I think there's more to the tattoo scriptures than we think there is.
John

I agree with that. 

Leviticus 19:28  "Do not cut your bodies for the dead or put tattoo marks on yourselves.  I am the Lord."  Correct me if I am wrong, but pagans of the time would cut or tattoo themselves as a form of worship to their gods.  I think it is more likely God was saying "Don't copy this specifically because it is a form of idol worship."

Meanwhile the scriptures from 1 Corinthians are rather taken out of context; 3:16-17 is talking about a temple we form as a group, not the temple which is our body.  While 6:19-20 is in fact talking about the temple which is our body, it is referring to  destruction from sexual promiscuity.

As for Romans 8:8-11, I really don't understand what that has to do with tattoos, unless we're trying to connect tattoos with being controlled by a sinful nature, which I don't find the scripture to support that. 

The thought that troubles me the most is that some Christians will accept a theory of man over the Word of God.

Echo that!  =-)

Since I'm the product of public schools, I know my faith was very much damaged because I had evolution hammered into my brain for so many years.  Not only evolution, but also stuff about how the Earth is billions of years old, the big bang theory, etc. etc. etc.  I needed God to erase all that stuff before I could really accept the Bible.  Not only the first two chapters of Genesis, but all of the Bible.  When I was able to ignore one part of the Bible, it was easy to ignore anything else that did not settle with me. 

I heard this story on the radio today, but the only news article I could find is kinda pathetic. Hopefully I'll be able to find something that has more detail, but for now; http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/03/14/national/main1398309.shtml

It is about the mother of Zacarias Moussaoui (guy currently being charged with the WTC bombing). She asked for a meeting with some of the 9/11 victim's families so she could meet them...
 

I understand what you are saying. Let me clarify. The wife of a mans father = HIS MOTHER. You hit on the one sin that is worse than homoperversion. In corinthians he probably just slept with his step-mother. iiiig gross

No, that's missing the point entirely.  I guess I was giving you too much credit when I thought you were referring to Leviticus in the first post.  Never mind. 

More on Pastor Ghorban Tourani;

How he became a christian: http://www.persecution.com/news/index.cfm?action=fullstory&newsID=344

More detail on his murder (WARNING! kinda graphic, but worth it to see his wife's response): http://www.persecution.com/news/index.cfm?action=fullstory&newsID=345

howdy folks
new here.

now that we have a supreme court that we want...it is only a matter of time before abortion and homoperversion will be made illegal. My question is what penalties should we attach to these crimes. I advocate death. I was wondering what you folks think. thanks for sharing

Would I be correct in saying this is in reference to Levitcus, chapter 20? (specifically verse 13)  

I think we have to ask ourselves; would God have us keep the same punishments today?  

When I look at Leviticus 20:10, "If a man commits aldutery with another man's wife-- with the wife of his neighbor-- both the aldulterer and the adulteress must be put to death,"  I am reminded of John 8:1-11 (the story of  the alduteress, when Jesus said, "let he who is without sin cast the first stone")

Also, there is Leviticus 20:11, "If a man sleeps with his father's wife, he has dishonored his father.  Both the man and the woman must be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads."  However, in 1 Corinthians 5, a man caught in the same situation is simply to be expelled from the church.  

Please don't misinterpret me; I am not saying this is a contradiction.  I am saying we must keep in mind the context of Leviticus; God was speaking specifically to the Isreaelites as they were about to enter the promised land. If one of God's chosen people were to give into sin, it would be a great threat to the rest of the nation.  As it says, "A little yeast works through the whole batch of dough." 1 Corinthians 5:6, and, ""Do not defile yourselves in any of these ways, because this is how the nations that I am going to drive out before you have become defiled.  Even the land was defiled; so i punished it for its sin and the land vomited out its inhabitants.  But you must keep my decrees and my laws. The native-born and the aliens living among you must not do any of these detestable things, for all of these things were done by the people who lived in the land before you, and the land became defiled.  And if you defile the land, it will vomit you out as it vomited out the nations that were before you." Leviticus 18:24-28.

Hmmm....  I realize i'm not doing a very good job of explaining this   ... I can also see I'm leaving myself wide-open to misinterpretation, so I'm just going to stop before I get myself any deeper than I already am.  =-)  Hopefully someone else can explain what I am trying to say...

I'm sure many have read it already, but I wanted to post this article.  http://news.christiansunite.com/Religion_News/religion04123.shtml

Powerful, yes?  A great testament to God. 

On a positive note, has anyone ever heard about Stephen Benett?  http://www.sbministries.org/

I heard him as a guest on a radio show once when Brokeback Mountain came out.  =-)  I think it is a great testimony to the fact gays can change.

A bit of a story about gay churches, when I first moved here I was scoping the churches in the neighborhood for one to go to... I was planning on going to the closest church to me, but they didn't have what time they met on a sign, so I looked to see if they have a website.  Glad I looked, because it was a churh founded and run by the gay and lesbian community.   :oThat would have been a bit awkward for me. =-)

We know that in order for a gay person to change, they first must come to know God's love, just as it takes for any of us to change, so I can see why a church would want to show love and acceptance toward the gay community.  As Paul says, "If I speak in the toungues of men and angels, but have not love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal." Romans 13:1  However, i think too often people forget that love, while very important, needs to be in balance with truth, and also that there are times (such as in 1Corinthians 5) where we need to expel those among our fellowship who are unrepentant. 

Someone pointed out to me once, that the 18th chapter of Matthew speaks well to this very issue.  It speaks of forgiving the brother who sins against you not seven times, but seventy-seven times, but also of cutting off that which causes you to sin... 

[For out of the overflow of the heart the mouth speaks.]

  Your question is good, but I'm sure if you don't have a habitual problem of overdosing on complaints against pointless problems, then you probably are just human... and God doesn't expect us to be him, just to love him and all his will.

Now, wait a minute...  We are called to be perfect, aren't we?  As it says in Matthew 5:48, "Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly father is perfect."  I realize the Bible also tells us that no one is perfect, but that does not mean we are to give up on perfection.  I am not saying we should all strive to be perfectionists, but that we should always to remember to give everything up to God.  For example, if I were to say, "I complain sometimes, but that is because I am human, and God will forgive me as long as I love Him."  How arrogant I would be!  However, if I say, "I have complained at times and was wrong, please forgive me," then I will be forgiven. 

I am not speaking against lightsavour, or saying lightsavour is wrong in his/her thinking.  Indeed, I do not even know lightsavour so it would be foolish for me to think that.  My goal is simply to clarify on something that could possibly be taken out of context. 

As to the subject of complaining, as it says in Matthew 12:33-37, "Make a tree good and its fruit will be good, or make a tree bad and it's fruit will be bad, for a tree is recognized by its fruit.  You brood of vipers (the pharisees), how can you who are evil say anything good?  For out of the overflow of the heart the mouth speaks.  The good man brings good things stored up in him, and the evil man brings evil things out of the evil stored up in him.  But I tell you that men will have to give account on the day of judgment for every careless word they have spoken.  For by your words you will be acquitted, and by your words you will be condemned."

Words do in fact carry a lot of weight.  As Paul says in Romans 10:10, "For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth you confess and are saved." 

As sincereheart pointed out,

The antonym of complain is rejoice.
And you can't do one if you're doing the other.

And if we cannot rejoice, how can we confess God's love?

Even if we rejoice one day and encourage others in the spirit of God, what will happen when they see us complaining the next day?  Thus, "Every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit.  A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit."  Matthew 17:17-18, and "Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire."  Matthew 7:19

A bit of a question; I remember learning somewhere that Islam came from the line of Ishmael in Genesis 16.  I don't remember the source, but is that correct?  I am reminded of what the angel said to Hagar, ""You are now with child and you will have a son. You shall name him Ishmael, for the Lord has heard of your misery.  He will be a wild donkey of a man; his hand will be against everyone and everyone's hand against him, and he will live in hostility toward all his brothers." (16:11-12)

Forgive me if this is a bit off topic.    Though it does kind of speak as to why the Quar'an has the differences it does.

First of all, To Kill a Mockingbid by Harper Lee.  =-)  I'm sure most everyone's had to read it in High School, but I remember I hated it in high school.  I read it again a few years ago, though, and I loved it.  =-)  Harper Lee always maintained it was just a simple love story between a father and his children (which it is =-), but it is also very much about prejudice and standing for what is right, even if it means standing alone. 

Tolstoy's Anna Karenina is another good one, in my opinion.  It is a book about the sanctity of marriage and the destruction of adultery.  The book does not preach morals, but it certainly shows the consequences of sin.  The book is not all sadness though, there is also a message of goodness and hope.  =-)  Also by Tolstoy is a short story called "Where Love is, God is"  It's a really great story and you can read it right now with this link! -->http://news.christiansunite.com/Religion_News/religion04092.shtml

Dostoyevsky wrote a couple that I like; The Brothers Karamazov and The Idiot.  Crime and Punishment is also good.  =-)  It is difficult to say what it is I like about Dostoyevsky's work....  I guess it is the same sort of fascination I have with Ecclesiastes (Ecclesiastes is one of the first books I read in the Bible, and the one book which served as a launch-pad for my faith.)  Many people find Dostoyevsky depressing (just as Ecclesiastes can be depressing, I guess), but for some reason i do not.  Anyway, if there's anyone out there who reads Ecclesiates and finds themselves greatly encouraged by it (as I do), give Dostoyevsky a try.  =-)

Almost done, =-)  Les Miserables by Victor Hugo.  First of all, the current complete and unabridged version is almost 1500 pages, and that is the one to read.  =-)  The Bishiop of Digne is my favorite character. =-)

I enjoy poetry as well; Edna St. Vincent Millay, Sara Teasdale, Elinor Wylie, and Christina Rossetti are among my favorites.  I tend to like the simpler poetry rather than the complicated and long-winded stuff like Whitman.  =-)  No offense to Whitman fans.  =-)

At any rate, there's tons of stuff I can list, but I think these are my favorite of favorites.  =-)  Take care, everyone.

["We do not want you uninformed about the hardships we suffered in the province of Asia. We were under great pressure, far beyond our ability to endure, so that we despaired even of life. Indeed, in our hearts we felt the sentance of death. But this happened that we might not rely on ourselves but on God, who raises the dead. He has delivered us from such a deadly peril, and he will deliver us. On him we have set our hope that he will continue to deliver us, as you help us by your prayers. Then many will give thanks on our behalf for the gracious favor granted us in the prayers of many."]

Hello, everyone.  =-)  I'm calling in from Denver, Colorado.

One thing about me is I have cystic fibrosis, (anyone who doesn't know what that is go here:  www.cff.org or you can ask me questions; either way)  Living with a terminal illness can be a great impediment to faith, as I have seen with many others, but it can also be a great help as well.  Like Paul said in 2 Corinthians 1:8-10:  "We do not want you uninformed about the hardships we suffered in the province of Asia.  We were under great pressure, far beyond our ability to endure, so that we despaired even of life.  Indeed, in our hearts we felt the sentance of death.  But this happened that we might not rely on ourselves but on God, who raises the dead.  He has delivered us from such a deadly peril, and he will deliver us.  On him we have set our hope that he will continue to deliver us, as you help us by your prayers.  Then many will give thanks on our behalf for the gracious favor granted us in the prayers of many."

I like to equate myself to this verse because it takes the focus off of me and back on God.  I dislike when people say I am strong to be living with an illness, or that I have great faith or whatever else.  As humans we are all alike, and we are all capable of  strength or faith or whatever else because they come from God, not oursleves.  =-)

In my own experience, it is often detrimental to tell someone they are strong or have great faith, because i know that led me to pride and the belief that i had been able to overcome many things without God's help. 

Anyway, enough serious stuff.  =-)  I look forward to meeting all of you and learning many new things.  =-)

Oh, and my real name is Jarod, in case anyone wanted to know.  =-)