The Holy Father

[Tibby]

Take notice there are no priests...

What bible do you read? I think Aaron would disagree with you on that. Moses, too. You know what, I think even Jesus would disagree in this case.

With the current topic, I've never really understood how calling a Preist father is any different they calling your male parent Dad.

[sincereheart]

ebia,

Quote:
Kinda like the "Jesus" name. Yes, there are those with the name in the Spanish-speaking world and there was another "Jesus" in Scripture. But only ONE "Jesus Christ"...
 
It's a good analogy, I think.  I'd feel pretty uncomfortable naming my son Jesus, but what's actually wrong with it?  Those who do call their children Jesus aren't implying that their children are Jesus Christ, or putting them on a par with Christ, they are just naming their son after the most important person ever to have lived, which is pretty reasonable thing to do.  It's really just a question of what you are used to, and what you mean by it.

But would it make a difference if they named their child "Jesus el Christo" as opposed to "Jesus"?  

My problem is with the grouping of the word "Holy" and "Father" for a man.  

*sigh*

[Dyskolos]

My problem is with the grouping of the word "Holy" and "Father" for a man.  

Nobody is asking you to call the Pope 'Holy Father'. If it's a problem for you that Catholics sometimes do it, well you just need to work through it somehow  

[sincereheart]

Nobody is asking you to call the Pope 'Holy Father'.

Did I say anyone was?   My apologies if I ever gave that impression.  

If it's a problem for you that Catholics sometimes do it, well you just need to work through it somehow  

Or.... I could just ask questions to try and understand it. Somehow, I thought my idea was kinder....

~Just a little helpful hint - if you notice at the top of my post that you responded to is this:
"ebia,"
which is usually a pretty good signal that the post was referring to a previous conversation with ebia and therefore my post was a response to ebia.   ~

[Dyskolos]

Yes thanks I read the thread and I knew the context of your remark.

Seems to me that this is just such a minor thing and you have beaten it way past death

[sincereheart]

Yes thanks I read the thread and I knew the context of your remark.

And yet you responded and in a rather snide way. Hmmm....

Seems to me that this is just such a minor thing and you have beaten it way past death

Sorry you see it that way. You could always ignore it and go on to something that you find worthy of your time.  

[Tibby]

Seems to me that this is just such a minor thing and you have beaten it way past death

I was debating between saying:

Yeah, around hear, we call it anti-Catholicism.

or

Yeah, welcome to CU Forums.

Um... it appears I said both, I said both. Oh well.

[Dyskolos]

Yes thanks I read the thread and I knew the context of your remark.

And yet you responded and in a rather snide way. Hmmm....

Seems to me that this is just such a minor thing and you have beaten it way past death

Sorry you see it that way. You could always ignore it and go on to something that you find worthy of your time.  

Even though I am not a Catholic, I find this Catholic-bashing kind of upsetting and really kind of un-Christian, so I choose not to ignore it.

Don't call the Pope 'Holy Father' if it bugs you so much.

[ebia]

ebia,

Quote:
Kinda like the "Jesus" name. Yes, there are those with the name in the Spanish-speaking world and there was another "Jesus" in Scripture. But only ONE "Jesus Christ"...
 
It's a good analogy, I think.  I'd feel pretty uncomfortable naming my son Jesus, but what's actually wrong with it?  Those who do call their children Jesus aren't implying that their children are Jesus Christ, or putting them on a par with Christ, they are just naming their son after the most important person ever to have lived, which is pretty reasonable thing to do.  It's really just a question of what you are used to, and what you mean by it.

But would it make a difference if they named their child "Jesus el Christo" as opposed to "Jesus"?  

No, I don't think it would - provided it was clear in context that they were being named after Christ, and that no-one was putting them on a par with Christ.  Of course, to an outside it might appear to be the latter, when it was really the former...

My problem is with the grouping of the word "Holy" and "Father" for a man.  

That's because you associate that phrase solely with God, not being used to hearing it used in another way.  So for you,  it does appear out of order.  In a society where "holy father" does not necessarly imply God, however, it isn't.  It's all a question of what is meant by the phrase, and what you mean by it is not the same as what a Catholic means by it when applying it to the Bishop of Rome.

[ebia]

Yes thanks I read the thread and I knew the context of your remark.

And yet you responded and in a rather snide way. Hmmm....

Seems to me that this is just such a minor thing and you have beaten it way past death

Sorry you see it that way. You could always ignore it and go on to something that you find worthy of your time.  

Even though I am not a Catholic, I find this Catholic-bashing kind of upsetting and really kind of un-Christian, so I choose not to ignore it.

Don't call the Pope 'Holy Father' if it bugs you so much.

In fairness, Sincereheart does seem to be asking a genuine question and making a genuine attempt to understand here.

There's more than enough real Catholic-bashing going on on this forum, without calling it when someone is genuinely engaging with the responses.

[ollie]

Yes thanks I read the thread and I knew the context of your remark.

And yet you responded and in a rather snide way. Hmmm....

Seems to me that this is just such a minor thing and you have beaten it way past death

Sorry you see it that way. You could always ignore it and go on to something that you find worthy of your time.  

Even though I am not a Catholic, I find this Catholic-bashing kind of upsetting and really kind of un-Christian, so I choose not to ignore it.

Don't call the Pope 'Holy Father' if it bugs you so much.

It is not Catholic bashing or anti catholic, but just asking questions and trying to understand why it is necessary to have these additions that at times seem to conflict with what God has revealed through the Holy Spirit.

Why is this always seen as "anti" or "bashing"?

[sincereheart]

ebia,
That's because you associate that phrase solely with God, not being used to hearing it used in another way.  So for you,  it does appear out of order.  In a society where "holy father" does not necessarly imply God, however, it isn't.  It's all a question of what is meant by the phrase, and what you mean by it is not the same as what a Catholic means by it when applying it to the Bishop of Rome.

Thanks for taking the time to answer. More mulling to do...


Tibby,
I was debating between saying:
Yeah, around hear, we call it anti-Catholicism.
or
Yeah, welcome to CU Forums.
Um... it appears I said both, I said both. Oh well.  

So now asking questions about a specific topic is bashing? Yet, earlier you said: But, I understand your question. Why so many names? I have wondered this as well. Never really looked into it, but wondered. Was it also 'bashing' when you said this?

And I take it that this:
I'm going to ask some more guys, but that is what I have so far.
is no longer true?


Dyskolos,
Even though I am not a Catholic, I find this Catholic-bashing kind of upsetting and really kind of un-Christian, so I choose not to ignore it.

I would appreciate it if you could show me where the 'bashing' is. Again though, if you find it 'upsetting' (like I find it 'upsetting' to call a man "THE Holy Father") then maybe
you might want to consider taking your own advice:

Nobody is asking you to call the Pope 'Holy Father'. If it's a problem for you that Catholics sometimes do it, well you just need to work through it somehow
Nobody is asking you to respond to me. If my questions are a problem for you, well you just need to work through it somehow....

Don't call the Pope 'Holy Father' if it bugs you so much.
Don't respond if it bugs you so much....



The irony of this would be amusing if it weren't so sad. If I ask questions and listen to the answers, it's bashing. Yet, Protestants are accused of ignorance because they don't take the time to find out more.

[Tibby]

Chill, sincereheart. I wasn't referring to you. I was referring to some of the other posts on this thread, posts that were little more then troll spam.

You asked why they made the name. This question could be anwered without Cathabashing. There was no need to get into a fight over how biblical it is. Not everything is a battle ground. I don't see why it is so hard for some people to just answer the question as best and as objectively as they can, without plugging all the emotion and personal theology into it.

[ollie]

Not a precedent for "Holy Father", but father period.
The Holy is an infered given.
Why does Rome title their priests, the pope, etc. "father" when God's word says no?

What do you call your dad?

I take it you don't call anyone a teacher either?

To take those verses literally is absurd, if not impossible.

"To take those verses literally is absurd, if not impossible."

Why is it absurd and impossible.  It is the word of God given through His Holy Spirt. SIGH!

Christians do it 365/24/7

I believe the scripture is in reference to spiritual heavenly father, not physical. Calling priests and pope father seems to be in the spiritual mode.

[ollie]

Take notice there are no priests...

What bible do you read? I think Aaron would disagree with you on that. Moses, too. You know what, I think even Jesus would disagree in this case.

With the current topic, I've never really understood how calling a Preist father is any different they calling your male parent Dad.

All christians are priests with Christ the high priest.

But not all are Apostles, teachers, preachers, etc. etc. in the order that Christ set in His church.