There is much already written here on the forum about this that you can find in the Bible Study area under Biblical Creation vs. Evolution. (This is not a debatable subject on this forum.)

I'll take a look. There's a lot of threads I'm interested in.  I think that the issue of natural selection is a different issue than the age of the earth.  To my reading, the Bible doesn't give us the age of the earth but does tell us how creation occurred.

I am not sure that I am going to take a man reading the Bible with a calculator and adding up the years in it overly seriously -- in other words I don't hold to the young earth theory as a Biblical truth.  The Bible uses numbers symbolically very often and to me the mechanisms and laws God used to create and maintain all things are left largely undescribed in the Bible.  A scientist once said that "The simplest model of the universe is the universe." Every other model leaves something out . . .

Remember the "missing link?"  That is a serious scientific argument.  Paleontologists don't find one species gradually becoming another species in the fossil record.  It's not there. The pictures they make of one thing slowly becoming another thing are not accurate -- the links between picture 1 and picture 2 and picture 3, etc., are missing. Dawkins and the like, supporters of natural selection, have had to respond to this lack of fossil proof (they make up an unproven story of a species being trapped in a small area, becoming a different species, and then suddenly spreading -- all without proof -- they haven't found the bones in that small area).  I believe a type of natural selection has been "proven" within species  -- we see chihuahuas that have been bred down originally from wolves, probably by man, so incredible change in creatures is possible within God's plan.  But the idea that the species line has been jumped by natural selection is unproven and seems to have strong evidence against it if the bones are any indication.

As far as politics goes, we do not want to back the politicians we support into unnecessarily declaring their position on non-political issues if it hurts their ability to be elected.  The bulk of the world has been trained that natural selection is an absolute truth, which is a ridiculous lie, even in scientific terms.  Nonetheless, we should help "our guys" win elections -- not force them to cast pearls before swine and be rended by the loss of an election.  And we should be "wise as serpents" in the political arena.  Flame away!

I enjoyed this thread very much.  My wife is a former Seventh Day Adventist with only good things to say about the Adventists and particularly the fellowship within the church.  We keep a Sunday sabbath. Since I am not sure it is a commandment that still applies, we sometimes fall away from it, and I feel the loss when we do.  One of the benefits of the sabbath for me is the other 6 days, and particularly Saturday, since I know the sabbath is coming I can keep going and keep working, since they are not the day of rest.  I tend to get more done when keeping the sabbath and I tend to feel closer to God.  I look at the sabbath as a gift and a reminder.

I am ashamed to say that once, when I was a very new Christian and didn't even really understand the basics of it, a neighbor asked for help on the sabbath, an older lady whose husband was ill, and she wanted her car washed . . . I was washing mine . . . and the sun was going down and sabbath as we keep it was approaching.  I said "Can I do it tommorrow" or some such.  Tommorrow came and they were out and it just fell away and I didn't help.  This was before I had read the whole Bible, but even then I should have known that we can to a certainty do good works on the sabbath.  Was very ashamed when I figured it out.

I am glad for this thread because I've always found Matthew 19 interesting, when the rich man approaches Jesus: 

Now a man came up to Jesus and asked, "Teacher, what good thing must I do to get eternal life?"  "Why do you ask me about what is good?" Jesus replied. "There is only One who is good. If you want to enter life, obey the commandments."

"Which ones?" the man inquired.

 Jesus replied, " 'Do not murder, do not commit adultery, do not steal, do not give false testimony, honor your father and mother, and 'love your neighbor as yourself.'"

"All these I have kept," the young man said. "What do I still lack?"

Jesus answered, "If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me."

When the young man heard this, he went away sad, because he had great wealth."

What I have found interesting about this is that Christ named only certain of the commandments and they did not include the sabbath.  All the others that he left out seem to me to fall within "love your neighbor as yourself" or the young man selling his possessions and following Christ (which is basically, to me, giving the 1st commandment to place God first and worship no other Gods).  So . . . we are left, I think, with Christ naming every commandment EXCEPT the sabbath.

I am curious as to your opinions on this.

I have an in-law that is Pentacostal and believes that she has the gift of interpreting tongues.  I have never attended her Church, my wife has and calls them "pew hoppers."  But I can't argue with the in-laws sincerity.  She goes on regular missions with the Campus Crusade for Christ and has been all over the world, has smuggled Bibles into China when they were barred, and has done some amazing things that most of us wouldn't have the funds for (and she's not rich) or the commitment to do.

My grandmother in Texas remarried a Mexican fellow, great old guy, who when I was a young boy used to tell my brother and I that we weren't really men unless we could eat hot peppers . . . and then he'd pull down a jar and eat them with us.  Haven't much liked overly hot food ever since . . . but I did win some bets at the National Jamboree in the Boy Scouts.  The Scouts trade patches, and I collected patch after patch eating from a jar of hot peppers.

I spoke to my pastor about it, and he said that a "good news" approach might help; he recommended listening to my co-worker and identify the needs and hurts he is dealing with and then presenting a gospel passage that addresses it. Guilt, loneliness, emptyness, needs, fear of death were the common ones he said, and that he's found emptyness to be a common feeling among substance abusers, so he recommended reciting or showing Matthew 11:28. "Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy and my burden is light."

1-800-417-7666. (English number) will direct you right to your Senators . . . please tell them you oppose this bill. The recording will be for the legislation (the pro-amnesty groups get a straight line into the Senators aides while the rest of us go to a comment line . . .)

People should be more upset that than they are (it was barely on the news last night) that they killed an amendment to the amnesty bill that would have barred giving legal residence to felons. In other words, 600,000 felons who are currently illegal and could be deported will be given the right to remain in the country legally. They did pass Kennedy’s amendment that will bar sexual offenders from residence . . . which he put in to kill the stricter amendment barring all felons . . . but the Senate then voted to allow murderers, armed robbers, credit card fraudsters (which is how a lot of the Muslim terrorists fund themselves), and all other felons to be given the Z visa and stay. Here in Florida, where I live, we will probably get over 10% of them . . . over 60,000 new criminals to legally walk our streets with full rights when they get out of jail. It’s horrible to think about but they will be walking the same streets as my daughter.

It shows that even Christians can have fun and some great fellowship in the Lord.

I've found great fellowship as a Christian, many, many more friends than before . . . and what would have surprised me before becoming a Christian, much more openness about themselves, including sins, than among non-Christians.  A non-Christian will tell you about their triumphs easily (whether sinful or not) but Christians will tell about their failures as well . . . and not for pity but for the right reasons . . . which can create a very different and a much closer relationship. I expected the reverse, with everyone pretending to be holy and better than me.  Didn't happen.  I told a little story in a small group about a small thing I had done wrong.  The leader of the group told me about something he did in the same way, much much "worse" and frankly embarrassing.  Didn't phase him or the group a bit and helped me a lot. Lots of us clam up and keep our own council as Christians as well . . . but . . . I've been surprised by the openness and fellowship in the community. Not that this has much to do with fried chicken.

Maryjane, I did not undertand this: "Assurance is veiwed as Insurance and it is so sad to see the children that come out of these marriages..."

What does it mean?

Greg
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Well, I traded books with a new Christian at work, who was brought back to Christ in part by watching Joel Osteen on TV.  I gave him The Purpose Driven Life and he gave me one of Osteen's books.  I haven't gone very far in the book, but so far it is much more standard self help than Christian.

I saw in one of the posts above that Osteen doesn't have a cross in his church, but I don't think that means much.  His website says in its statement of faith:

WE BELIEVE…Jesus died on the cross and shed His blood for our sins. We believe that salvation is found by placing our faith in what Jesus did for us on the cross. We believe Jesus rose from the dead and is coming again.

Whether he preaches this I don't know.

I do think that prosperity gospel, insofar as it promises material things to a believing Christian, is false.  It may be God's will, it may not be, to give us wealth or health but it to a certainty not assured no matter how strong your faith is.  The books of Job and Jeremiah can't be understood as indicating that we Christians, if our faith is strong enough, will be provided wealth or protected from harm in this world and made happy. I've heard that history and ancient church documents indicate that all of the apostles other than John were martyred. They were rich men.  I hope that those that listen to Osteen understand why.

Joy is promised us and provided abundantly to the believer.  Happiness, wealth, and health, dependent on circumstances is not.

Consider it pure joy, my brothers, whenever you face trials of many kinds, because you know that the testing of your faith develops perseverance.  Perseverance must finish its work so that you may be mature and complete, not lacking anything. James 1:2-4

And of course I fully agree that all verses should be taken in context. We are not an ascetic religion, however.  The Song of Solomon also makes clear that our love and passion for each other in marriage can be favored by God.  The balance is the important thing, and putting God first in our lives, regardless of the pleasures in life that he has granted us.

[original]

I can't believe this debate has the most pages of posts, except for the "once saved always saved thread."  Ridiculous!  The answer is obviously ORIGINAL.  What recipe built the great franchise? ORIGINAL.  What recipe is crispy, yet doesn't leave slight abrasions in the roof of your mouth like pizza with garlic salt sometimes does? ORIGINAL. Finally, my fellow Christians, the very word "ORIGINAL" appears in the Good Book itself, yet the word "Crispy" does not.

2 Chronicles 24:13 NIV
The men in charge of the work were diligent, and the repairs progressed under them. They rebuilt the temple of God according to its original design and reinforced it.

Good Cub, Boy and Girl Scout programs also seem to attract families . . .

I agreed with everything said above in response to my post by Roger and Blackeyedpeas except for one statement I think: 1) "Marry young because of the physical demands of ones body" is not a Biblical value. I cite again 1 Corinthians 7:9 "But if they cannot control themselves, they should marry, for it is better to marry than to burn with passion."  I think in this matter, the word of God trumps the view that sexual desire is irrelevant to the decision to marry -- that somehow all Christians can or should be above all sexual passion and the demands of the body -- and I think it no accident that God has created us with that passion strongest in the man in his youth, and for the women she is most able to bear children safely and healthily when the natural consequence of this passion results in a child.  also believe that a young Christian gains a great benefit from dating, in youth, with an eye to marriage and a more serious attitude than the non-believer.

"The Christian ideal has not been tried and found wanting; it has been found difficult and left untried."

G.K. Chesterton, Chapter 5, What's Wrong With The World, 1910