Is it me or....

[Pizza_Mahal]

American is becoming similar to Sodom?
sorry, but it bug me.

[Soldier4Christ]

America is not similar to Sodom yet. There are many wonderful Christians that live here not just a few. There are those here in this nation though that are going the way of Sodom. This is the reason that you will see so many on here that are continually giving and asking for prayer for this nation and the people of it.

[Pizza_Mahal]

Whoa I didn't notice. I thought there very few follower left. Thank for info.

[Len]

I believe the only reason the U.S. has not been taken out by God is the fact that the church still has a hold here. But dailey we see more and more bodies compromising God's Word. Female "pastors", practicing homosexual church officers, Bible-less sermons, denial of the inerrancy of the Word, denial of the deity of Jesus...the list is long and growing...are becoming rampant among churches. We are definitely headed in the direction of Sodom.

Heavenly Father, please forgive us and draw us back to the truth. We are desparate, hopeless without You, Lord. Keep us close. We need You. Help us to claim, as a nation, 2 Chronicles 7:14. Without You, we are lost and destitute. In Jesus precious name, Amen.

[ibTina]

I believe the only reason the U.S. has not been taken out by God is the fact that the church still has a hold here. But daily we see more and more bodies compromising God's Word. Female "pastors", practicing homosexual church officers, Bible-less sermons, denial of the inerrancy of the Word, denial of the deity of Jesus...the list is long and growing...are becoming rampant among churches. We are definitely headed in the direction of Sodom.

Heavenly Father, please forgive us and draw us back to the truth. We are desperate, hopeless without You, Lord. Keep us close. We need You. Help us to claim, as a nation, 2 Chronicles 7:14. Without You, we are lost and destitute. In Jesus precious name, Amen.

Amen to everything you said here. I do see the USA heading in that direction, but also agree with Pastor Roger that "true" Christians are on their knees constantly praying for our Nation!

[Brother Jerry]

I am just thankful that when God comes to deal with this nation....I will not be here 

[Pizza_Mahal]

I am just thankful that when God comes to deal with this nation....I will not be here 

Yeah, Most of us will behead before we see it, sigh.

[john909]

Yeah, Most of us will behead before we see it, sigh.

I seriously doubt we'll be beheaded...LOL

What IS scary, however, is the political correctness the US is sliding into to please people.

Judge Robert Bork put it perfectly in his book, entitled "Slouching towards Gomorrah". I highly recommend the book.

(modified to remove link)

We are allowing people of differing, false religions to dictate US policy. We are pandering to the muslims, and even worse, electing them to public office. Non-Christians, and even some so-called Christians are removing all mentions of the One True God from our schools, removing crucifixes and crosses from our churches, teaching theoligical, feel-good pop-psycholgy vomit to parishoners, and generally telling people that all they need is to feel good about themselves.

I for one don't hold to the eschatological fears some do, because it's largely bunk -- misinterpreted by armchair theologians who didn't even attend seminary. All you have to do is watch TV to see these people leading people down the primrose path to self-indulgence, telling people that God loves them so much He wants them to be rich and well off, that all you have to do to be successful is worship God. This is one of our problems internally within the cmp of Christianity. Pastors are preaching XXXXXX, there is no XXXXXXXXXX -- it's been replaced by modern music written by people who have not a clue what proper theology is.

Why do some so-called Christian leaders feel the need to try and make Christianity more attractive to the laity? If they are, in fact, proclaiming the truth "which was once delivered to the saints" --Jude 1:3 by the perfectly righteous sovereign God, how would it be possible to make the truth more attractive? Obviously, one cannot improve on divine perfection. The lack of dedication to true biblical righteousness is a major factor in the ongoing disintegration of American society.

[Brother Jerry]

Amen and so true.  There is a thread around here about the feel good churches and the falsity of their doctrine as well.

[Kelly4Jesus]

But dailey we see more and more bodies compromising God's Word. Female "pastors",

Please tell me I didn't read that right! Female pastors are in the same sentence as homosexual church leaders. I am sorry but, I thought I left that theory that women were not to serve in the church as leaders, when I left Catholic faith!

If it is a sin for me to pursue being a pastor, please discuss this with God. I have been called, and I know it is God telling me, for I listen to no other Word. I don't believe in gay marriage (If God wanted us to be with each other, there never would have been an Eve, but a Jim). I uphold the Word and I follow the teachings of Jesus Christ. He is my Savior, my Redeemer, my Salvation, my healer, King, Friend. I will go wherever God leads me, whether it be full time ministry or pastoring a congregation.

Sorry, but I do not believe women are discriminated against in the eyes of God. I do hope I read this wrong--if so, just ignore the rant

God Bless,
Kelly

[Kathy]

Amen Kelly,
Why do people have a problem with women at the pulpit over a church? Women speak in tongues, give interpretation, pray over people for healing...etc, but when it comes to a women being in charge of a church people freak.
Kathy

[Brother Jerry]

I guess that since this is in debate....

And Kelly and Kathy and any others.  The first thing we must come to terms with is that the Bible is the inerrant word of God.  There are no flaws in it.  We also have to have realize that the Bible is not an "outdated" piece of literature, and that it's teachings of truths, doctrines, and such are timeless.  Another thing we have to understand when we look at the Bible is that every word is that of God and is thus there for a reason.

Of course the obvious verses to point to are in 1 Timothy chapter 3.  These verse state a couple of things which ensure the accuracy of the interpretation.  They speak in the pro-noun of he first off.  Which if one tried to say it was some old translations or something of that nature.  Or it was stated that way because back in the old Biblical times it was nothing but men.  So people today are often wanting to change that from a "he" of gender specific to more positional term and gender neutral.  However when we read these verses there is something else there to ensure that we keep it gender specific.  "A husband of one wife", lets us know that we are speaking specifically of men. 

Now that is the obvious verses that speak directly to those in the pastorate.  And it does not matter what denomination you are if...if you follow the Bible then that is what it says.

But let us take a look at some other concepts that are brought up throughout the Bible as well.  Take a look over in Ephesians chapter 5.  We see the clear path of Spiritual leadership in the home.  It starts with the husband being the head of the home.  Now tihs is not that the husband is command his wife to do things or anything like that.  But if the husband is walking with God and there is a matter of the Spirit within the home.  Then the husbands guidance should be followed. 

God's intentions are clear in these matters.  These directions are to cut down on discourd in the body of Christ.  Just as Christ is the head of the church, the husband is the head of the family.  The head of the church followed God and Christ was spot on.  If the husband is following Christ then the family will also follow spot on.  But if there is conflict within the home then there is conflict within the church.  This is the reason why God would establish a chain of command, if you will.  Order.  God is not the creator of chaos but loves order.  And there must be order in all that is for Him.  And it is His church and He has laid down the guidelines for His church. 

Even look back at that "husband of one wife" you will note that this eliminates even men who are divorced and remarried.  And you cannot simply dismiss this as meaning it is talking about only having one wife at a time.  Jesus spoke to the woman who had been divorced a few times as well and you should remember what he had to say about that.  And I have known some divorced and remarried men that said before they felt called to ministry but turned away and fell into sin, divorced, remarried and now would like to get into the ministry.  However they know that God is not calling them to lead a congregation.  But to get into the ministry in some form or fashion. 

I can only say to any woman that is feeling led to preach to ask themselves some questions.  Since the Bible teaches that the man is to be the spiritual leader of the home.  How can a man attempt to lead a wife who is a pastor?  He cannot.  THis creates confusion within the home.  And that confusion will spread to the congregation.  Even if both were pastors it leaves a breeding ground for Satan to enter and spread his confusion.  And we all need to ask ourselves if we want to be involved in any way, shape, or form in fostering Satan's plan and possibly causing a soul to be lost?

Now please let me end by stating this is not a message that I think a woman could not preach.  I know many that could and could do it better than many male preachers out there.  But I believe that women should not preach.  There are other ministries in which their talents may be used, teaching, conferences, etc, etc. 

And to all if I offend then I am sorry, the intention was not to offend but to state my beliefs and how I believe that those beliefs are backed by the Word of God.

[Kelly4Jesus]

(Titus1:5) (Titus 2: 1, 3-5) (Titus 2: 4-5)

Let us not forget...Miriam, Ruth, Rebekah, Abigail, Esther, Rachel, Deborah, Lydia, Herodius--just to name a few. Had they not stepped up to the plate and taken control--stayed silent--Can't imagine how our world would have turned out.

Oh, yeah..and Mary, Mother of Jesus. Imagine if she had stayed silent at God's calling!

[Soldier4Christ]

There is a difference between a woman being in the ministry and a woman being the lead over a church. We see in Romans 16 where Paul mentions a number of women that are in the service of the Lord. One in particular Paul refers to as a diakonos in the original Greek. This is the same word that is used in Rom 15:8 telling us that "Jesus Christ was a minister of the circumcision for the truth of God".

In a number of places Paul refers to certain women as being equals in the service of the Lord. (Rom 16:3)
In Rom 16 : 7 Paul refers to a woman as being "kinsmen", "fellow prisoner" and "apostle".

We know from these verses and others that women are to be esteemed as equals to men. Yet we also see that God has established a certain order in His church. Although we do not see anywhere of a woman being designated as a Bishop of a church, {A Bishop ( episkopos, male gender always )  is a superintendent, that is, Christian officer in general charge of a (or the) church (literally or figuratively): - bishop, overseer.} we do see women being in a position of having a ministry (teaching).

In fact we see in the following verse where a woman is not to "usurp authority over the man", that is to not be in a dominate position over a man.

1Ti 2:12  But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. 1Ti 2:13  For Adam was first formed, then Eve.

[Kelly4Jesus]

It is truly, my believe that God tells us each what path He wants us to go. As for authority, if it hadn't been for me--these kids would be homeless. I not only had to take care of 5 children, but I worked 7 days a week, 364 days a year from home as well. I paid mortgage, taxes and food. God moved me here to Kansas--not with my husband but on my own for a reason. Granted, He restored my marriage--but if I had not been given "authority", we would not be here (and doing well) today.

God leads EACH of us as HE calls us--and I don't think any human can judge another human being. That is God's job. So, if God leads me to ministry OR to pastor, I will not disobey--for I have NEVER disobeyed God..and Jesus is the one I follow.

God Bless,
Kelly