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The Rapture seems to becoming an increasing popular debate lately.
I don't know if this is really a debate issue, so I thought I would post it here.  I probably need to make some clarification first.  I do believe in the "Rapture." For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever. (1 THESSALONIANS 4:16-17), Do I care when that happens.....pre, mid, post......no.   I think its really great that there are Christians who are studying this subject in such great detail.  ( REVELATION 1:3 ) Blessed is the one who reads the words of this prophecy, and blessed are those who hear it and take to heart what is written in it, because the time is near.  I can see the world today and I can see what was written and shown through prophecy.  Is it exciting to me?  Somewhat and I can't argue that its interesting.  But, my salvation is in the hand of Christ who paid that price on the cross, who was resurrected three days after and went to be at the right hand of the Father.  There are definite situations that I do not want to face in this life, but would I be faithful to say in those times that Christ, who has walked beside me and most times carried me, would turn from me?  Would leave me alone in this world?   ( REV 7:16-17 ) "Never again will they hunger; never again will they thirst.  The sun will not beat upon them, nor any scorching heat.  For the Lamb at the center of the throne will be their shepherd; he will lead them to springs of living water.  And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes."  There is a difference for me in seeing thoughts through the spirit and seeing them through the flesh.  For me I like to study the gift of Salvation, really try to understand what Christ was like, what He did, and what he went through. So, is there really a need to "prove" (and I know some of you are trying :D) when this awesome event will take place or do we realize that as Christians, Christ has already saved us and no matter what is to happen to us on this Earth, that we will be with him forever in paradise?  Please remember this is a friendly discussion, just wondering what thoughts are out there to help my knowledge grow.  All opinions will be heard and taken seriously by myself......I can't speak for others however. ;D  And once again, please remember that I am not attacking anyones opinion.  I'm trying to increase my own knowledge from some great insight that seems to be common place on these forums.  So, out with it, whats all the hoopla about?  ;D

I agree Amorous, What is the importance of when as long as we know that the rapture, whenever it takes place, will in fact happen and we will be with our Lord and Saviour. Personally I think that arguing over such things detracts from the most important part of God's word, the wonderful word of the Gospel.

a big AMEN to everything. We need not worry about 'when' it will happen. We need to be doing His will and helping to increase the number of people who will be apart of this Event!!!!   AMEN!!



           Soldier for HIM.....Tina
                        (http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b207/tinabaran/notefromjesus.gif)

Amen Sister, we need to be busy doing the things Jesus told us to do and He will come back for us not a minute too soon and not a minute too late. That is His promise.

AMEN -Am-, PR, Tina, and Maria!!

I think that the reasons for studying the events leading up to the rapture is so when someone asks us about the things that are happening today in the Middle East we can explain to them and lead them to God. Jesus' Second Coming is actually what all of these events are leading up to and not the rapture. We are not to know the day or the hour in which the rapture will happen.
Kathy

Amen to all.

The Bible clearly tells us that we will not know when Jesus it to come again.  This being a key point in the entire process of the rapture and tribulation.  We will not know.  But one thing that Jesus told us to always be prepared for it.

Those that are trying so desperately to find a date for the return of Christ are seeking an excuse.  They are looking for a time so they know that 4 weeks before that time they better start straitening their life out and get going right with God again. 

Jesus does not want us to be saved but living unrighteously up until the time before he comes and then start being righteous.  He wants us to always be righteous and live according to His will.  For this is the glory of God to see it in our everyday lives and the planting of the seeds that God will nurture in others.  Not only is our spreading of the Word with our mouth and out literature part our "Commission" but to live according to who we are in Christ.

I once heard a speaker ask this and it is so true in our everyday life and what we as followers of Christ should be doing
"Are you becoming what you became?"
So true in that we who are saved have already become spiritually a saved being.  Now the question is are we acting and growing into that which Christ has made of us?

Should the Rapture matter to you?  Sure it should, just as the story of Moses should matter, or anything else in the Bible for that matter.  We are told that every word of it is for the edifying of saints, above reprooof, as well as the purpose of teaching.  So there is not a part of the Bible that "less" important than the others.  Nor is there any doctrine in the Bible that is less important than others.  We are to use it all and when you study and get to know a certain portion of the Bible (IE you have a thurough understanding of a book, story, concept, etc) then God will use you and your knowledge somehow, somewhere for His Glory and spreading His Grace.

Sincerely
Brother Jerry

Amen Bro Jerry.

I too admit I would like to know, but not to get right with God ;D

I am also thankfull that we humans are not privileged to the information. I for one procrastinate.........

If I have no idea when our risen Lord will return, and I am prepaired, then I will do everything I can to share His good news with those around me, that they may share in the exiting anticipation!

BIC

Blessings to you!

I have some time between mission work and thought I would check in.

Yes, this seems to be very popular for debate and discussion at this time, both on news stations and at churches, as well as Christian chat rooms online.

I tend to not listen to ones that watch the "signs" and tell me when they believe this will occur. I read the Bible. In Revelations it clearly states that, only God will know the precise time, and I will wait on Him. I haven't stopped looking up, waiting for the glorious day when Jesus returns but I concentrate on doing His Work that He planned for Me, for His Glory, and not on when He will come back. Even after Jesus' resurrection, the disciples believed that THEY were in the end of times. Although there are many signs today, there were also just as many back then. We should just stay focused on Him, His Work, His Word and helping the lost souls to find Him and follow His Ways.

I figure it this way: I know where I am going, no matter when it happens, so I am not concerned when that will happen. God will reveal that to us in His Time. I have Faith in His Promise and can't wait to rejoice in His Radiance, Worshipping Him for all eternity!

God Bless,
Kelly

Thanks everyone for all your insight. 
Blessings!

I certainly agree with most comments here.   I will say however, that this issue is spoken of greatly in the word and was clearly given for us to know Gods plan of history for mankind.  Bear with me for a few paragraphs if you would.


When the disciples came and asked Jesus privately "when will these things happen, and what will be the signs of your coming".  Jesus explained in great detail for them, and us, so that we would understand the signs that would signal His return.   So yes, it is important for us, just as it was them.  Not in a salvaic sense, mind you, but in the sense that we are not to be blind to Gods full plan for His Church as the world is.


1Th 5:4  But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.
1Th 5:5  Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness.
1Th 5:6  Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober.
1Th 5:7  For they that sleep sleep in the night; and they that be drunken are drunken in the night.
1Th 5:8  But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for a helmet, the hope of salvation.

Paul tells this group of believers to WATCH and be SOBER.   Again, keeping things in perspective here, he doesn't tell them to run around like chicken little crying that the sky is falling, but clearly we are to be aware of the times we live in, be sober and sound minded, preparing ourselves with faith, love and hope of our redemption drawing all the closer.

I will say that current world events have opened many many opportunities for me to share Gods love with others.   The world is obsessed with end time talk.   Just watch a few hours of the history channel, or late blockbuster titles.   Doom and gloom as it were.   Of course they too can see the writing on the wall, but none of them are watching and sober to current events.   If we are not watching and sober to the times, how will we ever be able to share Gods love and peace with them, with an un-earthly peace in the midst of it all?

Simple answer....by standing firm on Gods word and promises regarding the signals of His soon return and how we were instructed by Christ himself to watch and know the signs.   Is the rapture important to me?   You betcha!  Not in a debatable sense, but in truth and hope!   

I hear all the time people saying how these signs have been happening for 2000 years, and saying the lords return was near for a long time.   Indeed, but if you look at the signs that Jesus himself gave, and the manner in which they would be taking place, it narrows things down significantly!   Note that Jesus did not say any of the individual signs could not happen from time to time....i.e. wars rumors of wars, or earthquakes.

He gave a series of signs that would all be taking place together, in a cycle like that of the birth pains of a women.

Wars, rumors of wars....earthquakes in various places, nation against nations, kingdom against kingdom, roaring of the waves, great signs and wonders in the heavens.

Consider the last 5 years as opposed to history
Tsunami's
Earthquakes
Katrina - wiped out an entire city -  displaced thousands of people from N.O.
Wars current, and rumors of wars
Threats of asteroid impacts
Plagues - bird flu, AIDS, etc...
famines - happening in many parts of the world.

Can anyone name a time in history when ALL these things were taking place at the same time, in a cycle of ever increasing magnitude?   Jesus said this would only be the beginning!

Add on top of that current geopolitical landscape of a revived Roman empire living and thriving as Daniel predicted in the OT, and Israel being restored to the promise land as Ezekiel predicted and suddenly Jesus words over 2,000 years ago don't sound like distant story from a history book....its current headlines on a daily basis.


Let me be clear, I am not date setting here as no believer should, but I will boldly say we ARE INDEED living in the final hours of history.   And I know this not because I am some self proclaimed prophet giving a prediction....I know it because we are the only generation to experience ALL the above just as described in scripture, and in the same exact manner Jesus said they would happen.   


Let me ask the same question as the OP did.  Is the Rapture important to me?   Yes sir!   Why?   Because I know time is running out on this world.   Millions are drowning in the icy seas around us.   WE MUST know the times and plant crops of  Gospel seed before the spring rains begin, and its too late for those who do not know the times that lay ahead.  And, Jesus told us to watch so as to be ready for His return, to be living righteously in service to Him when he arrives.    Is the rapture important to you?    It should be! 




Grace and Peace!

Blessings Tim!
Okay, I must be a stick in the mud (if we had any mud, due to the heatwave in Kansas). I still think all these things happened throughout history, from Earthquakes, to volcanoes, astoroids (and now, space junk is falling), floods--wars; do you ever remember a time when someone wasn't having one, somewhere? If there wasn't a war, someone started one, it seemed, just to keep busy.

In my lifetime, I have seen our world atlas turn into a bunch of countries that are no longer there. I witnessed Mt. St. Helen's erupting, Mt. Popo (only know Mexican name, since I lived behind it when I was in Puebla) erupting in Puebla, Earthquakes in California (when isn't there one?), Tornadoes everywhere (me included), Hurricanes (been there--lived in Massachusetts, Hurricane Bob is the call to fame for my first born child..hee hee). There is the space shuttle incident, Oklahoma City Bombing..and I know I am missing TONS of events during that time period. Truthfully, I can't see one part of history where our earth wasn't in some sort of a mess, naturally or by man's own hands.

I lived in Vegas for many years. If that isn't the original city of sin, I don't know what is. Yet, I heard everyone here talking that, New Orleans was being "paid back" for all it's sin. When Vegas becomes ocean front property, I will worry but until then, I will just do as Jesus tells me to do, and keep looking up, awaiting His arrival. If I don't see Him come here on earth, I know for SURE I will see him when I go to heaven.

What was my point, anyway? If anyone has a clue, let me know. Sometimes, I just like to hear the sound of my fingers typing. :)

God Bless,
Kelly

Amen 2nd Timothy!

I loved your post, not just because we agree on many areas of Bible prophecy. I love the fact that GOD put every WORD in the Bible for a reason. We are to read and study GOD'S WORD from cover to cover very diligently for many reasons. The main reason is that GOD gave us HIS WORD to read and study for Salvation, instruction, encouragement, and a host of other reasons. It is a joyous challenge to study GOD'S WORD, even the highly complex and time-consuming Bible Prophecy.

YES, the RAPTURE OF THE CHURCH WHICH IS THE BODY OF CHRIST is an important and precious topic, and it represents a beautiful PROMISE of Almighty GOD. We know that the Promises of GOD will be fulfilled perfectly at HIS appointed time, and it appears that time is growing near. RIGHT NOW WOULD BE WONDERFUL!

Brother, we've been missing you. Wherever you are and whatever you are doing, many of us are doing the same thing you are:


Love In Christ,
Tom

1 Thessalonians 4:13 NASB  But we do not want you to be uninformed, brethren, about those who are asleep, so that you will not grieve as do the rest who have no hope.

1 Thessalonians 4:14 NASB  For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who have fallen asleep in Jesus.

1 Thessalonians 4:15 NASB  For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord, will not precede those who have fallen asleep.

1 Thessalonians 4:16 NASB  For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.

1 Thessalonians 4:17 NASB  Then we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we shall always be with the Lord.

1 Thessalonians 4:18 NASB  Therefore comfort one another with these words.

Hi Kelly4Jesus!    :)    I don't think you're being a stick in the mud at all!   Nothing wrong with questioning what we hear  :)




Indeed!   All these things have happened in the past.  But as I said in my prior post, Jesus never said these things wouldn't take from time to time, which they have....but He specifically said that right before His return, they would ALL be taking place together in a manner such as birth pangs.   All the signs together, Cycling if you will, in ever increasing magnitude like contractions before birth.   Before the last few World Wars, you may be able to find throughout history major world events like these that have happened in a singular sense or maybe even a few together over periods of time, but today if you go take a look at the headlines, you will see ALL those signs taking place this morning.   In todays headlines you can read about a massive earthquake, a Tsunami that has killed hundreds, wars (Iraq, Israel/Lebanon), rumors of wars (Iran, North Korea) Nations against Nations, Kingdom against Kingdom (Japan/US-North Korea, Syria/Iran Israel).  If you have followed the news over the last 20 years or so, you will see an unmistakable pattern.   ALL these events are increasing both in frequency and intensity, just like labor pains.    I think you will be hard pressed to find a time in history where this was the case.     Jesus said when you see all these things taking place in the manner He described, know that it is near, even at the door!      Lump all this in with Israels appearance as a nation again, world leaders scrambling to involve themselves in peace in that very region, a Revived Roman Empire that Daniel speaks of in great detail, and you get a time in history unlike any that we have seen since Jesus time.   We are unmistakably close if we are to accept the signs Jesus told us would signal His return.   We don't know the hour or the day, but we know the signs, and those signs are pointing to the promise He gave concerning the nearness of His return.






I'm not sure I subscribe to the idea that events like these are "payback for sins" as some have said previously.   I also don't think we should be worried about these things either.  Like you say, we are going heaven one way or the other if we have accepted Him as our Lord and Saviour  :)     Kelly, He might very well tarry for some time yet.  All we can go on is what He told us to watch for.   If we go by that, He's got His hand on the door knob.   I too will wait for His good timing, but its clear we don't have long to wait.   ;)   



LOL   :D   I'm fairly sure your point was to Occupy till He comes!  To that I can only say Amen!   I will add that I'm occupied with a painful crick in my neck from all the looking up though  ;D

Blessings!

Tom said:



Thanks brother, Its nice to be missed!   Spring schedule keeps my tied up a bit, but I should have more time to visit with you guys now.


Grace and Peace!

Kelly4Jesus,
Your not being a stick in the mud.  I started this thread to get an understanding of how other Christians are viewing this topic, your opinion included.  As a family in Christ we are to encourage one another and most importantly learn from one another, to hear testimony of our brethren, to bring to our family our happiness and grief to, most importantly, give praise to our Lord Jesus for all of these things. 

2nd Timothy,
Thanks for the response.  I have copied the verses down and will do a study myself.  Sounds very interesting. 

May you all be blessed!
-Am-

Hello Amorus,

We have several highly detailed threads about the Rapture already on the forum. If you do a forum search on "Rapture", you should find more material than you could study in years. You will find that we had several excellent studies and several debates that got too hot.

If you have any trouble finding them, holler.

Love In Christ,
Tom

Matthew 4:4 NASB  But He answered and said, "It is written, 'MAN SHALL NOT LIVE ON BREAD ALONE, BUT ON EVERY WORD THAT PROCEEDS OUT OF THE MOUTH OF GOD.'"

Brother Tom,
I'm not sure why I didn't think of that, and now that I look I can see the search button very clearly posted above.  Thanks for the reminder! (http://bestsmileys.com/clapping/2.gif)

 8)I think that the important thing is that we know it is coming and are prepared.  I think that it is important that we know what is going to take place during the tribulation in case Christ does not rapture us before it starts.  I think that the time of the rapture is irrelevant.  If God wanted us to know the times or date He would have had it written in His book. :)

This is true

Amen!  In fact He says no man knows the day nor the hour.   We were however given the season in discriptive form by Jesus himself.   But certainly not the day nor hour.


Blessings!

I don't really believe in the Rapture. that people shouldn't be discussing it so much.I think(whether it's true or not) that Believers should just live their lives as if He is coming today. Because if so many people are are looking & watching for the Rapture & if it doesn't happen,people will STILL be looking for it to happen.


                              Yours in Yeshua,
                              Curious
                             

There is no doubt that the rapture will indeed happen and we are told to watch and wait for it to pray that we may be considered worthy at that time. Yes, there is a great disagreement as to when it will happen but that does not remove the fact that it will happen as God has promised it will.

There is also a growing disagreement IF it is going to happen...true ?



                                Love in Yeshua,
                                Curious

No there is no growing discussion about if it is going to happen.  The Bible is quite clear that the church will be raptured from the world.  Where there is discussion is when it will happen in relation to the tribulation period.

You are correct however in your previous comments that we should live each day as if it is our last, as if Jesus was coming that day and to be ready for it.

little, please put that into paragraphs

My Bad,
Hi Everyone,From what I've gathered from my many yrs. searching the deep & hidden mysteries of Our Father & his words with a prayerful heart.
God will show his hand (not Physically)when he has to shorten the Days so mankind won't Aniallate itself.
It's always been my thought that this is when we would be taken(Raptured),Then the AntiChrist would rise for his 7 yr reign, 3 1/2yrs. of it in Horror.
During these 7 yrs. we are at the Marriage Supper in Heaven.AT the end of these 7 yrs., The Raptured Bride & those that refused to receive the mark of the Beast & the angels of our lord return with Jesus to Rule & Reign for a 1000 yrs.(the 144,00 are still on earth in petra)

During these 1000 yrs. Satan is bound and sealed up in the Pit & unable to tempt Man.After these 1000 yrs. Satan is let loose to gather from the 4 corners of the world and Gog & MaGog to march against us in Jerusalem,Fire will come down out of Heaven from God and devour them ,Satan is then cast into the Lake of Fire where the Beast & false Prophet are.
Then the Sea, Death & Hell shall give up their dead & the Dead will stand before God at the Great White Throne of Judgment & the Books will be opened & then the Book of Life and whosoevers name was not found in it, Is cast into the Lake of Fire.
 Then the New Jerusalem Decends from Heaven and the life giving waters that flow from the throne of God and the trees that bare's the 12 kinds of fruit will be used to Heal this World, Ezekiel says that water will flow to the east & down thru the valley and give life to the Dead Sea & that we will fish their too!
Some will Live in the New Jerusalem and never leave it, The Bible says it measure at 1500 miles wide & 1500 mi. in length and it's as tall as it is wide.
 You all know of it's Beauty as discribed by John, It's 12 gates & it's 12 Foundations....

Revelation 22:
1 And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb.
 
2 In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=--=-=-==-===-=-=-=-=-=
Ezekiel 47:
7 Now when I had returned, behold, at the bank of the river were very many trees on the one side and on the other.
 
8 Then said he unto me, These waters issue out toward the east country, and go down into the desert, and go into the sea: which being brought forth into the sea, the waters shall be healed.

9 And it shall come to pass, that every thing that liveth, which moveth, whithersoever the rivers shall come, shall live: and there shall be a very great multitude of fish, because these waters shall come thither: for they shall be healed; and every thing shall live whither the river cometh.

10  And it shall come to pass, that the fishers shall stand upon it from Engedi even unto Eneglaim; they shall be a place to spread forth nets; their fish shall be according to their kinds, as the fish of the great sea, exceeding many.
 
11 But the miry places thereof and the marishes thereof shall not be healed; they shall be given to salt.

12 And by the river upon the bank thereof, on this side and on that side, shall grow all trees for meat, whose leaf shall not fade, neither shall the fruit thereof be consumed: it shall bring forth new fruit according to his months, because their waters they issued out of the sanctuary: and the fruit thereof shall be for meat, and the leaf thereof for medicine. It's strange thing that after all that(1000 reign of Jesus) People will still reject God...
YLBD
Sorry about that

Brothers and Sisters,

The RAPTURE OF THE CHURCH WHICH IS THE BODY OF CHRIST is a BIBLE FACT - A PROMISE FROM GOD! The only disagreement on this matter involves "WHEN".

AMEN!
I'm ready & waiting, PATIENTLY 8)

I believe that Paul says in 2 Tim 4: 8 that we get a crown unto those who love his appearing, so it is very important. Inoticed that some one posted some of rapture verses, but there and other one in Gal 1:4 that speaks of the rapture. The word is EXAIREO which can be translated , deliver,rescue, and to PLUCK OUT, out of this evil age.