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DW, thanks for sharing that info on cults. What a coincidence, Mormonism has been on my mind lately. I have a lot of questions about Mormons and the Church of Latter Day Saints. I have taken into account what DW has already posted but I would like to make a seperate thread to ask questions.

Two mormon missionaries visited me while I was in Taiwan. My aunt, who is mormon, scheduled the visit. They came back a few times. I thought a lot about what they presented to me. If what Mormonism (up to what I know) is true, then the Church of Latter Day Saints is the true church that God intended to be on earth.

I do not know much about Mormonism but I plan on reading the book of Mormon and asking God whether this is true. But I would like some insight from those of you who know more on the subject.

Moroni 10:4-5

The Challenge: Moroni 10:4 & 5

As a Bible-believing Christian, I pretty much ignored the challenge by the Mormon missionaries to read and pray about the Book of Mormon. It didn't help that my church had never covered the topic. When I was 31 years old, my best friend at work was Mark McAllister. We were working the same job and spent a lot of time together. One day at work, he told me that I really needed to know for sure if the Book of Mormon is true or not. He challenged me to read and pray about it (Moroni 10:4-5). As I considered his challenge, I realized that he was right. I really did need to know for sure if the Book of Mormon was true or false. If it is false, no one should be one. If it is true, everyone should be one because it is from the true God. Therefore, I would need to be a Mormon.

I went home that night, knelt down on my knees in my Bible study room, and asked God to reveal to me whether the Book of Mormon was true or not. My Sunday school classes had never covered Mormonism but now I needed to know the actual facts. I promised God that I would tell everyone what He helped me find out.

One of the things He helped me discover was that the original prophets who wrote on the plates began their work with a disclaimer. Instead of saying that their writing was inspired by God or "thus saith the Lord," they would start by pointing out that this work was a product of their own personal opinion! They would also be commanded by their earthly fathers, rather than by Heavenly Father. The following is a collection of the Book of Mormons human origins.

The Book of Mormon: Work of Man!

"And I know that the record which I make is true; and I make it with mine own hand; and I make it according to my knowledge." (1 Nephi 1:3)

"Nevertheless, I do not write anything upon plates save it be that I think it be sacred. And now, if I do err, even did they err of old; not that I would excuse myself because of other men, but because of the weakness which is in me, according to the flesh, I would excuse myself." (1 Nephi 19:6)

"And I, Lehi, according to the things which I have read, must needs suppose that an angel of God, according to that which is written, had fallen from heaven; wherefore, he became a devil, having sought that which was evil before God." (2 Nephi 2:17)

"...wherefore, Nephi gave me, Jacob, a commandment concerning the small plates, upon which these things are engraven. And he gave me, Jacob, a commandment that I should write upon these plates a few of the things which I considered to be most precious, ..." (Jacob 1:1,2)

"...I conclude this record, declaring that I have written according to the best of my knowledge..." (Jacob 7:26)

"Now, my son, I do not say that their resurrection cometh at the resurrection of Christ; but behold, I give it as my opinion, that the souls and the bodies are reunited, of the righteous, at the resurrection of Christ, and his ascension into heaven.' (Alma 40:20)

"Now behold, I, Jarom, write a few words according to the commandment of my father, Enos, that our genealogy may be kept...it must needs be that I write a little but I shall not write the things of my prophesying, nor of my revelations..." (Jarom 1:1,2)

"Behold, it came to pass that I, Omni, being commanded by my father, Jarom, that I should write somewhat upon these plates, to preserve our genealogy... But behold, I of myself am a wicked man, and I have not kept the statutes and the commandments of the Lord as I ought to have done...and I had kept these plates according to the commandments of my fathers..." (Omni 1:1-3)

"And now I, Amaron, write the things whatsoever I write, which are few, in the book of my father." (Omni 1:4)

"And now I, Mormon, ... began to be learned somewhat after the manner of the learning of my people) and Ammaron said unto me: I perceive that thou art a sober child, and art quick to observe; Therefore, when ye are about twenty and four years old I would that ye should remember the things that ye have observed concerning this people;...and ye shall engrave on the plates of Nephi all the things that ye have observed concerning this people." [writing according his own learning] (Mormon 1:1-4)

"Behold I, Moroni, do finish the record of my father, Mormon. Behold, I have but few things to write, which things I have been commanded by my father...And whoso receiveth this record, and shall not condemn it because of the imperfections which are in it, the same shall know of greater things than these. Behold, I am Moroni; and were it possible, I would make all things known unto you." [All things aren't possible with God?] (Mormon 8:1, 12)

"Condemn me not because of mine imperfection, neither my father, because of his imperfection, neither them who have written before him; but rather give thanks unto God that he hath made manifest unto you our imperfections, that ye may learn to be more wise than we have been. And now, behold, we have written this record according to our knowledge, in the characters which are called among us the reformed Egyptian, being handed down and altered by us, according to our manner of speech. And if our plates had been sufficiently large we should have written in Hebrew; but the Hebrew hath been altered by us also; and if we could have written in Hebrew, behold, ye would have had no imperfection in our record. But the Lord knoweth ... that none other people knoweth our language; ... therefore he hath prepared means for the interpretation thereof." (Mormon 9:31-34)

"And now I, Moroni, have written the words which were commanded me, according to my memory; and I have told you the things which I have sealed up; therefore touch them not in order that ye may translate; for that thing is forbidden you, except by and by it shall be wisdom in God." (Ether 5:1)

"And I said unto him: Lord, the Gentiles will mock at these things, because of our weakness in writing; for Lord thou has made us mighty in word by faith, but thou has not made us mighty in writing; for thou hast made all this people that they could speak much, because of the Holy Ghost which thou hast given them; And thou hast made us that we could write but little, because of the awkwardness of our hands...Thou hast also made our words powerful and great, even that we cannot write them; wherefore, when we write we behold our weakness, and stumble because of the placing of our words; and I fear lest the Gentiles shall mock at our words. And when I had said this, the Lord spake unto me, saying: Fools mock, but they shall mourn; and my grace is sufficient for the meek, that they shall take no advantage of your weakness; ... " (Ether 12:23-27)

"Now I, Moroni, write somewhat as seemeth me good; and I write unto my brethren, ..."(Moroni 10:1)
Cont., next post

I think that is the best way to look at it.  Honestly look at the faith objectively and then see if in yourself you feel the holy spirit in that church.  Then you will have an unbiased opinion of them.  It's easy for people from other denominations to pick apart faiths and practices different from there own, but is that what the scriptures want us to do?  We are all christians bound together in brotherhood, without the labels of Catholic, Baptist, Mormon, Mennanite, Quaker, and others.

Absolute Proof

These quotes are conclusive evidence that the original authors from the Book of Mormon were producing a work of man. If God wanted the Book of Mormon to be inspired, He could have inspired its authors. But, as we have seen, the original authors of the Book of Mormon admitted that they wrote from their own human opinions, according to the best of their own knowledge, with their own errors and imperfections, and according to their own memory at the commandments of men. By their written testimony they altered the words on their own without God's help, and were supposedly ridiculed by men because of their weakness in writing. The original authors of the Book of Mormon wrote by their own hand upon the plates without the inspiration of God.

Abridgment of Gods Scriptures?

The claim that the original writers of the individual books in the Book Of Mormon wrote through inspiration ("the gift and power of God") means that every word would have been inspired scripture. Gods truth never changes. Gods word never changing through abridgments. God has severe penalties for those who would add or take away from his word. The fact that anyone would have eliminated some of Gods words through an abridgment goes against Gods word. (Rev 22:18-19).

The Bible: A Work from God

The Bible says, "All scripture is given by inspiration of God and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness." (II Timothy 3:16) The men who God inspired to write the books of the Bible clearly acknowledged that God was their source: "And the Lord spake unto Moses..." "...the Lord spake unto Joshua..." "The vision of Isaiah...for the Lord hath spoken..." "The word of the Lord came to" Ezekiel, Jeremiah, Hosea, Joel, and the other Old Testament prophets. The New Testament gospels are written eye-witness accounts of what Jesus actually did and said. Paul, Peter, James, John, and Jude all wrote as servants of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ."

The Book Of Mormon .. Which Version?

The LDS church has printed six additional versions since the first edition of the Book of Mormon in 1830. The other years of change were 1837, 1840, 1842, 1879, 1920, and 1981. Like the earlier versions, many words were changed. Which version is the one translated by God? The quotes above are essentially the same in all versions. The latest (7th) version has a comment about the previous versions. "About this edition: Some minor errors in the text have been perpetuated in past editions. This edition contains corrections that seem appropriate to bring the material into conformity with prepublication manuscripts and early editions edited by the prophet Joseph Smith."  

God's Way?

When God works, He doesn't make any mistakes. God is in the inspiration business. His works are perfect the first time. He doesn't run out of plates before the end of his words. He knows the future, so there is no need for an abridgment of his work.

The Book of Mormon claims to be translated by "the gift and power of God." God reveals His truth in man's native language, there is never a need for a translation. Man takes the work of God and shares it. This includes, copying, translating, abridging, making different versions and introducing errors.

The real God does not write true scripture with disclaimers in it. A work of errors is not from the true God. Why didn't the abridgers, eliminate the words and works of man? Why would God translate a faulty work of man with all the errors intact?

http://www.macgregorministries.org/mormons/pray_about.html

Hope this helps you out felix.
Bob

Felix102:
You will NEVER learn what the Mormons believe by reading the Book of Mormon. To learn what they believe, you have to go to "The Pearl of Great Price", and "Doctrines and Covenants." They give out that book as their "hook" and hope you swallow it.

Having read the Book of Mormon, I found it very dry reading and it reads a lot like the Old Testament. I never knew just what they believed until I went to a presentation by an x-mormon. Having read the Book of Mormon I thought I knew what they believed. Was I ever in for a shock.

I have spent many hours with many Mormon missionaries. They try to lead you into believing that they believe in the same God and Jesus as you do. Do I have news for you.

When they tell me that we believe in the same God and Jesus, I assure them that we don't. Their god had a father, grand-father, great-great-grand father and that goes on to infinity. My God has always been. Their Jesus had a brother named Lucifer. My Jesus is God.

They believe their god created the universe from existing materials, whereas my God spoke everything into existance.

When they tell me that their god created the universe from existing materials, I reply: "Man I would really like to see the pile he started with."

For information as to what they believe, go to the Utah Lighthouse Ministries at: http://www.utlm.org/. It is run by Jerald and Sandra Tanner. Sandra is the great-great-granddaughter of Bringham Young, the second leader of the Mormon Chruch.

I have yet to meet a Mormon that I didn't like and enjoy my encounters with them. However, they are always amazed as to how much I know about their religion. I even have printouts from all their secret ceremonies.

DON'T SWALLOW THE HOOK.

God Bless.
Live Well, Laugh Often and Love the Lord!

Thank you all very much. Helped a lot.

I agree with some parts but not the first part and the last sry but if you knew the beliefs of Mormons you know that they arent Christians.  First they dont believe in the Trinity (as three in one) and believe they are three of the many of their gods.   Other gods are human beings who have, through works and time, become divine.  Sry if this offendes you i just though you should know.  

Felix,
It is always easy to recognize a non-christian church. They always have another gospel in their hand. The Mormons follow the writings of Joseph Smith.. They deny the Trinity and do not beleive  that Jesus Christ is divine, /the Son of God.

Before you waste your time reading the false teachings of Mormonisn, please go to keyword, you can find out for yourself what they believe. Start with the question, "Are Mormons Christian?"
They also believe that the inspired Word of God is correct only if it lines with the book of Mormon. That would tell me that they have accepted Joseph Smith words over Gods. That is dangerous.
I hope that you can influence your Aunt to leave the Mormon church. It is one of the largest cults world wide.

Felix,
I clicked on the wrong key before I had a chance to sign off. I'm  sorry.

God bless you,
bluelake.  :)

I still think Mormons are Christians, as are Catholics (of which Roman Catholicism is just a sect of), Protestants, and the Greek Orthodox.  Mormons are just in the extremely radical end of the spectrum, while the other three are in the "good" spot.

I don't see where you got your definition of "cult."  I still think they are just really, really radical Christians.

The word Christian mean a follower of Jesus Christ and His teachings. The Mormons do not fall into this category.

2Corinthians11:4 "For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which we have not recieved, or another gospel, which we have not accepted, we might well bear with him."

I do not worship the same Jesus that the Mormons worship. My Jesus is the Son of God who was God Himself manifested in the flesh. The Mormon Jesus is the brother of Lucifer.

God Bless.
Live Well, Laugh Often and Love the Lord!

"[/size][/b][/u]
Mormonism is a form a Christianity in the sense that it traces its roots back to the teachings of Christ, and uses the same Old and New Testaments with only slight modifications and additional testaments and teachings. However, its practices are very different from contemporary Protestant and Catholic Christianity. Many Protestant and Catholic sects exclude it from Christianity entirely, and subjected Mormons to a great deal of persecution during the early years of the Church. For an extensive and detailed explanation see the following articles discussing differences and similarities."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christianity#Christianity_and_Mormonism [/color]

 You say your a Christian, then you make statements like that???

 Which is it my confused friend? are you an evolutionist - a Mormon - or a Christian? There is only one truth, pick a side and go with it, get off the fence before your bum gets sore!  ;D

Make up your alleged mind Sibbal!  :P

Bronzesnake

THEY USE "slight modifications" of the bible they have there own bible which isnt a bible and they have changed so many times its redicilous and to have additional testaments and teachings.  Is totally saying that I dont believe that God knows what he's talking about so im going to change this so it agrees with me and since the Bible is God breathed or inspiried. your messing with God's word and also these people are polythesistic because they dont believe in the Trinity they see it as three gods seperate.  And they believe they themselves can be God to.  Also its a matter of there salvation they dont have any.  They are lost.  The world might consider them a sec of Christianity but they are not.  They are one of those groups who are off seperate and think they believe in what believe in but they dont.  And some of those other groups you mentioned Sleeker they aren't Christians either because they dont believe that salvation is permnant and comes from and through Jesus Christ dying on the cross for our sins and raising up again.

I'm both an evolutionist, and a Christian (not of the Mormon sect either).
It's all relative.  You believe they aren't Christians because they are so radical.  They probably believe all the other Christians are extremely conservative who don't want to change.  If another sect of Christianity comes by that's even more radical than Mormonism, they'll think that both Mormonism and the rest of Christianity is really conservative.

"Mormonism is based on belief in Jesus as the Messiah."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mormonism

"The Christian religion, founded on the life and teachings of Jesus."
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=Christianity

  ;D

Evangilist put it quite well in another thread. That fence will be turning into a sword.

Amen Pastor Roger!

 EYOUCH! Talk about a split personality!!

Those who are wize will get to the "bottom" of that remark.

Bronzesnake

  :-X  

  :D ;D

Bronzesnake

I have only one question...what does EYOUCH mean?  :P

EYOUCH = It hurts pretty bad.  

 I was just trying to be wize ;D

There is no gray area with God! (James 1:17)
You either love and serve Him or you don't! (Revelation 3:16).

I'm not saying that they are right for doing that.  I'm not condoning it in any way.  I'm just saying they are Christians, but they are extremely radical and have a skewed vision of Jesus.  By the way, Wikipedia is a very good and reliable site.

 They are not Christians...They're Mormons...hello!!?
Christians believe in the Holy Bible - Jesus is God.

 Just because you call yourself a Christian doesn't make it so.

Bronzesnake

Wikipedia is worthless and is based on world views and not
Christian views if you look at a Christian its defintly not going to be a Mormon.  The world clusters all these people together who believe in God and call it Christianity while we know that is not true because the concept of salvation is very different and the attributes of God.

Please read Cults, Different Groups (http://forums.christiansunite.com/index.php?board=6;action=display;threadid=6468)  <-- click the link

Moronism is in the first two posts.
Bob

Finally someone with a link...and more backup.

The Link is to a  thread here, if you looked you would have seen it. ??? ???

Its still a link no matter how you look at it.

What do yall think about polygamy? Is that bad?

 I get into enough trouble with one wife!  :(

Bronzesnake

Umm...dream...i was looking at a few posts...and i can't help but ask, did you intentionally call it moronism? I thought it was funny, but i wasn't sure if it was a typo or not. anywho...those who call themselves Christians, yet completely dis-regard what Scripture says and write something contradictory to what Scripture has so plainly put down, leads me to question whether or not they are true Believers...Just a few thoughts. God Bless.

Joshua

;D ;) ;D

:) score one for Jemi!!! Woota!  ;D

Mormons teach that Jesus is the brother of Lucifer. The Bible teaches that Jesus is the Son of God. Which is more believable to you? (Mt.1:23, Lu.1:31-32)
 Mormons are not christian. They follow a different gospel. The Book of Mormon. They also teach that the Bible, the word of God, must line up with the teaching of the man Joseph Smith. Does that sound like christianity to you?

bluelake

Personally, I'd rather have a housekeeper than another husband.

Once again, my friend has a powerpoint presentation on CD on Mormonism. If anyone would like a copy, PM with your address.

Just a few facts about Mormonism: Joseph Smith wrote the Book of Mormom with the help of a seer stone. He put this stone in his hat, put his head down to the hat and covered the sides of his head. He did this for some time, can't remember how long, and dictated the whole book to someone (maybe his wife, have to look that up).

The Book of Mormom has been changed or modified over 2000 times!!

The Mormom religion is not even the same religion that was taught when it was first "invented."

Joseph Smith was also affiliated, very much so, to the Free Masons.

If you go to the Mormom Temple in Salt Lake City, there are pentagrams all over the building.

If a woman wants to leave the church, then the church elders try and help mend the marriage. If they cannot, they counsel the man to leave and divorce the woman.

Mormonism is NOT, and I repeat NOT, Christianity. If Mormon doctrine is to be believed, then Adolf Hitler is in heaven. How you ask? Because Mormoms believe that when you die, if you aren't saved, someone can get baptised in your place and then you go to heaven. Scary thought.

If you'd like more info, let me know. I could go on for days. I used to be a baptised Mormom. Another scary thought.

Hunter out