Hey early I think you should have just stuck with the second question.    It says the same thing in a lot less words.


God bless,
Jason

but I understand perfectly what the teachings delineate,................. you don't..  and I wouldn't describe myself a staunch Calvinist.

You really make me laugh sometimes.  You aren't a staunch calvinist yet you defend it as if it were the end all be all.  

Whatever, you and many Calvinist's don't truly understand sovereignty.  Just because someone has total control does not mean they have to exercise total control and then can change when they want.  Calvinism also places the boundries of time on God constantly moaning about "before the foundation of the world" yet God is not limited by time seeing as to Him things are, were, and going to be all at the same time.  We are "with God now, not born, serving Him now."  mind boggling to say the least and I don't even try to comprehend it because it makes my head hurt.  

When you realize this things become much clearer.  It's really impossible for us to understand the concept of knowing everything at once.  Also from what I've heard calvinists believe in man's responcability and God's sovereignty at the same time.  Oh, ok that makes sense and still keeps in line with Calvinism.

Just think, did it ever occur to you that nothing occurs to God?

God bless,
Jason

[I rather consider myself a Biblicist]

While I agree with the Armenian concept of free-will (per se), I don't consider myself a hybrid Calvarmenist (   )!  I rather consider myself a Biblicist.

   YAY!!

I.E. "those that follow God"

The point I'm verbosely attempting to make is this:  God said it.  It cannot be explained adequately away with blanket statements

I thought we were close to the same page.  

God bless,
Jason

Oh I get it now, YOU have all the answers instead.

Please

Well until I have some better experiences it remains unchanged.  I still don't agree with them anyway, and that's not going to change.  I'm not getting in to a huge debate because it proves fruitless time and again.  I already seriously disagree with your entire stance of the bible and other such matters.  We have gone at it before and I really don't feel like going at it again.  Not that I am trying to toss your age in to "disqualify" you or anything but 15-16 years is not so long and someday you just might find yourself changing the tune of "all my life".  You haven't left home to be on your own and do other things yet so your "people" experience should grow greatly.  I'm not saying this to be mean but rather when you see more you may not say the same thing.

I didn't tell you to go away or that I wouldn't EVER answer your question.  I'd have to say from you answer and spelling of Christian as xtians and wording of things you aren't.  I should just make you read my post again but that seems like it would be a waste of time.  Instead let me enlightne you a bit since you so easily fly off the handle.  I said and I quote
"I will not waste the time until you have an understanding of where you currently stand."

You first need to know this pertinent information.  I'm not going to try and teach someone algebra before they can even add and subtract.  If you are yet unsaved and don't know Jesus as your Lord and saviour then this needs to be taken care of first.  You need to first see that you like everyone is a sinner.

So I did not abandon you as you claimed.  I needed to know where rather I need to know whaere you are so that I can get started.  I don't waste time in the evolution vs creation debate either.  You are asking spiritual questions that need to be spiritually discerned.
1Co 2:14
But the natural man receiveth not the
things of the Spirit of God: for they are
foolishness unto him: neither can he
know them, because they are spiritually
discerned.

I am only following the bible.  I tried it other ways but of course God being perfect and knowing all his plan and way is the only way.  

So then, if you wouldn't mind, could you answer the question?

think of it as a placement test.

God bless, (oh yes this is something I do to all because I am told to even bless those that curse me.  This I might add can be quite hard yet I do it anyway.  There is no greater a blessing a man can give then to ask God to bless him.

Jason

It sounds like it's from a JW site.  The translation is wrong and they are all messed up in their beliefs.  There is SO much more to "everlasting life" then revalations.  In fact Rev. would be the last place I would go to for that one, meaning because it both is the end of the bible it would be a last reffernce.

Are you a JW or thinking about converting to being one?

I will not break my covenant, nor alter ANYTHING that has gone forth out of my lips! Psalm 89:34

So then this next quote here, does this make God a liar?

Zec 11:10
And I took my staff, even Beauty, and cut it asunder, that I might break my covenant which I had made with all the people.
Zec 11:11
And it was broken in that day: and so the poor of the flock that waited upon me knew that it was the word of the LORD.

The answer was to the latter, no God is not unfair.  

I must first ask this question.  Are you a believer?
If you are I will find the scripture for you.  

However if you are not a believer I will not waste the time until you have an understanding of where you currently stand.  It is a waste of time to debate what you think is fair or not if you do not even believe in Jesus Christ as your personal Lord and saviour.  

God bless,
Jason

Oh yeah I forgot along with my experiences the calvinst trusts in his tongue and not his heart.  Meaning that they believe I said it, so now it's so.  They often times have no problem sinning willfully and caring little, while rebuking those that do the same as them simply because they have not said they believe in Jesus.  I know a whole family of that brand and it makes me sick.

This arguement is so old and silly.  You have people who believe in Calvin, people who believe in Arminius and then people who believe in God.  I find it most amusing that some people think you can be either arminian or clavinist when neither are totally correct.  I have more and more problems with calvinists the more I meet them.  They are usually cowards to do what God wants them to do hiding behind the "if God wants to save them or dod this he will, I can't do anything to change that."  Hence making them sit on their lazy butts allowing something to go wrong or allow something ungodly happen because they don't want to step in.

For instance a child would be better off with his father but seeing how the courts work today the father has to jump through hoops and such to gain custody over the mother.  a family member of the mother agree's that the mother is living a wretched way and the father should have custody.  The family member now a coward to the reaction of his family members refuses to testify that this is so.  The father now has nothing quite so solid for proof and does not gain custody.

This is typical of 90% of the calvinists I have met.  I haven't personally met any arminians to my knowledge but I already know what's wrong with them anyway.  They are a prideful foolish bunch who trust in themselves and not God.  They are also very legalistic and ignorant to the many things written in the Word.

The rest of those that actually follow the LORD and His Word are always the "best of both worlds" having a much better and deeper understanding.  From what I've seen sower and some others are in the right on this subject.

God bless,
Jason

God bless,
Jason

No, because anything God has done or will do is fair.  I don't remember the passages at the moment but there are some that would answer your question.

Hey allinall I think you got it pretty good there too.  I don't follow either teaching because they are both wrong.  There are things we cannot explain but just need to have faith in.  I trust in the LORD and His plans.  I know He knows what He's doing and that's all I need to know.  So far from my experience the more I see people that hold to one particular teaching the more the aggrivate me with there misconceptions.  Calvinists always hide from doing what they should because "If it was meant to be it will be be" and never do what they need to.  They always hide from doing what they don't want to with that.  I haven't had too many encounters with Arminians so I don't have as much experience with them but from what I have read about them annoys me a lot as well.

Well at least the site is back.  I gave up checking back but now it's here again.  I can't believe some people alrady have 200+ posts.  So much for my 600+ posts.  Time to start over.  I guess we can call it spring cleaning.

God bless,
Jason