gifts are not of our own ability but God's. Sometimes people are too focused on themselves and how well THEY can perform under their gifts when we should be focusing on God and how well we can serve God (for when you serve others then you are serving Jesus). That is why paul tells us to serve with Love. If it is not in Love then it is useless and unfruitful. When you serve, are you trying to please men or God?

I see the posts on speaking in tongues. I see the decadence of abusing such spiritual gift. But I also see how prophesy, teaching, and other spiritual gifts are abused in like manner. However, speaking in tongues is certainly misused more frequently. Why? Because Satan would like to see more people misusing a gift from God but also doing it with a gift that will have the least chance of affecting others! Satan would also like to make people think that they are serving God when they are actually serving something completely different.

Paul talked about this but he did say "do not forbid speaking in tongues." If there are no interpreters then the person should refrain from speaking in tongues. However, it is good for the person to speak in tongues to edify himself. God intends us to use the gifts given to us. If someone speaks in tongues it is obstructing to God's purpose to forbid the person to speak in tongues. Of course, if the speaking in tongues is not from God (and we know when it happens) then the person should be admonished.


The very reason we need gifts is because we are imperfect and the only way we can hope to be perfect now is through one body- where each person can serve each other where each is lacking. Two people can work better than one; if one has brawns and the other has brains, you can see how working alone is unfruitful. If the two combine then it is perfect. Likewise, this is what we must do now. One day though, we will be made perfect and these gifts will no longer be necessary.

[Jemidon2004]

oh i understood what you wrote 8th person, but i've come across quite a few who have fallen into the error of theology where it is mandatory that you speak in tongues in order to be saved...that's why i wrote what i did...lol. God Bless

Joshua

[Sulfurdolphin]

Here are the gifts i have. I have the gift of listening,encouragement,counseling,tongues,teaching scriptures while witnessing,writing poems on Christ.

Michael

[The_8th_Person]

Thank you felix102 for the great post complete truth God has blessed you greatley just as he has all of us. Also I thank Sulfurdolphin you answered my question just as I asked it lol. Jemidon2004 I understood what you ment I was just making sure no one thought those were my feelings no harm done. God Bless all of you and good night I'm tired.

[gary cook]

There are different kinds of tongues .The tongue you have is ?YOUR SPIRIT praying to GOD for YOUR NEEDS .You see ?We do not know how or what to pray for ?But our spirit ,which is who JESUS CHRIST died for ,knows our needs .
As far as gifts .They are all with in every born again person ,all the gifts .Because the HOLY SPIRIT has them and dwells with in us .
But whatever the church is in need of ?These will be revealed with in the body of CHRIST .HE gives or reveals ,to whom ,or what person will let HIM .As we control this ?We do not decide ,what we recieve ,But only make our selves willing .But all things are possiable in CHRIST JESUS .We are given certain gifts ,but any gift can be used ,at a given time if needed .The problem as I see it is ?The inner being does not have control over the flesh .Most live in the flesh ,and not in or by our spirit .Whom we are 1st .They do not understand .The order we are .SPIRIT 1st soul 2nd last the weak flesh .GOD deals with the spirit 1st the soul[mind ]2nd the flesh last .Everything is in this order always .
That is why ?We should fast ,once in a while ,to give the inner man ,HIS place in ruling .Then we will see our mind changing into the mind of JESUS CHRIST and do HIS WORKS

[Brother Love]

If I remember correctly Paul says all who are in Christ are complete and lacking nothing now that the perfect man has been reveales:

Col 2:10  And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:

Also in - Eph 4:11  And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
Eph 4:12  For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
Eph 4:13  Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

The gifts were in the early Acts period while the body of Christ was forming - the body has been formed and revealed by Paul after Acts 28.  The perfect man has been presented (Christ in Ephesians) so the gifts and gifted men are no longer needed.

The good news - all the saints are equal when it come to what God has for them - all have the Holy Spirit available.

So, this discussing of what gift each has or hasn't is irrevelant - if you are saved you are complete in Christ - no excuses for not doing something because you don't have the gift - and no pride for thinking your gift is better than the next guy or for one who does not have a gift!

Quit being concerned what you have or don't have and get to work - you have been equipped - bless God!

Another Refreshing Post Brother AMEN!

[Brother Love]

The Gifts

All right – tongues – easy if you take the Bible as it stands and understand how God deals with Israel as a nation. Most make issue of prayer languages, interpreter or not and never cover what tongues are really for.  Let’s get down to the basics.  Remember, God deals with Israel as a nation differently than he deals with the body of Christ today.  

According to the Bible tongues are for a sign (1 Cor 14:22  Wherefore tongues are for a sign,…).  The verse didn’t say tongues were for your personal edification, prayer time, public worship service, etc.  Tongues are for a sign.  Now, who require signs in the Bible?  The Jews require a sign (1 Cor 1:22  For the Jews require a sign,….).  Why did the Jews require a sign?  It was a part of their history.  When God and Moses had their conversation at the burning bush Moses said (and I paraphrase), “They are not going to believe me.”  The Lord said, “I will give you some signs to authenticate your ministry.”  Moses went to them and did signs and wonders and they believed.  When the Lord came to Israel in the gospels he came with signs to authenticate his ministry and some believed. In fact the Pharisees came seeking a sign - Mat 12:38  “Then certain of the scribes and of the Pharisees answered, saying, Master, we would see a sign from thee.”  After Christ arose he gave the apostles the signs to authenticate their ministries they went about doing signs and wonders.

Next, tongues were not for believers but for unbelievers – “not to them that believe, but to them that believe not: - I Cor. 14:22.  [/size] This is the clincher.  Moses went to Jews who were unbelievers of his ministry.  Jesus went to an unbelieving Israel with signs.  Paul went to unbelieving Israel with signs.  Also, the Jews were “unbelievers” in the sense that they did not believe that God would not bless the Gentiles.  In Acts 2 where the signs and wonders took place Peter preached to thousands of “unbelieving Jews” and they believed after the message with signs and wonders (Acts 2:43).  

Today tongues are used in churches for believers – in other words done for the edification of the speaker or hearer, which is contrary to I Cor. 1:22 and 14:22 (note both verses are 22 – can’t beat the book!)

Now, when you use your “tongues” in your church service are there any unbelieving Jews there?  Maybe and maybe not but most likely not.  When you are using “tongues” in your private prayer closet are there any unbelieving Jews there?  

Let’s wrap it up – When God deals with Israel as a nation he uses signs and wonders as authentication.  God is not dealing with Israel as a nation today – God is dealing with individuals.  Tongues are for a sign and to unbelievers, not believers.  Tongues are a sign of judgment to the unbelieving Jews.   Also, unbelievers are “believing “ Jews in Acts who were didn’t believe the Gentiles could get in on the blessings.

Tongue speakers are not following this today one bit.  I really don’t care about how good tongues feel to you and how excited you get when you utter your “tongues”.  When you pray and speak in tongues are you doing it as a sign to unbelieving Jews?  I don’t care if you saw millions at once speaking in tongues.  What you saw were millions of deceived people led by an unclean spirit.  They may be nice, polite, Bible-quoting people but they were deceived while they were nice, polite and quoting scripture.

I know you have a lot of verses you get from I Cor 14 but remember Paul is rebuking a carnal church of a misuse of a doctrine to the point where he calls them children in malice.  Why you think you can find anything positive there to support your tongues beats the fire out of me.

Don’t judge tongues by your experience – judge your experience by the Bible.  Anybody can think they speak in tongues.  I’ve even seen people “practicing” their tongues so they wouldn’t lose them!  Please, people!  The great men of God of old wouldn’t and didn’t mess with that stuff for a minute and God used any one of them more then 10,000 tongue speakers today.
But you say, “Yes, but I still know what I know and I speak in tongues and others do so that proves it!”  Fine, base your doctrine on feelings and experience and ignore the plain teaching of scripture.
Again, one last time with feeling – UNTILL YOU UNDERSTAND THAT GOD DEALS WITH ISRAEL AS A NATION DIFFERENTLY THAN HE DOES WITH THE BODY OF CHRIST TODAY THEN YOU CAN FORGET UNDERSTANDING THE GIFTS!

May God bless

Good message Brother, AMEN!!!!

[AVBunyan]

Thanks, Brother Love - seems clear to me - I'm blessed that you see it also.  

I have a post called "The Characteristics of the Modern Charasmatic Church"...but I'll refrain.  

To be fair I have "The Characteristics of the Modern Baptist Church" also - and I'm an Independent Batptist!

May God bless you my brother!

[gary cook]

Well 1st off .we have everything with in us ?Because we have the very SPIRIT OF GOD ,if BORN AGAIN ?But we are not all at the same place spiritually .We will not all understand everything now ?But we should at lest understand ?Who we are .And we should know ?We live in FAITH .Our problem as a people .Not of this earth !is understanding TRUTH .We do not get reborn and know everything !We grow slowly in the LIVING WORD .Some faster .You have plainly see .HOW the 1st followers of CHRIST grew .They walked with JESUS CHRIST ,3 years and new very little ?Having recieving the TEACHER ?They grew rather fast .But even then ?You see paul at the start ,different than at the begin as well as others .We JUDGE too quickly the things we do not understand .I think of us ?as ME teaching my little childern .They can only see so much .And when I have not finished talking .They say ,I know .But they do not .We are like that very much .That is why ?our LORD says ?oUR minds MUST be renewed .Only the HOLY SPIRIT can fully reveal ,The things from HIM .And this is the real teaching we need .As BORN AGAIN is a work of the HOLY SPIRIT .We can not SEE this ?Only the results .
THIS is only the start .HE HAS MUCH WORK to do in uS .But we must be willing to learn .OR we will be in this same place in CHRIST ,if JESUS tarrys ]10 years from now .This is MY THOUGHT ?.

[Shammu]

Well after alot of praying last night. The Lord hit me with a 2x4, along side the head. I do have a gift, Prophecy[/b] now I need to find out what it is.........

While I was praying, eyes closed in a white, so bright I saw prophecy. I didn't see it, it was like in my brain.

Is this how most of you found your gifts?

[Soldier4Christ]

Well after alot of praying last night. The Lord hit me with a 2x4, along side the head. I do have a gift, Prophecy[/b] now I need to find out what it is.........

While I was praying, eyes closed in a white, so bright I saw prophecy. I didn't see it, it was like in my brain.

Is this how most of you found your gifts?

Somewhat similar, brother. Before being saved the Bible was like any other book to me. It was history, geography, many such things as that. After being saved it was like a light that came on. I was able to understand the reason behind all those words and the purpose was so much more than just history and geography.

This gift does not always work. It works when it serves a purpose for Him. Scripture that I have read a thousand times over and nothing until it serves His purpose, to straighten out something in my life or to bring another person to Him.

The gift of preaching. I will work hard to put a sermon together, study, write notes, cross reference. Then as I am about to give that sermon it is all gone and another sermon is given to me to preach instead with none of the words being mine and verses popping into my head that I would otherwise have to search a long time for.

All of these gifts that He gives us are for His work. To further His work through us. He will meet out our portion as it suits His purpose and when it suits His purpose.





Rom 12:4  For as we have many members in one body, and all members have not the same office:
Rom 12:5  So we, being many, are one body in Christ, and every one members one of another.
Rom 12:6  Having then gifts differing according to the grace that is given to us, whether prophecy, let us prophesy according to the proportion of faith;
Rom 12:7  Or ministry, let us wait on our ministering: or he that teacheth, on teaching;
Rom 12:8  Or he that exhorteth, on exhortation: he that giveth, let him do it with simplicity; he that ruleth, with diligence; he that sheweth mercy, with cheerfulness.
Rom 12:9  Let love be without dissimulation. Abhor that which is evil; cleave to that which is good.


Co 10:31  Whether therefore ye eat, or drink, or whatsoever ye do, do all to the glory of God.


 Rom 14:19  Let us therefore follow after the things which make for peace, and things wherewith one may edify another.

1Co 10:24 Let no man seek his own, but every man another's wealth.