Prideful and arrogant Christians

[Learning_disciple]

Ezekiel 21
26 Thus saith the Lord GOD; Remove the diadem, and take off the crown: this shall not be the same: exalt him that is low, and abase him that is high.

Daniel 4
37 Now I Nebuchadnezzar praise and extol and honour the King of heaven, all whose works are truth, and his ways judgment: and those that walk in pride he is able to abase.

Luke 14
11 For whosoever exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.

Is it wrong to ask God to abase someone who is very prideful and arrogant especially if they claim to be a Christian but don't truly know the Lord? I know such a person (don't we all?) who is thought very highly of by family and friends, but has a serious attitude problem
and looks down upon others. Although he goes to church (when he's not working that is. he's very covetous and puts his possessions before God) but it is mainly for
show and family. He judges others who don't have as much as he does and thinks because he has a nicer home and a better truck and car that some how makes him a better person. he judges people by what they have or don't have.
I don't know how to relate to someone like that because I never put much stock in personal possessions. not that I don't want nice things, but I don't cling to them or put them before people and relationships. this same person sees no problem being covetous, his dad, a self made preacher is almost the same way. very greedy and prideful. Not sure how to pray for them and wanted to ask if it would be wrong to ask the lord to abase them and make them see that being a Christian is more then having a good name in the community and having a lot of possessions.

[LMarsh]

Abase=to lower in dignity.

I had to look that up.  I knew the jist of the definition but needed the clarity.  Truly this person you know just sounds like most of the "worldly" people out there.  Most of the true Christians I have come to know don't cling to those things and don't look down on others for what they have or don't have.  Seems to me like since you've noticed it...your called to pray for him.  I will as well but it's Gods will whether he wants to abase the fellow or not.  I think as a fellow Christian you should pray for a renewing of his Spirit and fellowship with the Lord.  That his eyes be opened and his ears to be made to hear again.  
I find when I find myself personally asking the Lord to "bring a person down to where he should be" well, my pride or hurt is getting in the way.  
Maybe That's exactly what he needs and God will rebuke him.
But we our greatest commandment is to Love one another.  Show it to him in Your actions, Your speach and your prayers for him.
I'm certainly a newbie Christian myself and don't know much so if this doesn't make sense disregard the above.  
But I was led to answer you since, I have dealt with a prideful person in my own personal life and ended up discovering that the only difference I could make was instead of praying for the destruction of his pride (which was affecting my own joy for the Lord), I tried to be a good example (which I always fall short of) and prayed for him in love.
God answered my prayers and this person is a born again believer who God uses daily as an example to my children, myself and our neighbors.  

In His Love,
LMarsh

[Allinall]

Two things here I'd give counsel on:

1.  Is he saved?  If so, how does God see him?  How does God treat him, and what is God doing in his life?  "Why do you see the speck that is in your brother's eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye?  Or how can you say to your brother, 'Let me take the speck out of your eye,' when there is the log in your own eye?  You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your brother's eye." Matthew 7:3-5  Before you move to deal with him, in prayer, or otherwise, make sure your perceptions of his condition are clear.  Make sure the speck you see isn't blurried all up by the log in your eye.    If all is right...

2. "Brothers, if anyone is caught in any transgression, you who are spiritual should restore him in a spirit of gentleness. Keep watch on yourself, lest you too be tempted." Galatians 6:1  Tell him!  If he is in sin, which having a lofty opinion of yourself most certainly is, then show him his sin, through scripture, speaking that truth in love in a gentle spirit, always wary that you to can fall.

Hope this helps!  Pray is always good, and necessary.  Sometimes God wants us to "pray with boots on."  

[Willowbirch]

Thanks, LMarsh and Allinall!  

[Learning_disciple]

Abase=to lower in dignity.

I had to look that up.  I knew the jist of the definition but needed the clarity.  Truly this person you know just sounds like most of the "worldly" people out there.  Most of the true Christians I have come to know don't cling to those things and don't look down on others for what they have or don't have.  Seems to me like since you've noticed it...your called to pray for him.  I will as well but it's Gods will whether he wants to abase the fellow or not.  I think as a fellow Christian you should pray for a renewing of his Spirit and fellowship with the Lord.  That his eyes be opened and his ears to be made to hear again.  
I find when I find myself personally asking the Lord to "bring a person down to where he should be" well, my pride or hurt is getting in the way.  
Maybe That's exactly what he needs and God will rebuke him.
But we our greatest commandment is to Love one another.  Show it to him in Your actions, Your speach and your prayers for him.
I'm certainly a newbie Christian myself and don't know much so if this doesn't make sense disregard the above.  
But I was led to answer you since, I have dealt with a prideful person in my own personal life and ended up discovering that the only difference I could make was instead of praying for the destruction of his pride (which was affecting my own joy for the Lord), I tried to be a good example (which I always fall short of) and prayed for him in love.
God answered my prayers and this person is a born again believer who God uses daily as an example to my children, myself and our neighbors.  

In His Love,
LMarsh

Hi LMarsh,

  What you said was just what I needed to hear. Thank you for your insight. I truly believe he  doesn't know the Lord at all and knows he doesn't. I pray God will someday save him if it's His will for him to be saved. That is God's choice not ours. I pray he will turn and repent and seek Christ with his whole heart.

God
bless

[jive4005]

God HATES a prideful look... fact!

Deke

[C C]

   Prideful and arrogant Christians--that's a contradiction in terms!!!  I believe utterly from the bottom of my heart that Satan has quite a few of his servants running around claiming to be Christians JUST TO SPOIL THE LORD'S NAME!  They're everywhere too.  Just keep in mind, weat and tares.  I have a little rule of thumb . . .

"I can tell by your house and your car who your gods really are."  

[Tibby]

What he said

[ollie]

One cannot be prideful and arrogant and claim to be of Christ and His saving grace. They are of the flesh and not the fruits of the Spirit.

Ollie

[felix102]

I know how you feel. Many of us would like to humble people like that, but notice...there is no reason for you ask God to abase him. You already quoted why we shouldn't brother  

"For whosoever exalteth himself shall be abased"
These are Jesus's words and therefore we know for a fact that it will happen. No need to ask God to make it happen. He'll do it Himself.

"Thus saith the Lord GOD; Remove the diadem, and take off the crown: this shall not be the same: exalt him that is low, and abase him that is high."

The Lord God said and what God says WILL happen.


So whatever the person is doing, it is to his own fall -guareenteed by the word of God. In the meantime, we need to love the person and a genuine love is loving someone whose actions you profoundly hate. Jesus stilled loved the pharisees even though they were the epitome of hypocrits. Even though they killed Him, Jesus stilled loved them. You are a wise man brother, I know you can love those people still.

[joyunending]

All I see is a chance to be an example for this person and to pray that God would open their eyes and hearts to the wrong they are doing.
  A prideful heart will usually be seen and disreguarded by those around him.  I think the world knows what a true Christian is supposed to be, and would know that he is not one of them.
    If not, all we can do is pray that the love of things is replaced by the love of Him.... that's all we can do.
      Joy

[Willowbirch]

All I see is a chance to be an example for this person and to pray that God would open their eyes and hearts to the wrong they are doing.
  A prideful heart will usually be seen and disreguarded by those around him.  I think the world knows what a true Christian is supposed to be, and would know that he is not one of them.
    If not, all we can do is pray that the love of things is replaced by the love of Him.... that's all we can do.
      Joy

Amen, Joyunending!

[Shammu]

One cannot be prideful and arrogant and claim to be of Christ and His saving grace. They are of the flesh and not the fruits of the Spirit.

Ollie

I am meek and he (God) is strong....... I follow him.

[Whitehorse]

This is a good post: it's a very common problem. And there are few things harder to deal with than pride. It has been said (and I wish I could remember who said it) that pride is the one illness that makes everyone sick but the person who has it. I've seen it on every level-who hasn't. The straightforward kind, and the kinds that hide under other personality characteristics. What I do is, I hand it over to the Lord and let Him deal with it. He does a really, really good job.