Why should we keep the commandments?

[nChrist]

Brothers and Sisters,

It's fairly easy to be deceived by many of the false religions and false teachings today. One has to listen carefully and get through the thin veneer of what sounds reasonable. I'll just give a few examples:

One false cult teaches that not keeping the Sabbath is the sign of the beast.

Several false cults teach that mankind can be perfect, holy, and without sin RIGHT NOW in this short life. In fact, this becomes a requirement to keep Salvation.

Many false cults teach that sin is a loss of Salvation. There are NO human beings without sin, so this would make Salvation impossible for any human being.

One needs to look carefully when someone starts spouting a bunch of LAW because many of the false religions are based on the LAW - NOT GRACE!

Many of the false religions and cults teach that the individual saved person is responsible completely for either keeping or losing their SALVATION. It's like a never-ending payment plan on the part of the saved person. Any missed payment or failure on the saved person's part results in loss of SALVATION!

I'm just going to call things like they are and be blunt about this. I'm going to call these LAW CULTS. The finished and perfect work of JESUS CHRIST on the CROSS is NOT the CORE AND PRIMARY FOCUS! The primary focus is what man does. Part of the clever deception is downplaying the work of JESUS CHRIST on the CROSS and elevating man.

Many of these FALSE LAW CULTS don't even believe that JESUS CHRIST was and is VERY GOD! Pin them down and ask them, IS JESUS CHRIST GOD?
If they start stuttering and going into some other explanation to avoid a simple YES or NO, you are dealing with a FALSE CULT. Many of the FALSE LAW CULTS do horrible things to the ABSOLUTE DEITY OF THE GODHEAD, AND MOST OF THE TIME JESUS CHRIST! Why? JESUS CHRIST is the key and only way for SALVATION!

Let's make this simple and give you some questions to ask to quickly identify FALSE RELIGIONS AND FALSE CULTS:

1 - Is JESUS CHRIST GOD? The answer MUST be quickly YES!

2 - What MUST I do to be SAVED? The answer should be FAITH IN JESUS CHRIST and belief that HE died on the CROSS for me! YES - HE did die, but HE arose from the dead on the third day and IS THE RISEN SAVIOUR - VERY GOD! If they want to add works and keeping the law, they are a FALSE RELIGION OR CULT!

3 - What MUST I do to remain SAVED? JESUS CHRIST PAID IT ALL! I live because JESUS CHRIST lives - PERIOD! - END OF STORY! I'm saved for Eternity, and that's a Promise from GOD. If they want to add keeping the law and good works - THEY ARE A FALSE RELIGION AND FALSE CULT! SALVATION IS NOT on the installment plan. One is either SAVED for Eternity or LOST, and there is no in between.

4 - What part does good works and keeping the law have in SALVATION? The easy and quick answer MUST BE ZERO - NONE! Any other answer indicates a FALSE RELIGION OR FALSE CULT! It really is just this simple, and there is no Biblical answer for anything else.

5 - SO, what is the value of good works and trying to live GODLY lives? FIRST, these have NOTHING to do with SALVATION! Everything we do and say is part of our testimony before men. YES - we SHOULD have a desire to have a pleasing LIVING TESTIMONY before men to GLORIFY GOD - NOT OURSELVES! We SHOULD want to do GOOD WORKS for the same reason AND PART OF OUR LOVE AND APPRECIATION TO GOD. We are not RESPONSIBLE for our own SALVATION, and there is NOTHING we can do or NOT do to lose SALVATION! We are RESPONSIBLE for the quantity and quality of our EVERY DAY FELLOWSHIP WITH GOD! Our JOY and PEACE in this short life for a Christian depends greatly on our EVERY DAY FELLOWSHIP WITH GOD, so many Christians are happier than others because of yielding to the Will of GOD. GOOD WORKS ALSO RESULT IN REWARDS THAT ARE OVER AND ABOVE SALVATION! GOD tells us which GOOD WORKS HE will consider for REWARDS! They must be from love and appreciation to GOD ONLY and for the purpose of GLORIFYING ONLY GOD - NOT SELF! The Apostle Paul talked a lot about REWARDS, and he wanted them, but he wanted them only for the right reasons. Many people confuse what Paul said about REWARDS with SALVATION! They are TWO separate issues. LIKEWISE, many people confuse EXHORTATIONS FOR CHRISTIAN LIVING WITH SALVATION! The Holy Bible gives a host of EXHORTATIONS FOR CHRISTIAN LIVING, and NO Christian could ever meet them all. NOT MEETING THESE EXHORTATIONS FOR CHRISTIAN LIVING DOES NOT MEAN THAT ONE ISN'T SAVED OR HAS LOST THEIR SALVATION! If these EXHORTATIONS meant that, NOBODY would be saved.

Brothers and Sisters, in conclusion - there was a definite and obvious reason why JESUS CHRIST died on the CROSS for us. ALONE, we could not PLEASE GOD very often. ALONE, we should know that we don't HAVE ANY RIGHTEOUSNESS - ZERO! Our righteousness is as filthy rags. Any righteousness we have is GIVEN TO US by JESUS CHRIST - HIS RIGHTEOUSNESS - NOT OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS!

Bro. Niciah, how do you answer these 5 simple and most basic questions that are ALL BIBLE FACTS? Your answers will quickly tell me whether I misunderstood your first post or not. I don't think that I misunderstood it at all. If I did misunderstand it, I will apologize profusely. If I was correct in my understanding, my first reply to you STANDS!

Love In Christ,
Tom

Favorite Bible Quotes 242 - John 10:7-18 Then said Jesus unto them
again, Verily, verily, I say unto you, I am the door of the sheep. 8
All that ever came before me are thieves and robbers: but the sheep
did not hear them. 9 I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he
shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture. 10 The
thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am
come that they might have life, and that they might have it more
abundantly. 11 I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his
life for the sheep. 12 But he that is an hireling, and not the
shepherd, whose own the sheep are not, seeth the wolf coming, and
leaveth the sheep, and fleeth: and the wolf catcheth them, and
scattereth the sheep. 13 The hireling fleeth, because he is an
hireling, and careth not for the sheep. 14 I am the good shepherd, and
know my sheep, and am known of mine. 15 As the Father knoweth me, even
so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for the sheep. 16 And
other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must
bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and
one shepherd. 17 Therefore doth my Father love me, because I lay down
my life, that I might take it again. 18 No man taketh it from me, but
I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power
to take it again. This commandment have I received of my Father.

[nChrist]

Brothers and Sisters,

I wanted to add one more personal comment for the benefit of the regular users here. I don't plan to take apart Bro. Niciah's first post sentence by sentence. I won't bore you with that. I'll just tell you that the wording is there for some quite reasonable observations. I'm just going to give you one example from a one sentence quote:

Jesus taught, " If you want to enter life, obey the commandments."

This is NOT what JESUS taught, but what do you suppose this tiny sentence means? "LIFE" is SALVATION. We are NOT SAVED by obeying the commandments.

I simply wanted to give you more than a hint about how false religions deceive. One has to read every word carefully or listen to every word spoken. There are many other examples in this first post. The number of examples in my opinion could not be errors or misunderstanding. I hate lengthy debates about false religions and false teaching. Instead, the TRUTH takes care of everything, and I did provide the TRUTH that rebuts everything FALSE in this thread. In other words, I have no plan to argue word for word or sentence by sentence. Read Bro. Niciah's first post carefully and you should easily see it for yourself. Just don't speed-read or skip - read it all slowly and carefully. IT'S FALSE TEACHING!

Love In Christ,
Tom

Christian Quotes 129 -
He died fighting for His enemies!
What a contrast between the unselfish consecration
of Jesus in His great work and ministry on earth, an
the selfishness and self-seeking so often characteristic
of the race for whom He died!
There are many in this world, embarked in gigantic
enterprises. Stand in one of our busiest thoroughfares;
see the crowd hurrying past, each with deep-furrowed
lines of care on his brow. These are builders; not builders
in stone or steel, but figuratively rearing some huge
pyramid with unremitting labor.
One is toiling at the Pyramid of Riches - tier on tier
riveted with silver and golden clamps.
Another is engrossed with the Pyramid of Ambition -
heedless of the intervening work that he may reach
more speedily the coveted summit, and crown it with
Fame blowing her bronze trumpet.
Another is busy at some Intellectual Pyramid (choicest
of all), raising piles of mental treasure - laborious thought.
How few among these could say with an honest heart,
"I have no ulterior motive in all my labors. I have no
selfish interests to subserve - I am doing it all, neither
for the good of myself nor my family, but for others."
It would be a happier world if the use and design of our
pyramids had not been like those of Egypt - built to glorify
himself while living, and to cover his dust after death.
Different, how different, was the retrospect of Jesus!
"Christ pleased not Himself." Unselfishness in its noblest
type and form was the characteristic of His Redemption.
From the infancy in Bethlehem's cradle, to the expiring
prayer on the bitter tree, all was the purest unselfishness
of a loving heart. "He saved others, Himself He would not
save!" On His cross was engraved, not the superscription
of earth's boasted heroes - "He died fighting for His friends";
but, "He died fighting for His enemies!"
 -- John MacDuff  1895

[Brother Jerry]

BEP I believe that Bro. Micah cleared up his stance in the previous post

Salvation only comes through our faith in Jesus.

What I was trying to explain in my recent post was that because of God's salvation through Christ our attitude toward sinning should be different. We should not sin deliberately. If we know what sin is, why should we knowingly commit it.

When I spoke of the Ten commandments, my point was that the commandments show us what God viewed as sin and that as a Christian I should not purposely break it.

I am not saying that we should keep the Law as a way to be saved.

We can't earn our way to heaven. It is only by God's grace that we are saved. My point was that because I truly love God; I will not purposely sin.

Now I have not been around a long time to remember some of the folks we have had on before.  But it is perfectly understandable that if you are wanting to use a comparison of the Law to anything you will stick with the 10 Commandments, because the unsaved are familiar with them as well.  The unsaved do not know the rest of the Law, the 600+ other rules and regulations.  So if I were to write a paper talking about grace versus works I would generally stick to what the readers would absolutely know...the 10 Commandments. 

Jesus did use the phrase "If you want to enter life, obey the commandment."  He used that as part of a bigger teaching.  one to show that by following the commandments out of love and a desire to follow Jesus you have succeeded.  And as Micah was talking about, it is because we love God and desire not to have God upset with us that we will strive to not break the commandments.  And that is what Jesus was teaching, faith, which is a willingness to obey God, will save you.

I personally got that out of either of the posts.  But that is me.

To God's Blessed
Bro. Niciah

[Soldier4Christ]

Jesus did use the phrase "If you want to enter life, obey the commandment."  He used that as part of a bigger teaching.  one to show that by following the commandments out of love and a desire to follow Jesus you have succeeded.  And as Micah was talking about, it is because we love God and desire not to have God upset with us that we will strive to not break the commandments.  And that is what Jesus was teaching, faith, which is a willingness to obey God, will save you.

I agree with Brother Tom on this. Those that rely on the verse in Matthew "if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments" all too often forget the rest of Jesus' words that follow that and use this verse to attempt to bring us back to the requirements of following the 10 Commandments which no man can do. It is also hinted at quite strongly by Niciah about worshiping only on the Sabbath which is not worshiping in spirit and truth. It is difficult many times to see through to the false teachings when a person also includes that which is right in an attempt to cover up that which is wrong. It is subtle things such as this that expose cults.

The law is our schoolmaster not our salvation nor is the law a requirement to maintain salvation.

[nChrist]

Hello Brother Jerry and All,

I've heard restatements and attempted explanations from many false religions and false cults, and they don't float. However, they do still deceive many people and steer them away from SALVATION. Many of the false religions and false cults I'm thinking about and talking about also deny one or more of the HOLY TRINITY.

When the subject becomes SALVATION, only the TRUTH will work, and the ONLY WAY is taught here. No person in the history of mankind has ever been SAVED by obeying the Law, and no person has ever been able to keep the Law.

When some attempt to corrupt SALVATION with the keeping of the Law and good works by man, Christians must stand up and REBUKE IT! I did and I will continue to do so for the rest of my days on this earth. I will also do it without apology in a BOLD and BLUNT manner. I don't think there's any interest here in providing pulpits for false religions and false cults. If you'll notice, there is NO ANSWER from Bro. Niciah on the 5 most basic and simple BIBLE FACTS that pertain to SALVATION! There's been ample time and NO RESPONSE! If there is a response, it will be in denial of Bible Facts.

I'm not ashamed of the GOSPEL, and I don't apologize for telling the TRUTH! After reflection and prayer, I would do the same thing again and again and again. In fact, I pray that GOD gives all of us the strength and courage to shout the GOSPEL from the rooftops. I hope to NEVER apologize for the TRUTH of the GOSPEL. If I do, I hope to be REBUKED by another Brother and Sister in CHRIST!

One can read books and piles of materials from false religions and false cults. They are LOST, and it's a matter of LOVE to share the TRUTH with them. If their feelings are hurt in the effort, SO BE IT! That's not the intention. The intention is SALVATION and trying to prevent them from leading others AWAY FROM CHRIST. There are many pretty nice people in false religions and false cults, but they're still LOST and on their way to hell. It's not NICE for CHRISTIANS to withhold the TRUTH from them or to encourage them in any way to continue on their LOST PATH. We MUST also be concerned about the many they will DECEIVE! Our effort will be REAL LOVE, but it won't be politically correct. SALVATION is thousands of times more important than being politically correct. In fact, being politically correct is many times the ways of EVIL!

Some of the horribly false religions sound pretty good on the surface, and hosts of people are still being deceived to join them. These are probably the approaching end days of the Age of Grace. Time is running out, and great hosts will be going to HELL in the Eternal FIRES! I don't even have a problem in mentioning the horribly false religions by name: Mormon, Jehovah's Witness, Islam, and many others. I mentioned these because they are common in our own part of the world AND THEY NEED THE TRUTH! THERE'S ONLY ONE TRUTH THAT WILL SET THEM FREE FROM THE CURSE OF SIN AND DEATH! Hopefully, many Christians will be brave and loving enough to give them the ONLY TRUTH!

Galatians 4:16  Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?

Love In Christ,
Tom

Thanks be unto God for His unspeakable GIFT, Jesus Christ, our Lord and Saviour Forever!

[nChrist]

GOOD NEWS!

1:  Romans 3:10 NASB  as it is written, "THERE IS NONE RIGHTEOUS, NOT EVEN ONE; THERE IS NONE WHO UNDERSTANDS, THERE IS NONE WHO SEEKS FOR GOD; ALL HAVE TURNED ASIDE, TOGETHER THEY HAVE BECOME USELESS; THERE IS NONE WHO DOES GOOD, THERE IS NOT EVEN ONE."

2:  Romans 3:23  NASB  for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,

3:  Romans 5:12  NASB  Therefore, just as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men, because all sinned--

4:  Romans 6:23  NASB  For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

5:  Romans 1:18  NASB  For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness,

6:  Romans 3:20  NASB  because by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified in His sight; for through the Law comes the knowledge of sin.

7:  Romans 3:27  NASB  Where then is boasting? It is excluded. By what kind of law? Of works? No, but by a law of faith.

8:  Romans 5:8-9  NASB  But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from the wrath of God through Him.

9:  Romans 2:4  NASB  Or do you think lightly of the riches of His kindness and tolerance and patience, not knowing that the kindness of God leads you to repentance?

10:  Romans 3:22  NASB  even the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all those who believe; for there is no distinction;

11:  Romans 3:28  NASB  For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from works of the Law.

12:  Romans 10:9  NASB  that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved;

13:  Romans 4:21  NASB  and being fully assured that what God had promised, He was able also to perform.

14:  Romans 4:24 NASB  but for our sake also, to whom it will be credited, as those who believe in Him who raised Jesus our Lord from the dead,

15:  Romans 5:1  NASB  Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ,

16:  Romans 10:10  NASB  for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation.

17:  Romans 10:13  NASB  for "WHOEVER WILL CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED."

Thanks be unto GOD for HIS unspeakable GIFT!, JESUS CHRIST, our Lord and Saviour forever!

[nChrist]

2 Corinthians 4:1-18  Therefore seeing we have this ministry, as we have received mercy, we faint not; But have renounced the hidden things of dishonesty, not walking in craftiness, nor handling the word of God deceitfully; but by manifestation of the truth commending ourselves to every man's conscience in the sight of God. But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them. For we preach not ourselves, but Christ Jesus the Lord; and ourselves your servants for Jesus' sake. For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ. But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us. We are troubled on every side, yet not distressed; we are perplexed, but not in despair; Persecuted, but not forsaken; cast down, but not destroyed; Always bearing about in the body the dying of the Lord Jesus, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our body. For we which live are always delivered unto death for Jesus' sake, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our mortal flesh. So then death worketh in us, but life in you. We having the same spirit of faith, according as it is written, I believed, and therefore have I spoken; we also believe, and therefore speak; Knowing that he which raised up the Lord Jesus shall raise up us also by Jesus, and shall present us with you. For all things are for your sakes, that the abundant grace might through the thanksgiving of many redound to the glory of God. For which cause we faint not; but though our outward man perish, yet the inward man is renewed day by day. For our light affliction, which is but for a moment, worketh for us a far more exceeding and eternal weight of glory; While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.

[Brother Jerry]

I could not agree more with both of you, Roger and Tom. 

Roger, 
Exactly.  Jesus did use that phrase but in context it was part of a larger teaching.  One that can show that salvation should bring about a change in that one will desire to follow the commandments.  Not that it will save you or have anything to do with your salvation but it will be an effect of your salvation.

Tom,
I agree completely with you.  I was only trying to state that I saw nothing contrary to that in the posts.  I do believe that Niciah was meaning the same thing.  Even if his initial post was not as clear on that point he did clarify his stance later. 

[Soldier4Christ]

Let's say that if he meant the same thing that he was far from being clear about it and he did in fact use many of the key words that cults use even when he clarified things. I do believe that the truth would be known clearly if he were to answer Brother Tom's questions.

[Arkansas-Evangelist]

+  LOVE  +

[pob]

As Christians we want to be  obedient to our Father. I've read the thread and seen all kinds of good answers. I thought I would add just a little different slant and see what youy think.
10 commandments, let's see, they show us that we are sinners in need of a Savior.
They show us how to get along with God.
They show us how to get along with our parents.
They show us how to get along with our friends and neighbors.
How to stay out of trouble.

Practical instructions for a happy life.

[Soldier4Christ]

they show us that we are sinners in need of a Savior.

This is the purpose that the 10 commandments were given and the fact that without Him we were incapable of doing the rest.

Gal 3:19  What then is the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise hath been made; and it was ordained through angels by the hand of a mediator.

[allaboutGod]

I don't see how it is any different to do the works out of fear vs. out of love. You have to realize that when the bible talks about the fear of the Lord it is not talking about being scared of Him it is talking about a reverance for Him. in other words we are to fear [have an extreem reverence for] the Lord God. If you have a reverance for God then you will truly value and put into practice the things that He has told you to do. We also do this because we love Him. As Christ said if you love me keep my comandments. and when you keep His commandments you will live a life that is drastically different from what the world lives. Though we can never be saved through thw works they simple show the fruit of a changed life by the Holy Spirit.