DW,

I don't think the failure of this law to be enacted is so much "against christians" as it is about the failure of a bad law to pass.  The fundamentals of protecting the rights of Christians to not be forced into doing something that goes against our faith is obviously a fantastic idea, and its something everyone can get behind.  Unfortunately, in looking into the details of this particular effort, its pretty clear that it was not well conceived (pardon the pun).  If Those drung store counter staff who do not wish to provide birth control etc. ever want that right of refusal, they are going to have to find a better legal mind to but the law together.  This last attempt just had way too many problems.

Jimmy

PR,

Thanks for calling my faith into question.  So we're clear, I am absolutely a christian.  That being said, you and I probably disagree ona few political points.  I do find it interesting that you jump so quickly to villify me as a comunist just because I have some very serious doubts as to the reliability of this Obama birth-certificate issue, and the news agencies you tend to draw upon.  I was only tryign to make the point that there are those people in society that are simply never going to accept that Obama is a legit president, and they will always be able to find like-minded "media" to feed their theory.
In terms of me being a comunist, nothing could be further form the truth.  Oddly enough though, I would suggest to you that the U.S. with the nationalization of the banking and automotive sectors stands now to become a decidedly socialist nation, and all that happened under the watch of the guy you voted for.
It's a complicated time for labels at the very least

Jimmy

Pastor Roger,

I do see that you tend to cite the world net daily a lot, but your claim that the AP has been actively trying to hide a news story is not well founded.  As an organization, the source you seem to tout as being harbingers of the truth, is in fact far more likely to be misleading and biased than is the AP.  That much at least should be very clear to any media obvserver.  The convenient argument conspiracy theorists have to fall back on, is the lack of support in the mainstream media proves that they are left-wing propagandists.  Unfortunately, the sad truth is that in most cases, the mainstream media isn't reporting on wild conjecture, because it doesn't deserve reporting.

Jimmy

Pastor Roger,

I'm confused.  I just read this Associated Press story from October:

State declares Obama birth certificate genuine
Oct 31, 2008

HONOLULU (AP) — State officials say there's no doubt Barack Obama was born in Hawaii.

Health Department Director Dr. Chiyome Fukino said Friday she and the registrar of vital statistics, Alvin Onaka, have personally verified that the health department holds Obama's original birth certificate.

Fukino says that no state official, including Republican Gov. Linda Lingle, ever instructed that Obama's certificate be handled differently.

She says state law bars release of a certified birth certificate to anyone who does not have a tangible interest.

Some Obama critics claim he was not born in the US.

Earlier Friday, a southwest Ohio magistrate rejected a challenge to Obama's citizenship. Judges in Seattle and Philadelphia recently dismissed similar suits.


What's the deal? 

Jimmy

Hi all,

Haven't posted in a few years now, but with the election of Obama, I thought i would check back in, to see what the group was saying.  I have to say, I am a bit surprised.  As I recall, year's ago when members who were unhappy with President Bush made their views known, they were harshly rebuked with suggestions of ant-americanism.  It was said then, that supporting the President was the right thing to do for all Americans, regardless of political stripe.  Is it not your turn to do the same for the President elect?  It seems as though some folks here are a bit inconsistent.   Just an observation.

On another note, its good to be back!

Jimmy

hi all,

Thanks for all of the replies!  Although some of you don't really seem to be playing very nice...

PR: Many dictionaries include, as a definition for "co-opted" the following word usage: "To take or assume for one's own use; appropriate"  It seemed to me, that through a series of posts, the discussion topic moved away from the abismal approval ratings currently enjoyed by the Bush administration (if you beleive the numbers) into a rant about your usual list of talking points.  I was impressed with your collective ability to turn the thread around, and hence, used that particular term (quite appropriately I might add)  Perhaps you can call off the dogs now, if you wouldn't mind.

Cheers,

Jimmy

Very well co-opted boys.  my congrats to you all.

Hi all,

Cute question FC....

It certainly remains to be seen what kind of SCJ Miers will end up being. I think she really could go either way on a lot of different issues, which will both delight and terrify a few people, especialy here at CU...

cheers,

Jimmy

hi all,

DW:  How did I misinturpret "They do support taking Christianity out of the U.S. and replacing it with Islam."  I'm not sure how much more plainly something can be related, no matter how ridiculous the point.

PR:  Clearly, i have missed all of your proofs for liberals in America trying to replace Christianity with Islam.  Could you please tell me when a liberal has taken actions to try and force you to be a muslim?  I guess it just hasn't happened to me yet.  Wow... I must be quite lucky.

Cheers,

J.D.

Bep,

You're Bin Ladden!!!  Wow!  you're doing a great job of hidding from the us!  I guess our armies being distracted with the whole Iraq thing has kind of let you off the hook for the 9/11 unpleasantness.

Cheers,

Jimmy

Hi all,

great topic!  As a Journalism student, and a conservative one at that, this is a topic that I have studied in great detail.

I really wish that my own findings on the topic were a little more positive for the right in this country, but they do not seem to be so.

The notion that FOX provides fair and balanced reporting is simply not true, and in fact, recent studies have shown that FOX NEWS viewers are actually much more likely to be hopelessly misinformed as to actual world events in many instances.  

In general, I certainly don't expect any of you to stop watching FOX, as it is very comforting to see someone reaffirming what you think you know, but rest assured, you are most likely, being intentionally (but obviously willingly) mislead.

If it intrests any of you, check out the film: Outfoxed, Rupert Murdoch's War on Journalism.  It is an interesting and highly reliable look into what FOX news is really all about.

cheers,

Jimmy

Hi all,

Firstly, sorry for my absence.. I've been off travelling the world, and have been unable to make comments from the proverbial road.

Great debate here though.. I've really enjoyed reading it.

Just a few quick comments on some of the more recent comments:  I too beleive that president Bush is a poor leader, and has made many critical errors.  As such, and as a responsible member of a democratic nation, I do what I can to voice this displeasure.  When Clinton was in the wrong, I did the same.  This isn't to say that "I prayed for both and so can not be accused of not supporting either president", because such an argument is absurd.  I find it very hard to beleive that most of you arguing against FC were really behind Clinton, as you claim to have been.  But, guess what?  That's OK.. That's why we get the chance to vote, and no one is expecting you, or even asking you to support a guy who you feel is a poor president; i don't think you should expect me to do the same.  

As a cute game, just once, I would like to see BEP or DW say that Bush has perhaps dealt with at least one thing poorly during his reign.  Just for fun... You don't even really have to mean it if you don't want to, just humor me a little.

Pastor Roger, I've always thought you were a great sounding guy, and have a great deal of respect for many of your view.  However, with a comment like the one you made about liberals wanting to replace Christianity with Islam, really shocked me.  I thought you were much smarter than that, and substantially less prone to ridiculous rhetoric.

One last point would be the simple request that we not, as a collective group continually fall back to the apparant "Alamo" that is attacking the Christianity of others.  It's not something in which I feel we should indulge.

cheers,

Jimmy

Hi DW,

Thanks for the reply!

It is posible that had Japan developed a bomb of their own, then they would have used it against a civilian population.  However, I think that fact remains, that they did not have such a wepon, and so the point is probably somewhat moot.

In general, WW2 did fundamentally change the rules of warfare, and probably not for the better.  With all the indiscriminate bombing that took place, mostly by the Germans, British and Americans, it somehow became acceptable to view civilians as legitimate targets.  

It is very easy to blame wartime enemies for these transgressions, but I think part of being a decent member of a society, is also owning-up to the misdeeds of your own nation.  There is nothing unpatriotic about that kind of honesty.  In fact, I think it is probably more patriotic to admit fault, than to pretend that someone else is always to blame.  

In any event, I think my initial point, that the horrible results of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, be called something other than "good" still stands.

cheers,

Jimmy

BEP,

Thanks for the reply!

Sorry to disapoint, but I don't think the petition will be comming from my end anytime soon.

Cheers,

Jimmy

Hi all,

Interesting topic!

I think it's pretty hard to take an absolute stance on a topic like this, and to say that the U.S. did mankind a favour by killing hundreds of thousands of civilians.  To say such a thing would be to suggest that it is somehow "right" to kill innocents in war.  It is herein that I have my moral dilema.  I know full well that more people would have died had the bombs not been dropped, but I think the difference is, that those people would have been combatants, as opposed to civilians.

In the end, I think this is the sort of debate that will go on for decades, as it is certainly a global and geo-political turning point.  However, as it is to be dealt with in our own CU context, perhaps it would be more appropriate to call the event something other than "good"

cheers,

Jimmy