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Author Topic: Girl Wants To Start Caucasian Club At High School  (Read 4865 times)
Mr. 5020
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« on: September 24, 2003, 05:32:45 PM »

Link to Article

What do you think?  Should she be allowed to start the club?
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Mr. 5020
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Mr. 5020
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« Reply #1 on: September 24, 2003, 05:38:28 PM »

Results of the poll so far:

Question: Should a California high school student be allowed to start a Caucasian Club?

Yes, if there are other clubs like the Black Student Union and Asian Club she should be allowed to.  87%

No. There should be no clubs targeting any ethnic group.  11%

No. Only minorities should be able to have clubs targeting an ethnic group.  2%
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Mr. 5020
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Symphony
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« Reply #2 on: September 24, 2003, 05:39:21 PM »


Way to go, 5020.   Cool    Good article.  Thanks.


I looked at the results so far--130,000 polled so far!!

87% say yes, she should be able to have her club.  hehe.


Good point!   Grin
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ebia
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« Reply #3 on: September 24, 2003, 05:42:31 PM »

No, but not for any of the reasons give in the poll.

The reason a Caucasian club, or equivalent, would be unacceptable there (or here) as that Caucasians are have been historically and (to a reduced degree still are) those on the upside of the power inbalance.  If and when genuine equality is arrived at, and racism truly eliminated from socienty, then everyone can celebrate their racial and cultural background on an equal footing.

Until that time, it's up to those on the upside of the power inbalance to show a degree of humility towards those who have suffered in the past and present from that inbalance.

Which is (numerically) the majority and which the minority is irrelevent - see S. Africa.  It's about power.  The fact that the options in the article don't recognise that indicates that either they haven't understood the situation (pretty sad) or they were too lazy to try and word an option (also pretty sad).
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Royo
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« Reply #4 on: September 25, 2003, 12:58:29 AM »

The reason a Caucasian club, or equivalent, would be unacceptable there (or here) as that Caucasians are have been historically and (to a reduced degree still are) those on the upside of the power inbalance.  If and when genuine equality is arrived at, and racism truly eliminated from socienty, then everyone can celebrate their racial and cultural background on an equal footing.
Quote by Ebia
____________________________________________________

Then there never will be one; for I don't see society changing to that degree before the Lord comes again. Which is soon.

When people ask me my nationality, I just say I am caucasion-American. HeHe.  

Yours in Christ.  Roy.
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Tibby
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« Reply #5 on: September 25, 2003, 04:18:41 PM »

It is this simple, if you want equality, you treat everyone equal. No special clubs, no special people, we are all equal.

OR...

We can label people minorities, as in not part of the population, and give them clubs and scholarships and all that fun stuff because the white men defile our lands and raped out women. White man has always had power, and the minorities couldn’t help it, right Edia? The could never fight back or anything!  It isn’t like African tribes sold their dark skinned brothers as slaves to the white man, right? Or that Native Americans commonly joined the white men of one countries, so they could team up and slaughter the Indians and white men of other countries, right? Or that the Indians outnumbered the British 10 to one, but choose not to fight for their homeland, right? Oh, wait...
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ebia
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« Reply #6 on: September 25, 2003, 09:40:24 PM »

It is this simple, if you want equality, you treat everyone equal. No special clubs, no special people, we are all equal.

OR...

We can label people minorities, as in not part of the population, and give them clubs and scholarships and all that fun stuff because the white men defile our lands and raped out women. White man has always had power, and the minorities couldn’t help it, right Edia? The could never fight back or anything!  It isn’t like African tribes sold their dark skinned brothers as slaves to the white man, right? Or that Native Americans commonly joined the white men of one countries, so they could team up and slaughter the Indians and white men of other countries, right? Or that the Indians outnumbered the British 10 to one, but choose not to fight for their homeland, right? Oh, wait...
I'm really not sure what you're suggesting here.  How is the extent to which different people fought back against white invasion relevent?

The point is, that in Europe, North America and Australia white people still have the effective power and have done some terrible things in the past to create and maintain that power (different in each case).

I'll talk about Australia, because I'm slightly more likely to get the detail right:
First the British arrived, and created a legal fiction that the aborigines didn't exist.  This continued until very recently - aborigines have only been counted in the census since 1967, let alone been given similar rights to the rest of the population. 30 years ago children were still being removed from their families.

Then, trying to avoid the slave situation, they set up the "White Australia" policy, where non-whites simply were not let in.
By the time immigration was opened up to non-europeans, an extreamly racist society had been created.

A lot has improved since then - Australia (particularly the big cities) is now probably the most multi-cultural country in the world, but just saying people are equal doesn't make it so.  People have to feel equal, and have equal opportunities, and that means recognising the hurt of the past and trying to do something about it.

As far as the non-white immigrants are concerned, Australians are getting there, but there is still a good deal of racism around.  As far the the aboriginal population is concerned, the increadably damage that was done will take many generations to heal.  In both situations, it behoves those with the privaleges to act sensitively to avoid causing more hurt.
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Tibby
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« Reply #7 on: September 25, 2003, 10:40:53 PM »

I'm trying to say that if people want equality, they can't be claiming unequal treatment.
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ebia
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« Reply #8 on: September 25, 2003, 11:07:31 PM »

I'm trying to say that if people want equality, they can't be claiming unequal treatment.
In which case they can never catch up - you just preserve the status quo.
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Tibby
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« Reply #9 on: September 25, 2003, 11:58:22 PM »

Exactly
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Knox
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« Reply #10 on: September 25, 2003, 11:58:40 PM »

White man has always had power, and the minorities couldn’t help it, right Edia? The could never fight back or anything!  It isn’t like African tribes sold their dark skinned brothers as slaves to the white man, right? Or that Native Americans commonly joined the white men of one countries, so they could team up and slaughter the Indians and white men of other countries, right? Or that the Indians outnumbered the British 10 to one, but choose not to fight for their homeland, right? Oh, wait...

What exactly are you getting at here? You seem to have an understanding of American history that you gained as a child.

Black people are to blame for being enslaved? Native Americans are at fault for not slaughtering the British colonists? They had much more to contend with than the British, BTW. By the time the Mayflower landed, the Spanish had already exterminated thousands of entire tribes.
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Tibby
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« Reply #11 on: September 26, 2003, 12:14:08 AM »

Is my sarcasm to subtle for you people to grasp? My point is, you can’t pen everything on “the man” Even if you could, those people are dead and gone. I’d like to see something documenting the thousands of tribes the Spanish killed before The Mayflower landed.

Stop making excuses, Minorities have tried to pen all the guilt on Whiteman. They blame all problems, past and present, on the whiteman. I Say, That was then, and this is now, we should leave the dead buried! BUT, if you are going to bring it up, as Edia did, then we have to give Credit where credit is due, in the interest of “equality.”
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Mr. 5020
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« Reply #12 on: September 27, 2003, 11:27:52 AM »

Quote
Stop making excuses, Minorities have tried to pen all the guilt on Whiteman. They blame all problems, past and present, on the whiteman. I Say, That was then, and this is now, we should leave the dead buried! BUT, if you are going to bring it up, as Edia did, then we have to give Credit where credit is due, in the interest of “equality.”

This is true....
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Saved_4ever
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« Reply #13 on: October 01, 2003, 03:59:55 AM »

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It is this simple, if you want equality, you treat everyone equal. No special clubs, no special people, we are all equal.


No tibby you're special, really.  You even get a super star sticker.   Smiley

BTW you do know that her name is eBia right?  You've speeled it wrong several times now and the keys are nowhere near each other.  If you are having a problem distinguishing between a B and a D that would explain a lot to me.  All joking aside.
« Last Edit: October 01, 2003, 04:03:00 AM by Saved_4ever » Logged

 
Saved_4ever
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« Reply #14 on: October 01, 2003, 04:14:38 AM »

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Until that time, it's up to those on the upside of the power inbalance to show a degree of humility towards those who have suffered in the past and present from that inbalance.

First of all anyone who knows humans knows there will NEVER be a time when everyone "feels" equal.  There's a good reason for that.  Everyone is not equal, never have been and never will be.  The 6' 5" will always be able to reach things the 5' guy can't thus making them not equal.  Just to put it in it's most basic terms.

I really don't see why because someone's relatives were picked on by my relatives that I should sit in the corner with a dunce cap while they have a little "group" that complains about me.  It's stupid through and through.  The idea of people celebrating there individual backround keeps them seperate.

Why is this so hard for people to grasp?  What's the point of democracy if the minority ends up having the biggest voice?

If people want to be equal then stop yammering about things most people have no real part in.  Case in point, if americans want to be "equal" they need to drop they're bogus titles like "african-american", "asian-american" etc etc.  I'm white your black both americans.  It's that simple.  I don't run around claiming to be a greek-american (which I have every right to according to everyone else) because it's STUPID.  I have little to NO affiliation to Greece other than blood.

I am an american, I celebrate american holidays.  If I want to celebrate something from my blood heritage I don't need to make sure everyone else knows about it.  If I were to live in a town where there was a high population of greeks who wanted to celebrate something, whatever.  It doesn't need to become some stupid political thing.  Really the whole PC business is so stupid it makes me sick.  I refuse to use terms like african american because it's dumb and last I checked segregation was considered wrong.  Now everyone wants to use terms and such that segregate them.  People are so stupid.

<end rant>
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