What makes a man a true prophet?

[Sower]

[Note: There were also some women prophetesses, such as Miriam, Deborah, Huldah, Noadiah, Mary, Elisabeth, Anna, and the daughters of Philip. However all those who wrote Scripture were men].

1. A true prophet is a servant of the Most High God (Jer. 7:25)
2. A true prophet is a man in whom the Spirit of God is and who speaks through the prophet (Gen. 41:38; 1Sam. 10:6; Acts 28:25))
3. A true prophet is a man speaking not his own words, but supernaturally the words of God Himself (Exod. 4:12; 2 Pet. 1:2)
4. A true prophet speaks “in the name” or by the authority of God Himself (Dan. 9:6; Amos 7:14)
5. A true prophet does not decide what he will speak or not speak. He speaks what God gives him to speak (2 Sam. 23:2; 1 Kgs. 22: 14; Hag. 1:13)
6. A true prophet speaks the truth, whether it be pleasant or unpleasant (1 Kgs. 17:24)
7. A true prophet is in full control of his senses even while he speaks the Words of God (Num. 23:5,12,20,26; 1 Cor. 14:32)
8. A true prophet is also a “Seer” – he sees visions with his eyes open (Num. 12:6; 24:2-4; Hos. 12:10)
9. A true prophet not only “forth-tells” but also “foretells” – predicts future events which must surely come to pass (1 Sam. 9:6; Acts 3:18).  There is no prophet who did prophesy predictively.
10. A true prophet can be greatly troubled by the visions which he is shown (Dan. 10:7-9; Hab.3:2)
11. Biblical tongues were another form of prophetic utterance (Acts 2:1-21;33)
12. All true prophecy and prophets have come to an end, Christ being The Prophet, and His Word being the final Word  (Heb.2:1-4;  Rev.22:8-21).

[ravenloche]

12. All true prophecy and prophets have come to an end, Christ being The Prophet, and His Word being the final Word  (Heb.2:1-4;  Rev.22:8-21).


If this is the case, and there are no more prophets what do
we do with Eph.4:11-12?
And he gave some apostles, SOME PROPHETS, some evang-
elist,some pastors, and some teachers. For the working of
the ministry, the edifying of the body, and the perfecting of
the saints.

It takes all 5 ministries in the church for the complete will, of
of G-d to be revealed. I didn't say it -- to word did right
above!

When the WHOLE body is edified, when all are perfect, then
will the 5 ministries be done away with. NEWS FLASH---
WE THE BODY OF CHRIST ARE NOT PERFECT!!!!!!!!!!!

I have to go for now, but will return later and finish this
discussion.

respectfully yours in Yeshua:

  ravenloche  

[Sower]

12. All true prophecy and prophets have come to an end, Christ being The Prophet, and His Word being the final Word  (Heb.2:1-4;  Rev.22:8-21).

If this is the case, and there are no more prophets what do
we do with Eph.4:11-12?
And he gave some apostles, SOME PROPHETS, some evang-
elist,some pastors, and some teachers. For the working of
the ministry, the edifying of the body, and the perfecting of
the saints.

What we do with Eph. 4:11-12 is interpret it in the light of 1 Cor. 13:8, 2 Tim. 3:16, and Acts 22:18. Apostles and prophets were of limited duration, and this is confirmed by the fact that not one of the Early Church Fathers (post-apostolic) claimed to be an apostle or prophet. The same is true for all the Reformers. Pastors, preachers, teachers, evangelists, Yes. Apostles and prophets, No.

Why? because of 2 Tim. 3:16.  A complete revelation for a complete Christian means that all Divinely revealed truth is now in the written Word of God. It is both complete and sufficient for all our needs. The proclamation of the Gospel and the exposition of the Word is what is now commanded.

[ravenloche]

the scriptures refered to in 2 Tim. 3:16 were the Torah and
the Tenach. What you refer to as the Old Testament. The
new testament did not exist at the time that this was
written.

Respectfully yours

ravenloche

[musicllover]

To add to the list already mass together,  just to clarify

A true prophet speaks the truth, everything they say must come true.(Jer. 28:1-17) A false prophets of today would be this Dixon lady, most of her "visions" do not come true......therefore she is a false prophet.

Ok a few question, if the calling of a prophet is no longer allowed or given, then how will there be false prophets during the end times. Would seem to me that to have false you must also have true. If the calling of prophet has not been allowed since Christ then what are the ppl to judge by?
     Aren't the 2 witnesses that stand proclaiming Christ prophets duirng the first half of the tribulations prophets......how does this fit into believeing that the calling of a prophet was stopped with Christ ascention?
    If prophets come to an end with Jesus, then what is Matthew, Mark Luke, John, Paul, and the many who were killed in the early history of the church? What were they if not prophets?  
     IF Christ was the last prophet then what of the prophecy's yet to be fullfilled? Who proclaims those? How does the message to get to the world. Sure we have radio, TV, Internet, but what are the persons called who teach about the scriptures, and proclaim the prophecy's that Christ taught about?
      I've thrown alot of questions at you so I'll allow you to answer before I bombard you with more. I am teachable, and curious.
Blessings,
musicllover

[Sower]

the scriptures refered to in 2 Tim. 3:16 were the Torah and
the Tenach. What you refer to as the Old Testament. The
new testament did not exist at the time that this was
written. Respectfully yours ravenloche

Why should we not believe that Paul, speaking both practically and prophetically, could see ALL the New Testament writings included in "ALL SCRIPTURE"?  

First, he tells Timothy that from a child he has known "the holy Scriptures" speaking of the OT. Then he says "ALL SCRIPTURE IS GIVEN BY INSPIRATION OF GOD". Paul, in his own epistles, makes it clear that he is writing Scripture (1 Thess.1:13,14), and there are numerous passages to support this.

Peter, in his epistles also makes it clear that he is writing Scripture: "WE HAVE ALSO A MORE SURE WORD OF PROPHECY" (2 Pet. 1:19), but then goes on to place the epistles of Paul on the same level as the OT Scriptures (2 Pet. 3:15-18).  

Both Peter and Paul knew that they too were writing by Divine inspiration, so when Paul says "ALL SCRIPTURE" he cannot possibly be limiting that to the OT, since his own letter to Timothy is also Scripture. In this same epistle, Paul speaks of "the books" and "the parchments", which respectively mean the NT books and the OT scrolls. Paul was fully aware during his own lifetime, that much of the NT was already in existence, since he himself wrote the bulk of it.

The NT did exist [but not in it's fullness] while the apostles ministered on earth. They also knew that it was Scripture:
"And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you.  AS ALSO IN ALL HIS EPISTLES... AS ALSO THE OTHER SCRIPTURES..." (2 Pet. 3:15-16).

[Sower]

Ok a few question, if the calling of a prophet is no longer allowed or given, then how will there be false prophets during the end times. Would seem to me that to have false you must also have true. If the calling of prophet has not been allowed since Christ then what are the ppl to judge by?

Not necessarily the way you have expressed it. When the apostle John closed the Bible with the book of the Revelation, he closed the door to true prophets. However, he could also see that false christs and false prophets would arise, hence the warning to add or subtract from his prophecy. Nonetheless, because people in the end times would insist that prophecies have not come to an end, false prophets would arise to fulfill their expectations.  We can judge a false prophet by his claim to be bringing "new revelations" from God, as Muhammed and Joseph Smith did, for example. We know those "new revelations" are false, because they blatantly contradict and controvert the Word of God.  

Aren't the 2 witnesses that stand proclaiming Christ prophets duirng the first half of the tribulations prophets......how does this fit into believeing that the calling of a prophet was stopped with Christ ascention?

These "two witnesses" -- possibly Moses and Elijah themselves -- are indeed true prophets but their role during the reign of the Antichrist is not to bring more revelations as much as to testify against the Beast.  Notice that (1) they are called "two witnesses", (2) their ministry is limited to the reign of the Antichrist (3.5 years or 1260 prophetic days), (3) "when they have finished their testimony" they are killed.
In other words, they expose the Antichrist by testifying against him, and for this they are executed. But they are also resurrected and then taken to Heaven (Rev.11:11,12).

These two witnesses were ALREADY PROPHETS who come back to earth for a season! That's why they are called "two olive trees" and "two lampstands standing before the God of the earth" (Rev.11:4). They appeared with Christ in His transfiguration and communed with Him about His passion and His departure [exodus] from the earth.

If prophets come to an end with Jesus, then what is Matthew, Mark Luke, John, Paul, and the many who were killed in the early history of the church? What were they if not prophets?

You missed my statement "HIS WORD BEING THE FINAL WORD".  The Word of Christ has been given to us by the evangelists Mark and Luke, as well as the apostles Matthew, John, Paul, Peter, James, and Jude.  This is all prophetic and all Scripture. But it is "THE FINAL WORD". There were also other prophets and prophetesses during the apostolic period who did not write Scripture, but with the closing of the Bible and the end of the apostolic period, all true prophecy has come to an end.
 

IF Christ was the last prophet then what of the prophecy's yet to be fullfilled?

Christ is THE PROPHET predicted by Moses, and His prophetic Word was given to the apostles to be fulfilled in the last days, culminating with the prophecies in the book of the Revelation: "But in the days of the voice of the seveth angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God SHOULD BE FINISHED, as He hath declared to his servants the prophets" (Rev. 10:7). It is Christ who tells John to "Write the things which thou hast seen, and the things which are, AND THE THINGS WHICH SHALL BE HEREAFTER" (Rev.1:19), seeing that
"the TESTIMONY OF JESUS is the spirit of prophecy" (Rev. 19:10).

Islam, which opposes Christianity, claims that Jesus was "a prophet" and Muhammed is THE PROPHET. That's why we must maintain that Christ is THE PROPHET -- the final Prophet -- and all true prophecy flows from His Holy Spirit and testifies of Him. It is the resurrected Saviour who gave "gifts to men", one of them being prophecy, which Paul said would "fail" or cease (1 Cor. 13: along with tongues and supernatural knowledge.

Who proclaims those? How does the message to get to the world. Sure we have radio, TV, Internet, but what are the persons called who teach about the scriptures, and proclaim the prophecy's that Christ taught about?

Seeing that there are no more true apostles and prophets, it is the evangelists, pastors, and teachers who must now proclaim the written Word of God.  Too often there is little of Scripture in most sermonizing. Christ and the apostles focused on declaring the written Word of God and expounding on it by comparing Scripture with Scripture, and tying Scriptures together to teach the truths of God.
     

[musicllover]

I see where you are coming from this is not an new idea, these teaching has been around along time, yet I am still not sure I agree.
     It must be understood A true prophet teachs what has already been taught in the scriptures there are no "NEW" prophecy's. If someone teaches something that is not supported by scripture they are a false prophet.
     
1 Cor 12 speaks of the gifts of the Spirit, prophecy is mention is verse 10. This is Paul speaking, well after the assenction of Christ.

1 Cor 14:3
But everyone who porphesies speaks to men for their strengthening, encouragement and comfort. (4) He who speaks in a toungue edifieds himself, but he who prophesies edifies the church. (5).....I would rather have you prophesy, he who prophesies is greater than one who speaks in tongues, unless he interprets so that the whole church is edified.

The "office" or calling of a prophet is still in the world today, sadly we all recall the false prophets of, Jim Jones, or Keresh, etc etc. Becuase I believe that Chirst is not going to abandond us, he has given us the Holy Spirt. Therefore You simply can not have false with out the true, people have nothing to compare with other wise. Jesus was a prophet no doubt but not the last one. Jesus teaching on the mount about himself
 Matt 5:12 Rejoice and  be glad, because great is your reward in heaven, for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you. ......... 5:17 Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets: I have not come come to abolish them but to fulfill them......Jesus contineus teaching those listening that any who breaks these commandments, are least in the Kingdom of Heaven, any who practice and teach these will be called great.....
 (abolish means to To do away with; To destroy completely)
 
Matt 10:41.....recieving a prophets reward......
Jesus did not say he was the end of the prophets, but to recieve a prophet.....

When you read any of the end time books, the books that are the prophecy for our day, and those to come in the future they predict false prophet Obviously there are many in the world today,full of the anti christ spirit. But yet I fail to understand how God would expect those in the world today to "know" these false prophets with out having a true prophet scattered among the thorns.....so to speak.

More evidence for thought can be found in the book of Acts
(as was also told in the OT) Pete full of the Holy Spirit, begin to speak to the ppl, he is standing in the office of "prophet" Christ did not take it with him.  Act 2:17  And it shall come to pass in the last days, says God. That I will pour out of my Spirit on all flesh, your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your young men shall see visions, your old men shall dream dreams........18).....I will pour out my Spirit in those days: And they shall prophesy......20)......Before the coming of the great and awesome day of the Lord.

This is the promises as was told my Peter after the assention of christ, for the generations to come. The calling  or office of a "prophet" has to still be with us verse 20 explains all that will happen, BEFORE the coming of the great and awesome day of the Lord.

And of coarse the Eph 4:11 And he himself gave some to be apostles, some prophets, some evangelist.........
HIMSELF being Christ. It was wtih Christ asenction that the Holy Spirit begin to move thru the generations not just the few men thru the OT or just thru the Disciple but to all men who choose to believe, the Holy Spirit is the one who works thru the ppl.....in what ever that gift is. Among the many gift the Holy Spirit give is the gift of prohpecy. A very high calling indeed, and one that hold much responsiblity, but we should desire to have.

One last question?
Do you believe that Holy Spirit exist? I would naturally assume you do, so I ask, do you believe in any of the gifts exist in the world today. If not, what do you believe the Holy Spirit does for a believer?
respectfully, in Christ,
as with any discussion, find comfirmation in the scriptures. I continue to be teachable, may Christ be glorified.
Musicllover
 

[Sower]

Do you believe that Holy Spirit exist?

Not only do I believe that the Holy Spirit "exists", but that He is God the Holy Spirit. So when God tells us something is going to stop, we simply believe Him. That's faith.

I would naturally assume you do, so I ask, do you believe in any of the gifts exist in the world today. If not, what do you believe the Holy Spirit does for a believer?

All spiritual gifts were not intended to continue for all time:

(1) God has only 12 apostles, and Christ very specifically said that they would sit on twelve thrones ruling the twelve tribes of Israel. Thus we find that the Heavenly City, New Jerusalem, has 12 foundations, and that in the 12 foundations of the wall of the city are the names of the 12 apostles (Rev. 21:13) while on the twelve gates of the wall are the names of the 12 tribes of Israel (Rev. 21:12).

(2) Prophecies, tongues, and supernatural knowledge would cease, stop, come to an end (1 Cor. 13: and so they did. Once the New Testament was completed, there is no further mention of these three gifts by the Early Church Fathers, who lived immediately after the apostles. They accepted the complete written Word of God as final revelation.

(3) The "sign" gifts -- signs, wonders, and miracles -- were for the apostles and for the apostolic period also, "GOD ALSO BEARING THEM WITNESS" with these (Heb. 2:1-4). Paul writes about "the signs of an apostle" in the course of establishing his authority as an apostle, and that these sign gifts accompanied His preaching and teaching.  That they were not permanent is evident from the fact that Epaphroditus was very sick "nigh unto death" but Paul does not say anything about healing him, but rather speaks about how "God had mercy on him" lest "I should have sorrow upon sorrow".

So to sum up, the gifts that have ceased are (1 Cor.12:28) --apostles, prophets [and those with supernatural knowledge as in Scripture], miracles, healings, diversities of tongues, and interpretation of tongues. Today's tongues are not biblical, but "glossolalia" or babbling.  Today, God works His miracles in His own myterious ways and in response to "the prayer of faith" (James 5:14-20).

[musicllover]

I wondered, I agree to disagree. Miracle occur, healing occur, you would be hard pressed to explain to me how a deaf womens hearing was restored at a service I was at many years ago. Too many people that knew her from the local area knew she was deaf, yet she was hearing.

I am still curious though what (in your understanding) is the job of the Holy Spirit? There is nothing wrong with believing they do not occur, except you might miss out on experiencing but it has nothing to do with salvation, so how do you feel if one believes in the miracles, the gifts as we've talked about?  What happens to someone like myself who does believe in miracles, signs and wonders? You believe I am going to be easly decieved, the truth is many are decieved in this day, but that still isn't saying the prophet don't exist or miracles don't occur, we must be every so careful, become knowledgeable of the word, and line everytihng up with scripture.
      I know I'm full of questions but I find it interesting to talk about the differences in our faith, as long as the plan of Salvation is the same.....Jesus is the only way. If you believe some other way I'm done with this discussion.  I think some of the trouble is the differences in definition that we each might have.  
definition of a
prophet- is the inspired messanger who declares the will of God.

preacher- one who proclaims the gospel publicly
   
teacher-one who instructs

Miracles- an interventionin of the nautral universe by God.

(these def are taken from my Nelson's bible companion.) Does these def seem right to you? Its so easy to get these to cross over with each other.
We argree, prophet, preaching and teaching are gifts of the Holy Spirit, yet I fail to see any limits but on these gifts, except by man.
   
  Where does it say that there are teachers, and preachers but not prophets?
     I agree there are false teacher, prophets ect and they will meet the Judgement of God, but are you saying that anyone who believes in signs and wonder is doomed to judgement too (aside from being decieved)?
    Are you saying that those that proclaim to be prophets, who performs signs and miracles in the world today are false, and doomed for God judgement?
   I can agree, signs and wonders, and that prophecy's will cease, there is a day when these gifts are no longer needed but I don't believe we are there yet. You do not need miralce in Heaven, they are needed in this world, not simply for the time that Christ walked this earth, greater things than these as it says.

If you do not believe in signs and wonders then what is your belief in the return of christ. The rapture will def be a "miracle" and what of the signs and wonders that are mentioned in the last days?
 
Sorry, but I've asked before, how do you have the false with out the real? When you see a fake 10, 20 or 100 dollar bills, the only way a person could tell the fake from the real is to know what the real looked like first ? (unless its in my wallet, then I know I got the wrong wallet  )
I guess I find it hard to put the Holy Spirit in a box and say this is how you will behave, I want to be open to what God has for me, to be used in what ever way he might want to use me. But I do not want to be ignorant of the devils schemes either, if God wants to perfomr a miracle, signs or wonders then I say GO GOD.
Well blasted you with more questions.....
warm regards,
musicllover