Personal Blatherings

[Whitehorse]

Hi! As the subject line reads, I'm just excited about something and just generally wanted to blab about it to whomever might want to hear it.

I was doing my prayer/meditations just now, and something occured to me. I'm Reformed, by faith, and I've been wanting for a long time now to have a better understanding of the parable about the wedding feast. You know the one where there's a man present without wedding clothes and he is cast out, "For many are called, but few are chosen." I used to think, consciously or not, that meant God's sovereignty was a bar to salvation for some. It just occured to me that any who truly have saving faith stop sinning, so it was the man who barred his own way. I believe it means God did not choose him on account of his lack of proper saving faith which would have produced the righteousness (wedding clothes). I believe that is the basis for his being overlooked, because Matthew 5 states that any who hunger and thirst aftrer righteousness shall be filled. This is not to overlook the doctrine of predestination, so clearly laid out in scripture (Oh, no, the floodgates have been opened!), but it more greatly establishes God's justice and mercy. It's amazing how easy it is to think of this doctrine as reflecting something harsh about God. I'm finding it not to be so. Any thoughts?

[ollie]

 Matthew 22:1.  And Jesus answered and spake unto them again by parables, and said,
 2.  The kingdom of heaven is like unto a certain king, which made a marriage for his son,
 3.  And sent forth his servants to call them that were bidden to the wedding: and they would not come.
 4.  Again, he sent forth other servants, saying, Tell them which are bidden, Behold, I have prepared my dinner: my oxen and my fatlings are killed, and all things are ready: come unto the marriage.
 5.  But they made light of it, and went their ways, one to his farm, another to his merchandise:
 6.  And the remnant took his servants, and entreated them spitefully, and slew them.
 7.  But when the king heard thereof, he was wroth: and he sent forth his armies, and destroyed those murderers, and burned up their city.
 8.  Then saith he to his servants, The wedding is ready, but they which were bidden were not worthy.
 9.  Go ye therefore into the highways, and as many as ye shall find, bid to the marriage.
 10.  So those servants went out into the highways, and gathered together all as many as they found, both bad and good: and the wedding was furnished with guests.
 11.  And when the king came in to see the guests, he saw there a man which had not on a wedding garment:
 12.  And he saith unto him, Friend, how camest thou in hither not having a wedding garment? And he was speechless.
 13.  Then said the king to the servants, Bind him hand and foot, and take him away, and cast him into outer darkness; there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
 14.  For many are called, but few are chosen.

 The call is put out to all through the good news of Jesus Christ. Not all will be chosen through the good news.
 But a few are chosen by choosing God and His Christ.

[Whitehorse]

Hi, Ollie! Thanks for your reply.

Yes, exactly. What I was trying to decipher is what exactly is the basis of that choice? Of course, God's sovereignty, but that's really very broad. Take Esau, for example. There is a basis for God's rejection, the selling of the birthright, even though it is also clear that God made His decision before the foundations of the earth were laid, *so that His purposes in eternal election might stand.* But Jesus also says to make every effort to enter the kingdom of God, because many will not be able to. However...I still haven't decided if that related to the fact that many will try to enter when they are no longer able (at the judgment) or if this is referring to now. From the context, I tend to side with the latter, but there's room for either viewpoint. (What happens at the judgment depends upon our heart attitudes now.) Actually, I haven't sorted that part out yet, but here's what I'm getting at: God's sovereignty in no wise contradicts human responsibility. The man at the wedding feast was clearly held responsible, and so I was trying to determine the basis, which was the wedding clothes. THe book of revelation says the white garments are the righteous acts of the saints. Goes back to sowing the spiritual seed.

Of course, just to qualify the statement: We are saved by grace alone, through faith alone. Not of our works so that no one can boast. But, the works are the inherent byproduct of that true faith. What do you think?

[ollie]

James tells us that God's people are not made righteous by faith only but also by works. This is not to say that works save one but help to make one righteous along with faith. One will be saved by faith but rewarded according to ones righteous works. Yes with true faith come works of God. Works do not bring faith, but faith brings works

Ollie

[John the Baptist]

Hi, John here:
Agape LOVE is recreated at the new birth. It can become 'saltless' & good for nothing. Rev. 3:16-17 (faded Garment, of Christs Rightousness)

Works are the Christians recreated MOTIVES of LOVE! When one 'feels' bad, good works regardless, enrich bad feelings. That is why feelings are not a way to test ones relationship with Christ, huh? See Acts 5:32

But on the subject of the wedding garment? Matt. 25 quickly comes into mind?? Here we see 'oil' as the measuring of the RIGHTOUSNESS of Christ. All seem to have on the rightful clothing to some degree at least. They are ALL called Virgins, as ALL were also SLEEPING!

Then we see a "MIDNIGHT CRY"?? And if ALL ARE ASLEEP, who gave it??? And it WAS FROM OUTSIDE! Verse 6. Even the Master was OUTSIDE. And there WAS A SHUT DOOR !
This no doubt 'includes' the 2 Thess. 2:1-3 workless 1/2 gospel that is NO gospel of only believe. Christ states an ETERNAL GOSPEL FACT, "IF YE LOVE ME KEEP MY COMMANDMENTS". He even supplies the POWER! Phil. 4:13 * 2 Cor. 12:9. So any such teaching such as this is TRUELY FALLING AWAY head first!  

We think of a shut door. Read Matt. 23:38. We hear talk of Joel 2 & Acts 2 at times, with having the Holy Spirit poured out. We understand that He, (the Holy Spirit) was to uplift Christ +.
Do we think that one could have any more POWER than when Christ was right here as God, in their midst, & doing miracles, and having TRUE converted followers accept Him AS GOD?

Yet, we too are having the showers of the latter rain today! See Acts 3:19. And what are most people in the House of God doing while the door of probation is still open? See 1 Peter 4:17, (Lev. 16:14) then what happens after this judgement? The probationary door closes.

---John

[Whitehorse]

Ollie, that was so beautifully said. Thank you.

John, I like the parable you selelcted with the oil. Our works testify to our persevereance. It would be a pretty dark light that had no works. As you say, Paul's argument about showing what we believe by what we do. And the last verses, I Peter 4 & Leviticus; it's very sweet because it adds purpose to our present sufferings. Kind of has a James 1 texture to it.

[John the Baptist]

Ollie, that was so beautifully said. Thank you.

John, I like the parable you selelcted with the oil. Our works testify to our persevereance. It would be a pretty dark light that had no works. As you say, Paul's argument about showing what we believe by what we do. And the last verses, I Peter 4 & Leviticus; it's very sweet because it adds purpose to our present sufferings. Kind of has a James 1 texture to it.
****

Hi, John here:
Are you into Psalms 77:13 any? Earthly & Heavenly Sanctuary.

It states in the Heb. 11:13th verse that these ones ALL died in FAITH. Your remark about loving works makes me think about people questioning them. (works)

And in Rom. 8:1 we see that there is NO CONDENMATION to those  who are in Christ Jesus. So just suppose that the ones that had slain the Lamb offering in Faith had refused to go to the Laver for washing, (Ex. 30:20 'that they die not' ?) 'believing' that Faith was enough?

---John

[Whitehorse]

Yeah, and I think that's so common, about the laver. It's somehow in the culture that serving the Lord is about inner joy and happiness, but what we find happiness in is inherent in the motive. If we're happy because we love the Lord and see His beauty, that's one thing. But if it's the happiness that comes from a lack of trouble, then that's not CHrist-centered at all. In this case, there would be no loving works and I think that's where so much of the church is at right now. Jesus said blessed are the persecuted, but it's sad because I'd like to see more willingness in the church. *sigh*  

[Corpus]

Just some thoughts on this parable from a favorite of mine, Father George Rutler:

Many of us have pulsing in our heads the Coleridge verses from the "Ancient Mariner" that are, or were until recent reforms in education wiped out learning, a staple of a child’s literary education. "The feast is set, the guests are met...." One can hear the merry din. Weddings are the great feasts of life, even if clergymen may not relish their multiple sequence in the parish calendar. Our Lord sees the whole world as a wedding. His last parable before consummating salvation on the cross was about the marriage of the king’s son (Matthew 21:45-22:14).
Some republicans (the small "r" kind) were confounded when the recent monarchical occasions of a royal funeral and golden jubilee drew millions of rapt observers. But the most ardent royalist admits that the messianic kingship is not of this world. Ask Pontius Pilate or the crowd Jesus shunned when they tried to make Him their kind of king in Galilee. The same Temple gathering that heard the parables of the two sons and the wicked husbandmen hears this from the lips of the Heavenly Bridegroom. By the testimony of St. Paul (Philippians 3), this man is the Once and Future King, and is still King when cloistered in the carpenter’s shop, a supernatural version of King Charles hiding in the oak at Boscobel.
This parable is added to the pair of warnings about Christ’s rejection by the Jews. It would be disloyal to the tribe not to feast, so even in the heaviest private sorrow, the public Jew will "anoint his head and wash his face that he appear not unto men to fast." Christ will raise that etiquette to the holiest pitch when He breaks bread in the upper room hours before sweating blood. Those first called, who violated protocol and decency by refusing to attend the wedding, will be replaced by those of lesser rank. So far the fellows listening in the cheaper seats are gloating at the Pharisees. But for their own obstinacy, they will be cast aside in favor of the lesser breeds without the law. At once the audience shares the unease of the Pharisees, for the Master has shifted into another gear, and they do not know where He is taking them. Those lesser breeds are all of us from China to Canada—and this includes Rome and Dublin. There is only one caste in God’s system, and it is the outcast. But raised in dignity, one man refuses to don the ceremonial garment and is cast out not by men but by God.
Jesus did not preach this parable on His way to suffering and death in order to give me a platform to rant about haberdashery. But dare I say that our Lord had an eye for clothes? Not always approvingly: He had strictures about broad phylacteries and long tassels. But He wore a seamless garment, which was a fine thing worth gambling for, and His first motion when He rose from the dead was to fold up His grave clothes neatly. Either He did it or an angel, but it evokes a sartorial mystery, stretching from Joseph’s colored coat to the white robes of the heavenly martyrs. Man is to present himself with dignity before the King, and that dignity is not of man’s making: "You have not chosen me, I have chosen you." To deny that is to be denied the feast.

[Whitehorse]

Wow. That is very beautifully written. Thank you!

[Whitehorse]

New Blather! I don't think all ministry ideas are from the Lord. Sometimes, they're things we want to do. If you've prayed your brains out, and you're still not sure, how do you know when a ministry idea is from the Lord, you, or it's just a really bad idea?

[ollie]

New Blather! I don't think all ministry ideas are from the Lord. Sometimes, they're things we want to do. If you've prayed your brains out, and you're still not sure, how do you know when a ministry idea is from the Lord, you, or it's just a really bad idea?

If one ministers according to how God wants it done, according to His revealed word, then one knows it is from the Lord and not a bad idea from man's mind.

[Whitehorse]

I've seen a lot of ministries that looked good fail, and I wonder: was it because the Lord had other plans for those people? I've seen very ungodly causes thrive and grow while godly causes seem to bear little fruit.

Even now I'm seeing false brothers do terrible damage to the unity of God's church. I see it all the time. But the godly seem to fall prey to these people again and again! It seems like no one wants what is true anymore. They shake hands with those who are so clearly not God's people, falling prey to their manipulation tactics so they can look good, and then they cut themselves off from the truth!

A pastor I know who is a godly and righteous man retired from his church because the parishioners didn't want the truth, they wanted a nice pat on the back, they wanted to feel good about going to church, then go home and live their worldly lives. So he retired, and here's the part that haunts me: he said that as a young man he wanted to bring life back into the spiritually dead churches in his community. They all have an appearance of doing the right thing, they have their traditions and mores, but in their hearts they don't love God above all. They're riddled with idols and they do not want to be turned from their idolotry. So that was his goal, and knowing that community as well as I do, his assessment was right on target. But he retired that way, saying all he had done with his life had born no fruit and it's because of deceptions that lead to apostacy. Sainst caring more about the person in front of them no matter what that person truly is about thatn the Lord they cannot see.

I feel everyone should do something for the Lord every day; edify at least one saint and try to snatch at least one stick from the fire. Godly knowledge that isn't spent for others rots. There's a scriptural admonition to do this, but I'm not seeing much of the true church left in the world, and what I do see is so easily subverted by false believers. Then I remember what the pastor said.

[Symphony]

Excelletn questions.  

On your first, WH, IMHO, to me, about the chosen, and the man cast out who had no garment, the only real difference is, we do not know.  God knows, but we do not.  And, the fact He came down, in the form of His Son, indicates that He's willing to look at it from our point of view.  God, then, is in the precarious position of, from the very beginning, knowing the rules to the game, knowing it's outcome, and Who's going to win, and yet playing it anyway.  Nothing can account for that in our--that is, the human--lexicon other than just the word "love".  He loves us.  Otherwise, why else would He play a game He already knows the outcome to?  

On knowing God's will in various ministry ideas.  Again, it's only one day at a time.  I agonize over my own entrepreneurial projects; but the true unfolding, from a human point of view, is still only one little baby steppy at a time--the next step.

You're a mountain climber?  Do you look at the whole mountain?  Nope, through my daily events, I've learned, or I'm learning(maybe), that I accomplish twice as much by simply going about them--not trying to "own" them.  It's human nature, the fallen nature, to ingest the entirety of an unfolding, before it has unfolded.  Before The Fall, things were not so, for the human.  He didn't even "know" he was naked.

So our "knowing" is what gets us into trouble.  And in our various ministry objectives, more often than not, they "fail".  The only ones which succeed are those, when looking back, you realize somehow are not "man-made".

Was God working through all the last 2000 years of agonized, bloody, recalcitrant and fractured church history?  It would be difficult to say.  But somehow on the individual trajectories, through all of that--the bald ambitions of so-called Christian devout men, the competing jealousies, the fruits of countless "evil hearts"--God's mysterious will is being won--but it's certainly not easy to see.

Obvious then, to be walking only "by faith", faith in Jesus Christ--like a trusting child with its parent, your hand in His, one moment at a time.  A trusting child isn't concerned about the morrow, and doesn't even know it exists.

Thank you.

[Whitehorse]

Yiu, I had some time to mull this one over, and what I decided was this: we can want something that is godly. Really godly. But that doesn't mean that's what God has us cut out for. I know lots of people who want to be Christian recording artists to glorify the Lord! Great, if they could sing.

Regarding the retired pastor, who knows what happened; there are a couple of possibilities. Maybe it was something he wanted and the Lord didn't have it in mind. Maybe God wanted him to do something else. Or, it could be that he didn't see the fruit of his labors so he thought there were none. The Bible says God's word never returns void. Famous missionary David Brainerd was said to have literally worked himself to death, lamenting that his work was bearing no fruit. But it was his death that really awakened people. They saw the Lord in his sacrifice, and many were saved after his death. If seeing is believing, we've got a problem.

Application: I intend to ask earnestly with all my heart that the Lord guide us in His ways for His purposes, that He puts us where He wants us to be, doing what He wants us to do. Would He deny such a request? Of course not. I know I'll always love where He puts us.