Historical Facts On Record Concerning Popes.

[JudgeNot]

Children, children!
Ha-ha.  I’ve never watched soap operas – but this exchange has to be as good as ‘Days of Our Lives’ or ‘As the Stomach Churns’.

Let’s, market it, call it ‘Reality Forum’ – make a bunch of money and give the money to the poor!
               

[Pilgrim]

Children, children!
Ha-ha.  I’ve never watched soap operas – but this exchange has to be as good as ‘Days of Our Lives’ or ‘As the Stomach Churns’.

Let’s, market it, call it ‘Reality Forum’ – make a bunch of money and give the money to the poor!
               

LOL! Judging by all the funny doctrines of the RCC you would think its devotees would have a sense of humor.

[JudgeNot]

 

[Willowbirch]

Just get your hands on a catholic Bible (You know the one? The one with all the extra [Apocryphal] books).and look up Ex 20:3-17

 (I'll only interrupt for a moment, I promise - I'm just a plain old Christian)

The Old and New Testament, including the Apocrypha, were combined in the original Septuagint Bible read by the early Christian church. While I do not disagree with the "omissions" made as the Church grew, I believe the Apocryphal texts, as the material studied by some of Christ's great heroes, still deserve a certain ammount of respect. A Christian who is mature enough to "rightly discern truth" should have no trouble reading these books; if they are mere legends, how can they hurt us theologically? If we refuse to read because they "aren't approved"...didn't our teachers force us to study the mythologies of Greece and Egypt, Native America, and other such things?  

(Okay, I'm leaving! Carry on!  )

[Pilgrim]

http://www.cuttingedge.org/news/n1334.cfm

HUMAN SACRIFICE
 
"As you can tell, by the 1200's,  I had the Roman Catholic Church practicing powerful White Magic Witchcraft.  The invention of the Mass said in Latin was the key, as it produced tremendous spiritual power.  But, I was lacking a human sacrifice, and Lord Satan was not happy about it.  You see, all witchcraft requires sacrifice, and Satan wants it to be human.  Even White Magic people who sacrifice animals, or who do not sacrifice anything, are not aware that someone, somewhere, is sacrificing on their behalf.  Where in the world could I get a human sacrifice system operating in the Roman Catholic Church and still maintain my fig leaf cover as a Christian Church?
 
Ah, I have the answer:  I can invoke the magical properties of a priest performing a "Mystery "!  All pagan priests in every era have wowed their adherents with the idea that he can perform a "Mystery" that no one else can even conceive, let alone do.  Let me see how I can work this out.  I will need a body, preferably that of Jesus Christ, and I will need blood, again preferably from Jesus Christ.
 
I have it!  I will propagate the lie that, at the time of Communion, the wafer becomes the body of Jesus Christ, and the wine actually becomes His blood.  [Transubstantiation] Then, there is no difference between the "Mystery" ceremony the Catholic priest mystically performs, and the real sacrificial ceremony a Satanic priest really performs.  In the supernatural realm, there will be no difference, and I will have my human sacrifice!  Once again, I can keep sacrificing that hated Jesus Christ again and again, and again, endlessly!  How wonderful this concept truly is!  The people will think they are doing great honor to Jesus, when they are really sacrificing Him at Satan's altar.
 

Finally, since all true pagans eat the flesh of their sacrificial human victim and drink the blood, after the sacrifice is over, I will have the Catholics eat the wafer and drink the wine after the priest is finished with the symbolic sacrifice. Perfect!"

[creationist]

Tibby said
This Forum is for all Christians. That include Catholics, as well as the Anti-Catholics. We request the same respect from you that you get here.


I think you are wrong Tibby.

This is not a polically correct site.
If you bothered to read the  “Listing Terms”
You would note that it doesn’t accept Catholic listings Therefore this is not a Catholic friendly site. Ha!

BEFORE LISTINGS can be accepted on ChristiansUnite.com, the following terms must be agreed to. If you cannot agree to these terms, then listing your site with us will not be to your benefit, as we individually check each site, to make sure that the content is proper for inclusion on ChristiansUnite.com, and up to the standards of the visitors to this site.
1. We can only accept entries from web sites that glorify Jesus Christ. If your web site is of a Christian nature then this must be made obvious. If your site is Christian owned, then it must contain a statement of faith, testimony, or presentation of the Gospel. There can be no contradiction of the other terms of this agreement.
2. You must believe that Jesus Christ was the son of God, is God, was born of a virgin, was crucified as punishment for the sins of mankind severally, was resurrected on the third day, ascended into heaven, and is coming back soon to rule and reign for evermore.
3. You must believe that the only way to eternal salvation is through personal belief that the blood of Jesus is all-sufficient for the penalty of sin and an acceptance of him into your life as Lord and Saviour.
4. You must believe in salvation by grace alone, and that salvation is immediate and eternal upon acceptance of Jesus as a one-time sacrifice for your sins, and not obtained through any works, sacraments, traditions or merits of our own.
5. You must believe in the Trinity: That God The Father, God The Son, and God The Holy Spirit are three Persons present in one God.
6. Your site cannot contain any rude, obscene, or otherwise unagreeable content, to be judged solely by our opinion.
7. We reserve the right to cancel any listings at any time for any reason. Any dispute will be solved by ChristiansUnite.com.
If any of the above Terms & Conditions are not met at any time then your listing will be removed.

[Tibby]

Well then I guess this site isn’t for us.

Goodbye

[Pilgrim]

According to this pro Catholic site most Catholics don’t believe the hocus pocus of the mass. I find it interesting that the RCC can’t even convince its own gullible people of this lie. Apparently the RCC bit off more than it could chew when it invented the occult lie called the mass.


http://www.trosch.org/ind/homepage.html

“  Within the Church there have always been and will always be false teachers. Surveys have indicated that in the 1990's, 70% of Catholics no longer believe in the real presence of Jesus in the Eucharist. Yet, all who attend Mass are being encouraged to receive Holy Communion. Sin is no longer recognized or believed to be a reason not to receive Holy Eucharist. The Biblical admonition to not receive, unless first examined and found worthy, is sacrilegiously abused.”

[ebia]

According to this pro Catholic site

...

http://www.trosch.org/ind/homepage.html

This seems to be website of some group of fanatically traditionalist catholics with an axe to grind, who think JPII is far too liberal and should be got rid of

I wouldn't rely on them to represent the catholic position or provide unbiased information any more than I'd rely on Jack Chick to represent protestants.

This is not a polically correct site.

No it's not.  But since when did Christ condone the spreading of offensive lies, half-truths and hear-say in His name?

[creationist]

I'm new to this site, so please tell me about  Jack Chick.
What is it that he said that you don't agree with?
Was it the facts? The facts that prove that the Pope stood silent while Adolf slaughtered innocent people? The fact that Adolf received the Popes blessing? The facts that prove that many popes were adulterers and murderers?
Or have you also fallen for the lies that Satans little helper (Mr Pope) is spreading to science  Jack Chick?
History books can be hidden/burnt but the fact remains that The Vatican is Evil and corrupt.

[michael_legna]

I'm new to this site, so please tell me about  Jack Chick.

Jack Chick is a well known Catholic hater who will not balk at lying to further his hatred.

What is it that he said that you don't agree with?
Was it the facts? The facts that prove that the Pope stood silent while Adolf slaughtered innocent people? The fact that Adolf received the Popes blessing?

Take a look at Chick's biased or mostly non-existant sources and then compare their stories to the following from a credible source:

Blaming the wartime pope for failing to stop the Holocaust from the Vatican is a neat bit of revisionist history.

Newsweek, March 30, 1998: By Kenneth L. Woodward

"The voice of Pius XII is a lonely voice in the silence and darkness enveloping Europe this Christmas.... He is about the only ruler left on the Continent of Europe who dares to raise his voice at all." --Editorial, The New York Times, Dec. 25, 1941

"A full exploration of Pope Pius's conduct is needed.... It now falls to John Paul and his successors to take the next step toward full acceptance of the Vatican's failure to stand squarely against the evil that swept across Europe." Editorial, The New York Times, March 18, 1998

How the times--and the Times--do change. During the second world war, Pope Pius XII was lauded for his singular efforts to halt the carnage. And for years after, he was praised for the church's efforts in saving an estimated 700,000 Jews from the Nazi death camps--mainly by issuing false baptismal certificates to Jews, disguising some in cassocks and hiding others in cloistered monasteries and convents. But last week, after the Vatican issued its long-awaited mea culpa for failing to do more, critics of the church greeted the Vatican's statement with the sound of one hand clapping. As the Times's editorial suggests, they are demanding nothing less than a moral outing by the Vatican of Pius XII.

Something shameful is going on. That Pius XII was silent in the face of the Holocaust; that he did little to help the Jews; that he was in fact pro-German if not pro-Nazi; that underneath it all he was anti-Semitic--all are monstrous calumnies that now seem to pass for accepted wisdom. Most of these accusations can be traced to a single originating source: "The Deputy," Rolf Hochhuth's 1963 play that created an image of Pius as moral coward. That Golda Meir, later a prime minister of Israel, and leaders of Jewish communities in Hungary, Turkey, Italy, Romania and the United States thanked the pope for saving hundreds of thousands of Jews is now considered irrelevant. That he never specifically condemned the Shoah is all that seems to matter.
In fact, Pius XII was neither silent nor inactive. As the Vatican's secretary of State in 1937, he drafted an encyclical for Pope Pius XI condemning Nazism as un-Christian. The document was then smuggled into Germany, secretly printed there in German and read from Roman Catholic pulpits. The Nazis responded by confiscating the presses and imprisoning many Catholics. In his 1942 Christmas message, which The New York Times among others extolled, the pope became the first figure of international stature to condemn what was turning into the Holocaust. Among other sins of the Nazis' New Order, he denounced the persecution "of hundreds of thousands who, without any fault of their own, sometimes only by reason of their nationality or race, are marked down for death or progressive extinction."

The Nazis understood the pope only too well. "His speech is one long attack on everything we stand for," declared the Gestapo. "Here he is clearly speaking on behalf of the Jews. He is virtually accusing the German people of injustice toward Jews and makes himself the mouthpiece of the Jewish war criminals."

In February 1942, Protestant and Catholic leaders of Nazi-occupied Holland prepared a letter condemning the deportation of Jews to death camps in "the East." But only the Catholic bishops, "following the path indicated by our Holy Father," read the letter aloud from the pulpit despite threats from the Nazis. As a result, occupation forces swept Holland's Catholic convents, monasteries and schools, deporting all Jews who had converted to Christianity--something they had not done before. When word of this reached Rome, the pope withdrew a four-page protest he had written for the Vatican newspaper and burned it. As the 11 volumes on the war years published by the Vatican archives make clear, Jewish as well as Christian groups pleaded with the pope not to make a public protest because it would only intensify the Nazi persecution.

History books can be hidden/burnt....

Yes that is true but it is mostly Chick who is doing the burning of history books or at least the ignoring of them.  Or maybe he just gets his news from the modern press without ever bothering to research history.

[Willowbirch]

I wouldn't rely on them to represent the catholic position or provide unbiased information any more than I'd rely on Jack Chick to represent protestants.

Thank you, Ebia.  

And thanks for your post, Michael.

My sister is very "caught up" in Mr. Chick's publications etc; she is trying to follow his example by blasting and teasing non-Christians, and while this may in some cases be appropriate, it is not at all the command given us regarding evangelism. We are to defend our faith with graciousness, wise as serpents but gentle as doves.

But then, this thread isn't about Jack Chick, I guess.

[Tibby]

We will pray for your sister. Insulting people isn't always the best way to get them open to you.

[Allinall]

Well then I guess this site isn’t for us.

Goodbye

I'm goin' out on a limb here Tibby...but this is irony, isn't it?  If so, it's not bad!  I'm laughin' righteously bro!  But if it's serious, don't get your collar all up in a bind.  

[Tibby]

Mostly Sarcasm, but close enough.

It is good that you are laughing righteously, because The Lord hates unrighteous laughter