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when we refer to someone as a saint, we usually mean that they're a lifesaver, or a great person, or a volunteer junkie, etc.  But my spanish class got onto the topic of Catholic saints the other day.  Apparently, to become a sait, you ahve to be able to levitate, transform into an animal, and be able to heal the sick.  And when I found out that they were canonizing Mother Theresa, it made me begin to wonder on if there were really people who could levitate, etc.  Is there any real proff from the Bible that says God will give certain people abilities for the benifit of mankind, or even have the Virgin Mary appear to an individual with these abilities?  

Oh joy a bunch of cathlic mysticism.  Anyone who is saved is a saint.  The misconception of the term saint comes from the silly teachings of the cathlolic church.

I was just watching a little bit while changing channels on the south americans and some silly things they do.  They run around beating themselves and torturing themselves as a "penance to God".  Some go as fas as to immitate the crucifixtion of Christ.  How silly of man to think he can try and torture himself to get into God's good graces.

I agree 100%. We are called saints and is a synonym for HOLY because we are "set aaprt unto God."
aw

All that are called by the gospel of Jesus Christ, and obey it are sanctified through His blood and made holy, are saints.

Romans 1:7.  To all that be in Rome, beloved of God, called to be saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ.


 1 Corinthians 1:2.  Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both theirs and ours:


 1 Thessalonians 4:7.  For God hath not called us unto uncleanness, but unto holiness.


1 Thessalonians 5:14.  Now we exhort you, brethren, warn them that are unruly, comfort the feebleminded, support the weak, be patient toward all men.
 15.  See that none render evil for evil unto any man; but ever follow that which is good, both among yourselves, and to all men.
 16.  Rejoice evermore.
 17.  Pray without ceasing.
 18.  In everything give thanks: for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you.
 19.  Quench not the Spirit.
 20.  Despise not prophesyings.
 21.  Prove all things; hold fast that which is good.
 22.  Abstain from all appearance of evil.
 23.  And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.
 24.  Faithful is he that calleth you, who also will do it.


2 Thessalonians 1:7.  And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
 8.  In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
 9.  Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;
 10.  When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.
 11.  Wherefore also we pray always for you, that our God would count you worthy of this calling, and fulfil all the good pleasure of his goodness, and the work of faith with power:
 12.  That the name of our Lord Jesus Christ may be glorified in you, and ye in him, according to the grace of our God and the Lord Jesus Christ.


 2 Thessalonians 2:13.  But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:
 14.  Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.
 15.  Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.


2 Timothy 1:9.  Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,
 10.  But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel:


1 Peter 1:13.  Wherefore gird up the loins of your mind, be sober, and hope to the end for the grace that is to be brought unto you at the revelation of Jesus Christ;
 14.  As obedient children, not fashioning yourselves according to the former lusts in your ignorance:
 15.  But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation;
 16.  Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy.


 1 Peter 2:9.  But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light;


 jude 1:1.  Jude, the servant of Jesus Christ, and brother of James, to them that are sanctified by God the Father, and preserved in Jesus Christ, and called:


Those in Christ and such as should be saved are saints.
That is, all true Christians.

The church at Rome teaches falsely about saints. They do not adhere to scripture concerning this and in fact contradict scripture with their own thoughts.
 

Whoever gave you this "Catholic" definition doesn't know what he/she is talking about.

The RCC does have a set of criteria for deciding to canonise someone, but it does not require the sort of things you're talking about.  It does (I think) require them to have performed some sort of miracle.

These are not, anyway, the criteria for being a saint.  They are the criteria the church uses to say "we can see that this person was so clearly and obviously holy that we know he or she was a saint".   The church accepts that the vast majority of saints will never be recognised in this world.  Canonization is the process of recognising [some of] those who can be.

Right On! Brother

Brother Love :)

The word "canon" comes from the Greek word kanon meaning a standard or measuring rod.

The custom of canonization began in the early church by popular acclamation. Hence the custom of calling all the apostles "Saint."

The Roman Catholic Church since the 10th century has officially applied the standard of holiness of life to certain individuals who lived exemplary Christian lives and through a lengthy process of prayer and study have declared that the individual is in heaven.

Contrary to the belief of some, the Church does not "create" saints, but simply applies the standard of gospel holiness to those God permits the Church to know are in heaven with Him. One principle way for God to affirm the presence of an individual in heaven with Him is through the performance of miracles through the intercession of that person.

Oh boy... Be gentle, guys. ;D

On another forum, someone posted a lengthy list of padre pios accomplishments.

As I recal one of the claims made which qualified him, for catholic sainthood, was;

His own claims made by himself to have shed his own blood for hundreds of peoples and the remission of their sins.

Yet as I understood from the article, padre pio, died of old age .

It still to this day somehow, does not sound right to me..

Petro

I know of only one biblical Measuring Rod...and we all "fall short" of That.

Quote from: Saved_4ever on October 08, 2003, 02:24:41 AM
Oh joy a bunch of cathlic mysticism.  Anyone who is saved is a saint.  The misconception of the term saint comes from the silly teachings of the cathlolic church.

I was just watching a little bit while changing channels on the south americans and some silly things they do.  They run around beating themselves and torturing themselves as a "penance to God".  Some go as far as to immitate the crucifixtion of Christ.  How silly of man to think he can try and torture himself to get into God's good graces.

Once Again, RIGHT ON!!!!!

Brother Love :)
 
 

I'm going to let Ave clean his/her own mess up, but I'm going to correct Brother Love here. This beating he was referring to is a heresy in the Catholic Church. A Heresy founded in Protestantism, I might add.

Saints or Holy Ones- set apart (Rom 1:7, 1 Sam 2:9)  

All true Christians are saints in the Biblical sense of the word (Eph 1:12-14, 1 Pet 2:5-9.

Not perfect nor called saints because of anything they do but, because they have accepted Jesus as Lord and Savior (Phil1:1, 4:21)

Leave it to man and his devisive ways to define they who are sanctified  by God, for service to Him.

This is why, the religious institutions have competing stables of saints, to be prayed to, and sought out in times of need
of need.

One must belong to the institution which has the saint which is associated to one of its faithfull, leave the chuch lose your saint.

It is just all nonsense..


Petro

Ok, I geuss I will join in. :D

Why are you always so hung up on titles? Don’t focus to much on the definition of the word. “Saint” is just a silly title. We are all saints, just like we all the priesthood of believers. So what if we use the title of “Saint” for special Christians. It is just a name, what’s in a name? It doesn’t make you any less of a saint? No, it doesn't. Just because Paul is a Saint doesn't mean you are not one. You just don't have an offical title. Is that all you want? Because if so, I can mail you a peice of paperfrom' Print Shop" to hang on your wall ;D ;)

Is thios yopur definition of a saint??


That is what you say...


Special christians??...............I never heard of such a thing??


God loves names, and a name says it all.  

Isa 56
4  For thus saith the LORD .............
5  Even unto them will I give in mine house and within my walls a place and a name better than of sons and of daughters: I will give them an everlasting name, that shall not be cut off.

God renamed every one of the men He called in the OT.


Would you pray to me if you gave me this official title??


You are not only silly, you are dangerous...you know just enough about scripture to lead people away from God, with your thoughts and ideas..instead to HIM


Petro

Oh, dear, aren’t we in a viscous mood. Petro, relax. You want to take bible, lets start talking about the verses about showing kindness to all. Why don’t we? Love seems to be pretty big issue in the bible. You can quote verses all you want; anyone can be a bible scholar thanks of the net, love take a bit more work, buddy.

Oh wow, look at your verse, it says no other name is above that of Jesus. Why do you spend so much time on “saint” when the verse YOU posts takes of Jesus being the most important name?

I’m “dangerous” eh? That line could pick up chicks. “Hey baby, I’m dangerous.” ;D You say I’m dangerous, how about you try to steer clear from the danger and just not reply to my posts? Just a while ago, you would have said I know nothing, now you say I know enough to be dangerous? Sounds like someone is changing their story on us, and it isn’t me for once ;) How about you make up your mind, and stop blowing smoke. Better yet, keep changing your mind, do what ever you want, just do it a little bit more compassion, please. I thought we have finally come on mutual understanding and respect.

But, back to the topic at hand, you said nothing that disproves my point; it is a title, nothing more. You are making mountains out of mole hills. Call them Joeblows for all I care, it isn’t the word you use that matters. Just because they are called saints doesn’t mean the rest of us aren’t. Lawyers have doctorates, but the official title for a lawyer is mister, but we called other males “mister” as well. It is just a title. When you get right down to you, you are the only one who cares what they are called.

The apostle Paul frequently asked other fellow believers in Jesus to pray for him.

Col 4:3
At the same time, pray for us, too, that God may open a door to us for the word, to speak of the mystery of Christ, for which I am in prison.
Rom 15:30
... join me in the struggle by your prayers to God on my behalf,
James asks presbyter believers to pray over other believers.

Jam 5:14
Is anyone among you sick? He should summon the presbyters of the church, and they should pray over him and anoint (him) with oil in the name of the Lord
Prayer appears to be the normal way for believers (saints) on earth to support one another. Probably all of us have asked another Christian, as Paul did--another saint in the Body of Christ--to pray for us when we had a need.

As Catholic Christians - we believe that as we can ask a fellow Christian -a saint- to pray for us, we should be able to ask prayers from the saints already united to the Lord in heaven. If the prayers of certain Christians here on earth seem to possess special power because of their great faith witness or holiness, how much more powerful and effective might not the prayers of those of the communion of saints in heaven who are fully united to God.

In the book of Psalms, which was the hymn book for the Temple in Jerusalem, we sing to those in the heavenly court and exhort them:

"Bless the Lord, O you his angels, you mighty ones who do his word, hearkening to the voice of his word! Bless the Lord, all his hosts, his ministers that do his will!" (Psalm 103:20-21, RSV, as below)

The fact that those in the heavenly court can hear our prayers  is also indicated in the book of Revelation, where we read:

"And another angel came and stood at the altar with a golden censer; and he was given much incense to mingle with the prayers of all the saints upon the golden altar before the throne; and the smoke of the incense rose with the prayers of the saints from the hand of the angel before God." (Revelation 8:3-4)

Thus those saints who are angels have a role in presenting our prayers to God in an intercessory manner. (Angels are also saints, as indicated by the fact that the Bible applies the Hebrew word for saint/holy one -- qaddiysh -- to them, cf. Daniel 4:13, 23, 8:13. Thus we speak of St. Michael the Archangel, St. Gabriel, St. Raphael, etc.).

Since the Ascension of Christ, when Jesus took the Old Testament saints from sheol to heaven, large numbers of humans saints have also been in heaven, and Revelation indicates they also present our prayers to God:

"And when he [the Lamb] had taken the scroll, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, each holding a harp, and with golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints" (Revelation 5:8).

The twenty-four elders represent the hierarchy of the people of God in heaven (just as the four living creatures represent the hierarchy of the angels of God in heaven), and here they are shown presenting our prayers to God under the symbol of incense (which is, in fact, what incense symbolizes in church, since it is a pleasing smell which rises upward).

One might object, saying, "But maybe those weren't prayers to the saints but prayers to God!" This may well be true. However, a person who says this only digs the hole deeper for himself since this would mean that those in heaven are aware of prayers which weren't even directed to them!

In any event, we know that the saints in heaven (whether human saints or angel saints) are aware of our prayers and, based on them, intercede with God on our behalf. Scripture, Tradition, and the Magisterium all agree.