Faith is mysticism?

[Tibby]

According to Websters online:

Main Entry: mys·ti·cism
Pronunciation: 'mis-t&-"si-z&m
Function: noun
Date: 1736
1 : the experience of mystical union or direct communion with ultimate reality reported by mystics
2 : the belief that direct knowledge of God, spiritual truth, or ultimate reality can be attained through subjective experience (as intuition or insight)
3 a : vague speculation : a belief without sound basis
   b : a theory postulating the possibility of direct and intuitive acquisition of ineffable knowledge or power

Check out the last 2. Thoughts?

[Ralph]

  Faith is not mysticism. Neither is it blind. It is based upon
what has actually taken place in time, and the faithful witness of those who saw, felt, heard, and testified to those things which we believe by the power of the Holy Spirit's
accompanying witness to the gospel message.
  Mysticism unbridled by Scripture will always end in idolatry
and blind faith is faith without any basis. The certainties of history known by a person are not formed by mystic perception, nor does a person's understanding of history rest upon blind belief of those historical facts.

[ebia]

According to Websters online:

Main Entry: mys·ti·cism
Pronunciation: 'mis-t&-"si-z&m
Function: noun
Date: 1736
1 : the experience of mystical union or direct communion with ultimate reality reported by mystics
2 : the belief that direct knowledge of God, spiritual truth, or ultimate reality can be attained through subjective experience (as intuition or insight)
3 a : vague speculation : a belief without sound basis
   b : a theory postulating the possibility of direct and intuitive acquisition of ineffable knowledge or power

Check out the last 2. Thoughts?

Did you mean faith in general, or specifically Christian faith?

[Tibby]

Take your pick. And tell how they(faith and mysticism) differ.

[ollie]

According to Websters online:

Main Entry: mys·ti·cism
Pronunciation: 'mis-t&-"si-z&m
Function: noun
Date: 1736
1 : the experience of mystical union or direct communion with ultimate reality reported by mystics
2 : the belief that direct knowledge of God, spiritual truth, or ultimate reality can be attained through subjective experience (as intuition or insight)
3 a : vague speculation : a belief without sound basis
   b : a theory postulating the possibility of direct and intuitive acquisition of ineffable knowledge or power

Check out the last 2. Thoughts?

To just get a more broader discerning of the question asked:

faith
Pronunciation: 'fAth
Function: noun
Inflected Form(s): plural faiths  /'fAths, sometimes 'fA[th]z/
Etymology: Middle English feith, from Old French feid, foi, from Latin fides; akin to Latin fidere to trust -- more at BIDE
Date: 13th century
1 a : allegiance to duty or a person : LOYALTY b (1) : fidelity to one's promises (2) : sincerity of intentions
2 a (1) : belief and trust in and loyalty to God (2) : belief in the traditional doctrines of a religion b (1) : firm belief in something for which there is no proof (2) : complete trust
3 : something that is believed especially with strong conviction; especially : a system of religious beliefs
synonym see BELIEF
- in faith : without doubt or question : VERILY  
 
 

[nChrist]

Oklahoma Howdy to All,

I voted "NO" and firmly believe that Faith in Jesus Christ has nothing to do with anything mystical. Further, I don't think there is an appropriate definition in any dictionary for the "Faith"  God's children have in the WAY, THE TRUTH, and THE LIFE.

I don't think it would be possible to write a sufficient definition for "Faith" that we have in Jesus Christ. It starts out with simple, childlike belief, but it grows and continually changes as the child of God matures, studies HIS WORD, seeks HIS Will, and fellowships with HIM. For these and other reasons, I believe it is impossible to define "Faith" as it relates to our Lord and Saviour. On one end of the spectrum is the definition of man, and on the other end of the spectrum is THE ULTIMATE TRUTH AND REALITY!

Love In Christ,
Tom

[Petro]

While Websters, may give one of the definitions of   the word;

"mystical"

"spiritually significant or symbolic"

It has nothing to do with, Christian Theology or Doctrine, but everything to do with the Occultic.

Its best definition is that when defining mystic (mysterious, secret, occult) or mysticism

"The doctrine that knowledge of spiritual truths can be acquired by intuition and meditation."

The only word which would be considered as associated with the Christian Faith, of the two in the above definition is the word "meditation."

However, meditation no matter how deeply practiced is useless in so much matters, as it pertains to gaining insight into spiritual truths.

Because all meditation really is, is;

"To think deeply, to plan or intend."

And no one can understand spiritual truths, unless they possess the Spirit that raised Jesus from the dead.



Blessings,

Petro

[Tibby]

Petro, that has to be the shortest post you have ever written I actually bothered to read the whole thing for a change. lol j/k I love ya, bro! Ok, ok, for real.

You are seeing to much into the word. You are adding your own connotation to it. Listen:

Hebrews 11:1- Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

Faith is trusting completely in God. We belief by doing one thing, God will do such and such. Faith is believing when there is no proof of it. "A belief without sound basis."

[ollie]

Oklahoma Howdy to All,

I voted "NO" and firmly believe that Faith in Jesus Christ has nothing to do with anything mystical. Further, I don't think there is an appropriate definition in any dictionary for the "Faith"  God's children have in the WAY, THE TRUTH, and THE LIFE.

I don't think it would be possible to write a sufficient definition for "Faith" that we have in Jesus Christ. It starts out with simple, childlike belief, but it grows and continually changes as the child of God matures, studies HIS WORD, seeks HIS Will, and fellowships with HIM. For these and other reasons, I believe it is impossible to define "Faith" as it relates to our Lord and Saviour. On one end of the spectrum is the definition of man, and on the other end of the spectrum is THE ULTIMATE TRUTH AND REALITY!

Love In Christ,
Tom

A post with good thoughts.
However study of God's word can reveal the definition of faith as it is intended by Him.

Thanks for your thoughts on this,
Ollie

[Petro]

Petro, that has to be the shortest post you have ever written I actually bothered to read the whole thing for a change. lol j/k I love ya, bro! Ok, ok, for real.

You are seeing to much into the word. You are adding your own connotation to it. Listen:

Hebrews 11:1- Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

Faith is trusting completely in God. We belief by doing one thing, God will do such and such. Faith is believing when there is no proof of it. "A belief without sound basis."

Here lets look at the passage;

Heb 11
11:1  Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
2  For by it the elders obtained a good report.
3  Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.
4  By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh.
5  By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.
6  But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, .............


Faith is the (tangible) substance of things hoped for.....by it is understood the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.

To understand something is to gain or possess  knowledge; so it can simply be said,

Faith is the substance of knowledge.............

If one says Faith is acquired through subjective experience or mysticism.

The  teaching then,  that knowledge is acquired through or by intuition (unconsicous reasoning) or meditation (deep thinking)
makes the word of God of no effect, because FAITH is not then acquired from God through GRACE but, through something one does or does not do, dependiung how one looks at it, since it purely subjective..

Don't kid yourself, just because webster's use words like faith, communion, spiritual truth, symbolic, and so on, they do not mean the same thing, as defined by the Christian.


Blessings,

Petro

[ollie]

"Don't kid yourself, just because webster's use words like faith, communion, spiritual truth, symbolic, and so on, they do not mean the same thing, as defined by the Christian"

As defined by the word of God for mankind, Christian, not Christian.

[ollie]

"The  teaching then,  that knowledge is acquired through or by intuition (unconsicous reasoning) or meditation (deep thinking)
makes the word of God of no effect, because FAITH is not then acquired from God through GRACE but, through something one does or does not do, dependiung how one looks at it, since it purely subjective.."

Faith is not acquired through grace, but by grace one is saved through faith.


Ephesians 2:8.  For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

[Petro]

"The  teaching then,  that knowledge is acquired through or by intuition (unconsicous reasoning) or meditation (deep thinking)
makes the word of God of no effect, because FAITH is not then acquired from God through GRACE but, through something one does or does not do, dependiung how one looks at it, since it purely subjective.."

Faith is not acquired through grace, but by grace one is saved through faith.


Ephesians 2:8.  For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

I am aware of this teaching which twists the truth of the Word, that faith is NOT given by the grace of God, resulting in  Faith being mans work, however this is interpreted by those who tewst the Word to allow something that they can contribute towards their salvation, so then they teach faith is something that they produced, and not something that weas produced by Gods GRACE.

Of course when questioned they focus on Gods GRACE, providing the gift of salvation, leaving the issue of faith as a product of mans own contribution.

Some as you have heard herein, would go even further to teach that one must first be saved, in order to receive faith to believe.


Unfortunately, Faith is the product of Gods drawing the sinner by GRACE to  himself by His words, the pure word of God accomplishes His purposes, it is the word that causes the deaf to hear, and the blind to see, and the ignorant to understand, and God who knows the heart of men, gives more  to them that hear, and those that do not, even what they have, is taken away from them.

This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.  (Jhn 6:29)


The Grace of God, will produce FAITH in him that hears; this why the word exhorts one to take heed how, he hears, and what he hears since;  with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you:
(Mk 4:23-25)

The great truth, everyone who comes to God trusting His Word which must be seen, is that no one can do anything unless it is  given to them from above, and it is clear that whosoever comes to God must believe Him, and



that HE is rewarder of them that diligently seek HIM..

Heb 11
6  But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.
8  By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went.

Rom 4
3  For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God,






and it was counted unto him for righteousness.


Search the scriptures and in them you think you have eternal life but they are they which testify of me, and you won't come to me to have eternal life. Jhn 5:39

It is supremely important how you hear, and what you hear..


Blessings,

Petro

[Willowbirch]

Hebrews 11:1- Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

Faith is trusting completely in God. We belief by doing one thing, God will do such and such. Faith is believing when there is no proof of it. "A belief without sound basis."

I fail to see where the "unbased" nature of faith comes from; faith is the sunstance of things hoped for, evidence of things not seen. Evidene and substance, two very solid things. Yes, it requires complete dependency on God when we honestly can't see a thing. But is this dependency based on a foggy idea that "maybe" God will provide, fulfill, act? When we step out in faith, we are abandoning are false, "unbased" knowledge and instinct. Comments?

[ollie]

God through His Spirit inspired writer of Hebrews says this about faith:


 Hebrews 11:6.  But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.