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Theology => Prophecy - Current Events => Topic started by: Bronzesnake on June 29, 2004, 03:00:36 PM



Title: ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: Bronzesnake on June 29, 2004, 03:00:36 PM
ALLAH IS NOT GOD
(OP-ED By Jan Willem van der Hoeven - ICZC)
Now we have the proof, and we should be thankful for Dr. Rantisi, Hamas new leader's clarity: that Allah - many times wrongly translated as 'God' - is not the God of the Bible, nor the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. Allah is another deity, one who drinks blood as water, who loves jihad and terror, and promises virgins in his so-called paradise to those who kill Jews - the more the better.

This Allah has nothing, nothing to do with the God of the Bible. And no matter how many times the muezzins shout out that Allah hu ahbar - 'our Allah is greater' - the God of Israel remains infinitely greater and is the only true and living God and Creator, a God of love to be worshiped as the Creator of us all.

So Dr. Rantisi's declaration that Allah (not God!) has declared war on President Bush and Prime Minister Sharon, and thus on the U.S. and on Israel, is strangely revealing. Every intelligent believer already knows that this evil bloodthirsty 'god' has, like Amalek, a war for generations against the only true God and His chosen and elected people. What's new?

But let no one, and I repeat - no one - from henceforth translate Allah into God. It's pure nonsense.

Allah is the god of terrorists; Hizb'allah, the party of this god. So, if Allah were the same as the only true God, then He would be fighting His own people, the Jews who, in accordance with His eternal promise, He has brought back to His own land as He promised again and again in His word to do.

Allah, if he was the only true God, is making war against a President who begins his day with prayer and the reading of the Bible, and who believes in and loves God.

How ridiculous can one be?

So now President Bush and the whole enlightened and believing western world knows. Allah and his jihad-centered and terrorist-championing religion has declared war on Israel and the U.S. In this fallen and decadent world, these nations are the last strongholds of the Judeo-Christian values inspired by the only true and living God. And these are the strongholds that need to be terrorized into submission to the teaching of ISLAM by the will of this bloodthirsty deity, Allah!

When Christians earnestly prayed in England and elsewhere to be delivered during the second world war from the terrible scourge of Nazism - God used the U.S. led Allied forces to bring victory on the Continent over this beastly power. So too, now, we as believers need to earnestly pray that God will again deliver us from this equally dangerous power, and cause leaders to arise, especially in the West, who like Churchill and Roosevelt, will vanquish this Evil Force!

May the true God - the God of Israel - have mercy upon us!

Jan Willem van der Hoeven, Director International Christian Zionist Center

 Is anyone really surprised?

Bronzesnake.


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: Tibby on June 29, 2004, 05:16:44 PM
Does it really bother you THAT much? Does it really matter all that much?


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: Requiem on June 29, 2004, 05:56:43 PM
Keep telling yourself that...maybe it'll come true.   ::)


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: Tibby on June 29, 2004, 07:13:48 PM
Keep telling yourself that...maybe it'll come true.   ::)

hahaha ;) No, you didn't hear him right, he has "proof" ;) Strangely enough, it is the same theory used to prove Elvis is still alive ;)


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: JudgeNot on June 29, 2004, 09:31:33 PM
I don't believe that the god that Islam worships is the same God Christians worship.  The differences are too pronounced.  Christians worship Jesus Christ as God.  If you believe the Islam god is the same - show me the similarities.


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: JudgeNot on June 29, 2004, 10:14:57 PM
Ebia,
I gotta admit, sometimes you make a post that really floats my boat, (this isn't one of those times), and I think "yea!"  Then other times, there you are with a high-powered rifle shootin' holes in my lifeboat.

I never know whether to respond to you or ignore you.  You need an auto-gauge on your posts – an indicator that blinks for me and says “reply” or “ignore”.  It would sure help to lower my blood pressure!
 ;)


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: Bronzesnake on June 30, 2004, 02:34:08 AM
I don't believe that the god that Islam worships is the same God Christians worship.  The differences are too pronounced.  Christians worship Jesus Christ as God.  If you believe the Islam god is the same - show me the similarities.

I agree, and I'm frankly surprised that so many Christians seem to believe the Muslim Allah is the same God Christians believe in. I don't believe the terrorists represent mainstream Muslims by any stretch, but at the same time, I do not believe the Muslim and Christian God are one and the same.

Bronzesnake.


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: Bronzesnake on June 30, 2004, 02:36:33 AM
I don't believe that the god that Islam worships is the same God Christians worship.  The differences are too pronounced.  Christians worship Jesus Christ as God.  If you believe the Islam god is the same - show me the similarities.

Is the Jewish God the same as the Christian God?

 Are the Islamic texts part of the Old or New Testament?


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: Bronzesnake on June 30, 2004, 03:02:14 AM
Does it really bother you THAT much? Does it really matter all that much?

Did I say it bothered me? Even if it did bother me, why does that bother you? ;)

 This is a forum, we discuss things here...right?


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: Bronzesnake on June 30, 2004, 03:06:02 AM
Ebia,
I will not reply to a question in reply to a question - few things make me more irate than to recieve such a reply.  

State your case.  >:(
Seems to me there is good precedent in replying to a question with a question;
's good job you never asked Christ a question.

If the Jewish God is the same as the Christian God, then so is the Islamic God.  

Sure, we disagree quite a lot about His nature, but we also agree on a lot.

 Hey, if that's the case then we don't need Jesus anymore, we can worship Muhammad, afterall, the Muslim's don't believe in Jesus as God, He's just a prophet  :D

Bronzesnake.


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: Tibby on June 30, 2004, 03:08:51 AM
Does it really bother you THAT much? Does it really matter all that much?

Did I say it bothered me? Even if it did bother me, why does that bother you? ;)

 This is a forum, we discuss things here...right?

the discuss away. I asked 2 questions, you answered one. ;)


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: Bronzesnake on June 30, 2004, 03:12:36 AM
Does it really bother you THAT much? Does it really matter all that much?

Did I say it bothered me? Even if it did bother me, why does that bother you? ;)

 This is a forum, we discuss things here...right?

the discuss away. I asked 2 questions, you answered one. ;)

 I answered both my friend...

Q) Does it really bother you THAT much?
A) No

Q) Does it really matter all that much?

A) This is a forum, we discuss things here.

Bronzesnake.


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: nChrist on June 30, 2004, 03:33:47 AM
Oklahoma Howdy to All,

 ???  Did I miss something here? Jesus Christ is the ONLY WAY. It sounds like someone turned a bunch of politicians and lawyers loose in the same room.   ;D

Allah is a moot issue since he wasn't a Holy Trinity. According to Allah, Jesus Christ was just a man subordinate to Muhammed. I don't think that Almighty God likes that story.

Love In Christ,
Tom


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: iconHis on June 30, 2004, 04:07:44 AM

Amen, BEP.

God, Jesus, Holy Spirit, are all one, very simple.


Colossians 1:10-19

That ye might walk worthy of the Lord unto all pleasing, being fruitful in every good work, and increasing in the knowledge of God:

Strengthened with all might, according to his glorious power unto all patience and longsuffering with joyfulness:

Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in llight:

Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:

In whom wwe have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:

Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers:  all things were created by him, and for him:

and he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
and he is the head of the body, the church:  who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead: that in all things he might have preeminence.

This is the story The Almighty likes...

For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: Bronzesnake on June 30, 2004, 10:48:40 AM
ebia...

 
Quote
No, but the Old testament in particular is accepted by Islam on the whole (bar a few places where they believe the OT to be corrupted) and a lot of the Koran mirrors stuff that is in the bible.

 So anything goes in your mind? I guess the JW'S version is ok also, and the Mormons too. Everyone is going to Heaven!

 
Quote
The islamic concept of God is very close to the Jewish one, with a few "refinements", added.  The Koran itself makes it clear that they worship the same God.

 Oh, my mistake, if the Koran itself says they worship the same God, then it must be true.
 God is not a concept ebia. If you don't believe in Jesus, you're not going home. Don't you know that?  ???

Quote
I never said that.  Actually, a muslim would never say that either because they don't worship Mohammed.

 Sure they don't.  ::)

Quote
The Jews don't recognise Jesus as God either, and they worship the same God.  Accepting that someone worships the same God does not imply accepting that they know every thing necessary about him.


 You are seriously confused young lady. The first Christians were Jews...Jesus was a Jew! Are you telling us that the Jews are correct, that Jesus isn't God?

Bronzesnake.


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: Heidi on June 30, 2004, 11:39:15 AM
Ebia, if the Muslims and the Jews are worshiping the same God, then, as Jesus says; "Because you are unable to understand what i say, you belong to your father, the devil and you want to carry out your father's desires." Since Jesus said that he is the only way to god, then according to him, the afther of anyone who does not worship him is the devil. This makes complete sense to me because who else are we worshiping if we are not worshiping the true God?


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: Tibby on June 30, 2004, 12:03:24 PM
I answered both my friend...

Q) Does it really bother you THAT much?
A) No

Q) Does it really matter all that much?

A) This is a forum, we discuss things here.

Bronzesnake.


Both questions are yes or no questions. You have not answered the last question till you give a yes or no.

If you think this is about Muslins being saved, then none of you have any idea what Ebia is trying to say. Personally, I do not think that Ebia’s argument is really all that hard for you to grasp. Show me one quote of Ebia’s that says Muslims are going to be saved. ::)


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: JudgeNot on June 30, 2004, 07:56:41 PM
Ebia says:
Quote
So there aren't three different Gods (there can't be, anyway, there is only one God).  There isn't one correct God and two totally incorrect "God concepts" - that would require a change in God between David's time and that of modern Jews.  There is one God, and at least two groups have some incorrect information about Him.  I have no doubt that the Christian information is the more accurate, but you can't reasonably claim the Muslims worship a different [false] God without claiming that David did too, which I'm sure you wouldn't wish to do.

At last!  You stated your case!  (Did it hurt getting that tooth pulled??)  :P
Why didn’t you put it that way to begin with?  (If I may quote Reba: “Sheesh!”)   :)

I am in agreement that Isaac, Ismael and David worshipped the same God figure at some point in history.  
However I think the argument you are finding here is that the decedents of Ismael have bastardized their god figure to the point he no longer resembles the God we worship.  Soooooo – they are actually no longer worshiping the same deity.  In fact I will go out on a limb here and say Islam’s god no longer resembles the God of the Jews (obviously, since Islam believes Jews are less than human).  

One last counter-barb (if I may):
Quote
Seems to me there is good precedent in replying to a question with a question;
's good job you never asked Christ a question.
Hopefully you aren't comparing yourself (and your ability to debate to whatever degree that may be) to Jesus.  
I know Jesus.  
You ain't him.   ;D


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: JudgeNot on July 01, 2004, 12:57:44 PM
Quote
Islam does NOT regard the Jews as less than human.  The Koran goes as far as to call us all (Muslims, Jews and Christians) "people of the book".

I stand corrected.  You are right - it is the modern-day muslim people that regard Jews as sub-human.
 :)


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: AdeptusLux on July 01, 2004, 04:13:04 PM
Hi everyone,
I just wanted to say that from my Yahshuan ;) (Christian) viewpoint, I agree allah isn't YHWH (God). YHWH has a Son named Yahshua ;D (Jesus). Muslims say Yahshua isn't the Messiah :'(. Therefore the muslim allah is not YHWH >:(. From what I understand, allah is an ancient "moon god" :P that contacted mohammed from among several hundred supposed deities they worshipped at that time.


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: Tibby on July 01, 2004, 06:19:23 PM
Actually, the Moon God theory is just an urban legend.

Judgenot, no, you are confusing them with the white Christians who think Jews are sub-human. Don’t worry, I can see how you would confuse the two. ;) ;D


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: nChrist on July 02, 2004, 12:42:12 AM
WHEW!!

Well, whoever they are, they wish to exterminate every living Jew in Israel. I guess they can call themselves whatever they wish and claim beliefs of whatever they wish. It's no longer a secret that their schools all over the world teach that Americans must be exterminated also. The secret is out - all of this is done under the religious banner of Islam and has been for many years.

I'm sure there are various versions of Islam, and some might not wish to kill innocent women and children. Regardless, none of them have Jesus Christ as their personal Lord and Saviour, so the argument about Allah is moot. AND, REGARDLESS, they will be coming for Israel and for us - whoever they are. We will either bring it to them, or they will bring it to us. Some won't believe this until a few more things happen, but all will know soon.

Here's the big secret - All Biblical prophesy will come to pass, and nothing can stop it. It will happen, and when it does Christians should be deeply concerned about whether they shared the Good News of Jesus Christ or hid.

Love In Christ,
Tom  


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: Sower on July 02, 2004, 06:12:17 AM
I don't believe that the god that Islam worships is the same God Christians worship.  The differences are too pronounced.  Christians worship Jesus Christ as God.  If you believe the Islam god is the same - show me the similarities.

It goes far beyond that. The "god" of Islam has taken the revealation of the God of the Bible and turned it on it's head. The Koran makes Ishmael the child of promise, not Isaac. It also makes Mohammed the final "Prophet", not Christ. It also denies the Gospel truth that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, that He was buried, and rose again the third day according to the Scriptures. According to the Koran, God cannot have a Son, therefore the New Testament is declared to be false. All the OT truths are also falsified.

Lest we forget, the angel "Gabriel" is said to have appeared to Mohammed to bring down the revelation of the Koran, and establish it as God's final word to mankind. The false prophet Joseph Smith also clamied that "Gabriel" came to to him with the new revelation of the book of Mormon, to add to the Bible which seemingly can now inadequate.  Why should we not therefore conclude that Satan came as a false "angel of light", claiming to be Gabriel, in order to controvert the Word of God through Mohammed and Smith?

Scripture says that "in these last days God has spoken unto us by His Son" (Heb. 1:1-3) who is the brightness of God's glory and the express image of His person. The last book in the Bible is "the Revelation of Jesus Christ" (Rev. 1:1) and the apostle John sealed that book as the end of all revelation (Rev. 22:18,19). These truths are trampled on by the Koran.

IN LIGHT OF ALL THIS, CHRISTIANS SHOULD CLEARLY UNDERSTAND THAT THE GOD OF ISLAM IS SATAN, WHO REJECTS BOTH THE FATHER AND THE SON.  HE ALSO WISHES TO SEE EVERY JEW EXTERMINATED. ISLAM IS A RELIGION DIRECTLY OPPOSED TO CHRIST AND THE GOSPEL. THIS IS ANTICHRIST. LET'S MAKE NO MISTAKE.


Title: ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: Brother Love on July 02, 2004, 07:58:38 AM
IN LIGHT OF ALL THIS, CHRISTIANS SHOULD CLEARLY UNDERSTAND THAT THE GOD OF ISLAM IS SATAN, WHO REJECTS BOTH THE FATHER AND THE SON.  HE ALSO WISHES TO SEE EVERY JEW EXTERMINATED. ISLAM IS A RELIGION DIRECTLY OPPOSED TO CHRIST AND THE GOSPEL. THIS IS ANTICHRIST. LET'S MAKE NO MISTAKE.


AMEN!!!


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: JudgeNot on July 02, 2004, 04:59:22 PM
You're a little vague, there, BL.
Tell us what you REALLY think.
 ;D


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: Bronzesnake on July 02, 2004, 05:20:44 PM
ebia...

 
Quote
The above is all true, but the vast majority is in agreement with non-Christian and pre-Christian Jews, so unless you are prepared to claim that David worshiped a different God, then you can't claim Muslims do on this basis.

 That is a truly foolish argument ebia.
The God of David is the Christian God. The Old Testament prophesied that a saviour would come...guess who that would be ebia...ya, it's Jesus. The Old Testament also prophesied that His own ( Jews ) would reject Him, that He would eventually be crucified and be resurrected. The Christian God is the Jewish God, the scriptures prophesied it, and the scriptures are aligned with each other. Muslims do not believe in Jesus as God, so how can they be the same God, unless you don't believe Jesus is God?

Quote
The bible wasn't a book when John wrote that - infact almost certainly not all the books that make up the bible had even been written.  Of course, no one here is claiming the Koran to be correct where it disagrees with the bible, so all that is completely irrelevent anyway.

 That is conclusive proof that you haven't got a clue about when the scriptures were or weren't written. That's par for the course with you young lady.

 You really should do some serious studying before you make any more unsubstantiated claims my friend....Or, you could simple ask - there are many biblically educated people here ebia - they can tell you when the scriptures were written, as well as many, many other biblical truths which you seem to be so confused about.


Bronzesnake


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: Bronzesnake on July 02, 2004, 05:37:44 PM
sower...

 
Quote
IN LIGHT OF ALL THIS, CHRISTIANS SHOULD CLEARLY UNDERSTAND THAT THE GOD OF ISLAM IS SATAN, WHO REJECTS BOTH THE FATHER AND THE SON.  HE ALSO WISHES TO SEE EVERY JEW EXTERMINATED. ISLAM IS A RELIGION DIRECTLY OPPOSED TO CHRIST AND THE GOSPEL. THIS IS ANTICHRIST. LET'S MAKE NO MISTAKE.

Exactly!

 When satan exclaims..."I am God" it won't be the Old or New testament God, which are one in the same. The scriptures depict a"god" who persecutes Christians and Jews, so how can a Christian God hunt down and destroy his own followers? It is going to be the false "Allah" that walks out of the temple and makes his false claim.

 In the following verse, satan makes war with Christians...therefore, he can not be coming as a false Jesus.

 Rev 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

 In this verse, God warns the Jews to run to the hills! Apparently this false god also hates Jews!

 Mar 13:14 But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains:  

 Allah is the false god that satan will pretend to be.

Bronzesnake.


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: Bronzesnake on July 04, 2004, 12:37:09 AM
Bronzesnake quote...

The God of David is the Christian God. The Old Testament prophesied that a saviour would come...guess who that would be ebia...ya, it's Jesus. The Old Testament also prophesied that His own ( Jews ) would reject Him, that He would eventually be crucified and be resurrected. The Christian God is the Jewish God, the scriptures prophesied it, and the scriptures are aligned with each other. Muslims do not believe in Jesus as God, so how can they be the same God, unless you don't believe Jesus is God?
 
ebia reply...
Quote
So modern, non-christian jews don't worship the same God.  Were the Jews of Christ's time who didn't recognise him worshiping the same God?

 God the Father is the same God ebia, and you know it. Why play these games young lady? Are you really a Christian, or do you simply enjoy an argument? Perhaps you are a J.W., that would explain your difficulty in believing the Old Testament God is the exact same God of the New Testament. This is basic fundamentals here ebia.

Jesus was rejected by the Jews ebia. You do understand the Trinity don't you? I'm not so sure you do, because if you did, you wouldn't be questioning the fact that the Old Testament God is the Christian God. The Muslims reject Jesus, therefore they do not worship the same God - Jesus is God - Muslims don't worship Him. Why can't you grasp that ebia?

Here are some Old Testament scriptures in regard to the Jews rejecting Jesus ebia.

Psalms 69:4  Those who hate me without reason outnumber the hairs of my head; many are my enemies without cause, those who seek to destroy me. I am forced to restore what I did not steal.

Psalm 69:8  I am a stranger to my brothers, an alien to my own mother's sons;

Isaiah 6:10  Make the heart of this people calloused; make their ears dull and close their eyes. Otherwise they might see with their eyes, hear with their ears, understand with their hearts, and turn and be healed."

Isaiah 29:13  The Lord says: "These people come near to me with their mouth and honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me. Their worship of me is made up only of rules taught by men.

Isaiah 53:3  He was despised and rejected by men, a man of sorrows, and familiar with suffering. Like one from whom men hide their faces he was despised, and we esteemed him not.

Isaiah 63:1-6  Who is this coming from Edom, from Bozrah, with his garments stained crimson? Who is this, robed in splendor, striding forward in the greatness of his strength? "It is I, speaking in righteousness, mighty to save." 2 Why are your garments red, like those of one treading the winepress? 3 "I have trodden the winepress alone; from the nations no one was with me. I trampled them in my anger and trod them down in my wrath; their blood spattered my garments, and I stained all my clothing. 4 For the day of vengeance was in my heart, and the year of my redemption has come. 5 I looked, but there was no one to help, I was appalled that no one gave support; so my own arm worked salvation for me, and my own wrath sustained me. 6 I trampled the nations in my anger; in my wrath I made them drunk and poured their blood on the ground."


Bronzesnake Quote...
That is conclusive proof that you haven't got a clue about when the scriptures were or weren't written. That's par for the course with you young lady.

ebia response...
Quote
I can't prove it, but the most widely accepted dates for biblical authorship don't put Revelations at the end of the list.  It wasn't put at the end of the canon because it was the last to be written, but because it was the last to be decided to be included, and because that's where it fits.

 Wrong! All you have to do is ask ebia, you don't need to keep guessing. There are many good people here who will gladly set you straight on the dates.

ebia quote...
Quote
Thats, still only part of the story - how can "this book" refer to the whole bible, when the whole bible wouldn't be a book for another couple of hundred years?

ebia!  :D The bible is not just some book that a bunch of dusty old men decided to throw together one day. You haven't got the slightest idea of how soon after Jesus actually lived, and walked the earth that the gospels or Acts were written - it was no where near "couple of hundred years"
There is solid evidence that the gospels were written as early as 40 A.D. and John was one of the original twelve decipals. There is also great evidence that portions of Acts were written within four years after the resurrection!
Just ask ebia, and the proof will be provided!

Bronzesnake Quote...
Allah is the false god that satan will pretend to be.
 
ebia reply...
Quote
You've been told before - Allah is just the arabic word for God.  Arabic Christians worship Allah.  If you mean the Muslim idea of God then say so.  Or do you think that all non-English speaking people worship different Gods?


 You know full well what I mean ebia, quit with the childish games my friend.

 As far as your comment..."Or do you think that all non-English speaking people worship different Gods?" I find that offensive, as it implies racism. If anyone worships any god besides the Judeo/Christian God, then they don't worship the same God. Why is this so difficult for you to get a grip of ebia?

Bronzesnake.


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: Sower on July 04, 2004, 12:47:16 AM
ebia...

 
Quote
The above is all true, but the vast majority is in agreement with non-Christian and pre-Christian Jews, so unless you are prepared to claim that David worshiped a different God, then you can't claim Muslims do on this basis.

 That is a truly foolish argument ebia.

Ebia is simply trying to pick a fight for the sake of doing so. So you're right. Her arguments are foolish, and her attitude leaves much to be desired. Ebia, I could show you chapter and verse in the Koran to back up everything stated, but won't waste my time trying to convince you. Those with discernment know the truth.



Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: Bronzesnake on July 04, 2004, 12:27:01 PM
ebia...

 If the Islamic God and the Christian God are one and the same, then why don't you prove it by denying Jesus as God, and only worship as a Muslim. After all, if they are the same you won't have to worry about losing your eternal salvation right ebia. You better go out right now and buy a prayer carpet, oh ya, don't forget to face Mecca when you pray to Allah, that's important.

ebia quote...

Quote
I'm just trying to get a consistant straight answer out of you.  The Muslim concept of God, and the "non-Christian" Jewish concept of God are virtually identical (if anything, the Muslim concept is closer to the Christian one than the Jewish one is), yet you accept that the Jewish God is the same as the Christian God, and insist that Muslim God is different.  That is simply not consistant.  Perhaps if you actually answered these questions with straight answer:

 I can no longer take you with any degree of seriousness ebia. I'm convinced you are not Christian, and you are here strictly as an antagonist. Your quote (above) has exposed you as a fake my friend.

 You had me going for a while there though. :D

You will not lure me in again, but I'm sure you'll try. ;)

Bye...

Bronzesnake.

 


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: nChrist on July 04, 2004, 10:40:46 PM
Ebia,

You want it straight, so here it is. You've always had an argument and a side-step for everything moral or Biblical that is discussed here. You name it, you have an argument against it. The "side-step" I speak of is your attempt to go around the teachings of the Holy Bible in just about every discussion you become involved in. Most of those arguments would be those of an antagonist or an atheist.

Jesus Christ is the only WAY, so all of your "side-steps" are moot and of the devil. Yes, the devil would love for those in Islam to believe they are saved. However, that would be impossible for those practicing Islam, so why even mention it? They either have Jesus Christ in their heart as their personal Lord and Saviour, or they don't.

So, here is your straight answer:

Those practicing Islam are lost and going to hell. Forget the side-steps and tell it like it is.

Tom


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: Bronzesnake on July 06, 2004, 09:05:58 AM
Ebia,

You want it straight, so here it is. You've always had an argument and a side-step for everything moral or Biblical that is discussed here. You name it, you have an argument against it. The "side-step" I speak of is your attempt to go around the teachings of the Holy Bible in just about every discussion you become involved in. Most of those arguments would be those of an antagonist or an atheist.

Jesus Christ is the only WAY, so all of your "side-steps" are moot and of the devil. Yes, the devil would love for those in Islam to believe they are saved. However, that would be impossible for those practicing Islam, so why even mention it? They either have Jesus Christ in their heart as their personal Lord and Saviour, or they don't.

So, here is your straight answer:

Those practicing Islam are lost and going to hell. Forget the side-steps and tell it like it is.

Tom

 Tom, you are absolutely correct about Islam. So few are willing to come right out and tell the truth.

 Hal Lindsey has written an article on "Islam's violent core"
 
 It's a very interesting piece which suggests that our society (the west) has become blinded by political correctness in believing Islam is a peaceful religion.
 
 Lindsey states..."The West – and especially the United States – continues to cling to the myth that "Islam is a religion of peace." History reveals this is simply not true."
 
 I must agree, especially when we never hear any Muslim Leaders speak out against the "fanatical few" Can you imagine the uproar if it was a Christian faction in place of this fanatical Islamic core? Church leaders and individual Christians would be absolutely outraged! Not a peep from the Muslims though.
 
Here is the article in it's entirety...
 
 http://www.wnd.com/news/printer-friendly.asp?ARTICLE_ID=39116 (ftp://http://www.wnd.com/news/printer-friendly.asp?ARTICLE_ID=39116)


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: JudgeNot on July 06, 2004, 09:33:46 PM
Ebia posted:
Quote
"History" reveals that Christianity is not a religion of peace.

Whose history?  (Or is that exactly your point? History is constantly being revised...)


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: Heidi on July 06, 2004, 10:19:12 PM
AMEN, BEP!!!!


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: nChrist on July 07, 2004, 03:01:58 AM
Brothers and Sisters,

First, let me state that I'm posting a feeling, and I don't hint at date setting.

I honestly feel that we are seeing Biblical prophecy unfolding before our very eyes. Many may not recognize it, and many may not believe this. I'm beginning to think that I might live long enough to see considerable unfolding. I can say one thing with absolute certainty - 100% of all Bible prophecy will be fulfilled at God's appointed time.

The fanatical few will become fanatical hordes. I would qualify that statement by saying that I don't believe it is a fanatical few now, nor has it ever been. The POWER OF GOD has held things in check. However, THE RESTRAINER WILL BE REMOVED! It is far past time for us to fervently share the GOOD NEWS OF THE GOSPEL OF THE GRACE OF GOD. We need to forget about being politically correct and shout the Gospel from the rooftops.

Love In Christ,
Tom


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: Shammu on July 07, 2004, 04:09:02 AM
Brothers and Sisters,

First, let me state that I'm posting a feeling, and I don't hint at date setting.

I honestly feel that we are seeing Biblical prophecy unfolding before our very eyes. Many may not recognize it, and many may not believe this. I'm beginning to think that I might live long enough to see considerable unfolding. I can say one thing with absolute certainty - 100% of all Bible prophecy will be fulfilled at God's appointed time.

The fanatical few will become fanatical hordes. I would qualify that statement by saying that I don't believe it is a fanatical few now, nor has it ever been. The POWER OF GOD has held things in check. However, THE RESTRAINER WILL BE REMOVED! It is far past time for us to fervently share the GOOD NEWS OF THE GOSPEL OF THE GRACE OF GOD. We need to forget about being politically correct and shout the Gospel from the rooftops.

Love In Christ,
Tom
AMEN bep ;D


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: Shammu on July 07, 2004, 04:19:30 AM
Quote
We need to forget about being politically correct and shout the Gospel from the rooftops.
Sometimes people pay more attention when you whisper.
And you have people you want to hear the Gospel, walk away. Either that or you are embaressed of your Christianty.

You know you make me wanna SHOUT!!

I LOVE YOU JESUS!!!!!!!!!


Title: Re:ALLAH IS NOT GOD...
Post by: Bronzesnake on July 17, 2004, 07:11:30 AM
Apparently the link to the following Hal Lindsey article didn't work, so here it is...

Bronzesnake

Islam's violent core
By Hal Lindsey

© 2004 WorldNetDaily.com

The world in general has been sickened by the savage beheadings of innocent people by Islamic fundamentalists. But we really shouldn't be surprised.

Daniel Pearl in Pakistan and Nick Berg in Iraq, both Jews, were the first to suffer this modern revival of historic Islamic savagery. Then it was another American, Paul Johnson in Saudi Arabia. And then South Korean Kim Sun-il in Iraq, a reported born-again Christian. All were murdered without mercy by Muslims proclaiming the by now familiar mantra of praise, "Allahu akbar" [Allah is great].


The suicide crews flew American planes into the World Trade Center buildings and the Pentagon on 9-11 shouting, "Allah is great." Clearly these Muslims saw themselves carrying out their actions for a religiously based cause in the name of Allah.

It is important to note that these acts of barbarism were committed by diverse ethnic groups of Muslim zealots in different places. This reveals that there is a cohesive source that motivates all of them to commit such atrocities.

The West – and especially the United States – continues to cling to the myth that "Islam is a religion of peace." History reveals this is simply not true.

Islam is not like Christianity, which teaches one should love his enemy. Christians seek to win converts by a loving presentation of the message of Christ's offer of pardon for sin that He purchased by dying in our place.

On the other hand – according to the Quran – in places where Islam rules, it is to offer no mercy to the "infidel unbeliever" unless he converts to Islam. If he is allowed to live, he must live as a third-rate citizen and suffer all sorts of abuses with no legal rights to protect him. He is excessively taxed for "the privilege" of living among Muslims.

The cohesive core of Islam that continues to inspire its long history of violence is the Quran and the sayings and actions of Muhammad, himself. The many biographies of Muhammad reveal that he employed murder and war repeatedly to advance Islam. When he conquered Medina, he and his troops beheaded all the adult Jewish men, which Muslim sources place at over 600. So the practice of beheading "infidels," especially Jews, is well established by Muhammad himself.

Many scholars believe we are actually in the Third Great Jihad in the history of Islam. The first was the original Great Jihad that spread Islam from the Atlantic to the borders of China. The second Great Jihad created the vast Ottoman Turk Empire. The third Great Jihad began with the takeover of Iran by the Ayatollah Khomeini and the defeat of the Soviet Union in Afghanistan by the "holy warriors" of Islam who came there to fight from all over the Muslim world.

The goal of the Third Great Jihad is to drive all Western influence out of the Middle East and to restore it to Muslim rule as it was in the seventh century. Central to this is the obliteration of the state of Israel. They will not accept American style "democracy." To them, this is an inherent part of a degenerate Judeo-Christian culture and is anti-Islam.

The victory over Soviet military forces in Afghanistan gave inspiration to the Muslim warriors that goes far beyond our realization. They surmised that the reason they prevailed over the mighty Soviet war machine was their complete fundamental faith in the Quran. From that, they reasoned that Muslim warriors have suffered such humiliating defeats in the battles of recent times because they have forsaken pure devotion to the fundamental teachings of the Quran and Muhammad.

The firebrand Osama bin Laden was one of these "holy warriors" who fervently applied these lessons. He proclaimed that he would lead a revival of Islam that would cleanse their lands of all "infidels" and re-establish former Muslim glory.

Osama bin Laden, with his group of "holy warriors" who had come from many Muslim communities around the world, issued a "fatwa." A "fatwa" is a legally binding interpretation of the Quran for a contemporary issue written by an Islamic scholar. Part of Osama's fatwa – dated February 1998 – proclaimed:


The ruling to kill the Americans and their allies – civilians and military – is an individual duty for every Muslim who can do it in any country in which it is possible to do it, in order to liberate the al-Aqsa Mosque [in Jerusalem] and the holy mosque [in Mecca] from their grip, and in order for their armies to move out of all the lands of Islam, defeated and unable to threaten any Muslim.

This is in accordance with the words of Almighty Allah "and fight the pagans all together as they fight you all together," and "fight them until there is no more tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in Allah."


We must not underestimate the power and impact of this "fatwa" upon the millions of young Muslim men who are demoralized over the decline of Islam in recent centuries. The message of Osama bin Laden that was forged in the fire of battle with the Soviet military strikes a deep, resonant chord in the hearts of young Muslims longing to restore the former glory of Islam. To them, Muhammad's division of the world into only two groups is the only truth. Muhammad taught that the world is divided into "the house of Islam" and the "house of war." Every land outside of Islamic rule is considered a place for war.

If we merely dismiss these facts as the ravings of a few fanatics, we do so at our great peril. About 15 percent of the 1.3 billion Muslims in the world are now fundamentalists. That's about 195 million Muslim zealots scattered over the world who are bent upon the destruction of the United States.

The other 85 percent of Muslims are not fundamentalists, but their beliefs are not based on a literal interpretation of the Quran and the acts of Muhammad. And they rarely speak out strongly enough against the Muslim fundamentalists to make a difference. If there is a "peaceful" majority of Muslims, they had better speak out clearly and strongly against the growing power of the fundamentalists, or they will be confused with the Muslims who bring future terrorist acts against this country.

When Muslim fundamentalists launch attacks against our citizens that kill tens of thousands, there will surely be a release of fury that will not be so discerning of what kind of a Muslim a person is, unless he has made it very clear beforehand.

At this very moment, there are some devout Muslims plotting massive attacks against the United States. We must wake up to this reality that they are in our midst and start focusing all our resources on the places where they are most likely to be found. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that out – just one who is willing to be politically incorrect.