DISCUSSION FORUMS
MAIN MENU
Home
Help
Advanced Search
Recent Posts
Site Statistics
Who's Online
Forum Rules
Bible Resources
• Bible Study Aids
• Bible Devotionals
• Audio Sermons
Community
• ChristiansUnite Blogs
• Christian Forums
• Facebook Apps
Web Search
• Christian Family Sites
• Top Christian Sites
• Christian RSS Feeds
Family Life
• Christian Finance
• ChristiansUnite KIDS
Shop
• Christian Magazines
• Christian Book Store
Read
• Christian News
• Christian Columns
• Christian Song Lyrics
• Christian Mailing Lists
Connect
• Christian Singles
• Christian Classifieds
Graphics
• Free Christian Clipart
• Christian Wallpaper
Fun Stuff
• Clean Christian Jokes
• Bible Trivia Quiz
• Online Video Games
• Bible Crosswords
Webmasters
• Christian Guestbooks
• Banner Exchange
• Dynamic Content

Subscribe to our Free Newsletter.
Enter your email address:

ChristiansUnite
Forums
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
August 21, 2019, 08:12:13 PM

Login with username, password and session length
Search:     Advanced search
Our Lord Jesus Christ loves you.
281574 Posts in 27307 Topics by 3790 Members
Latest Member: Goodwin
* Home Help Search Login Register
+  ChristiansUnite Forums
|-+  Entertainment
| |-+  Movies (Moderator: admin)
| | |-+  Matrix: Revolutions
« previous next »
Pages: [1] Go Down Print
Author Topic: Matrix: Revolutions  (Read 1814 times)
Sapphire W34P0N
Gold Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 804

We'll party like we're dead.


View Profile
« on: November 06, 2003, 04:51:26 PM »

Out of five stars, I'd give it 'bout three and a half. The thing I don't like about the series (starting with Reloaded) was how philosophy kind of became the main focus of everything, and nothing really changed in this movie. It blew Reloaded out of the water, but came nowhere near the original. The fight between the machines and Zion was really cool, but I can't say too much else stood out.

I would like someone, however, to PLEASE explain the ending to me, as far as the fight between Neo and Smith goes. What was the end of that all about? It's really the only thing that confused me.

Overall, if you saw the first two, might as well see this one. It's an experience, for sure.
Logged
Ambassador4Christ
Gold Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2873


Are You GOING TO HEAVEN?


View Profile WWW
« Reply #1 on: November 06, 2003, 04:57:53 PM »

Out of five stars, I'd give it 'bout three and a half. The thing I don't like about the series (starting with Reloaded) was how philosophy kind of became the main focus of everything, and nothing really changed in this movie. It blew Reloaded out of the water, but came nowhere near the original. The fight between the machines and Zion was really cool, but I can't say too much else stood out.

I would like someone, however, to PLEASE explain the ending to me, as far as the fight between Neo and Smith goes. What was the end of that all about? It's really the only thing that confused me.

Overall, if you saw the first two, might as well see this one. It's an experience, for sure.

It's an experience, like LSD

Logged



Are You GOING TO HEAVEN?

http://forums.christiansunite.com/index.php?board=3;action=display;threadid=550

Galatians 4:16   Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?
Tibby
Gold Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2560



View Profile WWW
« Reply #2 on: November 07, 2003, 12:49:23 AM »

Haven’t seen it, yet. The first movie was good about having deep philosophical means. Reloaded just tried to hard. It went from deep philosophical study with the Zen master to philosophy 101 with Dr. Nobodycares. When you really look down at the ideas of the Matrix series, it is a slap in the face the Christianity, Buddhism, philosophy, and about anything else you try to compare it too.

The other day, a ran into a guy who was trying to tell me The matrix is a Buddhist Allegory. He said, I kid you not, Neo is Buddha and Morpheous is the Dalia Lama Roll Eyes He said some more stuff, waste of time to write. By the end, I wanted the shown him another form of Buddhism... Shaolin Grin lol j/k

Ok, done with the rant. The point is, IT IS JUST A MOVIE! If I hear Buddhism and the Matrix in the same sentence together again…

Oh, it would help if the fight scene used REAL people!
Logged

Was there ever a time when Common sence was common?
Romans8_1
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 126


Hello


View Profile
« Reply #3 on: November 07, 2003, 09:30:08 AM »

Spoiler ..... Spoiler ..... Spoiler ..... Spoiler ..... Spoiler .....  
Don't read if you don't want to know what happens in the movie.


You can take almost anymovie and inject your philosphy into.  Some are easier than others.  That's why movies touch each of us differently.  I am not alone in thinking the first one was very analogous to Christianity.  "The One" ... "Trinity" ... "Freed from Slavery" ..."Zion"... etc.  The first one really rocked my world.  The second one left me wanting ... and it was kind of meant that way.  It was really meant to be part of a larger whole which included the third.  That is another reason it came out so soon.

Now ... onto 3 which I saw yesterday.

I am not done trying to figure out what I think about it.  Like the first 2, it take time and discussion to start delving into the finer points.  I will say that at first I was left without a sense of closer.  I still had questions like ....
1) How was Agent Smith able to cross from the matrix to real life?
2) How Neo got his powers to affect the real world.
3) Where does the story go from here.  We are left with people in the matrix and people outside?
4) there are a few other questions as well.
But as I thought about it more, I can see more clearly what it was about.

I think all of these have answers.  But they are not plainly given.  I also think that many of these answers are left kind of open to interpretation, because they are not spelled out.

Here's a possible explaination submitted for your approval.  Tell me what you think.

Using Christianity as a model ....
Neo is Christ, Smith is death.  
Smith is spreading across the matrix ... this can represent spiritual death since they are sill the same person (as seen at the end when they revert back), but they are seperated from anything that can be interacted with.
Neo as Christ ... doesn't realize who he is or is purpose until he gets older.  Christ didn't start his ministry until age of 30.
Until the final battle with Neo/Smith, It took a lot of work to be freed from the matrix (sin), you had to have someone intercede for you (morpheus/Levites) to free you (forgive your sin).  Then comes Neo (Christ) who lives for a while in our world.  He consults with the oracle (possible the Holy Spirit) for advice.  He realizes that he has to go to Machine City (possibly Hell).  He doesn't want to, but he is obedient so that mankind can be freed.  He fights death, and could win, but gives in, in the end.  Jesus died for us willingly.  I don't understand all the dialog at this point, and I'm not sure how Neo did it, but what we know is that he overcame Agent Smith (spiritual death and/or physical death) and destroyed all of Smith all over the world.  It leaves us in confusion at the end whether Neo is dead or not, so it's hard to draw anymore analogies here.

But, the nature of things has changed according to the conversation between the Oracle (possibly the Holy Spirit) and the Architect (possible God).  No longer will people have to work to get out of the Matrix (free from the Law).  No longer will they need someone to free them (intercede for their sins).  We are told that those who want to leave, will be free to do so.  It's sort of like being in Jail and someone comes along and opens the cell door and says everyone is free to leave who wants to.  Now this is the state of OUR world we are in today.  Christ has done it all.  We can be freed from our sin (freed from the matrix), by simply asking now.

Another Observation: It was very plain that they were trying to paint Neo as a Christ figure.  Everywhere from openly calling him 'Savior' many times, to the point where he is in a crucifix position at the end of the movie.

Well, I'll stop here.  This is just a first quick draft based on how I'm feeling about the movie now.  I'm sure as I read some of your interpretations, I may find that I am totally off.  I also need to see the movie again to pick up on what I missed the second time.  I would appreciate to hear what yall thought, as well as if you think my interpretation holds any water.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2003, 12:04:22 PM by Romans8_1 » Logged
Ambassador4Christ
Gold Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2873


Are You GOING TO HEAVEN?


View Profile WWW
« Reply #4 on: November 07, 2003, 03:04:55 PM »

Sounds like a minus five to me
Logged



Are You GOING TO HEAVEN?

http://forums.christiansunite.com/index.php?board=3;action=display;threadid=550

Galatians 4:16   Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?
Tibby
Gold Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2560



View Profile WWW
« Reply #5 on: November 07, 2003, 03:25:27 PM »

Romans, Nice post. Now I'm come for you.  Angry lol j/k

Yeah, we can find Christian in most anthing. I'm sure that is the first thing in Tracy Lord's mind when she does a movie Wink

I don't know, Neo as Christ is kind of a stretch. I mean, I can see the Oricle as the Oricle at Delphi, yes, that was clearly the point they where tryign to make with her, but Neo as Jesus? As for:

Quote
Jesus... doesn't realize who he is or is purpose until he gets older.  Christ didn't start his ministry until age of 30.

I think Jesus knew we was God from the start. You don't shock Teachers of the law with your wisdom and turn water into wine and NOT know your a little different. Normal humans don't draw wisemen from the other side of the known world to see them as babies. Just because he didn't start at age 30, doesn't mean he didn't know. I know I have a tournament at the end of this month. Why am I not there now? It isn't time yet. I know I have  a Biology class at 9 on monday, why and I not there now? It isn't time yet. I don't think Jesus was as much of a idiot as Neo. Lets face it, the Charactor Neo isn't very bright. Smart people do not take red pills from large black men who wear sunglasses and night and hang out in abandon buildings. Grin
Logged

Was there ever a time when Common sence was common?
Romans8_1
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 126


Hello


View Profile
« Reply #6 on: November 07, 2003, 03:31:07 PM »

On a scale from one to 10, I would say a 6.5 - 7 right now.  I'm still trying to assimulate it all, so this number might change.  If you've seen the first two, it's definately a  must see.
Logged
Romans8_1
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 126


Hello


View Profile
« Reply #7 on: November 07, 2003, 04:59:18 PM »

I don't think this movie is perfect analogous to Christianity and didn't mean to imply such.  At different times, some of the Characters can take on different parts.  Maybe I did stretch a little on analogy of Christ starting His mission at 30 to be analogous with Neo not realizing who he was until late.  I still think Neo takes on Christ-Like, Messaih-Like, Savour-Like role in the movie.  (on a side note, not all Christians believe Christ knew who he was 'fully' His whole life).  

"I" definately see many Christian undertones in this movie, as in the first.  As you watch it, think about what I've said and see how much of a stretch it is.  As far as Neo being an idiot, you may make that case, but he was dealing with some pretty incredible stuff.  He whole world-view was totally blown.  I think I would be a little stupid also to be in his shoes.

Peace
Logged
Sapphire W34P0N
Gold Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 804

We'll party like we're dead.


View Profile
« Reply #8 on: November 07, 2003, 05:07:19 PM »

A4C, your opinions are wrong, plain and simple.

Romans, I think I can explain some of your questions.

<MAJOR SPOILERS>

1) How was Agent Smith able to cross from the matrix to real life?

You do not need to see the third one to understand this, for it was explained in the second one. In Reloaded, the first time Smith and Neo meet (right after Neo has consulted the Oracle), Smith explains his position. Even he says he doesn't know exactly how it happened, but in similar words, he explains that when Neo "killed" him in the first one, it was possible that perhaps some part of Neo was overwritten or copied into his code, which could allow him to enter and exit the Matrix at will, depending on the code that was changed. This would also explain how Neo and Smith are diatomically oppsite, and I suppose would explain the ending, as far as that Neo and Smith could not possibly exist as one because of that confliction.

2) How Neo got his powers to affect the real world.

I forgot exactly what the Oracle said, but she did comment on this topic when Neo talks with her in Revolutions.

3) Where does the story go from here.  We are left with people in the matrix and people outside?

Because Neo was able to destroy Smith and essentially save the Matrix, the machines conceded to a peace with the humans. It is never outright said in the movie, but we can assume from some of the other comments that are made that all the humans plugged into the Matrix will be given a choice of whether they wish to stay that way, or if they want to be unplugged and live in Zion or, perhaps, a human city that would be made on the surface of the Earth (the last part is just an assumption of mine).

I think that's all you should need to know...I still need to see it once or twice more to get it all, like Reloaded.

</MAJOR SPOILERS>

I don't care much for the whole philosophy stuff...it's nice to have, but it's too deep and profound for me. I just really enjoy the idea of AI overtaking the human race (kind of like the Terminator series) and the idea of a fake world that's really an intricate 'Matrix' is just a very interesting one.

Smart people do not take red pills from large black men who wear sunglasses and night and hang out in abandon buildings.

Haha. I couldn't help but laugh at reading this. Good stuff...
Logged
Tibby
Gold Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2560



View Profile WWW
« Reply #9 on: November 09, 2003, 05:19:51 PM »

Finally saw it. It was ok. Everyone keep telling me “Dude, it blows the first two out of the Water!!!” Yeah, maybe if your idea of a good movie is an explosion and a shower scene. In which case, it had enough for the first to make up for lack of the second.

It was WAY to rushed, it would have been better to take 90% of the Zion out of Reloaded, and tack on Revolutions to the end.

I found the end to be a little on the sacrilegious side. Neo in the cross position when he went to fight Smith. I had a feeling they where trying to make Neo Jesus, but when the machine said “It is finished” it was kind of clear. And he called the Machine city a city of light.

And they didn't explain enough. It was an ok movie, but nothing is going to top the first. The first will alwasy be the best!
Logged

Was there ever a time when Common sence was common?
Sapphire W34P0N
Gold Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 804

We'll party like we're dead.


View Profile
« Reply #10 on: November 10, 2003, 04:43:46 PM »

The first will alwasy be the best!

Amen to that.
Logged
Romans8_1
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 126


Hello


View Profile
« Reply #11 on: November 10, 2003, 05:01:03 PM »

I would like to submit for your consideration ...

Using tv shows (ie Joan of Arcadia) and movies (ie Matrix) can be a very powerful tool in spreading the Gospel.  We have precedents for this through out the NT.  The Gospel was constantly explained in ways that the unbelievers could understand and relate to.  

Yes, I love the first one also.  It was so mind blowing in regards to both plot and graphics.  It was the ultimate eye candy that totally engaged the mind.  It will be a long time before we see something as engaging as this was.  

But through this, we were able to explain the Gospel in terms that others could understand.  We would tell them that they are born into bondage of sin just like the matrix and that what we see is not the real world.  It's not the way things are suppose to be.  Then after being freed, we want to free others.  How do you convince someone they are living in a fairy tale?  It's almost impossible to do.

Now ... what about the 3rd?  Can this also be used to explain the Gospel in new ways? Most definately.  There's so much language dealing with faith, love and choice.  Especially compelling is the dialog at the end with the Oracle.  I don't mean to express heresy, but I believe Neo was meant to be a Christ-like figure.  The imagery and language was very obvious.  This is not being sacraligious either.  It's just a different way to spread the Gospel, we should go with that.  Neo had to die in order to set everyone free.  Now that Neo has died, the rest of the people can be saved by just asking.  It no longer is going to take work, and for someone to intervene on our behalf.  Everyone has a free choice now.

Is this the exact Gospel?  Not really.  There are a lot of doctrines that Christians still debate today.  But I still believe that we can use this movie to bring the Gospel to new people in new ways.  Everyone's going to watching the movie.  This is a great time to use these conversations to explain spiritual matters in ways that they might be able to understand.

Just my 2 cents.

Grace and Peace to you all.
Logged
Tibby
Gold Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2560



View Profile WWW
« Reply #12 on: November 10, 2003, 10:24:20 PM »

Or... The 3rd could have just been rushed because everyone was tired by the end and just wanted to end it with a bang. A LOT of bang. In fact, I think there where more explosions then there was plot in this one! I think when they where testing all the explosions before filming, they blew the plot up!

I've never been a big fan of Gospel gimmicks. It just isn't my thing. There is a Book called the Gospel Reloaded out. I keep passing by it in the store and cursing commercialized Christianity. But you might want to check it out.

First one- Philosophy came naturally.

Second one- They tried WAY to hard to clump philosophy into it, so as not is disappoint the fans. It sucked.

Third one- Realizing the Matrix was so big they could show a chimp with a mean face doing martial arts and still make cash, they put the chimp in a trench coat and made him fight in the rain, then blew up some left over T3 props, and called it a day.

 Grin
Logged

Was there ever a time when Common sence was common?
Romans8_1
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 126


Hello


View Profile
« Reply #13 on: November 10, 2003, 10:41:32 PM »

I've never been a big fan of Gospel gimmicks. It just isn't my thing.
I can understand that.  Each person has to follow their own convictions.  I just like the way Jesus and Paul used everyday things to explain what heaven was like or what it mean to be a follower of Jesus.  I have found it beneficial to follow that example.  I've worked with youth (mostly 9th through 12th graders) for years and I often have to relate the Gospel in ways that they can comprehend.  

The great thing is that God gives us a mulitude of tools to work with and then we get to pick and choose according to our ministries.  I was just wanting to point out that I have used some of these tools and wanted to give an example of how some of us have benefited from them.

Peace.
Logged
Pages: [1] Go Up Print 
« previous next »
Jump to:  



More From ChristiansUnite...    About Us | Privacy Policy | | ChristiansUnite.com Site Map | Statement of Beliefs



Copyright © 1999-2019 ChristiansUnite.com. All rights reserved.
Please send your questions, comments, or bug reports to the

Powered by SMF 1.1 RC2 | SMF © 2001-2005, Lewis Media