Why did God let Jesus die?

[Whitehorse]

Heavens, no. Actually I was responding to eyeball's post-he said Christian training was brainwashing. It was his quote in the box above my post.

[Heidi]

Oh sorry. Happy face. Sometimes I quickly glance at the wrong name. By the way, I liked your response.

[Whitehorse]

I do that, too.   Thank you for your gracious compliment.

[Heidi]

Eyebally, i don't know if it would do any good to reply to you because you do not think throught the answers. But'I'll take the risk. Those passages, as are all passages in the Bible describing life AS IT WAS THEN. They are describing human nature which is definitely corrupt. The bible is full of what man is capable of even with God.  God is trying to show us through these descriptions of the lives of people what happens to us if we don't go His way. He is also trying to test us to see if we will do what He says, even if it SOUNDS ILLOGICAL, as in the example of God asking Abraham to sacrifice his son, Isaac. Without God in our hearts, all humans can know is human logic. BUT THAT DOESN'T MEAN THERE ISN'T A BIGGER LOGIC OUT IN THE UNIVERSE.  My best analogy is children. Children are notorious for thinking they know everything. They don't have a clue that their parents know what they're up to until later in life. But they think they do. That is how God sees us.

Most people go their own way, thinking they know better than God. It is then that He sends conseqeunces our way to show us that we don't know more than He does. WE ARE NOT MASTERS OF OUR OWN FATE, WE JUST HINK WE ARE. We don't know how we were created and how things were back then, so why wouldn't we believe the bible? How can any of us challenge it because we weren't there? I can understand if people don't understand the bible, but to say it isn't true is actually saying that we KNOW it isn't because we were there. That is the epitome of arrogance and the belief that we are omniscient.

 The ultimate consequence for not believing Him is, of course, not having eternal life. We can choose to not believe if we want, but when we die, we'll know whether we were right or not. The most arrogant among us are the ones who are willing to gamble with their souls. The sad thing is that when they find out they were wrong, it will be too late. If Christians are wrong, what do we have to lose? We have Christ's love in us that can never be taken away. Nobody can jump inside our skin and take it away. When we die, nobody can challenge it any more. The devil will no longer be there to tempt us to sin because we won't be able to sin any more. And the sin we once engaged in on earth has been taken away from us so all that's left is love. Jesus said, "He was has will be given more. But He who has not, even what he has will be taken from him." That pretty much describes an atheist when he dies.

[Petro]

And don't give me that lame excuse, that you want them to make their own decisions in life, well old buddy, if you don't teach them, they will always find someone else, to lead them in what their spiritual beliefs will be, I never believed, but being a father myself, one day when someone shared with me this verse that says;

Train up a child in the way he should go: and when he is old, he will not depart from it.(Prov 22:6)

I would also consider it brainwashing if they only saw my view of the world. My children never knew my opinions until the later years.

eyeball,

Brainwashing, isn't just indoctrinating minds intensively, it can be done by rejecting ones own childrens upbringing, and allowing others to influence them, to the point where attitudes, peer pressures, drugs, or alcohol makes radical changes in their belief and attitudes, kind of like accepting, immorality and perversion as normal human behavior.

You deceive yourself, your kids, understood perferctly what your view of the world and God, was, way before you made your opinions known.

By your attitude and living your life before them, unless of course you abandomed them, even then, how you treated them while they were growing up, made it clear to them, if you loved them or not.



Petro

[Heidi]

What comes out of our mouths is what we value. Our kids can accept or reject our values. I'm only accountable for what I teach them. They are accountable for their choices.

[eyeball]

I have been away for awhile. I see no one has answered the question. I mean come on, just say "I don't know", OK?

Again. God knows all. God Made all. God made the rules. Not my beliefs, but yours. Therefore, God would have known, if he created the universe the way it is, Jesus would have to die.
That leaves us with several options to explore.
1. God could not make the universe in a manner that would prevent Jesus' death.
2. God did not know that his son would have to die for your sins.
3. God wanted his son to die.

Which is it? Are there any other logical alternatives?

[Whitehorse]

Clearly the third one. The Father sent the Son to die, and the Son willingly agreed to do this because He didn't want His people to perish. God is not aman and He doesn't think like one, either. Man's way is to look out for number one. God's way is to love intensely. His priority isn't avoiding suffering. It's salvation for those He loves.

[Heidi]

That is a VERY intelligent question, eyeball. It is one that even Christians wrestle with. But here's my opinion on it. All of us are born with a Lack of unconditional love form God in us that came from the loss of connection in the garden when Eve at the fobiddent fruit. Adam and Eve were created perfectly in God's image. But then, if Adam and Eve were perfect, how cold they know the value of God unless they knew what the alternative was?

At this point God sent Satan in the form of a serpent to tempt Eve to eat, which she did. This gave her the knowledge of good and evil, at which point, she felt ashamed and covered her nakedness. Now, God's whole purpose is to ALLOW us to sin so that we'de see God as a GIFT, not an entitlement. Now that we're capable of evil, we can now DESIRE the things of God. But the problem is that we CANNOT stop being evil because we are now sinners. God 's solution then was to send His son, Jesus, to the earth to give us the forgiveness from God, thus, re-establishing our connection to God. But the only way we want to come to Jesus is if our pain from NOT being with Him is sot strong that we truly DESIRE God. We are not entitled to God's love. We have to WANT it.

So yes, from the beginning, it was God's plan to allow our sin so that He could send a redeemer for us. I do NOT believe that jesus had a choice to die. If He hadn't died, then God would have been wrong about Him, which is of course, impossible. I also believe that Jesus Himself knew He had no choice. But, being both man and God, He is going to want to live also. That is why in the garden, He said, "The flesh is weak, but the spirit is strong". "Let Thy will be done."

Jesus is also trying to show us that our EARTHLY life is not as important, nor as glorious as eternal life, which is why He said "You have to lose your life in order to save it." So it is not a bad thing that we have to die. Those of us who want to hang onto our earthly life more than we want  eternal life do not understand the riches of heaven as mush as we want the treasures (which are fleeting) of out earthly life. we all have some attachment to our lives.

This is just my opinion. I feel it in me strongly but not everyone may agree with me.

[Symphony]

Why did God let Jesus die?


To prove that even if our Creator, the ONe Who made us, came in our very own flesh, and became one of us, subject to all human frailty, pain and suffering--that even if God did that, we would still kill him.

This is why it is critical that the fact that Jesus was God in human form be understood.  It is to prove to us that even if He did that--THAT, we would still kill him.

And Voila!!  Look what happened!!

We proved Him right.  

[Petro]

I have been away for awhile. I see no one has answered the question. I mean come on, just say "I don't know", OK?

Again. God knows all. God Made all. God made the rules. Not my beliefs, but yours. Therefore, God would have known, if he created the universe the way it is, Jesus would have to die.
That leaves us with several options to explore.
1. God could not make the universe in a manner that would prevent Jesus' death.
2. God did not know that his son would have to die for your sins.
3. God wanted his son to die.

Which is it? Are there any other logical alternatives?

Hey eyeball,

Actually  the answer is none of the above...

The answer to the question; "Why did God let Jesus die?"

Is found in the scriptures, and although we know it was for the sins of the world, the scriptures also reveal that God ordained it before the world unto our glory, and it is by the wisdom of God in a mystery;
Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
 1 Cor 2:7-8

And over in the book of Acts we find that God actually determined (horizo appointed, set the bounds, ordained)the death of Jesus, God knew that Satan the father of lies, who at the Garden of Eden, murdered the fist Adam and his wife Eve, would kill the second Adam, given the opportunity.

This why Jesus reffered to him  as a murder and a liar from the begining (Jhn 8:36-44)

And since God knew that the children of the evil one,  would do the will of their father, and murder Jesus, he delivered Him (Jesus) to wicked men who crucified and slayed Him.

Note;

Acts 2
22  Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:
23  Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:
24  Whom God hath raised up, having loosed the pains of death: because it was not possible that he should be holden of it.

And God caused this to happen, so that all men everywhere would know that it is He who, has power to give and take life, since He is the Creator of all things that are seen and unseen, that He might be glorified, and Praised.

Remember, Jesus was innocent he had no sin, and Satan knew this, but when he had the opportunity, he enter into these men who killed Jesus, just as he entered into Judas when he betrayed the Lord.  (Jhn 13:27)

Petro