Faith and Works ?

[Silver Surfer]

It the condition of the heart and belief in what Jesus done.

Luke  6:46   "And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say ?"

       I have no intentions of furthering the plans of the anti christ, I attend church with a heart to worship, makes no difference if its Sun or Sat.

Romans 6:16   "Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness ? "

 

[Brother Love]

SAVED--- SEALED--- SECURED


<))><

[Shammu]

SAVED--- SEALED--- SECURED


<))><

AMEN!! BL

[oneBook]

musicllover-

I am not saying they weren't worshipping at those meetings, I like you believe that we should worship 24x7.  The word translated worship in Hebrew is avodah (serve/work).  We are His servents, and as such we serve Him every day, which means we obey His commands.  Consequently, in order to worship Him on the Sabbath, we need to stop working, and hold a holy convocation, and set the day apart.  This is the Biblical mandate for the Sabbath.  He is the judge of how well we obey (heart attitude, thoughts, etc), but there are physical actions involved in the worship of God.

Let me say further that yes, we could keep the Sabbath and at the same time commit other sins, and it would not cancel them out, or somehow make it so that God will save us.

Let me also address the word belief, because I think that this word is misunderstood.  Belief as it is used in the Bible implies action based on trust in God's character and word.

James 1:22 - 25
22 But prove yourselves doers of the word, and not merely hearers who delude themselves. 23 For if anyone is a hearer of the word and not a doer, he is like a man who looks at his natural face in a mirror; 24 for once he has looked at himself and gone away, he has immediately forgotten what kind of person he was. 25 But one who looks intently at the perfect law, the law of liberty, and abides by it, not having become a forgetful hearer but an effectual doer, this man will be blessed in what he does

Note in the above passage that the law of liberty (God's law) is compared to a mirror where we see the image of ourselves as God would have us.  God's law describes the image of the Messiah and how to demonstrate in a real way love for God and our neighbor.

Look also at this verse

Romans 2:13-16
13 for it is not the hearers of the Law who are just before God, but the doers of the Law will be justified. 14 For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves, 15 in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them, 16 on the day when, according to my gospel, God will judge the secrets of men through Christ Jesus.

Here, the Gentiles do what the Law requires even though they do not have the Law. In this case, Paul is using the term Law to denote the Jewish leadership.  Why do I say that?  Because the Jewish leadership forced Jews to keep the Law (and all their additions), but not Gentiles unless they were circumcised and became Jews.  Therefore the Gentiles are a Law to themselves (they enforce the Laws on themselves) and their conscience bears witness when they keep or break them.  Does this contradict Eph. 2? Not at all, neither of the above verses is dealing with how to be saved, but how to live after you are saved.  The fruit of salvation is that we keep the Law of God with all our heart, and when we break it, then we repent and God forgives.  This is the duty of Israel, and since all Christians are a part, it is our Christian duty.

You can meet any day of the week to sanctify and sing to God, but make sure you also set apart the days God said to, that is worship too, and not setting them apart is "knowing what is good to do and not doing it" (Jas. 4:17)

Let me leave you with a final thought in the form of a parable-

There was a woman who was wooed by a man and gave herself over to him. Eventually he was abusive to her, and would not let her go.  After some time, another man came and freed that woman, and married her and treated her well, and showed her real love.  The man and his bride would comemorate the special events in their relationship every year, until one year when the woman forgot about an event.  As the years went on, more of the special times were forgotten, and eventually, the woman started celebrating the special events with her husband on the days of her former lover.

If you were this man, how would you feel?

Peace and Blessings brother,

-oneBook

[Silver Surfer]

SAVED--- SEALED--- SECURED


<))><

"Ye shall know them by their fruits." The class of religious people here described, profess to be Christians. They have the form of godliness and appear to be laboring for the good of souls, while they are at heart avaricious, selfish, ease-loving, following the promptings of their own unconsecrated hearts. They are in conflict with Christ and His teachings, and are destitute of His meek and lowly spirit.

[Jemidon2004]

And you'll know a true Christian by his/her attitude...or by his her fruits...because they will be to glorify God and not themselves...just a thought...i'll be back in the mornin...play nice..God Bless

Joshua

[Shammu]

And you'll know a true Christian by his/her attitude...or by his her fruits...because they will be to glorify God and not themselves...just a thought...

AMEN!!

i'll be back in the mornin...play nice..God Bless

Joshua

Do I have to??

God bless all who read this posts.
Bob

[musicllover]

musicllover-


If you were this man, how would you feel?

Peace and Blessings brother,

-oneBook

I understand your parable, at the same time, no carnal man did what Jesus did. And Jesus did "it" so all people would have a way into heaven.
    I lay in bed last night thinking, and I know its sounds kinda wierd, but what would life be if we didn't Jesus, we judge as the ubove parable makes us do, with the carnal mind, we measure all the sins of the world,  God doesn't have a scale. And If he did, would he put not going to church on Sat at the top of the scale?  
   With out Jesus we could do anything we wanted, any wrong, or any right. But how would we know? There has to be right before there is wrong. What would there be to judge the wrong against and what would there be to judge the right by? If Jesus hadn't made away for us, we could all be living any life we choice, any sin, any time, who would really care?  There would be no eternal life, no rewards so just act as you please. The whole thought process makes me feel over whelmed with the magnatude of what Jesus done for us.....and WHY? What have we done to earn it, Jesus did all there was to do. We can't buy our way into heaven, or work our way there. The works we do are to glorify God not ourselves anyway. Any good I do is of Jesus, nothing of myself. Yet Silver would say you don't attend on Sat therefor you are going to hell.
    Observing a sabbath, or observing any sabbath is not wrong. Granted you (onebook) understands this still stating that Sat is the better day to set aside. And I'm saying that the day is a man apointed day......yes I understand the to observe the sabbath is a divine direction. Christians began meeting on the first day of the week to seperate themselves from the Jews, they were fearful they would be killed like Jesus, if having worship services on the first day of the week was going to send anyone to hell such as Silver S keeps insisting then I guess its one of those we'll have to wait and see games, All the disciples, and Christians who worhsip on Sunday to this day are going to hell.  I totally disagree with Silver's judgement. It explains that the disciples had hidden out in John 20:19, they seperated themselves from the Jews. And the guest speaker of the evening was Jesus Christ just risen from the grave, and then he delivered the Holy Spirit by breathing on them. Pretty good service I would say..... And on the first day of the week too. Sunday worship will NOT send anyone to hell, not even no worship will do that......BUT  not knowing who Jesus is will. That is the only way into Heaven.
   

musicllover

[musicllover]

It the condition of the heart and belief in what Jesus done.

Luke  6:46   "And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say ?"

       I have no intentions of furthering the plans of the anti christ, I attend church with a heart to worship, makes no difference if its Sun or Sat.

Romans 6:16   "Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness ? "

 

 silver....
a house divided against itself can not stand.......,
what good prupose would satan have of letting, or bringing, people togehter to worhsip Jesus on a Sunday?  
     
musicllover

[Silver Surfer]

And you'll know a true Christian by his/her attitude...or by his her fruits...

John 14:15   "If ye love me, keep my commandments".

 Revelation 14:12   "Here is the patience of the saints: here [are] they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus".

[nChrist]

Silver Surfer,

There are two Commandments of Jesus Christ, and anything regarding the Sabbath IS NOT among them.

You worship a day.  It is far past time for you to worship a LIVING SAVIOUR, JESUS CHRIST.

Love In Christ,
Tom

[Silver Surfer]

Silver Surfer,

There are two Commandments of Jesus Christ, and anything regarding the Sabbath IS NOT among them.

How did you get to be moderator without knowing the Bible ?
  Matthew 24:20   "But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the [sabbath] day:  
  24:21   For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be".  

You worship a day.

That's plain silly !
I obey God's command to observe a certain day, that God Blessed and made Holy, for the benefit of man.

 

[Jemidon2004]

no it's not silly. you are more worried about the commandments themselves than the One who Abolished them. (Christ if you didn't get it the first time) and that comment would have had you banned if i was moderator..lol...here's a thought silver...like i said "YOU WILL KNOW A CHRISTIAN BY HIS/HER FRUITS and another thing since we're part of the body of Christ, you'll know one another by a sense of fellowship when you enter into the presense of another fellow believer...psst (That's the HOly Spirit living inside us if ya didn't know, the commandments don't make that possible) I'm done for the night...i got WORSHIP in the morning and i'm playing music...so i need my rest...lol. God Bless all who read this (and open Silver's eyes)   night

In His Service,
Joshua

[musicllover]

Silver Surfer,

There are two Commandments of Jesus Christ, and anything regarding the Sabbath IS NOT among them.

How did you get to be moderator without knowing the Bible ?
  Matthew 24:20   "But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the [sabbath] day:  
  24:21   For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be".  

You worship a day.

That's plain silly !
I obey God's command to observe a certain day, that God Blessed and made Holy, for the benefit of man.

 

.....I obey God's command to observe a certain day,.....HEY ME TOO, its it great   you picked Sat and I picked my nosed.. oops....no no no I mean I go to church on Sunday. ANd I believe God does bless it as well.
    Am I being a stinker again?

Silver it is beyond my Christian understanding that anyone can claim they are the only ones going to Heaven. Does it bother you that other groups believe they too are going to be the only ones in Heaven? Why can't it just be the simple truth.......Jesus did it all, you won't answer this cause you haven't answered me before.......but If Jesus walked into a place....and worshiped, said a prayer or healed someone, blessed the event or time and it happened to be a Tuesday......would you still be saying Sunday Christians are going to hell? Jesus is our example, there wasn't a day or place the Jesus walked that he didn't teach, or preach, heal. This is the way we should walk. We fail most of the time, isn't life hard enough with out inposing some kind of Pharasee like rule over others?
       Anyway like others on board tonight I am tired......maybe tired of your line of reasoning even. I find it very sad that you a christian brother is so quick to judge and condemn Sunday worshiper to hell......not even Jesus condemned, he come to save.

musicllover

[Silver Surfer]

no it's not silly. you are more worried about the commandments themselves than the One who Abolished them.

Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.  
  5:18   For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till [all] be fulfilled", (Matthew 5:17,18).

Not everything has been fulfilled !

Notice this Bible verse: "The law of the Lord is Perfect...converting the soul", (Psalms 19:7).

IF...the Law is gone....no one is converted anymore !
WHY ?
#1.) " for by the law [is] the knowledge of sin.  (Romans 3:20).
#2.)" What shall we say then? [is] the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.(Romans 7:7)
#3.)" Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.(1 John 3:4)


" for where no law is, [there is] no transgression.  (Romans 4:15)...
..if there is no law, there is no sin.....therefore, no need for a Saviour

and that comment would have had you banned if i was moderator..lol...here's a thought silver...like i said "YOU WILL KNOW A CHRISTIAN BY HIS/HER FRUITS

You're absolutely right !
 "And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.  
  2:4   He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.  (1 John 2:3,4)