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June 07, 2024, 10:59:29 PM

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Our Lord Jesus Christ loves you.
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| | |-+  James Cameron launches 'Titanic' assault on Resurrection
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Author Topic: James Cameron launches 'Titanic' assault on Resurrection  (Read 2201 times)
airIam2worship
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« Reply #15 on: February 28, 2007, 01:15:39 PM »

AMEN
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Brother Jerry
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« Reply #16 on: March 06, 2007, 11:57:32 AM »

Well I watched it last night.  Recorded it.  Tonight I will watch the Tom Brokov special that was on after it.

I will have report on both soon.  I took notes all throughout.  And I can say that I was mad, I laughed, and I was amazed.

But I will finish up the event tonight and then over the next couple of days have a written report.  I am preparing some of this for my Sunday School lesson.
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Brother Jerry

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I am like most fathers.  I, like most, want more for my children than I have.

I am unlike most fathers.  What I would like my children to have more of is crowns to lay at Jesus feet.
Soldier4Christ
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« Reply #17 on: March 06, 2007, 11:58:45 AM »

I'm looking forward to reading that.

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airIam2worship
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« Reply #18 on: March 06, 2007, 12:09:34 PM »

Amen, me too
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« Reply #19 on: March 06, 2007, 12:23:12 PM »

If you read down in the section called 'TELEVISION' I wrote something about it.
The only thing that kept coming to my mind was - 'Why are you looking for the l;iving amongst the dead?'
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« Reply #20 on: March 07, 2007, 02:36:22 AM »

Did anybody see 'PEOPLE' magazine this week?(March 12, 2007)

There's an article on page 178 titled "IS THIS JESUS' TOMB?"
Under it it reads 'Titanic director James Cameron thinks he's found the tomb of Jesus Christ. Skeptics say he should stick to shipwrecks.'

Towards the the end of the article it states that a Harvard archeologist thinks it's an attempt to exploit The DaVinci Code noting that there were 71 Jesuses buried in the cemetary where the boxes were found and he quoted, "I would describe this as a sheep-and-donkey show."

And this is from a secular magazine. Hilarious!!!!!
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Soldier4Christ
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« Reply #21 on: March 07, 2007, 03:05:06 AM »

Their are many secular archaeologists that are calling this "documentary" a big farce, also.

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« Reply #22 on: March 14, 2007, 10:56:02 AM »

Well it did take me a little bit.  There was so much out there already on this...but here is my two bits.

The Lost Tomb

Quote
Scene opens up with Jesus on the cross
“The most famous death in history”
“Gospels tell us he was buried in a tomb.  And 2 day later Mary Magdeline, one of his closest disciples found the tomb empty.”
Now I have no degree or anything.  But the last time I checked it was 3 days.


Quote
“Brings up the Gospel of Matthew and the mention of the rumors that were spread by Jewish priests.  The rumors being that the disciples took the body from the tomb and gave it a second burial.
However something they fail to mention is that the Gospel lets you know where those rumors started and why.  They were started by the Jewish priests in order to stop the flow of people converting to Christianity. 

Quote
And “according to Jewish burial traditions Jesus’ body would have been taken to a rock hewn family tomb.  Given that he was crucified for insurrection the reburial would have been done in secret by his closest disciples.”
There is a couple of things with this.  Jesus’ “home” was not in Jerusalem.  It would have been in Galilee. 
Another thing that about Jesus and his trial.  He was not tried for insurrection.  Remember the Gospels explain that the Jews did not want His blood on their hands.  So they turned Jesus over to Pilat.  And what did he try him under?  Basically tax evasion. 

Quote
Jesus’ body would have been shrouded and left to decompose.  1 year later his disciples would have returned with his family for the final burial ceremony. 
This would have been true.  However Mary came back a few days later (3) to finish preparing the body for this time period.  And when she came back….the body was gone.


Symbol above the tomb
Chevron and circle
They stated that the symbols meanings is unknown, however it is uncommon for this to be on a tomb because this was a rarity.


Quote
Journey to Harvard

Mentions that the writing were informal and messy.  And also stating hard to read.
But said that he would say that it says Jesus, Son of Joseph
Now this does make it exciting.  But then we also have to realize that not only was Jesus a common name but so was Joseph.

Quote
John Dominic Crossman – Professor emeritus De Paul University
“Says that finding Jesus bones would not be detrimental to his faith”
I am still trying to figure out how he thinks this. 

Quote
Prof James Tabor – University of North Carolina at Charlotte
“If being historical and realistic then Jesus would have been put into a permanent place”
And this is true…since this is not the Jesus of the Bible. 

Quote
They go into Jesus’ family tree.  Showing Joseph and Mary.  They state that according to Christian tradition Joseph died earlier and probably in Nazareth.  While according to this tradition Mary died later and more than likely in Jerusalem.
I can only assume that they imply Joseph died due to some other documents or oral pass down other than the Bible.  Cause again I do not remember it word for word but I do not recall anywhere that Joseph died.  I could see where they would think that and it would make sense since we do not see Joseph later on while Jesus was in His ministry.  But then it could be that he just did not show up to Jesus’ messages.  Or was not as active in his following of Jesus, like Mary was. 

Quote
They say that after Jesus death Mary continued and grew a following
As her popularity grew among the Roman converts her name became Latinized.
Maria is the Latinized version of the Hebrew Miriam
That is why the new testament records her name as Maria. 
They said that it was extremely rare to see the name maria written in Hebrew.  But that is what they found on one of the ossuaries in Jesus tomb.
So what we actually have in the tomb is Jesus, son of Joseph, and Maria.  At this point we should note that Mary’s name was Miriam in Hebrew.  The ossuary was scribed in Greek, and on top of that had a different version of the name Mary. 
And let me also note that at this point they start to bring in the Gnostic Gospels.  Many many things have been written about the Gnostic Gospels.  Most of which pertain to how they were not written by the people they pretend to be, Mary, Philip, etc.  They have never been counted as part of Canon and they present ideas and concepts which at times contradict what the Gospels teach.

Quote
Frank Moore Cross  Professor Emeritus Harvard University

They also found Matthew in the tomb as well.  They believe that this could have been because of decendants of Mary. 
So here they present that this is either the Apostle Matthew who just so happened to be buried with Jesus or possibly a relative of Mary’s.  Her family line had many Matthew’s in it, so this could be a relative.  Or in reality it could be that this is not the tomb of Jesus and this Matthew is just another Matthew.

Quote
Prof Tal Ilan Free University of Berlin

Jose is shown in Mark to be the brother of Jesus.  They said that it is rare to have this name in Hebrew as it would have been a nickname.
Not positive on this as far as it being a rarity.  However if one brother was buried with Jesus then where are the other brothers?  How about any sisters?  Again remember that Jerusalem was not Jesus’ real home.  So now they would say that Jose followed Jesus as well and moved to Jerusalem. 

Quote
Professor Amos Kloner
Bar Ilan Univeristy
“These were common names among jews during 1st century”
The truth is starting to come out.  A voice crying out amongst the wilderness so to speak.

Quote
Go to University of Toronto
Statistics expert.
Professor Andrey Feuerverger
Dept of Mathmatics and Statistics University of Toronto

If standing on crowded street in Jerusalem.  Calling names

Jesus 4% would answer
Mary 25% would answer
Jesus with Father Joseph, Mother mary, etc… no percentage given.
This was to just to show how common some of the names were.  You would think though that if you were to shout out for Mary that any spelling of Mary (Miriam/Maria) would be possible.

Quote
They said that Joseph son of Ciaphas prosecuted Jesus and that they have found Caiphas’ tomb
A side note that does more to prove the historicity of the Bible.
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Sincerely
Brother Jerry

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I am like most fathers.  I, like most, want more for my children than I have.

I am unlike most fathers.  What I would like my children to have more of is crowns to lay at Jesus feet.
Brother Jerry
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« Reply #23 on: March 14, 2007, 10:56:32 AM »

pt 2


Quote
Mariamne is another name they have found. 
They are saying that this is Mary Magdaline
They are saying that it is Greek inscription
This is something else they pulled from the Gnostic gospels.  In Philip she is called Mariamne.  However the other Gospels do not make this designation.  So we again have to look at what is credible and what is not.  And scholars for centuries have not counted the Gnostics as credible. 

Quote
Shows some frequency of names
Jesus Son of Joseph 1:190
Mariamne 1:160
Matia 1:40
Jose 1:20
Maria 1:4

Statistician says 1:97,280,000
1:2,400,000 if removing Matia since that is not a known member of Jesus family.
1:600,000 dividing by 4 so as to compensate for any biases
1:600 dividing by 1000 to estimate for all 1st century Jerusalem tombs
This is 1 in 600 that it is not the tomb of Jesus.
And this number is dependent upon Mariamne being Magdeline
So baseline says that if we had a tomb that had Jesus, Son of Joseph, Mariamne, Jose, and Maria in it, there would be approximately 1:600 chance of that happening.  Now Jerusalem at that time had about 25,000 people in it.  So there would possibly be several tombs with these combinations.  That is how common the names are.

Quote
They said that women were ordained and that Mary was a respected missionary.  They said that it was a later turn around in the church that removed women from being ordained or anything of that nature.
This is where they now start heading down using Dan Brown’s fictional Novel as a basis of fact.  This is and has been the biggest issue with The Da Vinci Code.  Because it was presented as having some facts in it…people assume that the story of Jesus living and marrying Mary are factual.  When there is no credible evidence to support that.  And again they go to the Gnostic Gospels.  And here they even mention the theory posited in Dan Brown’s novel. 

Quote
Gospel of Mary Magdeline and the Acts of Phillip. 
They said that as early as the second century the church fathers began to suppress these writings.  And that these writings were from the 2nd century.   They said htat the male dominated church was suppressing many writings.
So what they say is that the Gnostic Gospels are much more accurate and truthful than great writers and apostles as Matthew, John, Paul. 

Quote
They say that Mary Magdalene ended up in France.  Following this “later Christian tradition”
More from Dan Brown.  With nothing as evidence to support it.

Quote
DNA
They could only test if Jesus and Mary had the same mother.  They could not get a good nuclear test.  And had to go to Mitochondrial testing.
Concluded that the two samples are not related (at least motherly)
So initially the only thing they could test was to see if these two people were related.  And the only thing they found is that they were not at least on a motherly aspect.  Meaning that this Mary was not the mother of Jesus.  It does not prove if Jesus was the father of Mary, or if they were brother and sister, or related in some other way.  And yes they could be married.

Quote
“For centuries people have speculated of the relationship of Mary to Jesus”

They said maybe the marriage was kept secret to protect the dynasty.
Well not really.  The only credible source of data that we have is the Gospels and from there Jesus had only a Saviors relationship to Mary. 

Quote
They bring up the Ossuary that was brought out that had the inscription James son of Joseph, brother of Jesus.
They test the dirt build up on the two ossuaries.
The ossuary that was found that has James son of Joseph, brother of Jesus is currently in debate and is court in relation to it possibly be a fraud.  And again what comes into play is why would a brother be buried with a brother and not with a father or their own tomb. 
As far as testing the dirt on the out side of the ossuaries.  They test as having similar chemical make ups.  Which would preliminarily indicate that they are from the same tomb.  However further analysis such as testing the other ossuaries, samples from other tombs, and a more detailed chemical breakdown would be needed to state conclusively that the James ossuary came from this tomb.

Quote
They labeled Jesus as the leader of an anti government movement.  And one that would harbor secrets and use codes.
WOW trying to figure that one out.  Judas turned his back on Jesus because He was not a rebel.  He did not lead the Jews to revolt against Rome.  That is what the Jews were looking for in their Messiah was a revolutionary leader, one who would take them from oppression.  Shame they missed that He did…just not the type of oppression they were looking for.
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Sincerely
Brother Jerry

------
I am like most fathers.  I, like most, want more for my children than I have.

I am unlike most fathers.  What I would like my children to have more of is crowns to lay at Jesus feet.
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