ChristiansUnite Forums

I'll ask the moderators not to participate until 11-15.

There is considerable confusion on this issue, so this is a good question to discuss. Please list a reason for your vote and any Scriptures that apply.

Absolutely not. When God saved me He gave me ETERNAL life and not temporary life. He doesn't adopt us into His family and then kick us out as soon as we sin. We have an Advocate, Jesus Christ, Who intercedes for us when we sin and lets the Father know, "I paid for their sin, and they are mine!" We will lose fellowship and blessings and will be chastised, but we will NEVER lose our salvation. I am sealed by the Holy Spirit onto the day of redemption, and I am safe and secure in Jesus Christ--FOREVER!

If works (sin) can cause us to lose our salvation, then that means that works can obtain our salvation or at least keep us saved. God said in Eph. 2:9 that salvation is NOT from works.

I voted so now I guess I put my reasons and verses here?

I voted: No.
I know with certainty that I have salvation through Christ who died for me while I was yet a sinner and I will be a sinner until I am with Him
David sinned over and over again and because of his sin he had one of the most disfunctional families there ever was.  However he was called a "man after God's heart."  David sin but when he repented he never did that particular sin again.

My verses:
1 Kings 8:46  "When they sin agains you --for there is no one who does not sin---

Romans 7: 15, 17-20  "I do not understand what I do.  For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do.
As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me.  I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature.  For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out.  For what I do is ot the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do --this I keep on doing.  Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.

1 Cor 8:12  "When yo sin against your brothers in this way and wound their weak conscience, you sin against Christ.
Paul is talking to brothers in Christ who sin

2 Cor 5:21  "God made him who had no sin to be sin for us, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God."
At one time I wondered what it meant to be "in" Christ, so I did a little study on the word "in" and this is what I found:

• within the bounds of
  to a condition of
  having the activity or function of
  wearing (I like the thought of "wearing Christ"!
  by means of
  with reference to
  to the inside
  to a goal of place
  do as to be included or contained (I like this one too!)
  

Gal 6:1a  "Brothers, if someone is causght in a sin, you who are spiritual, should restore him gently.
(Again, Paul is talking to brothers in Christ.

1 Timothy 5:20 "Those who sin are to be rebuked publicly, so that the others may take warning"
(And again Paul is talking to belivers in the chruch.  He is saying to rebuke as in correct not "kick out".

1 John 1:8  "If we claim to without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us."

1 John 2:1  "My dear children, I write this to you so that you will not sin.,  But if anybody does sin, we have one who speaks to the Father in our defense --Jesus Christ, the Righteous One.

And finally:

1 John 5:16- 17  " If anyone sees his brother commit a sin that does not lead to death, he should pray and God will give him life.  I refer to those whose sin does not lead to death.  There is a sin that leads to death.  I am no saying that he should pray about that.  All wrongdoing is sin, and there is sin that does not lead to death."


(http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u227/JKA1989/bible.jpg)

I'll bet you've been wondering if I knew my Bible or could just give smart-alek replies and posts!  ;D

[/i]

Yes, is my answer to the poll ? & Here's some of my reasons for thinking this way:
Romans 6:
12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.

13 Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.

14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.  

16 Know ye not, that to whom  ye yield yourselves  servants to obey, his servants  ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?  

17 But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.  

18 Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.

19 I speak after the manner of men because of the infirmity of your flesh: for as ye have yielded your members servants to uncleanness and to iniquity unto iniquity; even so now yield your members servants to righteousness unto holiness.  

20 For when ye were the servants of sin, ye were free from righteousness.  

21 What fruit  had ye then in those things whereof ye are now ashamed? for the end of those things is death.

22 But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life.

23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God  is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

1TIM. 5:
19 Against an elder receive not an accusation, but before two or three witnesses.

20 Them that sin  rebuke before all, that others also may fear.

21 I charge thee before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, and the elect angels, that thou observe these things without preferring one before another, doing nothing by partiality.

22 Lay hands suddenly on no man, neither be partaker of other men's sins: keep thyself pure.  


1 Peter 4
1 Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh  hath ceased from sin;

2 That he no longer should live the rest of his time in the flesh  to the lusts of men, but to the will of God.  
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=--=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-===-=-==--=-=-=-=-=-=-==-=-=-=--=-==-
There's a verse or two somewhere in the Bible that says that your name Can be Blotted out of the Book of Life.
I'll find them if you need me too?

And the other one IF the Blind follow the Blind, Both shall fall into the Ditch...

This is what some Christians will say on that day and they were able to do some wonderous things & look where they thought they were going:
MATT. 7:
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
 
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.


I'LL Find More, Later Ok?
YLBD





-==-=-=-=--=--===-=-==--=-=-=-=-=---==--=-==-==-=-===-=-=-==-=-=-=-=-=-==-=-=-=-==-=-=-=-=-=-=

1 John 2:
1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:  

2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.

4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

1 John 3
7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.

8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

Love and Serve ONE GOD(the God of Abraham,Issac & Jacob) with ALL your Heart Mind & Soul
& Love your Neighbour as you Love yourself,,,,, IF WE Do those two things we have FULFILLED all those things that God has asked of us thru his SON & the Laws of the Prophets.. JESUS said that...

ONCE you find Jesus, WHY does it seem so Impossible for us to keep from Sinning?
And i'm not talking about the ones picking up sticks on the sabbath or not wearing your seatbelts or your motorcycle helmets or any other thing like that!

Just don't Lie, Steal, Kill, Fornicate, Drunkeness, ECT. ect. ect.The things in his Doctrine that he says don't do or you will Burn?

The Lord shows me Favor on a daily Basis and I've been this way about sin for a long time Now..
So i'm not changing anything i'm doing, And God Will Judge me on this Matter,
And as Long as I remember Too be Merciful, I Will Obtain Mercy, Because mercy Conquers Judgment from God...

Once you know Scripture you have no excuses for what you do and everything is being written Down, to be opened on that day & then the Book of Life...
Once a person has read All the words of God, Can that person say to God I did'nt know that was a Sin?
It was Unintentional, Lord...
Good Luck with that one...
YLBD
P.S
More Later If Needed

Brothers and Sisters,

This is a debate question, so please feel free to debate all you want. The moderators won't take part in this debate until 11-15 and maybe never.

Love In Christ,
Tom

Hi Little boy!  I only have a minute because I have to get ready for work and take my grandson to daycare this morning.

So let me get clear on your thinking.  You are saying that if you sin you could lose your salvation?  Not true my friend.  We all sin everyday.  If not by outward actions then in our own hearts.  Have you quit sinning because you are saved?  No.  Everyone sins.  That is just a fact of life until we are will HIM.

Take your first verse that I have copied.    "if any man sin we have an advocate"
And according to the verses that I used, even Paul said that he does things that he didn't want to (sin)

Your second verse: "propitiation "  meaning: to appease or conciliate somebody or something
We wouldn't need that if we didn't sin.
In fact we wouldn't need Jesus "on a daily basis" if we didn't sin.

I'm sorry Littleboy, I am typing and thinking in a hurry this morning and will have to get back to this later.

Love In Christ,
Yvette

I don't know.
There are some sins that I do. I ask God for help but I still do it. I don't like doing it but I'm too weak. I need to repent to go to heaven right? But I'm not really repenting if I keep falling into the same sins am i?  :(

Here is your answer:

Romans 7: 15, 17-20  "I do not understand what I do.  For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do.
As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me.  I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature.  For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out.  For what I do is ot the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do --this I keep on doing.  Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.


This was Paul's struggle.  Did he go to Heaven or hell?
We will always sin.  Sometimes it will be the same thing over again.  But in prayer, God knows our heart.  At the time you pray, are you truely sorry?  Yes?  Then you are forgiven.  And God remembers it no more.
What did Jesus say about how many times a person should be forgiven by another?  7 x 70?  He was giving and example of God's forgivness.

Of course Paul struggled within, he helped kill Christians and many other bad things,
But by the end of his life, His struggles (the war between his flesh & spirit) had ended, You can see this by what's written in his other books..
If Sin Abides (lives) IN you, The Love of God CANNOT, HE says this, not just me...More than 1 time too...

The Pastor might want to tell you what the parable of the unforgiving servant means:
Matt. 18:21-35
It has NOTHING to do with God allowing you to just keep sinning and the Example Jesus gives is a Parable
When a verse says WHEREFORE in the beginning of the next verse, Try not to seperate it from the previous verse or you'll take what is being said out of context, as you can see you've done here...
Please don't take this wrong, OK?
If you reread this parable you'll see it's not how many times, But if you can't forgive someone for something so small,
HOW can I forgive you for so Much!
I think that was his Message, Not to keep on sinning I'll just keep forgiving you...
YLBD
P.S
 The reason were told to forgive our brother 7x70 is that to be forgiven you must be able to forgive,
and if you can't even forgive him 1 time, you cannot be forgiven for ALL you've done against God...

I think I was misunderstood.  I course we don't go around doing whatever we please with the thought of " oh, well.  I'll just ask God to forgive me for that" and then go out and to the same awful thing again.   That certainly would not be repentant.
But yes God will forgive us if we are truly repentant, even if we do it again.

Lets say that I just stubbed my toe and I holler out a curse.  I'm going to feel might bad about it and I'm going to ask God to forgive me and help me with my foul mouth.  Then a couple days later I stub the same cotton pickin' toe and I holler out a curse.  Does that mean that I didn't mean that I was sorry the first time?  Of course not.  I was sorry.  But I did it again because I couldn't help it.  It was out of my mouth before I could stop it.  It hurt for crying out loud.  Now can I not be sorry again and ask for forgiveness again and ask God again to help me with my foul mouth?  Have I just lost my salvation?  Now the next week I'm up on a stool, trying to hang a curtain rod and I hit my thumb with a hammer.  What comes out of my mouth?  You got it.  A big ol' nasty curse word!  It might take me hitting and stubbing all my digits before I can ever get control of my mouth.
I've asked for forgiveness over and over and over for the same sin.  Is God going to say, "Sorry Yvette,  I can't let you in up here because you're too clumsy.  And besides that I have no more forgiveness for you."??  Of course not!  My God loves me.  He knows what an awful sinner I am.  That's why he sent his Son.

And as for Paul.  Of course he sinned.  He may not have kept going around persecuting the church, but he was human and therefore he sinned.  He may even have used the same cuss word I did when he stubbed his toe!  ;)

The previous post was "unintentional sin", so now for "intentional sin"

I've been saved and walking with Lord for a long time.  I've been faithful and have worked hard at putting my past behind me and I've grown in the Lord by leaps and bounds.
Now say some perverted puke rapes my little 3 year old grandson, who means more to me than anyone walking the face of the earth.  I go out and buy a hand gun and I plan on how I'm going kill that piece of wasted space.  I've thought about it and planned it.  When the creep comes out of the court house I shoot him right between the eyes and kill that cold piece dead!
Now that it's done, and I realize the extent of what I've just done, I'm regretful.  I'm eaten up with guilt and remorse over it.  I can't eat and I can't sleep.  I cry out in my agony to God for forgiveness.  Is He going to forgive me or am I going to lose my salvation?
Now remember I'm all ready saved and one of God's own.  But I planned and plotted this crime.  This sin of murder.  Just broken a commandent of God.
Is He going to forgive me?
Did God forgive David after he stole Uriah the Hittite's wife and plotted and planned Uriah's murder?  Yes.  God forgave David, the man after God's own heart!  David wept with repentance, and God forgave him.
Were there consequences for David because of his sin?  Yes.  That baby died.
Would there be consequences for me if I kill the puke that harmed my grandson?  Yes.  There are consequences for our sins.  But lose salvation over it?  No.  There is only one unforgivable sin.  And that is to deny the Holy Spirit.  To deny God.  To deny Christ.  To turn your back.

In Christ,
Grammyluv  ;)

I'm going to have some cake...
YLBD
P.S
All your ?'s about that, God can answer one day for you ok?
Not for me to Judge that one...

(http://www.clicksmilies.com/s1106/aktion/action-smiley-034.gif)

thank you grammy ((hugs)) I know now that I am not going to lose my salvation.  :) :-*

Thank YOU Brother David!  And great big hugs right back at ya!  ;D



Every morning I get up and I can hardly wait to see what someone has posted on these polls and I am disappointed.  Of over 3,000 members there are only 4? 5? of us willing to jump up.

I am sure there are other ministers on here that are not moderators.  PK's?  Ladies?  Do you not have an opinion or a BELIEF?  This is the problem with the church today.  Everyone is happy to sit on the side lines and watch.
Say something.  Right or wrong.  That is how we learn folks.  Step out and say what is on your mind.  Tell me I'm an old bitty for writing this.  Anything!

Really,
The most i've seen on at onetime is 8 people and that was'nt until this thread started....
YLBD

grammy most accounts are long since inactive. There probably only 20 active members

So I've heard.  Darn.  :(

Good Morning Brother David!

I guess that everything depends on what you call inactive. We have tons of folks stop by every 1 to 3 months. Maybe they stop here for a prayer request or for a discussion they're interested in. I really don't know, but there are many people who go much longer than 3 months between visits.

Some folks come here just for fellowship, or they don't need a specific reason to be here. I come here for strengthening and encouragement in CHRIST. The fellowship is great and there are tons of good things here to study. There is a variety of good and GODLY material posted here every day that's new, and I enjoy it every day unless I'm down in bed. Frankly, this is something good to become addicted to.

Love In Christ,
Tom

Amen Brother Tom, some of us are not able to be here for health reasons, like myself, but I sure miss it when I am not able to be here fellowshipping and sharing with other believers.

I thank God for every minute I am able to be here.

Hello Brother David, I know it's been a while since I have been here, how is the new baby?

Brothers and Sisters,

The answer to the "Sin Poll Question" is an absolute NO. This is one of the main reasons why JESUS CHRIST went willingly to the CROSS and died for our sins.

Bluntly, no man has ever been able to obey the law, and that's why the law has never saved a single person. The same is true for sin. NO man can live without sin.

If we say that we have no sin, we lie and the truth isn't in us.

1 John 1:8-10  NASB  If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar and His word is not in us.

NO man or woman has any righteousness of their own at all - ZERO! Man's righteousness is as filthy rags.

Romans 3:10 NASB  as it is written, "THERE IS NONE RIGHTEOUS, NOT EVEN ONE; THERE IS NONE WHO UNDERSTANDS, THERE IS NONE WHO SEEKS FOR GOD; ALL HAVE TURNED ASIDE, TOGETHER THEY HAVE BECOME USELESS; THERE IS NONE WHO DOES GOOD, THERE IS NOT EVEN ONE."

Romans 3:23  NASB  for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,

If we seek to establish our own righteousness, we are foolish and severing ourselves from CHRIST. CHRIST is the only righteousness of mankind.

Galatians 5:4-6 NASB  You have been severed from Christ, you who are seeking to be justified by law; you have fallen from grace. For we through the Spirit, by faith, are waiting for the hope of righteousness. For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision means anything, but faith working through love.

Galatians 2:19-21 NASB  "For through the Law I died to the Law, so that I might live to God. "I have been crucified with Christ; and it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself up for me. "I do not nullify the grace of God, for if righteousness comes through the Law, then Christ died needlessly."

Trying to establish our own righteousness is not only foolish, it's failing to submit to the righteousness of CHRIST.

Romans 10:3-4 NASB  For not knowing about God's righteousness and seeking to establish their own, they did not subject themselves to the righteousness of God.  For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.

Philippians 3:8-9 NASB  More than that, I count all things to be loss in view of the surpassing value of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and count them but rubbish so that I may gain Christ, and may be found in Him, not having a righteousness of my own derived from the Law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which comes from God on the basis of faith,

Bluntly, if man could live without sin, JESUS CHRIST went to the CROSS in vain. However, we all know that JESUS CHRIST and the CROSS is the most important and precious event in the history of mankind. JESUS CHRIST took our penalty in HIS Own Body and rescued us from the curse of sin and death. Man must never say that he can live without sin, be perfect, or be holy because that would be calling GOD a liar. We don't have any righteousness of our own. As Christians, we are seen in and through JESUS CHRIST, and the Righteousness of CHRIST is what we depend on. If we depend on ourselves, we depend on NOTHING and call GOD a liar.

As Christians, the devil and sin is no longer our Master, but that doesn't mean that we are free of sin. Our MASTER is now JESUS CHRIST, but we are still in the "old man" of flesh and corruption. GOD has promised that HE will finish the work of Perfection in us, and HE will even give us a Glorified Body at HIS Appointed Time. In the meantime, we MUST know that GOD is the only one who is Perfect, Holy, and without sin. In our present state it's a horrible error to try and compare our NOTHING to GOD'S EVERYTHING!

Bluntly, if we depend on our own perfection, holiness, and righteousness, our destination is HELL! because we have NONE!

Hebrews 10:1-10 NASB  For the Law, since it has only a shadow of the good things to come and not the very form of things, can never, by the same sacrifices which they offer continually year by year, make perfect those who draw near. Otherwise, would they not have ceased to be offered, because the worshipers, having once been cleansed, would no longer have had consciousness of sins? But in those sacrifices there is a reminder of sins year by year. For it is impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sins. Therefore, when He comes into the world, He says, "SACRIFICE AND OFFERING YOU HAVE NOT DESIRED, BUT A BODY YOU HAVE PREPARED FOR ME; IN WHOLE BURNT OFFERINGS AND sacrifices FOR SIN YOU HAVE TAKEN NO PLEASURE. "THEN I SAID, 'BEHOLD, I HAVE COME (IN THE SCROLL OF THE BOOK IT IS WRITTEN OF ME) TO DO YOUR WILL, O GOD.'" After saying above, "SACRIFICES AND OFFERINGS AND WHOLE BURNT OFFERINGS AND sacrifices FOR SIN YOU HAVE NOT DESIRED, NOR HAVE YOU TAKEN PLEASURE in them" (which are offered according to the Law), then He said, "BEHOLD, I HAVE COME TO DO YOUR WILL." He takes away the first in order to establish the second. By this will we have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

Continued

Brothers and Sisters,

Please read the following portion of Scripture carefully and go back to the Bible to put it in context and study it more in detail. To many, it appears to be a contradiction, but it isn't a contradiction at all.

1 John 1:6-10 NASB  If we say that we have fellowship with Him and yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth; but if we walk in the Light as He Himself is in the Light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus His Son cleanses us from all sin. If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar and His word is not in us.

I don't walk in the dark any longer, and I certainly don't love the dark or wallow in the dark. My old master is in the dark and no Christian in this short life is completely free of the old master. Our new MASTER is GOD and we feel guilty when we make mistakes or sin. GOD knew that we would make mistakes and sin, so HE provided a way for us to be cleansed. I wouldn't dare call GOD a liar, and I know that I'm not perfect, holy, or without sin. My LORD and SAVIOUR is Perfect, Holy, and without Sin. Please read the following portion of Scripture and notice some of the key issues and terms.

Romans 6:10-14 NASB  For the death that He died, He died to sin once for all; but the life that He lives, He lives to God. Even so consider yourselves to be dead to sin, but alive to God in Christ Jesus. Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its lusts, and do not go on presenting the members of your body to sin as instruments of unrighteousness; but present yourselves to God as those alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness to God. For sin shall not be master over you, for you are not under law but under grace.

Sin is no longer the master over a Christian, but that doesn't hint that a Christian is free of sin. CHRIST is our unquestioned MASTER, but we aren't free of sin yet. We are free from sin being the master over us and having sin drive every aspect of our lives. We no longer live to sin. We live to CHRIST but we are still human beings. We can pray, try as hard as we can, and even have GOD help us, but we can't have the Perfection, Righteousness, and Holiness of CHRIST in this old body of flesh and corruption. This is another reason why flesh and blood can't inherit the things of GOD that await us in Heaven. However, GOD has Promised that HE will give us a Glorified Body like CHRIST at HIS appointed time.

Romans 3:19-28 NASB  Now we know that whatever the Law says, it speaks to those who are under the Law, so that every mouth may be closed and all the world may become accountable to God; because by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified in His sight; for through the Law comes the knowledge of sin. But now apart from the Law the righteousness of God has been manifested, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, even the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all those who believe; for there is no distinction; for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, being justified as a gift by His grace through the redemption which is in Christ Jesus; whom God displayed publicly as a propitiation in His blood through faith. This was to demonstrate His righteousness, because in the forbearance of God He passed over the sins previously committed; for the demonstration, I say, of His righteousness at the present time, so that He would be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus. Where then is boasting? It is excluded. By what kind of law? Of works? No, but by a law of faith. For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from works of the Law.

Brothers and Sisters, who qualifies us and makes us fit to become partakers of the inheritance with the Saints in LIGHT? Do we make ourselves fit and qualified? The answer is absolutely, "NO!" Who is the Author and Finisher of our Faith? Is it us? The answer is absolutely, "NO!" Do we redeem and sanctify ourselves? ABSOLUTELY NOT! Brothers and Sisters, we aren't fit and qualified for anything but HELL. Further, there is no amount of work that we can do to become fit and qualified for anything but HELL. Salvation must be a GIFT from GOD because NO man will ever be able to earn it. JESUS CHRIST makes us fit and qualified because of HIS Perfect Work on the CROSS.

Colossians 1:9-12 NASB  For this reason also, since the day we heard of it, we have not ceased to pray for you and to ask that you may be filled with the knowledge of His will in all spiritual wisdom and understanding, so that you will walk in a manner worthy of the Lord, to please Him in all respects, bearing fruit in every good work and increasing in the knowledge of God; strengthened with all power, according to His glorious might, for the attaining of all steadfastness and patience; joyously giving thanks to the Father, who has qualified us to share in the inheritance of the saints in Light.

Romans 4:22-25 NASB  Therefore IT WAS ALSO CREDITED TO HIM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS. Now not for his sake only was it written that it was credited to him, but for our sake also, to whom it will be credited, as those who believe in Him who raised Jesus our Lord from the dead, He who was delivered over because of our transgressions, and was raised because of our justification. "BLESSED ARE THOSE WHOSE LAWLESS DEEDS HAVE BEEN FORGIVEN, AND WHOSE SINS HAVE BEEN COVERED.  "BLESSED IS THE MAN WHOSE SIN THE LORD WILL NOT TAKE INTO ACCOUNT."

Romans 5:20-21 NASB  The Law came in so that the transgression would increase; but where sin increased, grace abounded all the more, so that, as sin reigned in death, even so grace would reign through righteousness to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

1 Thessalonians 5:8-10 NASB  But since we are of the day, let us be sober, having put on the breastplate of faith and love, and as a helmet, the hope of salvation. For God has not destined us for wrath, but for obtaining salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ, who died for us, so that whether we are awake or asleep, we will live together with Him.

Acts 15:8-11 NASB  "And God, who knows the heart, testified to them giving them the Holy Spirit, just as He also did to us; and He made no distinction between us and them, cleansing their hearts by faith. "Now therefore why do you put God to the test by placing upon the neck of the disciples a yoke which neither our fathers nor we have been able to bear? "But we believe that we are saved through the grace of the Lord Jesus, in the same way as they also are."

Brothers and Sisters, we don't give thanks to ourselves for a single thing because we can't do a single thing worthy of Salvation. All Thanks and All GLORY goes to GOD!

Colossians 3:15-16 NASB  Let the peace of Christ rule in your hearts, to which indeed you were called in one body; and be thankful. Let the word of Christ richly dwell within you, with all wisdom teaching and admonishing one another with psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with thankfulness in your hearts to God.

Ephesians 1:18-23 NASB  I pray that the eyes of your heart may be enlightened, so that you will know what is the hope of His calling, what are the riches of the glory of His inheritance in the saints, and what is the surpassing greatness of His power toward us who believe. These are in accordance with the working of the strength of His might which He brought about in Christ, when He raised Him from the dead and seated Him at His right hand in the heavenly places, far above all rule and authority and power and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this age but also in the one to come. And He put all things in subjection under His feet, and gave Him as head over all things to the church, which is His body, the fullness of Him who fills all in all.

Galatians 3:22-26 NASB  But the Scripture has shut up everyone under sin, so that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe. But before faith came, we were kept in custody under the law, being shut up to the faith which was later to be revealed. Therefore the Law has become our tutor to lead us to Christ, so that we may be justified by faith. But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor. For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus.

Romans 8:1-2 NASB  Therefore there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has set you free from the law of sin and of death.

Romans 5:17-18 NASB  For if by the transgression of the one, death reigned through the one, much more those who receive the abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness will reign in life through the One, Jesus Christ.  So then as through one transgression there resulted condemnation to all men, even so through one act of righteousness there resulted justification of life to all men.

I'm hooked!  ;D
This is where I get my "get-up-and-go"!  Good news articles.  Fellowship.  Fun and more fun.  Bible study.  You name it.  I don't even watch TV at night anymore! 
All my friends live here!  ;D ;D ;D ???

Sister Yvette,

I feel the same way. I watch or listen to a few news programs in the background, but the important things that I feel a need for are here on Christians Unite. I also have a weather alarm radio that warns us when we might be about to be blown away.   :D  That goes off all the time in Oklahoma. We don't have a storm shelter, so the best we can do is go sit in the bathtub.   ;D   Needless to say, we don't go sit in the bathtub every time the weather alarm goes off. I think we went to the bathtub three times this year, and that's when a tornado was on the ground and fairly close to us. We pull a couple of heavy blankets and pillow over us, pray, and usually go back to what we were doing 20 to 30 minutes later. My wife and I were both born here and we've lived here all of our lives, so GOD has taken good care of us here for almost 60 years. We'll just give THANKS!

Love In Christ,
Tom

Hebrews 7:18-19 NASB
For, on the one hand, there is a setting aside of a former commandment because of its weakness and uselessness (for the Law made nothing perfect), and on the other hand there is a bringing in of a better hope, through which we draw near to God.

Yep.  Same here.  I've got the TV on (usually FOX news) but it's more for company since I live alone.  Lets me hear other voices, (other than the ones in my head)  Had to beat one of you boys to that one!  Hahaha!  But there is so much on this whole site that you could hardly ever visit it all!   ;D
I forget where I ever heard of it.  Might have been my local Christian radio station.  But I was parusing this website for a long time before I ever came over to the forums.   :D
It's cool too because when I talk to my family, or my best girlfriend who lives in Oregon, I'll say, "my friend BlackeyedBart or my friend DreamWeaver or Pastor Roger, said such and such the other day"!!!  Tee hee.


(http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z81/luvmyxr1/thtrue.gif)    (http://i215.photobucket.com/albums/cc19/Kirrrsten/Imnothearingvoicesinmyhead.gif)

Now that's not fair (getting good but still not fair).

 ;D ;D

Hello Grammyluv,

 ;D   Sister, those voices in your head don't bother us at all. We can't hear them through the computer.   ;D   We also have a lot of good clean fun and fellowship here. When we have the Promises of GOD in mind, it doesn't take much for Christians to have a good time and be thankful. Fellowship is definitely another Gift that GOD gives us for strength and encouragement.

Some folks have hobbies that cost an arm and a leg. An arm and a leg is what I'd have to pay since I don't have any money.   ;)  Being a Christian full time doesn't cost an arm and a leg, rather all of us. We are bought with a price and are no longer our own. We are purchased possessions belonging to GOD, and that should be enough to make us happy.

 :o  Sister, I think that I might have just heard one of those voices in your head. Is it Bill O'Reilly?   ;D

Love In Christ,
Tom

Oh my gosh!  I had to laugh out loud because it's true!  I had Bill O'Rielly on!  Also true that I'm a big fan of his!  (http://www.clicksmilies.com/s1106/mittelgrosse/medium-smiley-060.gif)


Oh! You KNOW you would've jumped on that if I hadn't beaten ya to the punch!
In the words of an old Waylon Jennings song:  "I've always been crazy but it's kept me from going insane!"    (http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u315/brandidonaldson/crazy.jpg)

I just found this thread, while wandering throught the forum. My answer to the poll is no loss of salvation. Now since all of you have quoted the verses I would have used, I am going to share a song my best friend sang in church a few weeks ago. The name of the song is:
            "Remind Me, Dear Lord"
             by Dottie  Rambo


The things that I love and hold dear to my heart
Are just borrowed they're not mine at all
Jesus only let me use them to brighten my life,
So remind me, remind me, dear Lord.

Roll back the curtain of memory now and then;
Show me where you brought me from,
And where I could have been;
Remember I'm human, and humans forget;
So remind me, remind me dear Lord.

Nothing good have I done to deserve God's own Son;
I'm not worthy of the scars in His hands
Yet He chose the road to Calv'ry to die in my stead,
Why He loved me, I can't understand.

Roll back the curtain of mem'ry now and then,
Show me where you brought me from,
And where I could have been;
Remember I'm human, and humans forget;
So remind me, remind me dear Lord.

Another Amen Islandboy!

I'm almost sure that I've heard that song at least once, and it's beautiful.

Love In Christ,
Tom

 

I'm running low on time, so I voted and will just drop my thoughts here!  I said No.  You can't lose your salvation.  There have been a great many passages listed.  My favorite passage on this matter is the book of Hebrews.  But here's a very basic thought to consider: was my salvation dependent on anything I brought to the table?  Most would agree that none of us brings anything worthy of the gift of life God gives us.  So, if I bring nothing of merit to obtain it...what makes me think I could do anything of merit to maintain it?  Folks, it's God.  You weren't too messed up for Him to save.  What makes you think you'll ever be too messed up for Him to hold you?  Just a thought.   :)

Thank you!!! You expressed and explained it perfectly!

(http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b207/tinabaran/jesusbraclet.gif)

And an excellent thought at that.   AMEN!

Amen Allinall!

Hello Brother Kevin. You hit the nail on the head. I am reminded of your user name right now, and we all need to be reminded of it daily:  JESUS CHRIST is our ALL-IN-ALL! We deserve nothing but punishment, but JESUS CHRIST took our punishment in HIS Own Body on the CROSS. There is no greater Love!

I'm not worthy of anything, but my LORD and SAVIOUR IS! I don't have any righteousness of my own, so I give thanks that I'm seen in and through JESUS CHRIST! I give thanks every day that I trust in the Righteousness, Holiness, and Perfection of JESUS CHRIST! Trust in ourselves or other men would mean nothing. I want to do good things and please GOD because I love HIM. If there is any glory, GLORY in CHRIST! JESUS CHRIST is our ALL-IN-ALL!

Love In Christ,
Tom


   

AMEN Brothers and Sisters!  God is good!  :)

No, God is Great!! :D :D :D

Amen to that!  I'm driving to work today, and looking at the newly fallen snow that was helping me be late to work...and grumbling.  I decided to reflect on the beauty of God's creation, and I thought: it's Christmas time, and what does God do here for us?  He paints everything white.  Beautiful.  What's more?  Christmas' promise of the gift of life to come from the cross would wash our sins..."whiter than snow."  So on Christmas time, God reminds those of us fortunate enough to be late because of the weather via the weather, to stop and wonder at His gift.  Yup Brother.  God is great.   :D :)

hello Tom!

you know that this question will just bring up the issue of osas. I would rather refrain from sin, and thus not have to
ask the question in the first place. If we serve our Lord with all that we have, then we won't have to enter into
sematics.

respectfully yours in Yeshua

ravenloche

Yes, it is a question that brings up OSAS and it is one well worth addressing. It is a question that arises even amongst the best of Christians. Why is this? Because even the best Christian no matter how hard they attempt to serve the Lord with all they have and attempt to refrain from sin will invariably commit sin even if it is unknowingly. This is why we are told to "Watch and pray, that ye enter not into temptation: the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak." We are all sinners and sometimes even the strongest of Christians will in their Christian walk stumble. This is the reason for this question and one that has been addressed quite well by others in this thread. It is not about semantics but rather about the subject of Salvation and what it means to be saved.

Haven't been here in years...but found this a very interesting question.

The question is not sin...

Christ died for the sins of the world and took them ALL upon himself...every sin is forgiven..everyone is forgiven.

The question is...do you believe that Christ took your sin upon himself and that all of your sin is forgiven? Do you believe Christ is who He said He is, God the son, and he died for your sins and rose on the 3rd day? Do you take God at His word that to obey God today is to only believe?

No faith/works...which means you prove your faith by your works...circumcision, keeping the law, rituals,etc...all of which were given to Israel...not to the body of Christ. We are to obey by faith. Anything else is disobedience and not what is for the church today.

All the Bible is for us, but not all the bible is to us. If it was all to us we would be building an ark today or sacrificing animals...you have to find where you are in God's Word today. We are not Israel...we are not under the law...we are for sure under grace, God will not send His wrath in this age...find where you are...start with Paul's Epistle's. We are in his prison Epistle's...when you read these and understand the wonderful riches of grace there, you will never question losing your salvation again.

Today it is not asking for forgiveness of sins, for they were all forgiven at the cross, Nor works, as faith in what Christ has done for us is accomplished...but belief by itself.  Faith means believing what God has said.

AMEN BEREAN!

It's all about GOD'S Matchless Grace and the finished work of JESUS CHRIST on the CROSS. If there is any Glory, it will be in CHRIST - not man.

Love In Christ,
Tom

 

I voted no.  I believe that Jesus died for all of my sins, both the ones I committed before I was saved and the ones I committed after.  I am forgiven.  I am saved.  I will go to heaven when I die.  I do my best to not add to the Lord's pain by sinning, but I tend to fall flat on my face on a pretty regular basis.  I pick myself back up and ask Jesus to forgive me again.  I'm glad I don't have to depend on living a perfect life or I would never make it!
Heather

I couldn't agree more sister

Hello Sister Heather,

Here's another AMEN!

Love In Christ,
Tom

 

IF you think that you can INTENTIONALLY go out and SIN as this POLL Suggest,
and NOT Lose your Salvation,(BLOTTED OUT of The BOOK of LIFE)
You Dont know the God I know!
It is Good to see were up to 14 people. :)

These people below, BELIEVED they were Christians, Only a Christian would Attempt or be able to do wonderous things in "his name"
Matt. 7:
21 Not every one  that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name  have cast out devils? and in thy name  done many wonderful works?  

23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

24Therefore whosoever heareth  these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:

25 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock.

26 And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:

27 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall  of it.

Would you like the Verses Where it Talks about BEING Blotted OUT  of the Book of Life?
Take a good look at JESUS'S words "NOT EVERYONE" that has said Lord Lord shall enter the Kingdom of God!

Can it get ANY plainer than that?
YLBD
HIS words were quote"GO AND SIN NO MORE",
NOT, Go ahead and Sin and i'll see ya next weekend!

Hello Littleboy,

Brother, you're welcome to your opinion, but no man lives without sin, and no man is perfect or holy. It's a matter of putting the Scriptures in context and rightly dividing the WORD of TRUTH.

How much sin, BIG or small, is really intentional? This means that the person knew it was wrong when they did it. How many Christians yield to various temptations, BIG or small? This is why all Christians have a continuing need for forgiveness. All Christians should know that they aren't perfect or holy. This is not a license to sin, but we do have an advocate with the Father. There was a reason why JESUS CHRIST died on the Cross for our sins - mainly because no man has ever kept all of the law, and no man has ever been perfect or holy. Our only righteousness is in JESUS CHRIST.

Did King David intentionally commit adultery? Let's bring it down several thousand notches and ask if Joe Smoe ever coveted his neighbor's wife? Let's go down a few more notches and ask if a man ever lived without a lie and if lies are intentional?

In short, NO man or woman is worthy of salvation, and NO man or woman has ever been saved by keeping the law. NO man or woman has ever been able to keep the law, and NO man or woman has ever been perfect or holy - intentional or not. If we depended on man's works, man's righteousness, man's perfection, or man's holiness - no man or woman would ever be saved. All of creation would be lost and bound for hell. That would definitely include ALL OF US!

So, if you are wanting to be worthy of salvation because of your own actions and works, you would be lost. The same would be true for all of us. The only thing man is worthy of earning is CONDEMNATION.

Love In Christ,
Tom

little, a few months ago I intentionally broke a promise. It wasn't a small promise, it was huge. My friend sissy, once told me her real name, she doesn't even reveal it to friends she considers family!

One day I got really angry with her. I went to the forums with full intent on breaking that promise. I broke it.
A few days later I felt guilt. I deleted what I did and asked for forgiveness.

Are you now saying that I am not forgiven? Are you saying that I lost my salvation? Are you saying that I am going to Hell?

Hello Brother David,

I'll let Littleboy answer for himself. I just want to post some beautiful portions of Scripture to think about:

Romans 5:17-18 NASB
For if by the transgression of the one, death reigned through the one, much more those who receive the abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness will reign in life through the One, Jesus Christ.  So then as through one transgression there resulted condemnation to all men, even so through one act of righteousness there resulted justification of life to all men.

Romans 8:1-2 NASB
Therefore there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has set you free from the law of sin and of death.

Love in Christ,
Tom

 

We can battle back and forth with verses all day long and get nowhere.
No David that's not what i'm saying.
BUT, You can only rape women & littlekids for so long or do you
think a man can rape  woman & littleboys & girls all his life and have "CERTAN times of FEELING Guilty"
And ask for forgiveness until the NEXT time He rapes or Kills!
Are you Guy's KIDDING ME, Do you REALLY Believe Gods Ears are open to Men like that?

I doubt if God will toss you into the Lake of Fire for Giving ALL of us Her Name, Sissy...

that isn't true repentance and that man never really had salvation in the first place

Neither, does any man that continues in his OLD way's...
Born Again means changing from the sinful person you once was.
This is all being written down in the Little Books & the cloaks of your Follies are
removed and known to God.
Their be no excuse for those that told you it was ok to continue to Sin,
Because no one cannot keep from sinning.

I would like to know,
WHY DID, Jesus tell the blind man that had just recieved
his sight, quote" TO GO AND SIN NO MORE OR A WORSE THING SHALL COME UPON YOU"?

This should be good, remember he's watching & writing it Down...

God will never ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever take away ones salvation

Littleboy,

In the very verses that you yourself gave Jesus Christ said, "I never knew you". Not I knew for a little while but "I never knew you".

We know that there will be many that give lip service but are not truly worshipping God in spirit and in truth. (Mat 15:8 )

Is it ok to continue in sin? As Paul said "God Forbid". As long as we are in the flesh though we will continue to sin. No matter how great or small a sin it may seem to man, sin is still sin in the eyes of God. No man is without sin, none are righteous in His eyes. It is for this reason that we need Jesus Christ for it is His righteousness and none of our own that counts. It is His shed blood that covers us.

Amen

1 John 2:
1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if  any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:

2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

3 And hereby we do know that we know  him, if we keep his commandments.

4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not  in him.

5 But whoso keepeth  his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.


Matt. 5:
19 Whosoever  therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach  men so, he shall be called the least  in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach  them, the same shall be called great  in the kingdom of heaven.

20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed  the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case  enter into the kingdom of heaven.

2Tim. 2:
19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, let every one  that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.

20 But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour.

21 If a man therefore purge himself  from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.

22 Flee  also youthful lusts: but follow righteousness, faith, charity, peace, with them that call on the Lord  out of a pure heart.


John 5:
13 And he that was healed  wist not who it was: for Jesus had conveyed himself away, a multitude being in that place.

14 Afterward Jesus findeth  him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse  thing come unto thee


Hebrew 10:
26 For if we sin wilfully AFTER that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
DID you understand that one?

1John 3:
6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.

7 Little children, let no man  deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is  righteous, even as he is  righteous.

8 He that committeth sin  is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

9 Whosoever is born  of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born  of God.

10 In this the children  of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not  righteousness is not  of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.


YLBD

 

Are you without sin, Littleboy? Since you accepted Christ as your Saviour have you been without all sin? Have you obeyed all of His commandments?

Yes, i've sinned since coming to the Cross, But as I grew as a Child of God,
Into one that wears his armor well,
I put away ALL those things BEHIND ME AND Hav'nt commited them since then.

YES, I HAVE OBEYED, I Love God with ALL my H. M, & Soul,
and I Love my Neighbour as much as my self,
JESUS Say's "I HAVE" FULFILLED ALL the Laws & those of the Prophets,
FOR Fulfilling those 2,
Do you not understand that simple thing?

so you do think I am going to hell because I did sin willfully

No David...
Like I said , I doubt that Our Father will through you into the
Lake of fire for saying someones name that you promised you would'nt,
In Fact I know he WON'T!

I believe you asked for forgivness, Right?

Now Just don't do That again, Not for the sake of Salvation,
But, so that you don't lose the trust, one build's with the people he surrounds
himself with, It's Hard to testifiy to people who you've Lied to and lost Trust with.

It's not like you had it planned, to go out from the get go and do what you did, Right?

NOW, if you are planning things like that and being devious, YEP! Your going straight to Hell,
NO passing go or collecting $200.00 and then on the day of Judgment the Books will be opened
and then the Book of Life and if your Name HAS been Blotted out, YOU will be tossed into the Lake of fire
Where Hell, Death, Satan, The Beast & False Prophet will be and the Smoke of your torment shall ascend forever!
Gods words NOT mine...
My Prayers & thoughts are with you Brother, I've read your post and can see the Struggle that you are going thru,
Believe me I don't like being the one who is willing to stand and say,
Stop it, their are consiquences to ones actions, Christian or otherwise!
That's me though, a Big Brother trying to protect his family.
Theirs NOT one of you I would'nt protect with my Very Life.
Don't Believe Me?
God knows & My Wife & Children would tell you that i would DIE for you, "IN A HEART BEAT"!
YLBD=Your Loving Brother Duane
And I do Love you Brother, Otherwise I would'nt have a word for you.
God removed the Beam from my eye awhile ago, BELIEVE ME it was a 4x4x12 too!
A little poke at some humor, Endure my Brother..

Littleboy,

It appears that you are very confused, especially if you actually believe you haven't sinned in a certain period of time. Would that be days, hours, or minutes that you haven't sinned in some way, or do you not understand what sin is? You also take Scripture out of context and get confused because you don't read and understand what comes before or after the Scriptures that you cherry-picked. It doesn't work that way. I'm not going to spend the time to show you your errors in handling the Scriptures because you got angry the last time I tried to help you. I'll just say that you are horribly confused. You need to learn how to properly study the Bible for yourself. It appears that you also need to learn about yourself and your own sin, and I'm talking about recent sin. It doesn't have to be a major crime for it to be sin - SIN IS SIN - BIG or small. You sin, and you've done it intentionally. If you do something in your mind - you've done it, and you will do it. If you actually think that you live without sin, GOD has said that the truth isn't in you.

You can trust GOD - YOU ARE NOT A HOLY MAN! NOT one of us is a HOLY man or HOLY woman in history, and you are no different. You can get angry with the TRUTH if you want to, but the TRUTH won't go away. The TRUTH is in the HOLY BIBLE - "Your righteousness is as filthy rags". If you are looking for your own righteousness, you'll never find it. The RIGHTEOUSNESS OF JESUS CHRIST IS WHAT SAVES US!

Littleboy, you are horribly wrong in telling people that you don't sin. IF this was true, you would be the only human being in history to accomplish this. We do change after being Saved, but we don't become perfect in this life. Hopefully, we sin much less, and we feel guilty when we sin. One doesn't have to wallow in sin for it to be a sin. Your examples with crime simply shows your confusion in this area. Many sins are NOT crimes under the laws of man.

I'll end this with one simple statement:  If you really think that you're HOLY, take a vacation and read the HOLY BIBLE as long as it takes to understand the TRUTH. Brother, you really need to start with the basics - the MILK of the WORD. If you get angry for me telling you this - so be it. The BIBLE will be more harsh than I am.

Love In Christ,
Tom

Ephesians 1:18-23 NASB I pray that the eyes of your heart may be enlightened, so that you will know what is the hope of His calling, what are the riches of the glory of His inheritance in the saints, and what is the surpassing greatness of His power toward us who believe. These are in accordance with the working of the strength of His might which He brought about in Christ, when He raised Him from the dead and seated Him at His right hand in the heavenly places, far above all rule and authority and power and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this age but also in the one to come. And He put all things in subjection under His feet, and gave Him as head over all things to the church, which is His body, the fullness of Him who fills all in all.

I did have it planned

The Lord is still willing to forgive us if we confess our sins in earnest to Him. It does not mean that we have lost our salvation.

1Jn 1:8  If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
1Jn 1:9  If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
1Jn 1:10  If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

There are many instances in the Bible where an individual sinned after coming to God and God still forgave them of those sins.

Hello Brother David.

When things like this bother you, pray about it and ask GOD to forgive you.

I must tell you that becoming saved does not mean that you become perfect, holy, and less than a human being. This is one of the reasons why JESUS died on the Cross for us. No man was ever able to keep the law perfectly in deeds or in thought, and this is why no man or woman can earn their way to heaven or be worthy of Salvation. The Apostle Paul spoke of his own battle with what he called the "Old Man". We are still in this corruptible body of flesh, and NOT one of us will be able to live perfectly and without sin in this life.

Becoming Saved does mean that you will have a desire to please GOD. Nobody does that perfectly, regardless of what they tell you. When you have guilt over a situation, your advocate with the FATHER is JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF, and there is no condemnation for those who are in CHRIST. This doesn't hint that any of us are perfect - just the opposite. However, it does mean that we don't enjoy wallowing in sin with the devil as our master. Our MASTER is CHRIST and HE knows that we aren't perfected yet. This was the war that Paul talked about having within himself. Paul called himself the Chief of all Sinners. Paul was a humble man who knew that his righteousness was in CHRIST. Paul had very harsh words for the self-righteous hypocrites of his time who thought they were law keepers. If we were able to be law keepers, did CHRIST go to the Cross for nothing?

Brother David, thoughts of self-righteousness are wrong. THOUGHTS OF CHRIST'S RIGHTEOUSNESS ARE RIGHT! CHRIST GETS ALL OF THE GLORY, and mankind gets NONE! This is why we worship and praise GOD - not man and certainly not ourselves. Paul also had some harsh words for those going about trying to establish their own righteousness. We should definitely try the best we can to please GOD and pray that GOD helps us

Brother David, I hope some of this makes sense. Please read Galatians when you get a chance. Read all of it slowly and carefully taking NOTHING out of context. The effect of our Salvation was JESUS CHRIST pulling us out of the sewer. Regardless of how hard we try, we will all slip and fall from time to time, but that doesn't mean that CHRIST is going to throw us back into the sewer - nor do we want to go back to the sewer. We should remain HUMBLE and KNOW that we are NOTHING without CHRIST!

Brother David, I didn't mean for this post to be this long, but I still need to tell you one more thing. This is IMPORTANT! Don't believe everything others tell you about CHRIST. Pray first and read and study the Bible for yourself. It will take a lot of work, but you will soon be able to tell when people aren't telling you the TRUTH. They might think that they are telling you the truth, but they don't know the truth usually for one or two reasons:  1) they don't study the Bible;  2) They don't know how to study the Bible. We live in a day and age where people want everything to be fast and easy. So, we have lots of folks expecting the same thing in learning the Bible. Drive-thru and microwave Bible study teaches someone enough to be confused, and then they go and confuse others. Nobody here claims to be a Bible Scholar, but you do get the truth here.

Love In Christ,
Tom

another big AMEN to that little phrase I NEVER knew you!

(http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b207/tinabaran/jesusdoor2heaven.gif)

I realise some of you think it's a sin to not wear your Seatbelt, or spit on the sidewalk...
I guess you'll find soon enough who's right, And I frogive you for you thoughts Weather God will,
Is up to him!
I have to go, be back maybe toimorrow.
YLBD

I do know I am forgiven even though it was intentional. I know there is no such thing a greater or lesser. I was merely trying to make a point.

Bep, I'll do what you said.

Little, please listen to Roger and bep

In the following verses we are given some of the things that are considered sinful and as we can see from this portion of scripture one sin is not considered greater than another.

Gal 5:19  Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
Gal 5:20  Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
Gal 5:21  Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

If they were then they would have been placed in such an order. These verses tell us that simply being angry at someone or lying is just as serious an offence as as is murder. All of these things can keep mankind from entering into heaven. Whether intentional or unintentionally we all have sinned and come short of the glory of God. We can clearly see from this that none of us are worthy, none of us are able to attain righteousness enough for us to enter heaven on our own. It is through the rightousness of Jesus Christ and His alone that we may enter heaven. No matter how hard we try we will fail if we try on our righteousness. It is the shed blood of Christ that covers our sins and makes us whole, makes us worthy through Him to enter heavens gates.

Did you know that even wishing a curse on someone else is a sinful thing?

Jas 3:9  Therewith bless we God, even the Father; and therewith curse we men, which are made after the similitude of God.
Jas 3:10  Out of the same mouth proceedeth blessing and cursing. My brethren, these things ought not so to be.

These verses are not talking about the use of swear words. The use of the word curse here is the same as wishing doom, disasters or maladies on others. It is the opposite of bestowing blessings on someone. Just our thoughts alone can betray us and cause us to sin.

Amen.

Thank you Sister.  I agree! (And resemble that!)

In Christ,
Grammyluv

AMEN AND AMEN!

Brothers and Sisters,

This turned out to be a beautiful thread. It reminds us and reinforces what JESUS CHRIST did for us on the Cross. It should direct attention AWAY from what men do for themselves, and this includes all of us. ONLY JESUS CHRIST IS PERFECT, HOLY, RIGHTEOUS, AND WITHOUT SIN. He allowed HIMSELF to be a Perfect Sacrifice on the Cross - the JUST for the UNJUST - the RIGHTEOUS for the UNRIGHTEOUS - the HOLY for the UNHOLY.

None of the Old Testament Saints were perfect, righteous, or holy either. If you will notice, numerous portions of Scripture make it plain that their faith in GOD was accounted unto them as RIGHTEOUSNESS. By the way, "Saint" simply means Saved Believers in GOD. Salvation has always been a result of Faith in GOD and GOD'S Grace and Love. JESUS CHRIST and the Cross greatly magnified GOD'S Love and Grace in a way that many more men saw it and understood it. In fact, JESUS CHRIST and the CROSS is the most important and precious event in history. A long list of GOD'S GREATEST Blessings were revealed at the CROSS, and they all relate to GOD'S Matchless Grace and Love for us.

1 John 1:8-10  NASB  If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar and His word is not in us.

Matthew 22:36-40  NASB  "Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?" And He said to him, " 'YOU SHALL LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WITH ALL YOUR HEART, AND WITH ALL YOUR SOUL, AND WITH ALL YOUR MIND.' "This is the great and foremost commandment. "The second is like it, 'YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.' "On these two commandments depend the whole Law and the Prophets."

Brothers and Sisters, the Two Commandments are just as hard or harder to keep than the Ten Commandments. No man has ever been able to do either! JESUS CHRIST is the only one who ever fulfilled the Commandments. This was one of the primary reasons for HIS FIRST COMING. HE also gave HIMSELF as a Perfect Sacrifice for sin, the ONLY one that GOD would be completely pleased with. HIS Perfect and Finished work for Salvation on the Cross. It was only Perfect because JESUS CHRIST is and was PERFECT AND HOLY. Please note that the WORK is FINISHED and PERFECT. We don't have anything of worth or value to add to it. GOD has already told us this.

Ephesians 2:8-10 NASB  For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast. For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.

We MUST believe and YIELD completely to the Perfect RIGHTEOUSNESS OF CHRIST. GOD isn't pleased with anything else, and this is the ONLY way to be Saved. GOD is only pleased now with PERFECTION, and CHRIST is the ONLY ONE WHO HAS IT! To think or proclaim that we have perfection is foolish. We are NOTHING without CHRIST, so GOD gets all of the GLORY!

Love In Christ,
Tom

Ephesians 1:11-14 NASB
also we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to His purpose who works all things after the counsel of His will, to the end that we who were the first to hope in Christ would be to the praise of His glory. In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation--having also believed, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of promise, who is given as a pledge of our inheritance, with a view to the redemption of God's own possession, to the praise of His glory.

John 1:14-17 NASB
And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us, and we saw His glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father, full of grace and truth. John *testified about Him and cried out, saying, "This was He of whom I said, 'He who comes after me has a higher rank than I, for He existed before me.'" For of His fullness we have all received, and grace upon grace. For the Law was given through Moses; grace and truth were realized through Jesus Christ.

2 Corinthians 1:20-22 NASB
For as many as are the promises of God, in Him they are yes; therefore also through Him is our Amen to the glory of God through us. Now He who establishes us with you in Christ and anointed us is God, who also sealed us and gave us the Spirit in our hearts as a pledge.

Ephesians 3:14-19 NASB
For this reason I bow my knees before the Father, from whom every family in heaven and on earth derives its name, that He would grant you, according to the riches of His glory, to be strengthened with power through His Spirit in the inner man, so that Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith; and that you, being rooted and grounded in love, may be able to comprehend with all the saints what is the breadth and length and height and depth, and to know the love of Christ which surpasses knowledge, that you may be filled up to all the fullness of God.

Philippians 3:20-21 NASB
For our citizenship is in heaven, from which also we eagerly wait for a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ;  who will transform the body of our humble state into conformity with the body of His glory, by the exertion of the power that He has even to subject all things to Himself.

Romans 3:19-28 NASB
Now we know that whatever the Law says, it speaks to those who are under the Law, so that every mouth may be closed and all the world may become accountable to God; because by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified in His sight; for through the Law comes the knowledge of sin. But now apart from the Law the righteousness of God has been manifested, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, even the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all those who believe; for there is no distinction; for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, being justified as a gift by His grace through the redemption which is in Christ Jesus; whom God displayed publicly as a propitiation in His blood through faith. This was to demonstrate His righteousness, because in the forbearance of God He passed over the sins previously committed; for the demonstration, I say, of His righteousness at the present time, so that He would be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus. Where then is boasting? It is excluded. By what kind of law? Of works? No, but by a law of faith. For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from works of the Law.

The way I read and I no that I am not very smart  but if you have sin in your life where I am you cannot come.

javascript:void(0);
Smiley

If that were the case then no one would be able to enter heaven for the only person that has ever been or ever will be on earth that is without sin is Jesus Christ.

yes but did he not say to come out from among the world. we know that we are not perfect but did he not say to strive to be. not just do what you want to it will be ok god forbid.


strive (strīv)

intransitive verb strove or strived, striv′enstriv′ ən or strived, striv′·ing

   1. to make great efforts; try very hard to strive to win
   2. to be in conflict; struggle; contend; fight to strive against oppression

It appears that you are splitting hairs for the sole sake of argument. If you look in the thread, this is exceptionally clear what was said. We usually don't spend so much time trying to strain gnats. The blunt truth about this issue is posted.

I might not know much but  I know that he wants us to give him our whole heart and if you do this you will not want to do alot of these things that are of sin.The Bible talks about the daily discipline of putting off our "old self" and putting on our "new self" in Christ.  This is a skill that is critical to maintaining our freedom from sin.  It is something that we'll be perfecting for the rest of our earthly lives.  Paul wrote:

22You were taught, with regard to your former way of life, to put off your old self, which is being corrupted by its deceitful desires; 23to be made new in the attitude of your minds; 24and to put on the new self, created to be like God in true righteousness and holiness.  Ephesians 4:22-24 NIV

The old self must be put off, because it is being corrupted by sinful desires and will otherwise lead us back into sin.  Simultaneously, we must put on the new self and be "made new in the attitude" of our minds.  Note that it is our responsibility to put off the old and put on the new, while God renews us in the attitude our minds.

How to put off the old self

Putting off the old self is synonymous with putting it to death.  The old self is the part of us that is continually trying to pull us back into sinful habits and thought patterns (Romans 6:11-14).  The lure of the old self can be powerful, especially when our memories remind us of the pleasures of past sin.  Here are some suggestions on how to put off the old self:

    * Ask for help:  Too often people try to resist temptations by sheer will-power.  As Christians, we have the source of ultimate power and assistance available to us: Jesus.  He knows the temptations we face (Hebrews 2:18) and will help us resist those temptations (Hebrews 4:15-16).   Each day we can pray, "Dear Jesus, please help me put off the old self  and put on the new self today.  Please help me overcome any temptations that come my way. Thank you, Jesus. Amen."
    * Reckon yourself with Jesus:  Reckoning with Jesus is basically aligning ourselves with him and his condition: dead to sin and alive to God.  Paul wrote, "Likewise you also, reckon yourselves to be dead indeed to sin, but alive to God in Christ Jesus our Lord" (Romans 6:11 NKJV).  A way to reckon with Jesus is to recite key Bible verses about our condition.  For example, using Romans 6:11 we can declare, "I am dead to sin and alive to God in Christ Jesus my Lord. "  Here are some other verses we can declare:

        I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me. Galatians 2:20 NKJV

        Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; old things have passed away; behold, all things have become new.  2 Corinthians 5:17 NKJV

        1There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit. 2For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death.  Romans 8:1-2 NKJV

        He Himself bore our sins in His body on the cross, so that we might die to sin and live for righteousness; for by His wounds you were healed. 1 Peter 2:24 NKJV

        Therefore we were buried with Him through baptism into death, that just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.  Romans 6:4 NKJV

    * Stop letting sin dictate your actions:  This is where we follow-up our faith with action.  Since we believe ourselves dead to sin, we must no longer respond to its temptations.  The two primary areas that we can focus on are our eyes and thoughts.  For example, if we're watching a television show that we know contains tempting material, we can choose to switch channels or simply turn the TV off.  Or, if a memory of a past sexual encounter comes to mind, we can shift our thoughts to another topic instead of fantasizing over the memory.

Hello Preacher,

I can see that you simply want to argue, and you haven't even read the thread. Look at the thread question and the answers to that question. Believe whatever you wish to believe. I'm not going to waste my time arguing with you. More than enough hard Scripture is already listed to answer this question, but answer it in your own mind however you wish. I have better things to do with my time. You and one other want to argue the impossible, so maybe the two of you need to get together, or maybe the two of you are already together. Regardless, I have other work to do.

Just that you know the are no one here with me but the lord . But thirty seven years ago I got born again not to say that I have not made mistakes but tried to get out of the sin business. Don.t mean to take time away from you

You sound exactly like Littleboy. Both of you have sinned whether you want to admit it or not. Big or small - Sin is Sin, but maybe you'd rather call them mistakes. GOD says that our righteousness is as filthy rags and ALL men sin, so what GOD calls it is all that matters.

but if we have god in our lives do you think we get up ever day to let sin control us

Dear Preacher,
     Please do re-read this thread slowly and carefully.  Think about what each person has written before you write your next post.  It will help your writing fit into the conversation better.  You and Littleboy seem to have the same opinion on this subject and it might be a good idea to contact him to see if you have anything else in common.  Maybe you guys could become good friends.   ;D
     It is my belief that salvation is permanent.  Even if I committed a sin and was run over by a bus immediately afterward, I would still go to heaven.  (I try very hard not to sin, with varying degrees of success.)  We do have to struggle daily to die to our old sinful selves and instead be made new in the attitude of our minds.  But that process has nothing to do with salvation.  We choose to become new creatures in Christ because we want to please God and because that is how we become an example of His love and His power to our fallen world.  Every time Christians sin we are telling non-Christians that Jesus is no good!  But we are still forgiven and we are still going to heaven.  God bless you and have a happy Easter!

OK I had to get in on this.  This question in itself shows total ignorance of what Jesus did on the cross, and what the entire word of God is about. it shows a religious mindset that has infiltrated the what most like to call "Christian" church. Or is that the reason for asking it. surly you knew the kinds of answers or questions it would bring.


blackeyedpeas said it best by using the scriptures. but the whole flux of the "Bible" is renewal of man to God through the shed blood of Jesus.
Now once all was complete Jesus himself said. "It Is Finished" The completion of the covenant that God made with man was complete at the very moment.

Eph 2:13  But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.
Eph 2:14  For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition [between us];
Eph 2:15  Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, [even] the law of commandments [contained] in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, [so] making peace;
Eph 2:16  And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:

Sin no longer has power except through the accuser of the saints. Sin in and of itself is not the issue. once you have accepted Jesus as your Sacrifice.

Again in Ephesians he says

Eph 2:5  Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)
Eph 2:6  And hath raised [us] up together, and made [us] sit together in heavenly [places] in Christ Jesus:
Eph 2:7  That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in [his] kindness toward us through Christ Jesus.

His gift of Salvation did not have anything to do with whether you sinned or did not sin. Once we accept him in our lives as Savior and Lord sin becomes a non issue. Once you truly get a picture of the absolute GRACE (unmerited favor) then sin itself begins to be distasteful. the outcome of which is a life that is a whole lot cleaner than the one you had lived.

What brings Salvation is Accepting Jesus as the ultimate sacrifice for the authority that Adam laid down in the first place.
What brings"damnation"(separation from God) is Not accepting Jesus as the Ultimate sacrifice for all sin.

I could go on and on, this is an issue that keeps most Christians crying at the alter instead of decrying in the streets the Name that is above every name.

You have heard the term "Plead the Blood" right? well if you haven't you should. Most of the old timers say "I plead the blood" in a crying bleating plea of unworthiness not understanding at all what the Blood means. The term Plead is a legal term. For instance, when you stand before a judge He will ask you "How do you plead" you can say "hey yes I blew it. man I was a scum of the earth and every time I turn around I screwed up, but I plead the blood. That sacrificial blood of the "SINLESS" Lamb of God. That and that alone is what can can get you off.

It is a gift of God not of your own works lest any man should boast.  If your reading this I hope that if you havn't, you will accept Jesus as your sacrifice for all sins. and begin a new life. Man it is "Mind Blowing" The peace that it brings.

AMEN HEATHER AND JAY!

We are NOT working our way to Heaven, mainly because we don't have the means to do so, and OUR OWN righteousness is as filthy rags. We DON'T place our faith and trust in any man, including ourselves, because NO man can provide what GOD requires EXCEPT OUR PERFECT AND HOLY LORD AND SAVIOUR, JESUS CHRIST! This is why we place our faith and trust in JESUS CHRIST and make HIM the LORD over our lives. JESUS CHRIST is the ONLY WAY, THE TRUTH, AND THE LIFE! We find our Peace with GOD ONLY IN AND THROUGH JESUS CHRIST!

Our good works are ONLY good if they are done in LOVE for GOD. If they are done as a duty, for recognition, or for any other reason - they are burned up as worthless. Further, good works are NOT required for Salvation. GOD judges our good works for ETERNAL REWARDS that are over and above Salvation. Those without any good works have not lived a good Living Testimony before men, but they have not lost their Salvation. Christians are EXHORTED (urged) to do good works and have a good Living Testimony before men, but this is not a requirement for Salvation. Above all, we must remember that our good works MUST be out of LOVE alone for GOD before GOD considers them to be good works.

I give THANKS every day that the work of Salvation was completed PERFECTLY by JESUS CHRIST on the CROSS. We place our faith and trust in HIM and HIS RIGHTEOUSNESS - because HE IS RIGHTEOUS, PERFECT, HOLY, AND NEVER FAILS! These things CAN'T be said about any man, including ourselves.


1:  Romans 3:10 NASB  as it is written, "THERE IS NONE RIGHTEOUS, NOT EVEN ONE; THERE IS NONE WHO UNDERSTANDS, THERE IS NONE WHO SEEKS FOR GOD; ALL HAVE TURNED ASIDE, TOGETHER THEY HAVE BECOME USELESS; THERE IS NONE WHO DOES GOOD, THERE IS NOT EVEN ONE."

2:  Romans 3:23  NASB  for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,

3:  Romans 5:12  NASB  Therefore, just as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men, because all sinned--

4:  Romans 6:23  NASB  For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

5:  Romans 1:18  NASB  For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness,

6:  Romans 3:20  NASB  because by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified in His sight; for through the Law comes the knowledge of sin.

7:  Romans 3:27  NASB  Where then is boasting? It is excluded. By what kind of law? Of works? No, but by a law of faith.

8:  Romans 5:8-9  NASB  But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from the wrath of God through Him.

9:  Romans 2:4  NASB  Or do you think lightly of the riches of His kindness and tolerance and patience, not knowing that the kindness of God leads you to repentance?

10:  Romans 3:22  NASB  even the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all those who believe; for there is no distinction;

11:  Romans 3:28  NASB  For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from works of the Law.

12:  Romans 10:9  NASB  that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved;

13:  Romans 4:21  NASB  and being fully assured that what God had promised, He was able also to perform.

14:  Romans 4:24 NASB  but for our sake also, to whom it will be credited, as those who believe in Him who raised Jesus our Lord from the dead,

15:  Romans 5:1  NASB  Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ,

16:  Romans 10:10  NASB  for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation.

17:  Romans 10:13  NASB  for "WHOEVER WILL CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED."

Little boy...if that were true Paul would not have spoke of false prophets.  But since Paul does speak of them, there must have been people professing to be of God, sent by God, and leading people astray.  They may have even been performing "miracles" in the name of God, much like some of our "faith healers" we see today.

And what is the "will of my Father"?  "Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind"

Now look at what they are saying here.... "But Lord I did this, and I did that, and I did all this stuff in your name....but not once did they say they loved the Lord they God with all their heart, and with all their soul, and with all their mind.  They tried to justify salvation through works and not through faith.

It has been said before in this verse... "I never knew you."  Never is a powerful word here.  Keep in mind it does not say that "I knew you once and forgot you", it says I never knew you, this means that they had never really come to Christ in the first place.  If one could gain and loose their salvation as you state then Jesus would have said something like "I knew you once but you went away."

Later you pulled some other verses in Littleboy.  Thank you.  But let us take a look at what you have.

Now we have a couple of things here.  Look at verse 2, we see that Jesus is the propitiation for the sins of the whole world.  We can see that this is referring to that Jesus died on the cross for the sins of the whole world, for everyone.  I think you and I can agree to that correct...if not then we have a deeper problem to discuss :).  But now what do you think propitiation means?  Looking up the definitions just to make certain, propitiate means "to make favorably inclined; appease; conciliate."  The common terms today would say this means to pay for, as in the phrase Jesus paid the penalty for our sins.  And I think we can probably agree on that too.  So how did He pay for our sins?  He died for them.
Romans 5:6 For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.
Romans 5:8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
Romans 6:10 For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
There is just a few verses to support that, there are more but we shall limit it there to save space.

So in order to be propitiated for our sins required Christ to die...how many times can we kill Him?  Christ died once, Romans 6:10 above tells us that.  He died once unto sin.  He was crucified only once.  If we were to lose our salvation He would have to be crucified again in order to get it back.  No Christ died once to offer the gift of salvation to the whole world. 

Ok so now let us look at verse 19 up there.  Notice it says whoever shall break one of these least commandments...which I am sure you would agree that would be a sin.  Notice what will happen to that person... they shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven...it does not say that he will not be allowed into heaven..just called the least. 

Now verse 20...what wast he righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees measured by?  They measured it by their works.  See the explanations above where Christ said "I never knew you" and what it was they said they were doing.  Not what was in their hearts but what their hands were doing in the name of God.

Exactly

Let me ask you this littleboy, do you believe that Paul never struggled with sin once he accepted Christ?  What do you make of Paul's writings in Romans 7? 

There are several other verses that I would like to bring up.  Because in order to truly study scripture you should always use scripture.

John 4:14 But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life.
Now it is understood that the drinking of the water that Jesus is talking about here is accepting Christ as Lord and Savior.  Notice the word never...remember our talk above about the power of that word?  If we could turn away the salvation and lose it then we would be "thirsty" again.  And that would change the meaning of the word never wouldn't it.
Let us also look at another powerful word in that verse...everlasting.  How long do you think everlasting is?  Is it only until we ask for it again?

John 6:35 And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst.
Never hunger....never thirst.... never means never.

John 10:28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
Here we have never gain...and another word...eternal, which is another one like everlasting...just sorta keeps going and going and going.

And one final one
John 11:26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?

So Littleboy let me ask you.  Do you believe that?  Do you believe that Jesus simply stated that in order to live forever all you have to do is believe in Jesus and turn your life over to Him?  Littleboy God knows that we sin, Paul says that ALL have sinned.  God knows that have sinned, do sin, and will sin.  And God cannot look upon us that way.  He sent His only begotten Son (John 3:16) to live as a man, to die as a man, but to be resurrected victorious over death so that we too may live like a man, die like a man, but through Jesus be victorious over death.  We may stumble and we may hit roadblocks (1 Peter 2:8).  But Jesus is there to pick us up and help us along.  His blood was shed to cover us so that when God looks upon us, all He sees is Jesus' blood and not our sins. 

This does not mean that a Christian should live in a sinful way, ie drinking, gambling, going to the strip clubs, not going to church, etc, etc.  By no means no.  We as Christians should turn our lives over to Christ and let Him lead us.  Preacher was heading in the right direction with it, we should not let sin dictate our actions, and that we should let our love of our God, and the gratefulness of our salvation shine in everything we do.  However we are going to stumble sometimes.  We ALL WILL sin sometimes, and if you think speeding is not a sin, then I would strongly recommend you go back and read Romans 13:1-7 which tells us that we should be subject to the higer powers, in reference to the government and the laws of the land.  And that disobeying them would be resisting the ordinance of God...and that is a sin.

Littleboy I will pray for you that you would come to understand the assurance of your salvation.  And that it is not by anything you have done or can do except accepting the free gift.  Jesus paid the price for salvation through His death and there is nothing more we can do.