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Should Hewlett Packard be boycotted by Christians ?

Click here for details (http://www.mcjonline.com/news/04a/20040109c.shtml)

No, we should be boycotting companies which, by their trading practices and similar, create and perpetuate suffering and injustice in the world, particularly the 3rd world.  Not supporting some idiot who thinks the most important issue in the world is who other people choose to have sex with.

Oh ebia !  Well that makes clear your stance on Biblical truth.

I wish.

Are we ready to boycott San Francisco?

I live in the Bay Area and work in San Francisco.  I haven’t spent a penny in ‘The City’ in the last ten years other than eating lunch at the local Chinese Deli.  And I WON’T spend a penny there.  Why – because ‘The City’ supports everything the Bible (and I) find abhorrent!  So yes – I boycott San Francisco.

JudgeNot said
"I live in the Bay Area and work in San Francisco.  I haven’t spent a penny in ‘The City’ in the last ten years other than eating lunch at the local Chinese Deli.  And I WON’T spend a penny there.  Why – because ‘The City’ supports everything the Bible (and I) find abhorrent!  So yes – I boycott San Francisco."

Goodness JudgeNot, whatever do you do when you need the public "bathroom."    :)

Ooooo - a 'public' bathromm in San Francisco is the LAST place you want to be.  I hold it!   ;D

The public bathroms in 'The City' are made in France.

 Smart move judge

Merci, dame aimable

Quel est tous ce détritus français?  ???

Actually no, I don't.  I "cheat".

http://www.free-translator.com (http://www.free-translator.com)

As I posted on another thread - the only foreign language I speak fluently is Texan.

Howdy pardner !  LOL

That's a real good translator JudgeNot.  Thanks.

C'est un vrai bon traducteur JudgeNot. Merci.

C'est ci bon?

C'est Ci Bon. That sounds like a  Louis Armstrong number ollie.  LOL

By the way, did you know that your "Stan" was born near us in the village of Ulverston ?  There is a plaque on the wall of the house.  Click here to see it (http://www.bbc.co.uk/cumbria/enjoy_cumbria/famous_people/stan_laurel_images/stan_laurel_plaque200.jpg)

Ulverston Fact - The actor Stan Laurel (born 16th June 1890, Argyle Street, Ulverston) is probably the best known Ulverstonian through the "Laurel & Hardy" films he made in Hollywood with Oliver Hardy in the 1920's and 1930's. Stan Laurel is remembered in Ulverston through the world's only Laurel & Hardy Museum. There is an appeal fund to place a Statue of Stan & Ollie in Ulverston, they are over half-way to their target, the website is based in the Netherlands, but the bank account is held in Ulverston.
Also :
http://members.lycos.co.uk/lahmuseum/Pages/ULVERSTON.htm

I live in the Bay Area and work in San Francisco.  I haven’t spent a penny in ‘The City’ in the last ten years other than eating lunch at the local Chinese Deli.  And I WON’T spend a penny there.  Why – because ‘The City’ supports everything the Bible (and I) find abhorrent!  So yes – I boycott San Francisco.

 :'( And what a shame it is the way it is. It's such a beautiful city. I used to visit there as often as I could!  :'(

It looks like Jeremiah was right when he fortold,

 Jer 17:9-11 "The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?
 10 I the LORD search the heart, I try the reins, even to give every man according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings.
 11 As the partridge sitteth on eggs, and hatcheth them not; so he that getteth riches, and not by right, shall leave them in the midst of his days, and at his end shall be a fool."

What a lovely nick, "sincereheart."

He sure got me into many "another fine mess"!

Thanks for the references. They were interesting.

Not sure about Louis Armstrong and C'est Ci Bon..

"C'est Ci Bon" is just about the sum total of my recall from three years of French in school. Perhaps other things if thought were given to it.

How about Hollywood and all its ungodliness and many of its movie people pushing their anti-Christ ways?

Yup Ollie,

Bet we all have different reasons in our understandings of why  Hollywood went so sinfull. Could it be Gods people withdrew and plaid dead?

A million years ago Mom said something like this...
 
'Becky maybe its not a sin to go to the movies but dont go to a movie you wouldn't take Jesus with you to see.'

 Not many movies, orTV, to watch abiding to that simple godly request.

Lance,

All those who love Jesus will suffer persecution. Having said that, yes, HP should be boycotted. Boycotts do work. Take Levi Strauss, Kmart, and AOL for instance. All are in financial straits because they either support homosexuality, pornography etc.

As I stated in the Disney post, Christians should support the work of other Christians. We must stop feeding the dog who keeps biting us.

Psalm 119

Thanks Psalm 119 for the one positive response to this thread.

Psalm 119 is one of my favourite psalms even though it is rather long.  I like it best read out to me as at this site : -

Click here to listen [needs Real Player] (http://bible.gospelcom.net/bgaudio/english/niv/hurl?passage=ps+119)

Boycotting yes, but deliberately avoiding?  I don't know.

Certainly San F. is become our own Sodom, then.

And the Lord was loathe to spare anyone save on Abraham's repeated request.

But maybe Reba's point here:  We've withdrawn from San F. and Hollywood, so why shouldn't they go south?

Still, debauchery IS debauchery.  Who wants to be around it.   ::)

Ezekiel 16:49
" 'Now this was the sin of your sister Sodom: She and her daughters were arrogant, overfed and unconcerned; they did not help the poor and needy."
Doesn't sound particularly more like S.F. than any other western city to me.

My grandparents  lived in The City how i loved to visit them. The smell of the warf....eating squid before they changed it's name.... the fog....riding the street cars....Grandma would never think of going to the store with out hat and gloves. This was a real change for  a country girl. For years saying i was born in San Francisco held a heap of pride. Mom and Dad lived in the Castro dristric. The Bible school Dad attended was in the filmore...  The Gate... the orange towers holding the fog. The wonderful Victorian homes the sun and fog playing off the detail of their beauty...

 

Public pressure does work, just look at the many attempts by Abber Crombie and Finch to sell teenage smut in their catalogs.  Each time they try Christians rally and AC&F has to back away.

Unfortunately we live in a secular world and we are only temporal.  Eastman Kodak is another company that favors homosexuals and will fire anyone for speaking against it.  So do we not get our pictures developed on Kodak film?  What about General Motors?

How about Microsoft?  They are big on favoring gays and I bet everyone here uses a PC with Microsoft Windows.  Personally I use Linux.

Here is an article from another board that posts some information on companies that support the gay agenda.  Some of these companies go so far as to demand that their suppliers NOT GIVE any money to any cause that is against the homosexual agenda.

here is the article and the board link:

http://www.asinner.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=65

LinuxGeek

It's like trying to hold back the sea.  However Christians don't have to accept homosexuality.  In our small ways we can stand against it just like any other sin.  If we all throw up our hands in desperation, it will gain acceptance.
If we are asked why we don't accept it, it is enough to say that God has forbidden it and leave it there.

Here's a funny story at least I hope you find it so.  When I first became a Christian many years ago and my work mates found out, as they were bound to do, they hung a calendar of nude pictures next to the office telephone so that when one answered the phone one got a close up look.  I got some double sided tape and stuck patches over the "naughty" bits.  This caused an outrage as I expected it would and it wasn't too long before I was up in front of the boss.  He wanted to know why I had done it to which I replied that it was only done for provocation and next time I would remove offending calendars completely.  He replied by saying that if I did I would be charged with stealing.
Several weeks later we were to receive a very important visit from some people from the far east and the boss realized that they may be offended by the extensive display of pornographic material.  He issued a directive that it must be removed.  Those people who refused had it forcibly confiscated.  LOL

..........the fog rolling in through the golden gate across the bay, the embarcedero, the freeway to nowhere, the Fairmont Hotel, the top of the Mark, the Presidio, Telegraph Hill, 80 degrees and tee shirts in the valley, 50 degrees and jackets in the city, homes above with garages underneath right at the sidewalk, the vistas and views from any place in the city, Candlestick Park, the Bay bridge, and on and on. The most beautiful city in America.

Yes I saw it in Hitchcock's "Vertigo" and those giant redwood trees too.

giant sequoia n.
A very tall, coniferous evergreen tree (Sequoiadendron giganteum) native to the high western slopes of the Sierra Nevada in southern California and having a massive trunk and light-colored, reddish wood. Also called big tree, giant redwood.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition Copyright © 2003 by Houghton Mifflin Company. Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved.
 --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

It has been my experience in the work place that management does not allow public display of pornographic material. How ever many have it in their private lockers etc. Many have porno magazines in their personal drawers.

Also the immodest dress of people is something hard to avoid in the workplace. I have found women to dress immodest more so than men. Sometimes one has to blank the mind, think on Godly things, and turn the head, and walk away from it.

Doesn't Paul tell us do not keep company with a brother guilty of fornication, etc. but not altogether those of the world who commit these sins?


 1 Corinthians 5:9.  I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators:
 10.  Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world.
 11.  But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.
 12.  For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within?
 13.  But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.

Boycotting of companies that uphold fair civil treatment of people from all walks of life, even when the walk might be in sin, becomes as difficult as it is to buy anything made in America when most all is made in another country.

Sounds romantic, but you left out "two men kissing in the park, two women strolling hand in hand up Market Street, blatant and open homosexual sex on the beach, the bums defecating on the sidewalks"; but perhaps you have to live here a while to “appreciate” the “improved” San Francisco as it has become under secular humanist rule.  Calling it “Babylon by the Bay” is much too kind – but I understand ancient Babylon was a beautiful city to behold, also.  

Homosexual propaganda is routinely left on the tables in our lunch room.  A few weeks ago I left a “Focus on the Family” brochure touting marriage as something between a woman and a man – someone threw it in the wastebasket within 20 minutes.

“Community involvement” means passing out condoms or protesting conservative government.  “Tolerance” is something others must have for homosexuals – no other opinions are tolerated.  “Being spiritual” is swimming naked and marijuana is medicine.  Crosses are worn on nipple rings as a “statement”.  The three most “evil” men in the world are President Bush, the Pope and Billy Graham.  

But I still openly post Bible verses on my office wall.  (Since I am a manager they are ignored rather than admonished.)  I openly read the Bible on the train to and from The City – which usually means the empty seat next to me is the last one taken on a crowded train – and when it is finally taken it is, more often than not, another Christian.  (Praise the Lord!!!)  

Today it is cold and windy, (well if you consider 50 F cold), threatening rain – it is actually quite dreary.  I looked out our office window an hour or so ago and watched the wind turn someone's umbrella inside out just as she was almost mowed down by a Yellow Cab.  The cabbie was having a hissie-fit because she dared walk where he was driving.  

What is REALLY interesting is to see all the summertime tourists in their T-shirts and shorts absolutely FREEZING to death.  They all have a quizzical look like "I thought this was "Sunny California!""

Not really meant to be romantic, but how I remember the city from when I lived there.

All those terrible things you list and say are also true of most cities in America, Canada, Europe, etc. etc..

If you go looking for the sin of the world I am sure you can find it most anywhere, People are called by God through His Christ to come out of it and not be part of it.

Yes - definitely so.  :'(  :'(  :'(

I am reminded of how Christ cried for Jerusalem.   :'(

The City i rememeber as a kid is no longer there, i know that, but i choose to keep the fond memeries. I am sorry Judge yours are not so. Saddly I have seen what you speek of and know you are correct.

Ollie seems some program you have and this forum are not in agreement  ;D hehe


 San Francisco once held a BIG bible school. Glad Tidings they  moved to Betheny Park just outside Santa Cruz.  The northern Ca headquarters for the AofG is now in Sacramento. I can not help but wonder if The City would be different today had the school stayed.

That thought brings to mind DTS  (the bible school in dallas). Woe v. Wade came to be in Dallas that bible school was silent. What is up with us? So rapture minded we are of no earthy good?
I have this strange idea the problems around us are there because we do nothing....

Reply #27, page 2

It is difficult to walk away from something, ollie, when you have to use the phone as part of your work and it is staring you in the face. That is precisely why they did it but the last laugh was on them.  LOL

I am afraid your experience about the display of pornographic material is somewhat limited.  People will get away with what they can.

God bless

I know what you mean JudgeNot but God knows the truth and your efforts will be rewarded one day.  I honestly did not know that it was so bad in San Francisco.

God bless.

I actually laughed outloud!!  And yes.  We are ready to boycott San Fran.  Maybe Ahnahld shoold gif dem a veezit?

Some one always seems to remind me of the real California I live in.... >:(

Some one always seems to remind me of the real California I live in.... >:(  


Opps i hate when this happens...guess it is twice as bad as i thought

I want to apologize to everyone for my “bitter” post concerning San Francisco.  Yesterday was not a banner day for me (forgive me Jesus) and I let my anger overcome my sensibilities (so to speak.)
I usually always see the good before the bad – and with that perspective – San Francisco is, indeed a beautiful City – and there ARE many, many righteous people who live here.  To them I apologize also.

But I STILL can’t get the picture out of my itsy-bitsy brain about Jesus weeping for Jerusalem.  

Weep for The City , Judge, she can use our tears and our prayers.

Look what J Vernon McGee says in his "Thru the Bible" commentary about Genesis 19.

"And he pressed upon them greatly; and they turned in unto him, and entered into his house; and he made them a feast, and did bake unleavened bread, and they did eat [Gen. 19:3].
Now these men have another feast. They had a feast with Abraham; they now have a feast with Lot.
They had brought out something when they said, “We’ll stay on the street and just sleep in the park,” and Lot says to them, “You don’t do that in Sodom. It’s dangerous! Your life wouldn’t be worth a thing if you did that.” May I say that maybe Los Angeles ought to change its name to Sodom. It would not be safe for you to sleep on the streets of Los Angeles; in fact, it is not safe at all to be on the streets of Los Angeles at night. Many women who live alone will not come out to church at night. One dear saint of God told me, “I just lock my door at dark, Brother McGee, and I do not open that door until the next morning at daylight. It’s not safe in my neighborhood to even walk on the street.” The days of Sodom and Gomorrah are here again, and practically for the same reason. Lot says, “No, men, do not stay on the street. It wouldn’t be safe for you.” When he “pressed upon them,” they came in.
But before they lay down, the men of the city, even the men of Sodom, compassed the house round, both old and young, all the people from every quarter:
And they called unto Lot, and said unto him, Where are the men which came in to thee this night? bring them out unto us, that we may know them [Gen. 19:4–5].
This is a sickening scene which reveals the degradation of this city—the city of Sodom. The name that has been put on this sin from that day to this is sodomy. Apparently there was no attempt made in the city of Sodom to have a church for this crowd and to tell them that they were all right in spite of the fact that they practiced this thing. May I say to you that the Word of God is specific on this, and you cannot tone it down. Sodomy is an awful sin.
When this man Lot had gone down into the city of Sodom, he did not realize what kind of city it was—I’m sure of that. He got down there and found out that perversion was the order of the day, and he brought up his children, his sons and his daughters, in that atmosphere. When he earlier had pitched his tent toward Sodom, he had looked down there and had seen the lovely streets and boulevards and parks and public buildings. And he had seen the folk as they were on the outside, but he had not seen what they really were. The sin of this city is so great that God is now going to judge it. God is going to destroy the city.
Let’s draw a sharp line here. There is a new attitude toward sin today. There is a gray area where sin is not really as black as we once thought it was. The church has compromised until it is pitiful. In Southern California we have a church made up of those who are homosexuals, and, lo and behold, they all admit that the pastor of the church is one also! May I say to you, the lesson of Sodom and Gomorrah is a lesson for this generation. God is not accepting this kind of church.
The idea today seems to be that you can become a child of God and continue on in sin. God says that is impossible—you cannot do that, and this city of Sodom is an example of that fact. Paul asks the question: “Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?” And the answer is “God forbid,” or, Let it not be (see Rom. 6:1–2). The idea that you can be a Christian and go on in sin is a tremendous mistake, especially to make light of it, as I judge is being done in this particular case.
This is what they were doing in Sodom and Gomorrah—and God destroyed these cities. Don’t say that we have a primitive view of God in Genesis but that we have a better one today. Don’t argue that, after all, Jesus received sinners. He sure did, but when He got through with them, He had changed them. The harlot who came to Him was no longer in that business. When she came to God, she changed. That is the thing that happened to other sinners. A publican came to Him, and he left the seat of customs. He gave up that which was crooked when he came to the Lord. If you have come to Christ, you will be changed. Many people write and try to explain to me that we are living in a new day and I need to wake up. My friend, we are living in a new day, but it just happens to be Sodom and Gomorrah all over again."

McGee, J. V. (1997, c1981). Thru the Bible commentary. Based on the Thru the Bible radio program. (electronic ed.) (Vol. 1, Page 81). Nashville: Thomas Nelson.

Another reminder:

Ezekiel 16:49
" 'Now this was the sin of your sister Sodom: She and her daughters were arrogant, overfed and unconcerned; they did not help the poor and needy."

To save a bit of space the whole chapter is not posted...

Ezek 16:25

25 Thou hast built thy high place at every head of the way, and hast made thy beauty to be abhorred, and hast opened thy feet to every one that passed by, and multiplied thy whoredoms.
KJV



26 Thou hast also committed fornication with the Egyptians thy neighbours, great of flesh; and hast increased thy whoredoms, to provoke me to anger.
KJV



28 Thou hast played the whore also with the Assyrians, because thou wast unsatiable; yea, thou hast played the harlot with them, and yet couldest not be satisfied.

29 Thou hast moreover multiplied thy fornication in the land of Canaan unto Chaldea; and yet thou wast not satisfied herewith.
KJV



32 But as a wife that committeth adultery, which taketh strangers instead of her husband!

33 They give gifts to all whores: but thou givest thy gifts to all thy lovers, and hirest them, that they may come unto thee on every side for thy whoredom.

34 And the contrary is in thee from other women in thy whoredoms, whereas none followeth thee to commit whoredoms: and in that thou givest a reward, and no reward is given unto thee, therefore thou art contrary.
KJV



35 Wherefore, O harlot, hear the word of the LORD:

36 Thus saith the Lord GOD; Because thy filthiness was poured out, and thy nakedness discovered through thy whoredoms with thy lovers, and with all the idols of thy abominations, and by the blood of thy children, which thou didst give unto them;

37 Behold, therefore I will gather all thy lovers, with whom thou hast taken pleasure, and all them that thou hast loved, with all them that thou hast hated; I will even gather them round about against thee, and will discover thy nakedness unto them, that they may see all thy nakedness.

38 And I will judge thee, as women that break wedlock and shed blood are judged; and I will give thee blood in fury and jealousy.
KJV


45 Thou art thy mother's daughter, that lotheth her husband and her children; and thou art the sister of thy sisters, which lothed their husbands and their children: your mother was an Hittite, and your father an Amorite.

46 And thine elder sister is Samaria, she and her daughters that dwell at thy left hand: and thy younger sister, that dwelleth at thy right hand, is Sodom and her daughters.

47 Yet hast thou not walked after their ways, nor done after their abominations: but, as if that were a very little thing, thou wast corrupted more than they in all thy ways.

48 As I live, saith the Lord GOD, Sodom thy sister hath not done, she nor her daughters, as thou hast done, thou and thy daughters.

49 Behold, this was the iniquity of thy sister Sodom, pride, fulness of bread, and abundance of idleness was in her and in her daughters, neither did she strengthen the hand of the poor and needy.

50 And they were haughty, and committed abomination before me: therefore I took them away as I saw good.
KJV

Dunno what your point was, but this sounds like a pretty good summary of the whole of western civilisation to me.

How beautiful, Reba! I can taste your memories! Like the forgotten flavors of childhood summers!

How far we seem to have strayed from such innocence, although I'm sure there are those who say it was never really all that lovely.  :'( Children often remember beauty where darkness lived.

My hometown had an Association of "vampire slayers". Wierd. Never knew it til we moved out.  :P