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Theology => Apologetics => Topic started by: peterkeys88 on May 27, 2003, 01:38:27 AM



Title: people before the resurrection
Post by: peterkeys88 on May 27, 2003, 01:38:27 AM
What happened to people who died before the ressurection, who, obviously , were not saved Jesus paying the price for us?  Maybe this is a dumb question with an obvious answer, if it is, somebody please tell me which bible book to look in.  Like Joseph or abraham, cuz they werent perfect but believed fully in God.  Jesus had not died for them yet so there sins could not be forgiven by grace.  And the cost of sin is death, I cant imagine there in hell, but I can't find a explanation for it.  Does Jesus' sacrifice transcend time, therefore paiyng for those before and after him maybe?  I don't know.  I'm not that well read (yet).  Educate me please.  


Title: Re:people before the resurrection
Post by: Petro on May 27, 2003, 01:13:46 PM
What happened to people who died before the ressurection, who, obviously , were not saved Jesus paying the price for us?  Maybe this is a dumb question with an obvious answer, if it is, somebody please tell me which bible book to look in.  Like Joseph or abraham, cuz they werent perfect but believed fully in God.  Jesus had not died for them yet so there sins could not be forgiven by grace.  And the cost of sin is death, I cant imagine there in hell, but I can't find a explanation for it.  Does Jesus' sacrifice transcend time, therefore paiyng for those before and after him maybe?  I don't know.  I'm not that well read (yet).  Educate me please.  

peterkeys, I say welcome here;

In the Gospels, at Luke 16, Jesus gives the account of Lazarus, a beggar, who laid at the gate of a rich mans house, and in the story, (which I believe is a true one, simply because He uses the beggars name and the name of Abraham) He gives an account of what happened afterward, he (the beggar) was carried by angels to Abraham's bosom.  

You can read the story at; Lk 16:20-31.

Then at Heb 11, there is an account of all the men of faith, whom God has chosen to list therein, who all died in faith never receiving the promises  made to Abraham, of which the scriputres says that;

Heb 11
8  By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went.
9  By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise:
10  For he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God.


And this chapter ends, this way; concerning all the people of faith in God..

39  And these all, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise:
40  God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect.

These people of which you ask, though they are dead and in the grave will be resurrected, because they beleived God in that He is able to resurrect the dead, see what the verse says concerning Abrham;

Heb 11
17  By faith Abraham, when God tested him, offered Isaac as a sacrifice. He who had receiuved the promises was about to sacrifice his one and only son,
18  even though God had said to him,  "It is through Isaac that your offspring" will be reckoned"
19  Abraham reasoned that God could raise the dead, and figuratively speaking, he did receive Isaac back from the dead.

This then is what the work which Abraham did in obedience to God, and his faith was such that because God had promised him, a son, through WHOM ALL the  promises would be accomplished.

That Son, is Jesus, (who spoke all the words God put in His mouth to speak to men, as testimony of who He was), rose from that dead, and has given us His word, that he will give eternal life to all who put their faith in Him.

Since God has testified that it is He, who will judge all the living and the dead, at the end of the age.

In order to receive these promises, one must believe that Jesus is who, He claimed to be, and above all else, that He died not only for the sins of the world; but that he died specifically  for my/your sins.

And in believing this, His words will become real, as Gods word was real to them of the faith  in God, before Jesus came.

This is what Jesus says;

He that believeth on me, believeth not on me, but on him that sent me.
And he that seeth me seeth him that sent me.
I am come a light into the world, that whosoever believeth on me should not abide in darkness.
And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.
For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak.
And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.
 (Jhn 12:44-50)

them, I told you, and ye believed not: the works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me.
But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.
My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.
I and my Father are one.  (Jhn 10:25-30)

So, to answer your question directly, those that died in faith of God spromises, have eternal life reserved for them, and will be raised, together with everyone else in the last day, and will be rewarded according to the faith, with eternity in the prescence of God.

In the meantime, their souls are held by the power of God, until that day comes..

Blessings,

Petro


Title: Re:people before the resurrection
Post by: Mick on January 22, 2004, 02:13:18 PM
My reading is that God will use different "yardsticks" by which he will judge everyone who ever lived,from the first cave-dwellers right up til now,even allowing for those who lived before Jesus and those who lived after him without hearing his Word.
For example,back in the mists of time,a starving caveman must have given the last piece of food to his wife and child out of compassion. Will God forget him? I think not.

 


Title: Re:people before the resurrection
Post by: ravenloche on January 22, 2004, 03:05:27 PM
My reading is that God will use different "yardsticks" by which he will judge everyone who ever lived,from the first cave-dwellers right up til now,even allowing for those who lived before Jesus and those who lived after him without hearing his Word.
For example,back in the mists of time,a starving caveman must have given the last piece of food to his wife and child out of compassion. Will God forget him? I think not.

Rev 20:11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
Rev 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
Rev 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
Rev 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
Rev 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.


 :'( :'( :'( :'(

there is only one "yardstick" mick