Good Works Poll Question

[Littleboy]

Good works to obtain salvation? NO! Jesus is the only name given that we might be saved by...
Good works to keep your salvation? Yes! Without them our Faith is Dead...
Without good works for us WHO are allready saved, Our Faith is Dead!
YLBD
P.S
If our faith is dead so are we....

[Soldier4Christ]

Good works are a result of obtaining and maintaining salvation. Works are the fruit of salvation, the proof so to speak that one is saved not one that must be done to either achieve nor maintain. It is Christ that achieved salvation for us and it is He who keeps us not through any works that we may do.

2Th 3:3  But the Lord is faithful, who shall stablish you, and keep you from evil.

2Ti 1:12  For the which cause I also suffer these things: nevertheless I am not ashamed: for I know whom I have believed, and am persuaded that he is able to keep that which I have committed unto him against that day.

Jud 1:24  Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,

Gal 5:22  But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
Gal 5:23  Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.


The fruit of the Spirit, not the works of men.


Gal 2:16  Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

The Book of James is an oft misunderstood teaching. To many it appears that the author is supporting the teaching that works are necessary to maintain salvation. This is not what the Book of James is telling us. It is telling us that works are a result of salvation that we will have the desire to do these works. That works are an outward expression of the inward faith.

Note how James says "What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith. This is telling us that it does not matter what a person says that there will be those that may profess faith but do not truly have that faith. We see this throughout the world today in people that profess faith in God yet do not show the fruit of the Spirit.

If we had to rely on works to maintain salvation then no one would be able to enter Heaven for no one has been able to maintain righteousness accept for Christ.

 

[nChrist]

Brothers and Sisters,

Many Scriptures already posted in this thread bluntly state that the good works of man have NOTHING to do with Salvation and NOTHING to do with keeping Salvation.

The ONLY good works that apply to Salvation at all are the Good Works completed most Perfectly by JESUS CHRIST on the CROSS.

It's the ultimate vanity for a man to think that he or she can add anything to the Perfect and Completed Work of JESUS CHRIST. It's as if some people are saying that CHRIST didn't pay enough and they have something to add. NO! - We don't have a single thing to add. Salvation is a GIFT through Faith in JESUS CHRIST. If Salvation had to be paid for, ONLY JESUS CHRIST could pay the price. This is why JESUS CHRIST is the ONLY way to Heaven.

The PRIDE of man says "I must pay something". The WORD OF GOD says you have nothing worthy to pay with! It's really just as simple as that.

Love In Christ,
Tom

Colossians 2:13-17 NASB
When you were dead in your transgressions and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He made you alive together with Him, having forgiven us all our transgressions, having canceled out the certificate of debt consisting of decrees against us, which was hostile to us; and He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross. When He had disarmed the rulers and authorities, He made a public display of them, having triumphed over them through Him. Therefore no one is to act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day -- things which are a mere shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ.

[Littleboy]

Hi Everyone
I'm talking about the works of (spiritual) Faith, Not works of the Flesh...
Like the work of (spiritual) Faith that saved the theif on the Cross next to our Lord, He was without works of the Flesh, But his (spiritual)Faith(believeing that JESUS was/is the Christ) and confessing that with his mouth saved him, Just like it does for all of us too...
Like the work of Faith Abraham showed when he was Willing to sacrifice(kill) his son Issac, Believeing in God...
Although Abraham's Faith also had a Physical Faith also, Because he Actually bound and was about to Kill Issac When
God told him to stop, I believe now that you will hold nothing from me, Not even your own Son Issac...
And Abraham was then told By God, that he is A Freind because of his Faith...
This is Probably the Best Example that I can Give you:

Do you think that Abraham would have still  been called the Freind of God,
IF he would have only had(Spiritual ) Faith And Not to have Followed it up by (physical) Faith By binding Issac
and about to Kill him?
YLBD
P.s
Maybe it's this type of forum, I seem to be misunderstood on every reply?

[nChrist]

Do you think that Abraham would have still  been called the Freind of God,
IF he would have only had(Spiritual ) Faith And Not to have Followed it up by (physical) Faith By binding Issac
and about to Kill him?
YLBD
P.s
Maybe it's this type of forum, I seem to be misunderstood on every reply?

Hello Brother Duane,

This question has nothing to do with the type of forum or which man said what, rather what GOD has bluntly said in HIS WORD. There isn't any misunderstanding at all. We either believe what GOD says or we don't, and it's really just that simple. Believing what GOD Says IS OUR FAITH! There isn't any "either", "or", or "follow-up". It's man who wants to add to or take away from GOD'S WORD. GOD gave us HIS Plan of Salvation very simply and bluntly - simple enough for a child to understand. Good works are NOT and have never been required for Salvation or to maintain Salvation. At the moment of Salvation GOD gives us Promises that are Eternal, and we should know that GOD always keeps HIS Promises.

GOD tells us that we have Eternal Life at the moment of Salvation, and we can either believe what GOD says or reject it. GOD also tells us that we are Baptized into the BODY OF CHRIST right then, our hearts are sealed with the HOLY SPIRIT as a pledge of GOD'S Promises, and the HOLY SPIRIT comes to live in our hearts. There are many other Promises made by GOD right then at that moment, and we can either Believe GOD or reject what GOD plainly tells us. GOD'S WORD hasn't changed, so it isn't a matter of what's said or not said on this forum. It's a matter of what GOD'S WORD plainly and bluntly states. We can believe it or reject it, and it really is just that simple.

Love In Christ,
Tom

Ephesians 2:8-10 NASB
For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast. For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.

[islandboy]

As Christians good works are not a requirement of salvation. However, I have found that good works become a way of life. When you have faith and give your self to  Jesus, and you spread the word of salvation, helping others becomes a way of life. The little things like kind words mean so much to the sad and lonely people, the giving of food or toys to the poor. Volunteering at your church or in your community means more than you may know. Even coming to this website or others where you join in on the posting or chat, helps those who maybe be housebound or just in need of a friend. Big or little things done, without any thought of "what's in it for me", are the good works that make people who are watching us, and the way we live our lives, understand and sometimes accept Jesus into their lives and hearts. So good works are not required for our salvation, but good works can make as better people and better Christians.

[nChrist]

Amen Islandboy!

It would be hard to imagine a Christian without thanks for what GOD has done for us. It would also be hard to imagine a Christian without love and gratitude to JESUS CHRIST. As Christians, we have more than just a good idea about what JESUS CHRIST has done for us, so it is a natural thing for us to show our love to GOD in whatever manner we can. Acts of love, worship, praise, and thanks are among the very few things that we can give to ALMIGHTY GOD that HE appreciates. After all, HE already owns the universe. Sister, you have a beautiful description of what GOD wants from each of us, and we don't have to be wealthy in the material things of this world to give them to our KING.

Love In Christ,
Tom

 

[Allinall]

Littleboy,

I heard an old pastor put it this way once:

"We are saved by faith alone; but not by a faith that stands alone."

You mentioned a passage in your first post...

Yes,
IF your talking about the WORKS of Faith and NOT the Works of the Law?
Galatians 2:
16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

...but missed the phrasing.  That is, there is no mention of "works of faith."  Only "faith."  The only works mentioned are those of the Law.  It's neat, isn't it?  How Paul was "doing the work of the Lord" by persacuting believers for their faith, when he met Jesus?  Uniquely, Paul wasn't doing good works when he was saved.  And the good works he excelled in afterward were because of his faith and gracious salvation.  Cool!  We love Him because He first loved us.  We serve Him not to gain favor, but because of the gracious gift He has given we who are not worthy.  And He only asks that we believe.  Simple? Hardly.

He says His strength is sufficient.  Try believing that on your hospital bed at 3 in the morning at age 36 suffering from a heart attack.  If I believe, if I have faith, my works will reflect that belief.

He says He will never leave us nor forsake us.  Try believing that when your business is going down the tubes, your bills are rising but your checkbook balance isn't, and the phones keep ringing with calls from the bill collector's - and all you want to know is if He's there to hear you cry.  If I believe, if I have faith, my works will reflect that belief.

We work good works because we have a Father Who works good works.  We take after Him.   

[nChrist]

AMEN BROTHER KEVIN!

Brother, I'll simply say that I BELIEVE more strongly now than ever. I believed before my times of trial, but things DID work out for my good. You're right about many things not being simple - GOD has to show them to us. GOD also gives us each other for prayer, strength, encouragement, and fellowship. Brother, please know that you're still in our prayers. As for the Promises of GOD, just say AMEN! and consider them DONE! If you get a chance, take a look at "The Faithful Promiser". They are quite old, but they are beautiful and TRUE. The Author is one of my favorites, John MacDuff.

The Faithful Promiser
http://forums.christiansunite.com/index.php?topic=20300.0

Love In Christ,
Tom

 

[Allinall]

AMEN BROTHER KEVIN!

Brother, I'll simply say that I BELIEVE more strongly now than ever. I believed before my times of trial, but things DID work out for my good. You're right about many things not being simple - GOD has to show them to us. GOD also gives us each other for prayer, strength, encouragement, and fellowship. Brother, please know that you're still in our prayers. As for the Promises of GOD, just say AMEN! and consider them DONE! If you get a chance, take a look at "The Faithful Promiser". They are quite old, but they are beautiful and TRUE. The Author is one of my favorites, John MacDuff.

The Faithful Promiser
http://forums.christiansunite.com/index.php?topic=20300.0

Love In Christ,
Tom

 

Amen!  Thanks for the link Brother Tom.  I'll be reading that today.  And thanks to everyone for your continued prayers.  God is great!   

[Lioness]

Good works should be a result of our salvation, they do not save us.

"For by grace are ye saved through faith, and that not of yourselves. It is the gift of God, not of works, lest any man should boast. "  Eph.2:8-9

But if  someone says they have faith, but don't have any good works, that would be cause to question if they ever really repented of their sin and turned the Lordship of their life over to Jesus Christ. True faith produces good works.

[Shammu]

Okay I decided to finally answer this question............. I also voted No.

When we speak of works in the context of the Bible we mean specifically good deeds, not just any action but only those that line up with the Bible's definition of good. What often comes to mind are the 10 Commandments. These are great examples of “good works” in both man's view and God's. In God's mind good works are only those things that come from a right view of His character as seen in the Bible and revealed in Christ.

The world today views good works in a much more general way. They see them as anything that is considered kind, for the benefit of others, or anything selfless based on their own standard. This standard is based on either their own opinion or the opinion of their society and culture. But as we have seen, in God's eyes only those things which come from the character of God are considered good. God is the standard of all good works.

Christian doctrine of Salvation, being saved from the penalty of sin, the way of attaining it is only through faith. It is wholly apart from works of any kind. We must not, and ultimately cannot, work for salvation.

Ephesians 2:8-9 For it is by free grace (God's unmerited favor) that you are saved (delivered from judgment and made partakers of Christ's salvation) through [your] faith. And this [salvation] is not of yourselves [of your own doing, it came not through your own striving], but it is the gift of God; 9 Not because of works [not the fulfillment of the Law's demands], lest any man should boast. [It is not the result of what anyone can possibly do, so no one can pride himself in it or take glory to himself.]

aith is God's appointed way of granting salvation, not works. It is, according to our definition of faith, a belief or trust in the promise or word of God regarding salvation. I simply believe in God's promise to give me salvation on His terms. Yet, it is not simply mental assent to the facts, for even the demons give assent to the facts.

James 2:19 You believe that God is one; you do well. So do the demons believe and shudder [in terror and horror such as make a man's hair stand on end and contract the surface of his skin]!

It is the resting and placing of one’s confidence in the work that God has promised to do. In this way God is the one who receives all the credit for salvation. The origin and purpose of all faith and in all works is God, not us.

In our faith God is glorified because of our dependence on Him. (Ephesians 1:12) In good works He is glorified because they are only a result of His action in us. (Ephesians 2:10 - “we are his workmanship”) So we can see that God is both the source of faith and good works (He is the creator of them in us) and that He is the reason for faith and good works. He gets the glory for them all. Man has nothing to do with it other than to be the recipient of God's gracious gifts. God has engineered it so that He himself is the focus, He gets the glory and man is given the privilege to be a part of this, as this is His rightful due, as the Lord.

[Def]

NO NO NO NO

[carlotta]

But what about Matthew 25: 31-46 ?   What are 'the nations'  ?  ('Goyim' in Hebrew,  to Jews meaning those who are not part of God's chosen people).  Judaism has always been very compassionate of non-Jews, not condemning them for unbelief but saying that God deals with them mercifully in accordance to their adherence to the basic, natural law given to the sons of Noah. Which basically means that the 'goyim'  (which in the Matthew verse could mean non-Jesus-followers) are to be saved, or not, because of their works.

P.S.  I believe that Christians are saved by faith, and I am endlessly grateful to the Lord for this; my question concerns 'the nations'.

[Soldier4Christ]

Yes, what we see in verse 32 of Matt chapter 25 is the use of the Greek word "ethnos" that was translated as "nations". This word was frequently used to mean a race of people. Not race as we understand it to mean in the modern word but one based on a group of people of the same habits or rituals or "tribe" specifically those of the gentiles.

This is because of the promises that God gave to Israel are separate from those given to the Gentiles. However it is still not the works of the law that save those of Israel but rather that of faith. As we see in the book of Hebrews that was written specifically to the Hebrew people that "the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did". Throughout the book of Hebrew we see the teaching that it is not works but that of faith in the hope to come, and that hope is the Messiah. The Hebrew people were blinded in part and did not see that the hope they were looking for did indeed already come but they will have their eyes opened and will see the truth in the end.