Then explain Acts 2 to me please.

I'm sorry, I honestly do not understand what your getting at. Could you please explain in your own words what you mean.

So its ok to have sex even tough I'm not married?

A quick question for you Roger. When someone "looses" their salvation, what exactly are we talking about here? Because we can either be talking about...

A. When a Christian sins, that sin separates them from obtaining Heaven. BUT, if they repent, they will be able to enter Heaven. By this way, their salvation is still offered after sinning, or rather, they have the chance to always come back, but only if they repent. And if they don’t repent, what does their salvation really mean since they will not enter Heaven.

B. When a Christian sins, their salvation is lost completely, in the sense that once they sin, there is no going back to God whatsoever.

Because I don’t mean to say that part B is true at all, but the fact that a Christian can fall away and be cast down into Hell if they are found with sin. But if they repent, they can enter Heaven.

Justin Moore
Jookie Jervin Eggers

     For one, sorry about the link thing, must have missed that in the agreement. Point two, let me clear up/restate some things.

     The main point of my message was the fact of baptism being essential in ones salvation. I was bringing this forward in the case that someone "not saved" could read anyone of these posts and think to them self, "all I have to do is believe," which in that case, they are not saved at all, but are given the disillusion that they are.

     I am not doing this to bring up arguments, in truth; I hate arguments because that means there are different interpretations of God's word. And if there is a different interpretation, that means someone has either been taught wrong, has not read enough, or is deliberately teaching false doctrine. 2 Peter 1:20-21 tells us this:

"But know this first of all, that no prophecy of Scripture is a matter of one's own interpretation, for no prophecy was ever made by an act of human will, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God."

     I bring strictly Bible, I teach only Bible, and I rebuke and edify with Bible only. I place no thoughts or opinions in anything that has anything to do with God. And if I do not know something, I will say so, and study up on it.
     Now I will admit this, the post, as said was for baptism, but I continued to rant on without giving full explanation of the "perfect" Christian. In no way, shape, or form would I say that a Christian is not faced with sin. We all know that Christians are face with trials and temptations, which is obvious. But the point is that we have free will, and we have the power to choose whether we obey God, or give in to sin. When we came up out of the waters of baptism, we are fully washed of all sins and have become a new perfect person. The problem, one could say, is that we have free will to choose to sin or not. What sucks even more is that it takes just one sin, just one stinkin' sin to keep us from Heaven. What the sweet part is that we can repent. Repentance, a true Godly sorrow, can save us from hell, which also takes us back to the point of being perfect, because without sin, we are perfect beings.

He commands us to be perfect - Matthew 5:48

"Therefore you are to be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect."

And God commanded us not to sin - 1 Corinthians 15:33-34:

"Be not deceived: evil communications corrupt good manners. Awake to righteousness and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame."

But God always gives us a way out of temptation - 1 Corinthians 10:13

"No temptation has overtaken you but such as is common to man; and God is faithful, who will not allow you to be tempted beyond what you are able, but with the temptation will provide the way of escape also, so that you will be able to endure it."

     So to answer the one question, "have I sinned?" Yes, but I have repented and no longer plan to ever do the things I did again.
     But I do have a question for you. Could you please explain the difference between our reward as Christians and our salvation?

Justin Moore
a.k.a Jookie Jervin Eggers

Oh, and before you start hating me for bringing the truth, Jesus already called it...
Matthew 10:22
"You will be hated by all because of My name, but it is the one who has endured to the end who will be saved."

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You must be careful when reading. Just because you read something doesn’t mean that is the exact law, there is usually more. Yes, the bible talks about faith a lot, but you must read on and study everything. For example, many people believe that only 144,000 are going to make it to heaven because that is what Revelations 7:4-8 says, and it does seem that way UNTIL you read the very next verse. Revelations 7:9 says “After these things I looked, and behold, a great multitude which no one could number, of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, with palm branches in their hands,” This clearly shows that there is many, MANY more that will make it to heaven, so many that it is uncountable.
   Going back to the “ask and you shall receive salvation” thing…by what your saying, all someone would need to do is send up a prayer to God and anyone could be saved. But in John 9:31 it says “Now we know that God does NOT hear sinners; but if anyone is a worshipper of God and does His will, He hears him.” So anyone who is not baptized for the remission of sin is a sinner, because that is the only way to have sin completely cleared. And anyone who is a sinner cannot be heard by God. Which means saying a prayer for salvation is un-doctrinal and will not save anyone.
It also seems that you are saying that once we are saved we are always saved. If this was true, then I could sin everyday, all day, and I would still be guaranteed a spot in heaven. But in many books of the Bible there are accounts of people falling away, turning away from Christ, and are now on a one-way trip to hell unless they repent. In Galatians 1:6-7 Paul is writing to a church, not just to one person, but an entire church in Galatia and said “I marvel that you are turning away so soon from Him who called you in the grace of Christ, to a different gospel, which is not another; but there are some who trouble you and want to pervert the gospel of Christ.” Not to mention the 7 churches mentioned in Revelation and how most were doing something wrong. The church of Ephesus he wrote, “Nevertheless I have this against you, that you have left your first love. Remember therefore from where you have fallen; repent and do the first works, or else I will come to you quickly and remove your lamp stand from its place unless you repent.” That’s pretty blatant to me. You must remember that sin is the complete opposite of God and that it only takes one sin to make that separation. But we have the choice to repent and be forgiven, but also must remember that to truly repent we must have a Godly sorrow and to never do it again; for that is true repentance.
I also read on this forum that Christians aren't perfect but God helps us to become better; and promises that in the life to come we will be made perfect. If Christians are not perfect, then that means we sin, which does not make us Christians at all, but rather luke-warm Christians which He will spit us out of his mouth because of that. If we do not sin, follow God's word, then we are perfect in the Lord's eyes. For we have died to sin, so how can we live in something that is dead? In 1st Corinthians 6:11 "And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified, in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God."
Lastly I extend my hand in helping also. If you have any questions, please ask. Right now I’m sitting at a computer at the university that I attend and don’t have much to do at times. I hope you can understand my concern about some of these topics and pray we can meet on a common ground on these subjects. Thank you so much for your time and I hope to hear from you all soon.

Justin Moore
a.k.a Jookie Jervin Edgers



P.S. If ANYONE replies to this post they better have scripture ready because opinions don’t mean jack squat unless you have scripture to back it up.

Also, if you have any problems finding baptism verses, here are a few in two translations.
NASB
1 Peter 3:21
   Corresponding to that, baptism now saves you--not the removal of dirt from the flesh, but an appeal to God for a good conscience--through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,
Titus 3:5
  He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit,
1 Peter 1:3
   Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to His great mercy has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
Acts 22:16
   'Now why do you delay? Get up and be baptized, and wash away your sins, calling on His name.'
1 Corinthians 6:11
   Such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.
John 3:5
   Jesus answered, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

NKJV
1 Peter 3:21
   There is also an antitype which now saves us—baptism (not the removal of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God), through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,
Titus 3:5
   not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit,
1 Peter 1:3
   Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to His abundant mercy has begotten us again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
Acts 22:16
   And now why are you waiting? Arise and be baptized, and wash away your sins, calling on the name of the Lord.’
1 Corinthians 6:11
   And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God.
John 3:5
   Jesus answered, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.

Here are sin related issues

Romans 6:1-4
What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin that grace may abound? Certainly not! How shall we who died to sin live any longer in it? Or do you not know that as many of us as were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death? Therefore we were buried with Him through baptism into death, that just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

1 John 3:7-9
Little children, let no one deceive you. He who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous. He who sins is of the devil, for the devil has sinned from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that He might destroy the works of the devil. Whoever has been born of God does not sin, for His seed remains in him; and he cannot sin, because he has been born of God.

Matthew 7:21-23
Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!



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Hello all,
I just came across this forum and started reading various subjects. One that caught my eye was the topic of salvation. It did not take long for me to be disgusted at the complete disregard of scripture. Now I will admit, a lot of the posts were mostly correct, but not 100%. We all agree that Jesus Christ came into this world for a purpose - a purpose to die for us so that we may one day enter Heaven. We all agree that one must have faith, one must have belief, one must repent, one must confess, and one must stay faithful. But where in all these post does someone talk about baptism? Do you all just neglect your first love as Christians and toss his word aside so that you may tickle your ears and hearts with the doctrine that you want to teach and hear? It burns my heart to read that people are teaching, on a Christian forum, the sinner’s prayer! “I marvel that you are turning away so soon from Him who called you in the grace of Christ, to a different gospel, which is not another; but there are some who trouble you and want to pervert the gospel of Christ.”
   I also looked into this faith-only idea.  You are also correct about the importance of faith.  Faith is the foundational basis for all that we believe, and without faith everything we do is in vain.  And obviously the water of baptism is simply water, but it is our faith that God will do what he said he would do when we present ourselves to be baptized.  He tells us in Romans 6:3 that baptism connects us with the resurrection and the burial of Jesus Christ.  That is where we come into contact with the atoning blood of Jesus, and without that the sacrifice would have been futile.  Any study of the Old Testament sacrificial system will lead you to this (Which Galatians tells us was the schoolmaster to bring us to Jesus Christ, a big object lesson for us to understand what was done on the cross).  IF simply faith was enough, then Christ coming to earth and dieing on the cross was completely pointless.  
   Moses once held up a big bronze Snake and those who looked upon it were healed from their snake biting inflictions. If it was the bronze snake that healed them, then how come superstores aren’t making a profit on bronze snakes for snake bites? Shouldn’t everyone have one just incase someone gets bit?  Because the bronze snake had nothing to do with the healing; it was their faith that God would heal them when they looked upon it like he said they would.  This is the same way with baptism; the water is nothing, but 2 Peter 3:21 tells us that Baptism NOW saves you.  Not because of the cleansing of the water, but because of the faith that God will do what he has set out to do.
   Now I also believe that if I am going to believe God’s word, then I am going to believe 100% of it all. And if God can speak the world into existence and create everything that he did, I am sure he can find the right words to write down in a book. So that means whatever the bible says, that is what I am going to do. In Acts 2:36-38, Peter says “Therefore let all your house of Israel know assuredly that God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Christ.” Now when they heard this, they were cut to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, “Men and brethren, what shall we do?” Then Peter said to them “Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.” This says clearly that we are baptized FOR the remission of sins AND the gift of the Holy Spirit. Peter does NOT say that baptism is a good idea, he commanded it, and without it we don’t come in contact with the blood, we do not get our sins washed away and we will not receive the Holy Spirit. And do not forget Mark 16:16, “He who believes AND is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned.” The book of Acts is full of people getting baptized. Acts 8:12-13 has men, women and Simon being immersed. The eunuch in Acts 8:27-39 was immersed also. Also, if baptism is inessential, then what would have John the Baptists purpose in preaching about another baptism to come? So without baptism, how would we receive the Holy Spirit and have our sins washed away? There is no other way to gain the Holy Spirit and/or have your sins washed away unless you follow what is written down in the Bible.