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Man oh man do i need some encouragement and prayer and HELP ME here.  =)

My daughter 17 and has been strong willed from the get go!

A bit of history: I am divorced since 1993, due to that fact that their dad was strong willed and quite manipulative in that when i said yes he said no and i said white he said black, kind of thing.  It was quite frustrating to the point that i nearly had a nervous break down.

Next bit of history: i move back home, yes, big mistake, next to my parents.  Though i love them and was raised to respect and honor them, how do you tell your mom to BUTT OUT!...especially if you are like i was in 1996 when my daughter said DONT MAKE ME LIVE IN THAT TRAILOR WITH YOU! and her grand mother, my mom said PLEASE DONT MAKE HER LIVE IN THAT TRAILOR WITH YOU! and here i am trying to keep the peace.

Okay, next bit of history:  my daughter lived with them for 3 years in their 'we have money to spoil her rotten'....not thinking that she was different from me in that she has a STRONG WILLED spirit and i was/am submissive as their child.

are you following me??

NOW today: She moved back in with me and it is her SENIOR year in high school...need i say more?  She is used to getting everything she wants and here i am to pick up the pieces and get her to the point of  OBEY me....

I say, in the heat of an argument..."go to your room" and she does not do that simple thing, and i need her to do that just so i can re-group and remain calm.  No, she wont do that, she follows me every where I go.  

I sometimes go into the closet and close the door behind me and sit in the dark.  All the while she has positioned herself on the floor outside of the closet talking, talking, talking, talking.

**Are you still with me?**

I pray, i take authority over stuff, I pray, i cry, i become frustrated, but still i have hope.

Any advice from any parent of the strong willed child.

If you do not have a strong willed child, please do not think for a moment you could possibly understand what i am going through.  I dont mean that in a mean way, but man you really must have a strong willed child to understand the magnitude of frustration a parent feels when reasoning does not work on one.

God Bless and thanks

Hi grommie  :)

I sometimes go into the closet and close the door behind me and sit in the dark.  All the while she has positioned herself on the floor outside of the closet talking, talking, talking, talking.


first thing you need to do is THANK GOD you`ve got a teen who is willing to talk to you  ;)


and i was/am submissive as their child.

hiding in the closet while your teen is trying to talk to you?

you might not like hearing this but second thing you need to do is quit acting like a child  :-X

I pray, i take authority over stuff, I pray, i cry, i become frustrated, but still i have hope.


sounds to me like your both strong willed, so is she just copying the example you have set on how to get her own way?  


yes I raised a strong willed child, and yes it takes a lot of patience and prayer, but it also takes a consistant (key) willingness to really listen, observe, and pay  close attention to them, its very difficult to fix a problem when you dont know what the problem is   ;)

I hate seeing the label "rebellious" applied to children of any age, labels dont help children, use them often enough and the very label we apply to them is often what they become.

Divorce is a ugly thing.

yes i agree that labels are no good.

and yes i agree with a majority of the things that you said.

and that last reply, no duh!  dont i know it.  but it was either committing suicide or leave him.  and i could not commit suicide.


I do listen to her Shylynne.  Most of the time i have no clue what to say to her as she has something to say about everything.  We do talk, but there are times when i just cant handle it and i ask her to give me time to re-group, but she wont.  What can i do?  

I understand what you are saying grommie,  but you said two key things that , without knowing either of you, tells me a lot about your daughter:

she follows me every where I go and talking, talking, talking, talking.

That says she wants a relationship with you, is trying to get close to you, and is craving your attention. Does this mean she will listen to everything you say, no, nor does it mean she wont argue with you, disagree with you, and maybe drive you completely up the wall lol...but look at it this way...shes 17 right...so you`ve got one, maybe two years at best  to create a mother/daughter bond that will allow you to be the best influence possible in her life, pour all the energy and time you can muster into doing this...and if you need space...well she has to sleep sometime eh   ;)  
One of the biggest walls  parents with teens run into  is how do I get them to TALK to me, so you want her to keep talking, if not maybe quite so much lol.  ;)  When you dont know what to say, let her chatter, your willingness to listen,  is more important than your answers anyways.

As to obedience, i`m not sure how to address that when it involves a 17 year old, where you allowed someone else to take over your role as mother for three years,  and then somehow expected to step right back into the role of parenting?  I do believe that the bond you create will directly effect  her willingness to respect what you have to say. However I don`t  believe there`s  room in a parents vocabulary for saying "I can`t handle it", you can because you must.  You already tried letting someone else handle it, and your living with the results.

how do you tell your mom to BUTT OUT!

You say BUTT OUT!  ;D

Thanks Shylynne.  Thought some of it made me incredibly mad, lol, I will bare in mind and take to prayer many things you have adviced me on.

God Bless

Here's a radical thought.... ;D

Have you just sat down with your daughter and discussed this with her? She's at an age where she's almost an adult but still somewhat of a child. That's a hard age to deal with and it's a hard age to be!  :-X

But maybe try to lay it all out for her. For instance:

"I know all of this must have been hard on you. Decisions were made that affected you and you've had to deal with it though you had no say in it. I apologize for the fact that adults make so many mistakes that kids have to deal with. I know it's not fair, but it's done, and now we have to move on and establish some sort of order in our relationship. I'm your mother and I love you and I'm not perfect but I want to try and do what's best for both of us.

I also know that you're no longer a child and you're still not an adult and I know that's a hard place to be. But I also know that I'm still responsible for you and I want to have a relatuionship where we can communicate with each other and work through issues as they come up and maybe keep other problems from happening by getting to know each other all over again.

When you were born, I looked at you and wanted/hoped/felt.......?? Now I see that you're almost old enough to go out on your own and I want to be sure you're ready for that. It's hard for me to believe that you are already 17. When I was 17 the hardest thing for me to deal with was.....?? "

Maybe ask her what she expects, wants, needs, from the relationship. Really listen. Even if it doesn't completely make sense and even if it's not completely based in reality. ;) Hear her! That she knows you listen will have a big affect. Yes, she will probably throw outlandish things out just to see how you handle them. So handle them carefully. She needs you to prove yourself to her - fair or not - so she'll know if you're worthy of respect. There's no telling what's been said that's still mulling in her head! If she says something disrespectful, you have every right to let her know that you find it to be so. Pick your battles carefully at this point so that you both don't just shut each other out!

You may also want to ask her if she has any questions and then take the time to answer them. Stay calm if she does! You may have been spoken of in a negative way but if you remain calm you can just respond to what comes up and don't retaliate verbally.  If she asks you something that you're not comfortable answering or that you think is none of her business, politely say so.

Just remember that the adults created a situation that a child is trying to deal with! Not laying fault! I'm just saying that as hard as it's been for you, it's also been hard for her! And if she's been given everything and is used to that, then there will be times when you just have to tell her that you can't or won't afford ~whatever~.

If I may ask, what prompted her decision to move back with you?

Shylynne,  sorry should have been sincereheart  =)


What prompted her to move back in:  She had been getting into trouble repeatedly. She had shown great disrespect to my parents in that she cussed them out literally, screaming, throwing a basic tantrum and they were going to pull in the reigns.  SO, she decided it was time to move out and back in with me.

Bare in mind, all 3 years i had pleaded with her to move in with me. I know how my mom is, i grew up with her.  Her way was the way to live a happy life without compromises. (my parents were not mean to me in that they hit, they just were used to having their way and if i said anything that went against what they were thinking, well there was something wrong with me...u understand Shylynne?)

They had done everything for her, buying her this and that and trying to spend time with her, though they were not prepared for this stage in her life.  Her 16th year, she was hurrying home to beat curfew and flipped the car.  Praise God she walked away from it unharmed with only a few cuts and scrapes, but they proceeded to buy her a new car.  They bought her a new car.   To this day, i can't believe they did that. And they say its HER car until she does something they dont like, then its THEIRS.  

That part i dont believe sometimes....my parents are in church every time the doors are open, though they have not learned how to love unconditionally.  

I got to hear from my mom..."i just cant love her anymore"  that has been so hard on me in that i felt more like the middle child and less like a mom.  *inside it cut me deep but I understood now what was going on.*

Libby and i do talk.  We talk more than my mom and i ever did. In fact the other day, well a couple months ago my mom remarked to me how we had an open communication when my brother and i were living in the house.  *i dont remember it that way.  Its like i said above, my thoughts had better line up with what she believed so i did not get into trouble*  but i dare not say that, no need to bring it up again.  I know God will show her through something or some one else to understand.

Libby has gotten into trouble repeatedly over drinking and getting caught by the authorities.  First time was her freshman year in high school.  She told me that she could not leave her friend behind to take the rap, and i understand she did not want to run. I commend her for that, but she got probation because of it and all of them, even the ones she stood up for, ripped her apart with their words. I was there through all of that.  Not my parents, ME.

We do talk more than i had said before, but what i was talking about, and this was my fault for not going into it more further, was when there is an argument.  It is tough being ONE parent when there is no relief in sight to the badgering of words coming from a tantrum throwing teenager.

She has told me over and over again, she wants to be left alone...to have it like she used to have it  which was  doing everything she wanted to do without any thing coming from me.  I have told her that I can not live like that anymore, it was ripping me apart.  I have told her i felt more like the chamber maid in a motel than a parent.

I do hear her.  That was not the reason i posted this....the reason i posted this is to get advice from another parent in the similar situation. And you have come to my aid in that you have offered me things to think about.  I appreciate it very much by the way.

I raised my daughter to be open, and share her feelings, but i forgot about the do it out of respect part  roflol, in that i have created a monster as it were.  =)

I have told her things from my past to help her understand why i want such and such for her, but it seems to come out more in the heated arguments than in any other area of her life.  Though, i know she hears more than i think she does.  

It is just so frustrating sometimes, to have no one to talk to about this...i have felt that im not going to make it one more year.  I have felt that im losing my mind, that everything I believed to be true has been false all along.

The father of our children is non-existent in she and my sons lives.  He just feeds their frustration, so im glad he does not call and say he is going to do this or that, then not go through on it.  I know they miss him, and where we are has never been kept from him.  He keeps himself from them for whatever reasons.

In the heat of the argument, she brings up why am i trying to be a mother to her now.  That has come up many times....my answer is this  "because i want to be the mother to you that you need me to be and that i want to be, it is never too late to try and im trying now"

I know she is going through a hard time in her life. I remember being 17 and misunderstood. I was so lonely and hated my life at that time.  I have told her as well that i am there for her no matter what.  And here i am...though "you will not understand the things i do, im still here."

The majority of the time, i can carefully answer, it's when she blows up out of the blue and lashes out with me with verbal hatred that really causes me to lose it.

The other day she was crying in her room...i opened the door and said "what's wrong?"   She ripped me apart and i felt like pond scum.

She said she did that because she did not want me to see her crying again, as this is all she does.  Though i dont see it that way. I told her  look youre my daughter, if you are crying i want to console you if i can.  If you dont want me to try, then ask me in a more polite way, not by cussing me out or telling me what a disappointment i have been in the past.

I took away her cell phone this time for good....i took it to my parents home and said, dont give it back.  They paid for it, i didnt.

Libby says things that blow me away sometimes.  Intelligent and seems to have it all together.  But then something happens, a word is said and she feels because she does not have the same thoughts that she is of no account.  (low self esteem)  She is totally gorgeous Shylynne.  Beautiful voice, excellent grades.  She gets made fun of a lot on school because ppl are jealous of her.  I try so hard to help in that area, but prayer is what works best as i dont know what to say to her on it half the time.  Her last name rhymes with whore so they use that really well.

Being a grandma is much more fun than being a mom! This stage will pass we all matured well sorta.


Mom and Dad raised a couple strong willed children ( not me of corse) LOTS of prayer and when ya think you have prayed enough start praying again.

dropping matches down the gas can

shooting matches out  of the ol BB gun

stealing change from moms purse

stealing  change from the offering plate

driving  boyfriends hot rod

getting  into fist fights (winning most  ;D )

breaking  EVERY window out of the house next door

dating a guy 10 years older then me

these things in the drug world of today dont seem like so much  this was the 50s  and early 60's

 I got spanked  and PRAYED for  or PRAYED for and spanked


Never give up on the prayer never never....

Yes any Divorce hurts!  This is why I am staying single for and Pure for God..  After being married twice, Never again.

I will Pray for you all though.. Prayer is Vital in holding each other up.

Blessings,  \o/

You can bet if i knew then what i now know, things would be a lot different.

Though i did not mean for this thread to become a Divorce debate, there have been many choices that have been made that i regret...but i nor anyone can regret forever as the very regrets can cause division between you, meant generally, and God and keep you from what HE has for you.

I never have agreed that Divorce is a good thing....though there are circumstances which I believe give a person a way out of what seems to be irreconcilable differences.  and boy am i not sure of that spelling.  =)

Rom 7:2
2 For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.
KJV

1 Cor 7:39-40

39 The wife is bound by the law as long as her husband liveth; but if her husband be dead, she is at liberty to be married to whom she will; only in the Lord.

40 But she is happier if she so abide, after my judgment: and I think also that I have the Spirit of God.
KJV


Ladies we are stuck And if have to remain married for these 40 + years so do you  :P  :P  :P  :P  :P

curious:  If the husband slams you against the wall causing you to break some ribs and arms and legs, what then?

Call the Police and have him arrested right away.  If have to be taken to the hospital, they will ask why you're here, and have them get the poilce for you! Don't give an inch, or they'll take a mile!!

ROFL!  ;D

Reba, you're my hero! And if you haven't killed yours (40+ years :-X), yet; then there just might be hope for the rest of us!  ;)

I got to hear from my mom..."i just cant love her anymore"
To give a child the impression that love for her is based on how pleasing she is..... How devastating for the child! What the prodigal son expected and did not get!


I was there through all of that.  Not my parents, ME.
Which she will always remember and more so as she gets older!

She has told me over and over again, she wants to be left alone...to have it like she used to have it  which was  doing everything she wanted to do without any thing coming from me.  I have told her that I can not live like that anymore, it was ripping me apart.  I have told her i felt more like the chamber maid in a motel than a parent.
This jumped out at me. So difficult for BOTH of you to know how to adjust to the changes!

I do hear her.
My apologies! I didn't mean to imply that you don't listen - I meant to imply that sometimes just knowing that someone cares enough to listen helps lift the load that she's obviously carrying! And I meant that sometimes we have to 'hear between the lines' of what they're not saying! Which does not mean kowtowing to her tantrums!  ;)

Libby sounds bright (able to zero right in on what hurts you) and so scared (trying to keep those who say they love her at a distance). Self-protective... It's gonna take a lot to chisel through that stone! "When children are the least loveable, that's when they're needing love the most!" ~unknown

Stay in prayer and let her know you love HER even when you hate her behavior!

When she moved back with you, did she have to change schools?

Libby says things that blow me away sometimes.  Intelligent and seems to have it all together.  But then something happens, a word is said and she feels because she does not have the same thoughts that she is of no account.  (low self esteem)  She is totally gorgeous Shylynne.  Beautiful voice, excellent grades.  She gets made fun of a lot on school because ppl are jealous of her.  I try so hard to help in that area, but prayer is what works best as i dont know what to say to her on it half the time.  Her last name rhymes with whore so they use that really well.
Ouch!

Some thoughts:
Would it be possible for the two of you to volunteer somewhere together? Soup kitchen, homeless shelter, abused children's shelter, etc.?

If she likes to sing, maybe singing at a nursing home or senior center?

Maybe she could attend a local community college and take a class or two?

Local literacy programs to help or even reading to kids?

Anything to help her see past her own situation!

Praying for you both!

sincereheart,  

Stay in prayer and let her know you love HER even when you hate her behavior!  Yes your exactly correct here, the behavior that i seem to forget is what bothers me the most.

When she moved back with you, did she have to change schools?  No.  Small town, one school.  =)  Everyone knows me and my parents as they are retired teachers, so everyone knows everyone.

her singing, this will be her 4th year to sing for the district and state music festivals.  State, however, you go to when you receive a ONE rating at the District.  and yes, she sings all over the place.

Our relationship these past few weeks has been wonderful. God knew what He was doing when He created PRAYER! (not meaning He does not know everything.)  :P  

i really dont know how ppl survive without him in their lives.

Thank you sincereheart, God has blessed me through you and i appreciate that very much.

Our relationship these past few weeks has been wonderful.
 :D That's wonderful!

God knew what He was doing when He created PRAYER!
ROFL!  ;D Prayer and weeding my gardens have kept my children alive numerous times!  ;)





Thank you sincereheart, God has blessed me through you and i appreciate that very much.
Awwww! Thanks!  :D It's nice to NOT be in trouble for a change!   :-X  ;)

Your welcome grommie, I only wanted you to see as sincereheart said "that as hard as it's been for you, it's also been hard for her!" , was really no intent to upset you.
A young girl came to me recently, tho a little older than yours, and shes really messed up, mostly because the mothers dealing with  her daughter only involves change HER. This girl is a gem, even if all her mother can see is the 'rough', it makes my heart ache to know that if she would just look into her heart, and see beyond her own agenda for her,  it would change how she deals with her, and go a long way in helping better their relationship and in getting her daughter to listen to her. It`s been my experience that children wont usually listen, if they dont feel they are being heard and understood.  
Aside from that, I think an important thing for parents to remember in dealing with older children, that  whatever we may see, is not who they are...by that I mean...rage is external - it`s not who they are...drugs are external - it`s not who they are...etc...sometimes we get so focused on the symptoms, we are not able to see they are only external evidences, and the real inner problems must be taken care of if we are to help them eliminate the undesirable methods they are using to cope.
Anyways sincerehearts advice is excellent, and I am happy to read things are improving.  :)  Prayer is the answer, God  knows how often I`ve asked for HIS wisdom, and how many times I messed up because I failed to.  :-X   Oft times God has even imparted to me wisdom THRU my children, imagine that ;)

Jam 1:5  If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all  liberally, and reproaches not; and it shall be given him.

Awwww! Thanks!   It's nice to NOT be in trouble for a change!

LOL!  yea she much prefers it when its ME thats in trouble  :P

I am currently raising a strong willed child and no how difficult it can be  :-[ I takes a lot of patience and depending on the relationship with the child and if you guys have similiar personalities you have to try to see things from the child point of veiw and then decide what the best course of action is to take.  My child happens to thrive of my moods if I stay calm and cool he is well behaved pretty much.  Of course he is still stubborn and wants to have his way but when I let him know with out losing it that it is not going to happen and there is not  any way around it then he does as he is told.  My son used to throw massive fits that would require me or my husband to physically restrain him.  One time at church it took three very large men to restrain him because he didn't want to go to sunday school.  But with a lot of consistancy and love and strict discipline he has mellowed quite a bit.  He still relapses everynow and then but that is just part of his personallity.  You say your parents wanted you to be submissive to their authority and to a certain extent that should be expected but to always have keeps the child from expressing his or herself and really is kind of lazzy on the parents part, not that I am calling you lazy because I would never judge you, I don't even know you but I does sound like when she questions or gives you a hard time you get extremely frustrated and really all you have to let her know is that she can talk all day long you are not going to change your mind and also she has to understand that if she keeps talking about something you have settled on that there will be consequences like grounding or taking the car away or the phone or what ever is most precious to her.  I haven't seen where you are giving her any reason to stop.  You are arunning from her and acting as if you are more afraid of her then anything else.

Shylynne, sincereheart, and love4God.


you guys, have really hit the nails on the heads lol.  

Yes, i had been running from her to a certain extent, but i do realize that i am all she has, other than God of course....

Yes it is hard for me to keep things away from her for a certain period of time, due partly because i just believe she has made a significant change.  though the past 2 days she has not been home much and i will have to sit down with her and discuss that thoroughly with her again.

I believe one of my best qualities, in dealing with my daughter is that I REMEMBER being her age and how horrible i had it due to the fact that i was MADE to SUBMIT and yes i have had a hard time telling any one my opinion out of a fear of being wrong.  While i do understand that just because opinions are different does not make one wrong or right, it has been difficult for me to say the least and I PRAY that my child learns more about that this year before she goes off to college that HER OPINION COUNTS for something.

YES I GOT MAD because you hit the nail on the head sincereheart, and i needed to get mad to deal with it.  Please do not feel horrible about that.  One thing God instilled me with is the ability to change no matter what.

And you guys, man, you are all a blessing due in part that You know where i am coming from and i did not have anyone to talk to about this here, where i live, at all.   Yes i love Jesus and He has always been there and will always be there, but wow PEOPLE can really help each other when they are going through things they are familiar with.

Peace to you all!
=)

Grommie, You are refreshingly humble and honest! Thank you for reminding me of the need for that!  :D



LOL!  yea she much prefers it when its ME thats in trouble
But of course! It IS your turn!  ;)

YES I GOT MAD because you hit the nail on the head sincereheart

ok now i`m confused bout who you really got mad at  ???
please let it be sincereheart  ;D  :P  :-*

ok now i`m confused bout who you really got mad at  
please let it be sincereheart

ROFL! Sorry! Name mix-up! It was YOU!!!!!!

Just in case you're not sure:

*chants: It's not me this time. It's not me this time. It's not me this time. It's not me this time.*

I believe one of my best qualities, in dealing with my daughter is that I REMEMBER being her age

you got it!  sometimes adults get impatient with young uns because they dont have their 'act' together, and forget it took years for us to get ours together and then some!  ;)
If we can be as patient with our childrens mess ups as God is with ours we might be more effective role models.

Where did I read about the mother who got angry with her child for not keeping her room clean, when her own was a pigsty  ???  :-X

Shylynne AND sincereheart


okay, which one of you is the kettle and which one is the pot because I am obviously the SOUP INSIDE


MUAHAHAHA!!   :P

ROFL!  ;D

I have three sons and they are NOTHING like I was, I was a STRONG WILLED and REBELLIOUS son. Only the Lord could have changed me.

Grace & Peace


(http://www.sirinet.net/~blkidps/blgif1.gif)

[size=24]WAS?[/size]

 :)

95% WAS   ;D

OMGOSH...I can SO relate to this topic(it will explain why I haven't been on as much)...

First off, a bit of a difference...I'm dealing right now w/ TWO thirteen yo boys(20 days apart....one is mine and my husbands and the other is his from an ex g/f)....
Anyhow, my stepson came and lived w/ us in July...the planning has been going on since May/June.  (we also have 2 daughters, 11 and 7)....
Let's see...my dh got a call from NY state (DCFS), stating that it was best for his son to get a fresh start and if we'd take him(I love how they treat kids like animals...NOT)...of course we would.  (Previously, about 5 or so months b/f that, he (dh) rec'd a call from the mom, she was freaking b/c my stepson was busted at school for buying pot.  He was also busted for breaking into cars, drinking, stealing cigarettes, etc...has a nasty temper, punches holes in walls, cusses out anyone, etc.
Sooooooo....July comes around, we get him.  Things were wonderful for a couple weeks, then all holy heck broke out.  
(oh yeah, we also rec'd in the mail that we were being sued for arrears from 1997 - present, not true, and she went onto state aide and child support had jumped to $515/month...and we were paying that even WITH him living w/ us!!!
OK...moving on...stealing from a store was involved, I took care of that w/ the manager, sucker punching my son in the back of the head, the back, kicking him in the chest and leaving marks, throwing him across the room(he has 50lbs on my son and about 7inches...hit my middle daughter, slammed her forward in the car twice, called names I can't even repeat, don't even want to....cussed me out, pushed me, threatenedme, called his dad a fag, told him I suck, this house sucks b/c we have rules, rules suck, if we loved him, we wouldn't discipline him, etc.  The list goes on...my dh had to leave to take care of the court things...he was gone a week, and what a week that was.  I've been lied to my face blatantly by him...from the beginning, called names a trucker would be ashamed of, etc.  The ulcer flared up, started w/ the throwing up all over again, stress overtook me, and I handed that over to the Lord a WHILE ago!!!  (during this time, my daughter broke her arm, my dh was severely burned and is STILL on w/c and can't walk normal ,and my aunt passed on...all w/in 8 days of each other)....
Anyhow, I kept trying to talk to him...he would scream, YOU HATE ME...and I said, no, I don't hate you , I love you, but I don't like you or your attitude.  I DEMAND respect.  He didn't care.  I always drive by this one church, and when things were at their worst w/ my stress, the sign simply said, "Love conquers all"...I was like, I've TRIED that....but, I prayed about it long and hard, and I'm finally feeling the stress lift.  
He has apologized to me, is starting to change his ways and conform, is bringing home passsing grades now(failed one subject, and just missed failing another last quarter), and he even apologized to my mom and step dad for what he said and did to them...on his own.
I know it takes a LOT of time, persistance and patience....and, of course, LOVE...as you show your daughter.  I'm starting to see attitude from my 11 yo, she has fluctuated though since she was 6(when she was dx'd w/ diabetes) and her sugars just are going crazy w/ puberty.  She also has a hard time w/ her halfbrother, the doctor labeled her w/ panic disorder b/c of all the chest pains she was experiencing and suggested counseling for us.  
It's been quite the ride, and I pray to God all is finally settling down.  I know I refuse to stress anymore, and faith and love is really all I need w/ this situation.  

I understand it is a tad bit different than yours, but I can definitely relate to a strong willed and stubborn child!!!

Sorry this is so long winded!!!
God bless!!!

Hey Grommie,

I am writng this hoping that you are still around.

I do not have a child like yours.  I do have children in Christ, that whine and complain, rebel, hurt and turn tables just for the fun of it.

One thing I struck me is that you should let God work on you before you want Him to work on your daughter.  Why? because you came first, you are supposed to have experience, and she's taken after you.  You (and your ex husband) have provided such an environment for her that it is a passtime for your daughter to irritate you.

Please, hold on with the searing :o  I am not being judgemental.  From my experience (learnt form my life and others') it is us that need reproof first. 

Only when I am the problem, there can be a solution.  When I dont think i am the problem then there is no solution at all!!

I dont know how God is going to deal with this.  I know one thing it is going to be pretty tough on you, but you will thank Him.  Because by that time, you would have forgiven yourself and others, you would have stopped thinking moving near to parents as a mistake, you would have started showering love on your parents,  you would have stopped being a rebel and become taller than your problems, you would be on your knees for yourself and family.  You would have the assurance of salvation and citizenship in heaven.

Begin by thanking Him that you felt it now than later when worse can happen with your daughter.

I am a son and I know.  Consider me your son and take this suggestion to heart.

Thanks :)

I prayed that Jesus will lead you by arm to read this!  Praise the Lord!!  :)