"Interesting" Verses

[Symphony]

Nehemiah 13:25:


"And I contended with them and cursed them and beat some of them and pulled out their hair..."


Ahem.  


     

[MalkyEL]

Actually the phrase is "plucked out their hair" [literal translation] which is referring to the beard or facial hair. It is a sign of mocking and scorn.

Isaiah 50:5 The Lord Jehovah has opened My ear and I did not rebel; I did not turn away backwards.
6 I gave My back to strikers, and My cheeks to pluckers; I did not hide My face from shame and spitting.
7 And the Lord Jehovah will help Me. On account of this I was not ashamed. On account of this I set My face like flint, and I know that I shall not be ashamed.

These verses are prophetic of Jesus - He had His beard plucked out when He was mocked and scorned at the time of His trial.

[Raphu]

Yes, that verse was about Nehimiah's response to the Israelite men marrying those not of the faith. Not the response we see today.

[JudgeNot]

Symph -
How about giving the entire verse in context along with the Jewish Law (which doesn't apply to me   ) so we know exactly where you're coming from.

It is an interesting verse.

Kind of like wearing sackcloth and throwing dust on one's self???

[Symphony]

Hmmm.   Some INTERESTING responses.


MalkyEl, mine is RSV, so it could be arguable as to which it is, their hair, or their beard.

But only that, Nehemiah beat them.  Hmmm.


Raphu?  A bit of sarcasm there--*...not the response we see today...* ??

Comparatively, we see the path our complacency has led to today.  Drastic times call for drastic measures?  But pulling out people's hair?  And beating them.  Hmmm.  I guess that would get a church into the newspapers.


JN--yep, context important, sorry for my laziness.  But I certainly don't see it as in the first person.  I mean, he's doing this to other people.

Of course, under Jewish law, measures were extreme--stoning--even for just picking up a stick, on Sabbath.

[Sower]

Of course, under Jewish law, measures were extreme--stoning--even for just picking up a stick, on Sabbath.

This has nothing to do with what Nehemiah did, which is to show righteous anger against sin, something which believers should do even today.

However, if you want to compare the Old and New Covenants, under the New Covenant, measures are even more extreme:

"He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life. And he that believeth not the Son, shall not see life; but the WRATH OF GOD abideth on him." (Jn. 3:36).

In this day of grace, the penalty for disbelieving God and rejecting Christ are far more severe, since the offer of eternal life is far more costly: "He that despised Moses Law died without mercy under two or three witnesses: OF HOW MUCH SORER [SEVERER] PUNISHMENT, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God and hath counted the blood of the covenant wherewith he was sanctified and unholy thing, and hath done despite [injury] to the Spirit of grace?" (Heb. 10:28,29).

Brethren, let us keep all things in perspective, and understand God's Word as it is meant to be understood -- not something for aimless discussion but for edification.

[Raphu]

Hmmm.   Some INTERESTING responses.


MalkyEl, mine is RSV, so it could be arguable as to which it is, their hair, or their beard.

But only that, Nehemiah beat them.  Hmmm.


Raphu?  A bit of sarcasm there--*...not the response we see today...* ??

Comparatively, we see the path our complacency has led to today.  Drastic times call for drastic measures?  But pulling out people's hair?  And beating them.  Hmmm.  I guess that would get a church into the newspapers.


JN--yep, context important, sorry for my laziness.  But I certainly don't see it as in the first person.  I mean, he's doing this to other people.

Of course, under Jewish law, measures were extreme--stoning--even for just picking up a stick, on Sabbath.

No sarcasm, at all. I loathe sarcasm in most of the so-called comedy of our time.
Most Christians today believe that they must stay with unbeliever spouses no matter what, except for adultry, but I don't believe that. A marriage put together by God is the only valid marriage, and Nehemiah conidered marriage to unbelievers as invalid and demanded that the Jewish men leave them immediately - no ceremony of divorce - not a valid marriage. Today, many people go against the will of God and marry unbelievers or make hasty judgments as young people and then feel bound by clergy to remain in horrible ungodly circumstances. In my opinion, and backed by the scriptures in 1 Corinthians concerning the unbeliever spouse, I don't believe Christians should remain bound to an unbeliever unless the unbeliever wants to stay and is not abusive. So many times I see that God did not put together a marriage, but people make mistakes by marrying unbelievers. "What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder", implies that God first put this together and the two were following closely the will of God concerning their union. I guess it would be a personal judgment call for a wife who was being beaten by an unbeliever husband whether or not he was "pleased to dwell with her". Should the wife then be willing to yield herself to sadism if that pleased her husband? I don't think so. Nehemiah seemed to think these men should leave immediately, and busted heads.

1 Corinthians 7:13  And the woman which hath an husband that believeth not, and if he be pleased to dwell with her, let her not leave him.
1 Corinthians 7:14  For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy.
1 Corinthians 7:15  But if the unbelieving depart, let him depart. A brother or a sister is not under bondage in such cases: but God hath called us to peace.

[MalkyEL]

Thank you, Raphu - you have made my day!!!!

I get so distressed with the constant parade of well meaning Christians who believe that divorce is the unforgiveable sin.
Thank you again for an interpretation of God's Word that confirms what He showed me a few years back.  Bless you!!!

Shalom, MalkyEL  

[Heidi]

I also agree. I lived with an unbelieving spouse. I told him that his physical abouse was unacceptable so he divorced me. I am now married to a born again Christian and marriage has been bliss!

[Raphu]

I also agree. I lived with an unbelieving spouse. I told him that his physical abouse was unacceptable so he divorced me. I am now married to a born again Christian and marriage has been bliss!

Hello Heidi, praise God for His provision for a way out for you! The Lord made your decision easy if the unbeliever left you. If you don't mind sharing, what would you have done if the unbelieveing huband insisted on no divorce and that he was a Christian despite his abusive behavior? So many other of these circumstances seem to not be as easily resolved, but go on in desperation.

[MalkyEL]

Hope you don't mind me interjecting a few thoughts  

First of all, true salvation is a heart issue - one in which a person pursue's a life of righteousness, having their minds renewed and transformed by the working power of the Holy Spirit.  If a person continues to abuse another person, what kind of fruit is being shown?  Jesus said that a corrupt tree cannot bring forth good fruit.  Something to think about.

Practically speaking, if a woman is in an abusive situation, whether her husband is a "christian" or not - she not only has the right, but an obligation to separate herself from that.  Subjecting oneself to destruction whether it be physical, mental, spiritual, or emotional is not what the Bible teaches.  We are called to "withdraw" from that kind of person.  

1 Tim 6:3 If anyone teaches otherwise, and does not consent to wholesome words (those of our Lord Jesus Christ), and to the doctrine according to godliness,
4 he is proud, knowing nothing. He is sick concerning doubts and arguments, from which comes envy, strife, evil speakings, evil suspicions,
5 meddling, of men whose minds have been corrupted and deprived of the truth, supposing that gain is godliness. Withdraw from such.
 
Most communities have safe houses for abused women.  The  church is not equipped for this unforturnately and offer little help or resolution - all too often women are brushed off and the behavior excused so they are left at the mercy of the world's system, or worse yet - "guilted" into staying in a relationship that will destroy them every way possible.

[Raphu]

Hope you don't mind me interjecting a few thoughts  

First of all, true salvation is a heart issue - one in which a person pursue's a life of righteousness, having their minds renewed and transformed by the working power of the Holy Spirit.  If a person continues to abuse another person, what kind of fruit is being shown?  Jesus said that a corrupt tree cannot bring forth good fruit.  Something to think about.

Practically speaking, if a woman is in an abusive situation, whether her husband is a "christian" or not - she not only has the right, but an obligation to separate herself from that.  Subjecting oneself to destruction whether it be physical, mental, spiritual, or emotional is not what the Bible teaches.  We are called to "withdraw" from that kind of person.  

1 Tim 6:3 If anyone teaches otherwise, and does not consent to wholesome words (those of our Lord Jesus Christ), and to the doctrine according to godliness,
4 he is proud, knowing nothing. He is sick concerning doubts and arguments, from which comes envy, strife, evil speakings, evil suspicions,
5 meddling, of men whose minds have been corrupted and deprived of the truth, supposing that gain is godliness. Withdraw from such.
 
Most communities have safe houses for abused women.  The  church is not equipped for this unforturnately and offer little help or resolution - all too often women are brushed off and the behavior excused so they are left at the mercy of the world's system, or worse yet - "guilted" into staying in a relationship that will destroy them every way possible.

Amen....

[ollie]

Some of us at times seem to pull our own hair out.  

[Raphu]

Ezra, chapter ten, also provides another witness about seperating from unbelievers that all the Israelites were to do.

[Trev]

I guess this is an intersting verse. What is the meaning of Isaiah 45:7
" I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things." ?
Is He actually creating evil?