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Title: Dutch Doctor proud of killing four newborns Post by: justjonny on December 27, 2004, 08:29:20 PM click here for full article (http://www.infowars.com/articles/life/dutch_doc_four_newborns.htm)
Quote The Dutch doctor spoke animatedly in his hospital office as he explained why he had agreed to break the law and kill a seriously deformed baby. "There is a small group of children for whom no treatment is possible for the congenital disease and malformations they are born with," said Eduard Verhagen, the head of paediatrics at Groningen Hospital in the Netherlands. "Asking doctors to take away the pain easily and allow the child to die quietly is the natural reaction. Adolf Hitler would be proud. The globalist elite are slowly conditioning the masses to accept euthanasia."For the incurable to die early requires that we do this or they enter a starvation phase and what suffering is more unbearable than a minor left to die from natural causes such as these." Dr Verhagen's actions have already provoked condemnation from the Vatican and others who argue that the right-to-life must remain inviolable. Title: Re:Dutch Doctor proud of killing four newborns Post by: Shammu on December 28, 2004, 02:51:54 PM click here for full article (http://www.infowars.com/articles/life/dutch_doc_four_newborns.htm) Yes, it is just one more sign of the times. Matthew 5:21 Ye have heard that it was said of them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment: Quote The Dutch doctor spoke animatedly in his hospital office as he explained why he had agreed to break the law and kill a seriously deformed baby. "There is a small group of children for whom no treatment is possible for the congenital disease and malformations they are born with," said Eduard Verhagen, the head of paediatrics at Groningen Hospital in the Netherlands. "Asking doctors to take away the pain easily and allow the child to die quietly is the natural reaction. Adolf Hitler would be proud. The globalist elite are slowly conditioning the masses to accept euthanasia."For the incurable to die early requires that we do this or they enter a starvation phase and what suffering is more unbearable than a minor left to die from natural causes such as these." Dr Verhagen's actions have already provoked condemnation from the Vatican and others who argue that the right-to-life must remain inviolable. Resting in the arms of Jesus. Bob Title: Re:Dutch Doctor proud of killing four newborns Post by: Saved_4ever on December 30, 2004, 01:15:58 AM I'm not one for euthanasia but I can't honestly tell you I would not want to see my child/newborn in agony. I think you miss the point of how bad these deformations really are. In a lot of cases they can't even eat and brain activity is minimal. It's not like they are going to be handicapped for life, they've been given a death sentence right out of the gate and wouldn't live for very long anyhow.
I think you need to think about these particular cases, though it could be quite the slippery slope. Title: Re:Dutch Doctor proud of killing four newborns Post by: musicllover on January 04, 2005, 03:26:52 PM Dear saved,
I understand, slipper slope YES. We must be careful where we allow our hearts to lead us on this one. I too find myself thinking .....but the handicapps are so terrilbe, the suffering so great, its a baby so innocent and precious, it seem humane to end thier suffereing........ but nothing can take away the facts, the word tells un not to kill. I've kick these thougth around in my head so I thought I'd write them here. We can not play God? Can man honestly determines who is too deformed and who isn't, sure he can that is why we have so many different relegions, ice creams flavors and sytles in the world,and eggs cause cancer one month and not the next. Once your on that side of the hill who deteremines the guide lines anyway? I believe that Christ took the pain and suffering to the cross for us, dieng for all man-kind, deformed or not. But because of the fall of man, our own free wills peopls still experience pain and suffering, not matter the age, we can be young or old and ready to die sometimes pain and suffering is part of the dieing process. (Doesn't the fall of man seems so lame and over used sometimes). Could these babies be more blessed than even you and I, to live so short and suffer so great, or just the opposite. Because the fall of man, isn't pain and suffering a part of life no matter how short that life may be? What might be their end if they were allowed to live and die as God had appointed? An early death full of pain and misery, a long life in pain in misery, or some miracle in the making? Honestly take away the fact that we are talking about babies and there isn't much difference between these babies and some adults. The word tells us even the rocks can cry out......a baby with no brain, not to sound mean or unfeeling but if a rock can worship then so can the defromed baby. I don't know either. Just some question I asked myself after reading the article. Title: Re:Dutch Doctor proud of killing four newborns Post by: Saved_4ever on January 05, 2005, 04:05:59 AM You see the other problem is we already allow poeple to live longer when ill because we sustain them with machines. More often than not and I would put money on the fact that these "deformed" babies are not surviving on their own. What about braindead people (from accidents or otherwise) that are only alive because we've hooked them up to machines? Is that not playing God by your definition? If we "had let it to nature" than a lot of ICU people would have been dead long ago. Now we have this issue where we think it's killing if we take them off the machines. Either way we are really playing God when we use medicine and surgery. We have to "keep people alive" while we cut them open and replace their heart or put stents in their arteries. Operations we have to circumvent the natural course God has given us and even more often we have placed on ourselves. How many overweight, smoking drinking, etc people have heart surgery?
We have given ourselves a shortened life by our own actions and then we go and try to make our body last longer than "God intended". We have made these questions harder on ourselves and God was not considered in the matter I'm sure. So be careful of the argument you use. And to simply save the bible tells us not to "kill" is inacurate when the whole word is taken into context. God commanded whole nations of people to be executed and we kill animals and plants every day so we can eat. It's a hard question for sure and again I would want to know how long these babies would live without any fancy intervention. Such as if the child has no brain (it can't worship either we take some things out of context) then it's heart will not pump and it will die shortly. Now what do you think? Title: Re:Dutch Doctor proud of killing four newborns Post by: musicllover on January 05, 2005, 01:18:56 PM You see the other problem is we already allow poeple to live longer when ill because we sustain them with machines. More often than not and I would put money on the fact that these "deformed" babies are not surviving on their own. What about braindead people (from accidents or otherwise) that are only alive because we've hooked them up to machines? Is that not playing God by your definition? If we "had let it to nature" than a lot of ICU people would have been dead long ago. Now we have this issue where we think it's killing if we take them off the machines. Either way we are really playing God when we use medicine and surgery. We have to "keep people alive" while we cut them open and replace their heart or put stents in their arteries. Operations we have to circumvent the natural course God has given us and even more often we have placed on ourselves. How many overweight, smoking drinking, etc people have heart surgery? We have given ourselves a shortened life by our own actions and then we go and try to make our body last longer than "God intended". We have made these questions harder on ourselves and God was not considered in the matter I'm sure. So be careful of the argument you use. And to simply save the bible tells us not to "kill" is inacurate when the whole word is taken into context. God commanded whole nations of people to be executed and we kill animals and plants every day so we can eat. It's a hard question for sure and again I would want to know how long these babies would live without any fancy intervention. Such as if the child has no brain (it can't worship either we take some things out of context) then it's heart will not pump and it will die shortly. Now what do you think? Saved, Sure people are kept alive my machines, (Not something that I would want), not something that we allowed when my oder brother fell over dead when he was chopping wood. Some have signed living wills asking for their life to be sustained by what ever means, others have asked just the opposite. Problem with alot of this is the money issue, some can't afford it, dont want the burden left to their families, some are scared of death and will do what ever it takes to pospone it. Maybe they need that extra time too.But who decieded for these babies, doctors, parents. Who is held responsilbe? Man stands back and says will it was for the best, poor dears never had a chance. But what about in God's eyes? Who will stand before the Judgement throne of God. If we could remember to measure everything by its eternal value maybe some of the ugly of the world could be diverted........(sure in a perfect world right). In this case there isn't surgery, machines. The article doesn't say how the doctore kills these babies either. BUt either way I don't believe anyone has the right to take a life. I forget the young womens name who when taken of the machine would starve to death.......but that is a big arguement too. Man put her on it, so when is enough enough. I don't have an answer. But the articles says nothing of machines in these 4 deaths. Some parents agreed to at least one of the murders,I wonder why don't they kill their own baby? The doctor did the Killing, he determined the extreme deformations, and as much as my heats wants to stop the babies pain this doesn't justify killing them. I'm horrified that now some how killing them is an option ! This should never be offered to begin with. The doc/parents purposely took their lives becuase it was more humane than allowing the baby to die a natural death........because of the pain involved, if you believe I took the scriptures out of context I'm sorry, but if they have no brain then the have no pain either so let nature take it coarse......... (I don't intend to take scripture out of context, not sure what you meant). If a rock can worship a defromed child has the right to life, no matter how long that life is. They are still a creation of God we have no right to take what few minutes, hours or days they have away from them,.....pain and suffering is a apart of life, it was a part of Christ's life. Is it wrong to want to stop that pain and suffering NO, is it wrong to stop it my cold blooded murder YES. Anything done to stop the childs life aside of letting them die is wrong. Thou shall not kill...... we can't play God, there is no taking this out of context. I don't understand why God called the Iserlites to kill all, man, women, child and beast, maybe because they were pagan nations that would lead the people of God astray, and they did many times. I'm not going to say God is wrong, thats his business not ours I don't undertand why. I hardly believe this Doctor is called on by God to kill these babies. I know his is God, just and mighty, far superior in his wisdom than man. There is no taken the commandment out of context... Thous shall not kill. God word even when he was calling the Iserlites to kill. I defend the right of the innocent baby who has no says so, no matter how deformed they are. I pretty sure that no person is born the way God intended to begin with. Man has most defiantly shortend their own lives by their own actions, so still the fall of man play the biggest role in this mess. Thous shall not kill.....bottom line no matter what side of the slipper slope you stand on, there is no justifying murder of an innocent, slow painful death of a deformed baby. What is this life.....,long, short, easy or hard but after is eternity heaven or hell. I guess this depends on how some see death. Its not the end it the beginning, I see these babies as very blessed, after dieing they are in Jesus arms WOW. If you sliced everything out of any humans life between birth and thier death what differences would there be? For these babies its straignt to heaven, for those who have lived, well much more is involved in that mix. |