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1.     The Charismatic Movement is willing to accept tongues, interpretation of tongues, visions, dreams, prophecies, etc. as being messages from God to His children.  This is a very serious danger.  Once you accept "extra-Biblical messages" (those which are in addition to the Bible, but not necessarily contrary to the Bible) it will not be long before you will be accepting "anti-Biblical messages" as being valid (those which directly contradict Gods Word).  The Charismatic Movement has done and is doing exactly that!

     In reality, all "extra-Biblical messages" are "anti-Biblical messages" because God's Word specifically warns against adding to the Scriptures.

     "Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish ought from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the Lord your God which I command you (Deuteronomy 4:2)."

     "For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, if any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plaques that are written in this book: And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book (Revelation 22:18-19)."

     The Charismatic Movement defends these "extra-Biblical, anti-Biblical messages" on the basis that new winds of the Holy Spirit are blowing (John 3:8).  They say, "Who can tell what the Holy Spirit may do?"  (see John 3:8 "canst not tell")

     Let us not forget that the Word of God is a complete revelation and was given by the Holy Spirit (II Peter 1:19, Timothy 3:16).  We can be sure of one thing--that the Holy Spirit will never contradict Himself (John 14:17 "Spirit of Truth").  It was the Holy Spirit who warned about adding to the word of God.

     Therefore, as Jesus said, if someone tells you something contrary to the Word of God, "believe it not (Matthew 24:26)."  See Galatians 1:8-10.  The Mormons speak in tongues and have, obviously, accepted extra-Biblical revelations.

2.     The Charismatic Movement encourages its followers to stay in churches and denominations of different beliefs in order "to win them over." (See Galatians 2:4; Ephesians 4:14, about "lying in wait to deceive".)  Also God's Word plainly teaches believers that those who preach another gospel are "accursed"- (Galatians 1:6-9), and those who fellowship with false teachers are partakers of their evil deeds (II John 10-11).  The Charismatic Movement is promoting the Ecumenical Movement and may possibly be the "glue" that joins all the churches together for the Antichrist (Matthew 24:24-25)

3.     The Charismatic Movement places undue and unscriptural emphasis on physical healing.  This causes many believers confusion and agony who are falsely taught that it is always God's will to heal.  The Scriptures plainly teach that God may use physical afflictions for refining, correcting, and chastening the believer (II Corinthians 12:7-10; Hebrews 12:3-11; Job 23:10).  The Scriptures leave no doubt as to the ability of God to heal.  But it is wrong and dangerous to teach that God must always heal.

4.     Worldliness (I John 2:15-17; Romans 12:1-2).  The Charismatic Movement is fostering and encouraging a spirit of worldliness in the church, and in the individual believer.  The Charismatic Movement seems to be trying to out-do the world in being worldly in speech, dress, hair, music, entertainment, etc.

5.     Women Preachers, Evangelists, etc.  It is strange, inconsistent and sad to hear Charismatics using I Corinthians 14 to justify " speaking in tongues" as a gift of the Spirit for our day when that very same chapter says plainly, "Let your women keep silence in the churches (I Corinthians 14:34)."  This results in disorderly homes and disorderly churches with women in places of leadership in direct violation of the Word of God.  This movement is encouraging women to forsake their God-given place in the home and in the church.

6.     "Coming under the Power" or being "slain in the Spirit".  The Charismatic Movement promotes and encourages an experience where the leader "lays hands" on the individual, causing the person to "faint, slump, swoon, experience the power, etc." and thereafter remain unconscious or semi-conscious for several seconds or longer.  The Charismatics have no Scriptures to justify and defend their practices.  There is No Scriptural precedent, example, or command for this experience, which borders on hypnotism and occult.

7.     The Charismatic Movement glories in "miracles and signs" (See Matthew 24:24-25).  A sign (tongues for example) or a miracle (such as physical healing) as a basis for validating a person's message or practices are unscriptural.  This is extremely dangerous, and the Scriptures plainly teach us that the last days will be full of great deceitfulness (II Timothy 3:13).  God warns that the Antichrist will usher in a time of "all power and signs and Lying Wonders (II Thessalonians 2:9-11)."  The False Prophet will deceive men by the use of miracles, even having power to give life to an image (Revelation 13:11-18).  The validation of a man's message and methods today are not "miracles", but the WORD OF GOD (Isaiah 8:20).

8.     What about salvation?  This is the real issue, and I find most Charismatics have a false plan of salvation.  99% of them will say, "YES" when asked if they can lose their salvation.  Whenever anyone says that they can lose their salvation, they are trusting in WORKS!  What they are really saying is that if they live the Christian life until they die they will go to heaven.  But, if they backslide and die they will go to hell.  This makes them the savior and not Christ, because salvation is dependent upon their actions or works in the end.  Christ becomes a helper or a partner NOT A SAVIOR!  Salvation is received at the moment of belief by an act of faith and it is eternal life (See John 5:24).  We are never told in the Scriptures that salvation is a process, or that we are to wait until after we die to see If we have attained it.  Salvation is the gift of God (Romans 6:23; Ephesians 2:8-9).  Jesus never said, "I and You" are the way!  Jesus Christ ALONE is the Savior!  Unfortunately, most Charismatics, because they are trusting in their works, are not saved.  Jesus will say to them, "I NEVER KNEW YOU!"  (See Matthew 7:22-23).  Jesus never says, "I ONCE KNEW YOU AND I LOST YOU."  That is impossible!  Those in Matthew 7:22 are boasting in LIVING THE CHRISTIAN LIFE.  This is their claim to salvation.  Jesus says to them, "I NEVER KNEW YOU."  They were trusting in works and not Christ!

WATCH OUT DON'T BE DECEIVED!

CHECK IT OUT IN THE WORD OF GOD!

1 Cor 14:39

39 Wherefore, brethren, covet to prophesy, and forbid not to speak with tongues.
KJV

I don't tell you not to speak in tounges lol but if you are going to use the true gift and don't babble is all I ask
in his love and grace,
David Winn

Well, that was a nicely written little expose, but I'm not going to apologize for what I do or do not believe. So in the meantime, I think our time would be better served loving one another.

Therefore, what can I do for you my brother? I know if we should ever meet up in church sometime, not to speak in tongues. That is, of course, umless you come to my church because you know what you're getting yourself into if you do that.

Nevertheless, I shall add you to my Ephesians prayer list.

In the meantime, and from the depths of my spirit:

Num 6:24  The LORD bless thee, and keep thee:
Num 6:25  The LORD make his face shine upon thee, and be gracious unto thee:
Num 6:26  The LORD lift up his countenance upon thee, and give thee peace.

Whether or not you agree, ZakDar, we should all be open to teaching and correction from our brothers and sisters in Christ. They are often the Spirit's chosen tool in our lives, whether we care for it at the time or not. :) Read what I said in "Tongues: A Sign."

Thanx my friend. I'd like to think I'm open to correction and do indeed maintain "teach-ability".

But let me put this is a little different perspective for ya. Look at the title of this thread. So let me narrow this down a bit into a number of ways to "retitle" it.

The Pentecostal movement is dangerouse because.....

The Assemblies of God movement is dangerous because.....

The Charismatic Catholic movement is dangerous because....

The Four Square movement is dangerous because....

I wonder what kind of reaction I would get if I wrote a nice expose titled "The Baptist movement is dangerous because..."?

Or, "The Catholic movement is dangereous because..."?

Or Methodist, Lutheran, Menonite, etc.

Get the picture?

No, let us "love one another" and therby fulfill the COMMANDMENT of Jesus. And yes, it IS a commandment - we DO NOT HAVE A CHOICE IN THIS MATTER!!!!!!!!!! This is one of only two commandments given from the very lips of the Lord of Glory!!! Let's write exposes on this commandment rather than fingering denominations.

Let me give you a strong example - and this is a true story.

A certain pastor of a particular charitable ministry also partakes of a certan business venture, and promote it beside, yet behind, his ministry.

Through this business ventrue, a Pakistani man got meet this man and see him at work in his ministry, and has come to respect this minister's faith, and his walk with Christ. In fact he was so impressed, he decided it was worthwhile for him to study Jesus.

So, he invited this pastor over to his house for dinner, and the pastor was pleased to accept his invitation. Now, when Pakistanis have a dinner guest, it's a friends & family event that usually will include anywhere from 25 to 50 people.

So here's this Pastor of the Gospel of Jesus Christ, surrounded by about 30 Muslims, (yes, Pakistanis are predominantly Muslim), and he's teaching them about Jesus.

But, Oh, wait a minute, he's "charismatic"!!!!!! Yikes!!!! Why would God use a "charismatic" Christian for such an important encounter?

I don't know, and don't care. In fact, I couldn't care at all what denomination he was from. All I know is that this man maintained a respect for another man regardless of his religion, and in so doing got to teach the Gospel to some folks that are from one of the most reknown anti Christ religions in the world!!!

Think about it!!
Think about it!!
Think about it!!
Think about it!!

DigitGen,

I just found this thread, and I would have to say that you are painting with a massive paint brush that is unfair and inaccurate. First, no two people have the same definition for the term "Charismatic". Second, those who claim to be Charismatic represent a large variety of people with differing beliefs. Third, you've given  a lot of information that is nothing but your personal opinion, exaggerated, or completely untrue about people who claim to be Charismatic. You can't hope to be accurate in trying to paint a toothpick with a 100 yard wide paint roller. Fourth, much of your bashing list for Charismatics has nothing to do with Salvation. What you specifically claim pertains to Salvation is wrong, and you probably know it is wrong. You don't have to believe in (OSAS), Once Saved - Always Saved, to be Saved. I do believe in OSAS, but that is NOT a requirement for Salvation. To add OSAS as a requirement for Salvation is FALSE, you know it is false, and you are adding to the Gospel of the Grace of God. I also believe in "Faith Alone in Christ Alone", but we both know TRULY SAVED people who also believe in good works. A secondary belief in good works does not mean the person is lost, and you already know that. SO, are you trying to deceive in talking about things you know are false????????

I am not Charismatic, but I know many people who claim to be in the churches that Brother Zakdar mentioned. The people I know in those churches are definite and obvious Christians who belong to JESUS. Yes, I have differences with them, but they also have differences with me. What we have in common is that we belong to JESUS. Many of them are strong Christians and servants of GOD. In fact, many of them are stronger and better servants of GOD than you are.

You haven't posted what your man-made label or tag is yet, but  without knowing your label or tag I know that I have differences with you. First, you have a list of things that cause you to bash other people, and it's really no concern to you whether or not you are talking to another Brother or Sister in Christ. It is an absolute that some or many of your opinions, labels, and tags are WRONG.

DigitGen, some people preach nothing but bashing and that makes it pretty hard to know if they belong to JESUS or not. In fact, some people spend so much time bashing that they don't have any time left for JESUS and the CROSS. There is no such thing as a bashing Gospel, so that would be "another Gospel". It's a fact that bashing Gospel doesn't save a single person, NOT ONE. In conclusion, you and I both know beyond any doubt at all that there are MANY extremely STRONG Christians who call themselves Charismatic, so what good did you do for the BODY OF CHRIST with your bashing post?

Moderator

*chuckles* Zakdar, please, calm down. I meant no offense. I did not say DigitGen was right in this case, or that I agreed. My appologies if it seemed that way. :)

In any case, BEP is right. We cannot go around bashing other denominations. It is this kind of infighting that the world views and it drives more away than I can count. Christ said the mark of a true Christian would be our LOVE. :)

Oh no, I'm not offended. I'm not even offended by what Digi posted. However, that title and subject IS a fence. And at a time when we truly need to tear down these fences and show the world our love for one another, well.... let's just say I'm disappointed more than anything else.

Hello Brother Zakdar,

Amen Brother!! We should all know there are people dying in their sins. It is a real shame that many lost people look at Christians and see so much hypocrisy that they decide it must be false and they don't want anything to do with it.

Matthew 22:36-40  NASB  "Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?" And He said to him, " 'YOU SHALL LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WITH ALL YOUR HEART, AND WITH ALL YOUR SOUL, AND WITH ALL YOUR MIND.' "This is the great and foremost commandment. "The second is like it, 'YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.' "On these two commandments depend the whole Law and the Prophets."

If all Christians were to pay more attention to Matthew 22:36-40, many more lost people would be accepting JESUS as their personal Lord and Saviour.

Love in Christ,
Tom

Colossians 3:15-16 NASB  Let the peace of Christ rule in your hearts, to which indeed you were called in one body; and be thankful. Let the word of Christ richly dwell within you, with all wisdom teaching and admonishing one another with psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with thankfulness in your hearts to God.

I'm broadly wwith ZakDar, LittlePilgrim and blackeyedpeas on this one.

I haven't read DigitGen's post all the way through but here's a few of my ideas. :)
It will not be long? I can't see any evidence to support this supposition, either in the Bible or elsewhere.

Now that's where it starts getting a bit tricky. You could argue that anything which is written which is not part of the Bible is an addition to it - and that you therefore fall foul of that guidance by writing anything at all, including posting on forums like this one.

Another literal interpretation is that the only true scripture is the original Hebrew and Greek, and that any translation into any other language is also an "extra-Biblical message". Is it permissible to translate or paraphrase the Bible into modern vernacular, or is it encumbent on all of us to learn the original language? The fact that the Bible itself was not written in "tongues" as described in Acts chapter 2, and that we therefore have to learn a language before we can understand the Bible, has not escaped my attention. If there was only one true self-evident interpretation of every last point in the Bible, then there would be no need for anyone to learn any languages.

Besides - what exactly is wrong with having the plaques that are written in this book added to you anyway? If the Bible is such a good book, then being given the honor of carrying a stone engraving of some of its text around with you would surely be a good thing, no? (I had to look up this passage in The Message before I realised that the verse probably means that the bad stuff that happened in Revelations might happen to you too.)

Admittedly I haven't read any more, but I think it's good and proper that we should discuss such things, because it makes us think, it helps us to a better understanding of the Bible, and it also brings us together as a church in the process. So thanks to everyone for posting.

http://www.nlbchapel.org/Power.htm

In the Image of Christ
Colossians 3:8-11

“The Power of God?”

        “For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect. For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God. For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent. Where [is] the wise? where [is] the scribe? where [is] the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world? For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe. For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom: But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumbling block, and unto the Greeks foolishness; But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God."  1Cor.1:17-24

                Nowadays it is common to hear people talk about the power of God. Many people testify of how the power of God has healed them of some sickness or blessed them with financial wealth, or caused them to speak in tongues. Today many so-called faith healers boldly proclaim that they have been anointed with power from on high. They display so-called healings and other signs and (lying) wonders to make people believe they’ve been anointed by God’s mighty power. Many of them claim that Jesus manifests Himself bodily in their presence and instructs them of His will. It is amazing the stunts that these charlatans come up with to deceive people into believing that they are anointed with the power of God. In fact, like showmen or entertainers, they keep trying to outdo each other in their rise to fame and power. One man blows his breath at people and they fall over backwards as if knocked out by some power or force. They call this stunt being slain in the Spirit, which by the way, is something you never see in the Scriptures. Is this man really anointed with the power of God, or does he just have a case of really bad breath? Another man claims it was a 900-foot tall Jesus that spoke with him, apparently the manifestation of a normal size Jesus was too common and unspectacular. It doesn’t take long nowadays for a new signs and wonders fad to come along and take the spotlight and center stage, and as time goes on they are getting stranger and stranger.

        Dear friends, the power of God is not a circus sideshow as it is so commonly portrayed today. It is not signs and wonders as many of today’s swindlers want you to believe. The true power of God is displayed in the preaching of the cross and seeing lost souls saved from the wrath of God and inheriting eternal life, as the above texts points out. I’m amazed when I watch some of the signs and wonders performers today; their focus is on health, wealth and the signs and wonders that they claim God does through them, and yet you hardly ever see them focus on the gospel. They have huge audiences coming to them seeking a sign, or healing, or to watch them perform their tricks. It has become a form of “Christian entertainment.” Jesus Himself warned against such things in the book of Matthew:

        “Then certain of the scribes and of the Pharisees answered, saying, Master, we would see a sign from thee. But he answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of  the prophet Jonas: For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth”    (Matt. 12:38-40).

        Jesus said it was an evil and adulterous generation, not a righteous and godly one that sought after signs. What’s so amazing in this verse is that the only sign that Jesus was going to give them was the sign of Jonas who was in the belly of a great fish for three days and nights, which was a figure of the Lord’s burial in the heart of the earth. Jesus was pointing them to His sacrificial death, burial and resurrection by this figure. The only sign Jesus was going to give them was the gospel. Our passage from 1 Cor. 1 above says that the Jews require a sign and that the cross was a stumbling block for them. How sad it is that these people missed out on the gospel that could save their souls because their focus was on signs and wonders instead of Jesus Christ and the cross.

        Those who are seeking after signs thinking that the signs are the power of God are deceiving themselves. The Bible warns about a man that will deceive most of the world by his power, signs and lying wonders, in 2 Thessalonians chapter 2:

        “And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: [Even him], whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved”    (2 Thess. 2:8-10).

        This man will be the antichrist, and he will use signs and wonders to deceive the people of the world. Those who think that signs and wonders are the way God manifest His power will easily be deceived by the antichrist who is possessed by Satan himself. In fact, the antichrist will proclaim himself to be God, and most of the world will worship him as such. It’s no wonder then that Jesus said it was an evil and adulterous generation that sought after a sign.

        Remember, the true display of God’s power is the preaching of the gospel which has the power to save those who believe. The apostle Paul knew the true power of God and made it clear in 1 Cor. 1:17-24. He wrote the same thing to the Romans:

        “For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek”    (Rom. 1:16).

        Dear friend, the only way to experience the true power of God in your life is by repenting of your sins and believing the gospel. Even if these so-called faith healers could make you healthy and wealthy someday, you are still going to die and meet your Creator, who will judge you (Heb. 9:27).  If you have repented of your old sinful ways of life and believed the preaching of the cross of Jesus, you will inherit eternal life. If the cross is a stumbling block to you and your life has never been transformed by the saving power of the cross of Jesus Christ, you will be damned and experience the second death, which is to be thrown into the lake of fire, where there will be wailing and gnashing of teeth for all eternity (Rev. 20:11-15).  Allow me to give you some sound advice, call on the Name of the Lord Jesus while there’s still time to be saved (Rom. 10:9-13). Don’t put it off another day, by then it might be to late (2 Cor. 6:2).

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