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Symphony
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« on: September 02, 2003, 11:27:38 AM »


What is the difference between a disciple and an apostle??
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« Reply #1 on: September 02, 2003, 12:10:18 PM »

My general understanding that a disciple is a STUDENT or one who is being instructed in the nurture and admonition of the Lord. All believers can and should be disciples.

An Apostle is "one sent forth" for a particular ministry and is placed in the church by God the Holy Spirit. Not all are or even can be apostles, but only those called and chosen.

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Petro
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« Reply #2 on: September 02, 2003, 10:11:29 PM »

An Apostle, according to Peter who stated;

Acts 1
15  And in those days Peter stood up in the midst of the disciples, and said, (the number of names together were about an hundred and twenty,)
16  Men and brethren, this scripture must needs have been fulfilled, which the Holy Ghost by the mouth of David spake before concerning Judas, which was guide to them that took Jesus.
17  For he was numbered with us, and had obtained part of this ministry.
18  Now this man purchased a field with the reward of iniquity; and falling headlong, he burst asunder in the midst, and all his bowels gushed out.
19  And it was known unto all the dwellers at Jerusalem; insomuch as that field is called in their proper tongue, Aceldama, that is to say, The field of blood.
20  For it is written in the book of Psalms, Let his habitation be desolate, and let no man dwell therein: and his bishopric let another take.
21  Wherefore of these men which have companied with us all the time that the Lord Jesus went in and out among us,
22  Beginning from the baptism of John, unto that same day that he was taken up from us, must one be ordained to be a witness with us of his resurrection.

So an Apostle was one not only chosen by Jesus, but was whom was with Jesus from the begining at the baptism of John, till the day He was taken up from us"

I don't see, that an Apostle had to compaioned with the other Apostles, necessarily, since it clear Paul was an Apostle chosen by Jesus, Barbabas was chosen and separated by the Holy Spirit (Acts 13:3), and although neither companioned with the others, there no doubt Paul was at the river the day Jesus was made manifest to Israel at the river Jordan. And both are consideredd Apsotles, according to scfripture.

Petro

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Allinall
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« Reply #3 on: September 03, 2003, 02:23:39 AM »

Amen Petro!  An apostle was one taught personally by Jesus, not just one who was with Him.  Why do I say this?  Because Paul was an apostle, and was most definitely not a follower prior to his conversion.  Yet Paul, like the 12 disciples, was the recipient of Christ's personal teaching.  A disciple is one who counts the cost of following Christ, and puts Christ first - he loves Christ more than anyone, or anything else.  "...I live, yet not I but Christ lives in me..."
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« Reply #4 on: September 06, 2003, 05:03:35 PM »


So anyone can be a "disciple", but there were only twelve apostles--those who had firsthand contact with Jesus.

There can be no apostles today?
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« Reply #5 on: September 08, 2003, 05:41:43 AM »

Anyone who is a born again Christian is a desciple. (or 'follower of Jesus').  The apostles also were desciples. But they were also called to be Apostles. Just as some are called to be Apostles, teachers, etc.  
As to weather some are still called to be apostles; I believe the answer is yes, but that is my personal belief. Smith Wigglesworth was said to be an apostle. He certainly was the greatest man of God since the Apostle Paul.
Each one of us is a desciple first and foremost, yet each has been called to something else also. God has called me to be a teacher, and maybe you an evangelist. But we are all a desciple of the Lord Jesus Christ. Our calling has to do with what He has chosen each of us for. My Mom was a quiet, yet powerful, prayer warrior. Yet she was a desciple. And when I lay 3 days near death because of a suicide attempt, she spent 3 days on her knees. Now, 25 years later, I know at least one reason God called her to be a prayer warrior. So many years later, we were both desciples of the Lord Jesus Christ, but her a prayer warrior, and me a teacher of the Word.
Hope this helps. Yours in Christ. Roy.
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« Reply #6 on: September 10, 2003, 02:05:35 AM »

Quote
So anyone can be a "disciple", but there were only twelve apostles--those who had firsthand contact with Jesus.

Nope!  Remember, Christ said that if our love for Him did not dominate our life then we could not be His disciple:

Quote
Now great crowds accompanied him, and he turned and said to them,  "If anyone comes to me and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be my disciple.  Whoever does not bear his own cross and come after me cannot be my disciple.  For which of you, desiring to build a tower, does not first sit down and count the cost, whether he has enough to complete it?  Otherwise, when he has laid a foundation and is not able to finish, all who see it begin to mock him,  saying, 'This man began to build and was not able to finish.'  Or what king, going out to encounter another king in war, will not sit down first and deliberate whether he is able with ten thousand to meet him who comes against him with twenty thousand?  And if not, while the other is yet a great way off, he sends a delegation and asks for terms of peace.  So therefore, any one of you who does not renounce all that he has cannot be my disciple.

Luke 14:25-33

I think it is often missed that to those to whom Jesus was speaking, ran a very real risk of losing family and possession for simply following Him.  The Pharisees, which were against Him, had the ability to kick someone out of the synagogues, while the Saducees, which also hated Him, were the priests and controlled the temple.  Following Christ had great ramifications - which was His point.  Count the costs was His message.  Unless we love less all that we hold dear now, we cannot follow Him.

Quote
There can be no apostles today?

No.  Why so?  The greek word for apostle, apostolos means "messenger" or "one sent with orders."  This implies a direct communication from the sender.  As scripture teaches that scripture is God's completed revelation, then the apostles have no more need.  God does not continue to reveal, as the job of these messengers was to relate.
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« Reply #7 on: October 09, 2003, 10:28:43 AM »

The ASSERTION that SAUL was at the river jordan when the lord was baptised is but that and there is NO evidence of scripture for it.
That PETER said what he did is one thing as pertaining to an Apostle.
But then HIS way of CHOOSING a replacement was wrong.
For it is clear that it is PAUL who was the replacement.
and so an APOSTLE is chosen not by LOT  as some even now so claim.
But By God as PAUL so affirmed.
and taught NOT by MAN (theological college?) but by GOD.
as Paul also affirmed.
It COULD be argued that Paul was taught by the Lord all that was nescsersary even of His baptism!
For there is much in that  as well no doubt.
So It can be said Peter was right in all he said.
But a FULLER or more PERFECT picture is obtained by PAUL.

iT IS perhaps worth noting as we are talking about disciples as well.
is that the Lord sent out not ONLY the Apostles but 58/70 disciples as well to go and minister in the SAME Spirit and did all those things which are reported.
« Last Edit: October 09, 2003, 10:30:58 AM by geralduk » Logged
Jabez
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« Reply #8 on: October 09, 2003, 10:36:58 AM »

So why wasnt Mary Magdalene a apostle??None of the 12 apostles i can think of where at the cross as jesus died.
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« Reply #9 on: October 09, 2003, 10:42:32 AM »


So anyone can be a "disciple", but there were only twelve apostles--those who had firsthand contact with Jesus.

There can be no apostles today?

Thats not what the scriptures say.
Only by wrongly asserting what PETER SAID.

For God gave to the church APOSTLES PROPHETS TEACHERS EVANGELISTS PASTORS for what purpose?
the PERFECTION of the church and the UNITY of the faith and knowing that you cannot have a unity of "THE faith...." without a unity of UNDERSTANDING for faith comes by hearing the Word of God and we know from other scriptures that HEARING alone is not ENOUGH so it is with UNDERSTANDING that faith IN God comes.

Now if in EVERY generation it is considered that we need pastors and evangelists why is it thought we do not need the rest>?
Even as soem say the day of 'pentecost' is past and we "have need of nothing"
But who ever heard of a baby breathing ONCE!?
being BORNagain is like a baby being BORN.
It has LIFE but to LIVE that life it MUST be FILLED with the BREATH OF LIFE and that continually!
it si written "be ye FILLED with the HOLY GHOST" that 'filled' is a present continous verb.

Paul is the PATTERN of a TRUE apostle.
and in the  MEASURE  God has given them will folow it.

Given that there was only 12 in the beginning it is unlikely that there are a MULTITUDE  of them today.

and even as there were FALSE ones then so there will also be today.
So we should test the Spirit and see wether they be of God or no.
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ebia
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« Reply #10 on: October 10, 2003, 04:26:25 AM »

So why wasnt Mary Magdalene a apostle??
Mary Magdalene is often titled "Apostle to the Apostles"

Quote
None of the 12 apostles i can think of where at the cross as jesus died.
What about John? (John, 19:26-27)
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Jabez
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« Reply #11 on: October 10, 2003, 09:56:28 AM »

One of his disciples,which was it?
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