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Theology => Apologetics => Topic started by: Psalm 119 on July 30, 2003, 10:00:37 AM



Title: Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Psalm 119 on July 30, 2003, 10:00:37 AM
Christians from all over the country are preparing to make a trip to Montgomery, Alabama (if need be ) to protect the Ten Commandments. Would you be willing to participate? Read more

http://www.montgomeryadvertiser.com/NEWS/StoryAlabamavigil29w.htm


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Symphony on July 30, 2003, 09:41:48 PM

Ohhh, that's good to hear, Psalm.  Thank you.  I was wondering how this was coming...


I support them(I won't be going)....


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: DareDevil on August 02, 2003, 07:46:36 PM
The people of God are described as those who keep the commandments of God and have the faith of Jesus, (Revelation 14:12).
 The vast majority of the Christian world is in disobedience to God's commandments...especially the 4th commandment...the 7th day Sabbath.
 They are following a day that Satan has set up to pull worship to himself.


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Psalm 119 on August 02, 2003, 07:51:59 PM
Daredevil,

Does this mean you will be going?

Psalm 119


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: DareDevil on August 05, 2003, 05:47:16 PM
Daredevil,

Does this mean you will be going?

Psalm 119
Oh, how I wish I could. But I just donated my vacation time to a person who needs back surgery.

The Mark of the beast scenerio (Rev. 13:15-18...and, Rev. 14:9-11) tells us that the 'people who keep the commandments of God' (verse 12 of Rev. 14) will be in opposition to...the Mark of the beast.
 So, yes I'm concerned about the state of affairs.


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Psalm 119 on August 06, 2003, 09:41:38 AM
Daredevil,

That was a kind act  you did, for giving up your vacation for someone else. May the Lord reward you for your kindness.

As of today 8/05/03, it looks like there will be a showdown in Montgomery, Alabama on or before the 20th. Hopefully thousands will take a stand.

Psalm 119


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Saved_4ever on August 07, 2003, 01:30:26 AM
One might think so but apparently the minority gots the vote.  It's sad but reversed "democracy" is what is currently in effect in America.


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: DareDevil on August 11, 2003, 05:49:38 PM
Daredevil,

That was a kind act  you did, for giving up your vacation for someone else. May the Lord reward you for your kindness.

As of today 8/05/03, it looks like there will be a showdown in Montgomery, Alabama on or before the 20th. Hopefully thousands will take a stand.

Psalm 119
But I must tell you that Bible prophecy tells us the the constitution of the USA will be taken down and abolished.....otherwise the Mark of the Beast cannot take place.


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Symphony on August 13, 2003, 05:59:32 PM

Daredevil:  But I must tell you that Bible prophecy tells us the the constitution of the USA will be taken down and abolished.....otherwise the Mark of the Beast cannot take place

Yes, that would sound pretty predictable.  I've heard or seen whispers about this in various articles.

Recently that increasingly our Federal courts are looking overseas to decide cases.  That means we are now taking our cues from other worldly magistrates.  I'm guessing this is a first, at least on the scale we are talking about.  (Tho', of course, our jurisprudence does come from England, largely...).

I think increasingly here people are generally socialistic; that would mean an readiness to abandon the Constitution.

I rec'd a mailing regarding Judge Moore just yesterday..;

Seems he has 'til August 20, to remove the monument from the Alabama judicial building.  

I heard JUdge Moore interviewed on the Sean Hannity radio program several nights ago.  We should pray for the Judge there and those helping him--and his family.  I think he is war-weary...


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: DareDevil on August 15, 2003, 03:36:27 PM
 I just read today that he plans on taking this matter to the supreme court.


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: John the Baptist on August 15, 2003, 10:10:55 PM
I just read today that he plans on taking this matter to the supreme court.
******
Hay! Just some questions, what is so important about the law of God if it is as some here say, that it is NO LONGER IN FORCE? Mankind is under GRACE ALONE, we constantly hear, or that Christ FINISHED the Law! Or that No one is perfect! we are ALL SINNERS! Only Believe!

And now? we see that we need a Supreme Court to put FORCE WITH TEETH in the Law of God! God needs Caesar's help to clean up the dirty denominations, or is it our USA government church denomination???  huh?

Regardless of 'Babylon's CONFUSSION' it is a DONE DEAL that Christ is not in her [or] her Daughter denominations!! Josh. 7:12 last part of the verse, along with Isa. 59:1-2. :'(  



Title: Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Ambassador4Christ on August 16, 2003, 08:05:59 AM
I just read today that he plans on taking this matter to the supreme court.
******
Hay! Just some questions, what is so important about the law of God if it is as some here say, that it is NO LONGER IN FORCE? Mankind is under GRACE ALONE, we constantly hear, or that Christ FINISHED the Law! Or that No one is perfect! we are ALL SINNERS! Only Believe!

And now? we see that we need a Supreme Court to put FORCE WITH TEETH in the Law of God! God needs Caesar's help to clean up the dirty denominations, or is it our USA government church denomination???  huh?

Regardless of 'Babylon's CONFUSSION' it is a DONE DEAL that Christ is not in her [or] her Daughter denominations!! Josh. 7:12 last part of the verse, along with Isa. 59:1-2. :'(  



John Boy the Baptist:

Please get out of bondage to religious systems today and get with the folks who will help you to "understand AND enjoy" your Bible.  ;D


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: DareDevil on August 16, 2003, 05:47:15 PM
I just read today that he plans on taking this matter to the supreme court.
******
Hay! Just some questions, what is so important about the law of God if it is as some here say, that it is NO LONGER IN FORCE? Mankind is under GRACE ALONE, we constantly hear, or that Christ FINISHED the Law! Or that No one is perfect! we are ALL SINNERS! Only Believe!

And now? we see that we need a Supreme Court to put FORCE WITH TEETH in the Law of God! God needs Caesar's help to clean up the dirty denominations, or is it our USA government church denomination???  huh?

Regardless of 'Babylon's CONFUSSION' it is a DONE DEAL that Christ is not in her [or] her Daughter denominations!! Josh. 7:12 last part of the verse, along with Isa. 59:1-2. :'(  


The supreme court will be the force behing the "Mark of the Beast".


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Symphony on August 16, 2003, 05:50:51 PM

(http://member.compuserve.com/fotosrch/3/20030816ALDM609.jpg)

About 4,000 people gathered outside the Capitol in Montgomery, Ala., on Saturday, Aug. 16, 2003 for a rally to support Chief Justice Roy Moore who has said he would defy a federal court order to remove the 5,200 pound Ten Commandments monument from public display in the State Judicial Building. (AP Photo/Dave Martin)

(http://member.compuserve.com/fotosrch/3/20030816ALDM604.jpg)

Seven-year-old Jessie Faircloth, right, of Tallassee, Ala., holds her Ten Commandments placard while she and others recite the Pledge of Allegiance during a rally at the Alabama Capitol in Montgomery on Saturday, Aug. 16, 2003. The rally was in support of Alabama Chief Justice Roy Moore who has said he would defy a federal court order to remove his 5,200 pound Ten Commandments monument from public display in the State Judicial Building. (AP Photo/Dave Martin)

(http://member.compuserve.com/fotosrch/3/20030815MY602.jpg)

Alabama Chief Justice Roy Moore admires an embroidered copy of the Ten Commandments given to him by orthodox Jewish Rabbi Yehuda Levin at the State Judicial Building in Montgomery, Ala., Friday, Aug. 15, 2003. Levin said Friday that Moore represents the best of America because of his refusal to remove a monument to the Ten Commandments from the rotunda of the judicial building. Moore says he will not obey a federal judge's order to remove the monument from the judicial building by next Wednesday. (AP Photo/Dave Martin)


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Knox on August 16, 2003, 08:25:20 PM
Personally, I think it would be cool if he actually went to jail! His political grandstanding has cost the taxpayers of Alabama millions of dollars over the years, and I suspect that the majority of Alabamians, Christians and non-Christians alike, are sick of his shenanigans.

4,000 people, that's not really much of a turnout. That would be a poor showing at one of our local college football games.


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Symphony on August 16, 2003, 08:41:01 PM

Yep; Jesus went to more than just jail too.  

You have to do away with anything even related to "God".

It's amazing we have to defend this--the expenses involved.

Why can't the opposition just let it go--they're the ones with the beef.  The U.S. Supreme Court has Ten Commandments in their building.  The only reason this is an issue is b/c of the ones bringing the suit.

What's wrong with the Ten Commandments.  Our country is based on them.  That's what we're founded on.


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Knox on August 16, 2003, 09:46:55 PM

Yep; Jesus went to more than just jail too.


Hmm. Try as I might, I don't see the 'Ol Judge as being similar to Jesus!



Quote
It's amazing we have to defend this--the expenses involved.

The Judge knew exactly what would happen when he snuck the monument in without permission after office hours. He knew that millions would be spent by the taxpayers and that ultimately the monument would be removed. How much more Christian it would be for him to focus his attention on widows and orphans in their need or something like that.  The procedure was filmed by a crew working for Dr. James Kennedy, who almost immediately started selling videos of it. So really I see the judge's stand on the monument is at bottom a money-making scheme. Not some grandiose defense of Christianity.


Quote
What's wrong with the Ten Commandments.  Our country is based on them.  That's what we're founded on.

Our country, The United States, is founded on the Constitution. I think one would be hard-pressed to find even any vague parallels between the Ten Commandments (whichever version you choose) and our nation's founding document.


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: John the Baptist on August 16, 2003, 09:59:47 PM

Yep; Jesus went to more than just jail too.  

You have to do away with anything even related to "God".

It's amazing we have to defend this--the expenses involved.

Why can't the opposition just let it go--they're the ones with the beef.  The U.S. Supreme Court has Ten Commandments in their building.  The only reason this is an issue is b/c of the ones bringing the suit.

What's wrong with the Ten Commandments.  Our country is based on them.  That's what we're founded on.
********
Ask these professed Christian ones that HAVE CONSTANTLY PREACHED THAT THEY ARE DONE AWAY WITH for answers to your questions?? No law, under Grace, Jewish, Legalism, FINISHED!! ???



Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Symphony on August 20, 2003, 11:14:48 PM

Well, it's the 11th hour--literally--midnight tonight is the deadline.  The Supreme Court has rejected Judge Moore's last minute appeal to that court('tho I understand they have a copy of the Ten Commandments in their courthouse!).

News report an hour ago said a 49 year-old man was being dragged away by police, from near the monument...

As if we don't all have better things to do. I appreciate these people doing this!!


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Saved_4ever on August 21, 2003, 02:27:15 AM
I guess you're on the east cost symph?  I'm curious as to what happened now that it's 2:25.



Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Saved_4ever on August 21, 2003, 02:40:57 AM
Quote
Our country, The United States, is founded on the Constitution. I think one would be hard-pressed to find even any vague parallels between the Ten Commandments (whichever version you choose) and our nation's founding document.

Umm I guess you haven't bothered to see what a lot of it is about but whatever.

What are you talking about, which ones?  There's one set of "Ten Commandments".


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Symphony on August 21, 2003, 07:29:07 AM

knox:  So really I see the judge's stand on the monument is at bottom a money-making scheme

Judge Moore is a Viet Nam vet., graduate of West Point, with a family, started this out by displaying a framed copy of the Ten Commandments in his circuit court room in 1995(if he displayed the statue of some Greek goddess in the courthouse would this even be an issue?...), which now has been dogging him all the way to his appointment as the highest justice in the state, Chief Justice--just because he wants a copy of the Ten Commandments in his courtroom--and he's doing it just to make money.  Hmmm.

He has a family.  He's a chief justice--that means he has to focus daily on the cases coming before him, as his regular job(otherwise he'd get fired) PLUS, fight this.

While the Southern Law Poverty Center, the ACLU and the Sep of Church and State Club, the three parties that are suing and are the only reason this is even an issue,  just watch as their fellows, who have served them honorably, dangle in the wind.

Throw the Christians to the lions.  Forget the Constitution.  Forget the Ten Commandments.  This is Nero here.  I'll poison my own mother if I want to.  I'll have incest with the other members of my own family if I want to.

That's what we do when we get our way.  And you aren't going to tell me not to.

And that's the way it is, or...  


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: John the Baptist on August 21, 2003, 07:56:47 AM

knox:  So really I see the judge's stand on the monument is at bottom a money-making scheme

Yeah right.  He's a Viet Nam vet., graduate of West Point, with a family, started this out by displaying a framed copy of the Ten Commandments in his circuit court room in 1995(I'll betcha if he displayed the statue of some Greek goddess you'd run salivating to support him), which now has been dogging him all the way up to his appointment as the highest justice in the state, Chief Justice--just because he wants a copy of the Ten Commandments in his courtroom--and yeah, he's doing it all just to make money.

Yeah, right.  

He has a family.  He's a chief justice--that means he has to focus daily on the cases coming before him, PLUS, fight this.

Yeah, he's doing it just to make money.

Yeah, right.  And he's suppose to roll over, yawn and say, "Whatever" when you walk in and take out his copy of the Ten Commandments.

Sounds fair to me!!

    ::)

*********
To much nothing/ness questioned here! What is the BOTTOM LINE reason of seperation of church and state is the question?
All so far we see is EMOTION, FEELING, and EXCITMENT! No reasoning together thus sayeth the Lord?

To post God's Ten Commands would NEED the Constitution being changed! So would prayer in school need a LAW violating the above!

Is this what you want?
This is the issue. Freedom to believe in Christ, or Laws to FORCE CHRIST UPON ALL PEOPLE? Changing the constitution is a VERY DANGEROUS starting point downward! Christ needs Caesar to do His work through His denominations?? Think about it. Sounds Catholic to me?? :'( :'(

Personally speaking: It is about time (long past time!) to CLEAN UP YOUR OWN (life) DENOMINATION FIRST. And then one needs not worry about Christs POWER to do the rest!

---John


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Psalm 119 on August 21, 2003, 08:34:16 AM
Here's a kindly rebuke for those who oppose "civil disobedience".

1) We are to obey God rather than man

2) Moses,The Hebrew midwives, Daniel, Esther, David, all the disciples, and Jesus Himself, all broke "mans laws"

3) The Declaration of Independence is in essence an "act of rebellion". Those who signed it, paid a dear price; they lost their homes, and fortunes ,for declaring their independence from England.

4) The law of God.. i.e. The Ten Commandments is the foundation for our civil law. (Blackstone Commentaries)

If we put a "monetary factor" on keeping our freedom; we are not worthy of being called an American citizen.

God Bless and keep Judge Roy Moore!

Judge Moore for President!

Psalm 119


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: John the Baptist on August 21, 2003, 10:27:12 AM
Here's a kindly rebuke for those who oppose "civil disobedience".

1) We are to obey God rather than man

2) Moses,The Hebrew midwives, Daniel, Esther, David, all the disciples, and Jesus Himself, all broke "mans laws"

3) The Declaration of Independence is in essence an "act of rebellion". Those who signed it, paid a dear price; they lost their homes, and fortunes ,for declaring their independence from England.

4) The law of God.. i.e. The Ten Commandments is the foundation for our civil law. (Blackstone Commentaries)

If we put a "monetary factor" on keeping our freedom; we are not worthy of being called an American citizen.

God Bless and keep Judge Roy Moore!

Judge Moore for President!

Psalm 119

********
Hi, this is a question. All over these forums there are the [FINISHED!] believers. You know, the GRACE COVERS the Ten now, and ALL 10 commandments are all past/tense!

How come some of you do not get after their evil NO LAW doctrine, but want Caesars constitution changed so as to FORCE non/Christians to be your guys type of ones? You say Law & they say NO LAW! Yet, these ones are your 'brothers'?
If them, why not all & any professed believers??

Again: Bottom line is, AGAIN, that these FALSE ONES NEED WEEDED OUT! It is not that we need Caesars Force to make the world Christians, but what we need is to HAVE CHRIST INSIDE of professed Christianity WORKING. READ Isa. 59:1-2 & Josh. 7:12's last part of the verse!  

Because we NEED CAESAR IS PROOF THAT CHRIST IS NOT 'IN' Protestentism!



Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Saved_4ever on August 21, 2003, 11:46:04 AM
JTB you really have NO understanding of what you speak.  You claim loss of salvation, works for justification and you are simply wrong.  You do not understand and your lack of command over the english language seems to be a good reason why maybe you don't.


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Symphony on August 21, 2003, 01:02:05 PM

ABC RAdio news just an hour ago:  Justice Moore's colleagues, the associates, eight of them, are breaking with him, ordering the monument be removed...

One protestor, an elderly minister from Iowa, being arrested and taken to jail

Just now, latest report, 1 p.m. Alabama time, 150 protestors there, singing, praying...


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Knox on August 21, 2003, 08:08:17 PM

ABC RAdio news just an hour ago:  Justice Moore's colleagues, the associates, eight of them, are breaking with him, ordering the monument be removed...

I don't think they are 'breaking' with him, I don't think they ever supported him on this. I read an interview with one of the other justices recently, and his prank has caused a lot of bad feeling with the other justices. He did move the monument in secretly, never consulting with the other members of the court. As I said in an earlier post, Roy Moore's antics have been expensive for Alabama and have disrupted the business of the court, and they are just tired of his antics.




Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Symphony on August 21, 2003, 09:26:40 PM

Knox:  Roy Moore's antics have been expensive for Alabama and have disrupted the business of the court, and they are just tired of his antics.



Are you a believer, Knox?


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: John the Baptist on August 21, 2003, 09:53:29 PM

Knox:  Roy Moore's antics have been expensive for Alabama and have disrupted the business of the court, and they are just tired of his antics.



Are you a believer, Knox?


******
Hay Knox, you can sure see how the mark of the beast will be enforced by professed Christians. Seems like her daughters will do her 'legal' work for her! And ALL of the world wondered after the beast. It is a good thing that we have some in Washington that are not brain d-e-a-d yet, huh?


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Knox on August 21, 2003, 10:28:18 PM

Knox:  Roy Moore's antics have been expensive for Alabama and have disrupted the business of the court, and they are just tired of his antics.



Are you a believer, Knox?


Why do you ask? Are you under the mistaken impression that only an unbeliever can think Roy Moore is a self-aggrandizing, political grandstanding opportunist? I will tell you that my understanding of Christianity is probably a lot different from yours. And his.


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: John the Baptist on August 22, 2003, 07:51:33 AM
JTB you really have NO understanding of what you speak.  You claim loss of salvation, works for justification and you are simply wrong.  You do not understand and your lack of command over the english language seems to be a good reason why maybe you don't.


****
"And the Lord opened the mouth of the (dumb) ass, and she said ----" You are a women right?

And What does, "... be a good reason why maybe you don't." (&) Why maybe??? And no question mark??? ..Mean??? More Babylonian CONFUSSION.

John the Baptist

Knox:
Just wondering knox, if the spiritual ('Christian?) I.Q. of these ones can even find the correct 'thread' to post on??? (saved-4ever) Surely, the 'hanging' of the Master's Commandments in any form, or, the removal of them can not change ones salvation, huh? Hanging as in 'spiritial' character assination will! See Heb. 6:6.


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Symphony on August 22, 2003, 08:32:39 AM

knox:  I will tell you that my understanding of Christianity is probably a lot different from yours. And his.



Why are you so cynical, knox.  "Understanding" is good, but this isn't about just "understanding".  

This is about "love", and love of the Savior, and love of His law...


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Psalm 119 on August 22, 2003, 08:32:39 AM
John the Baptist,

If I'm reading you correctly, you are making a valid comment about other believers not believing in the law, and or Ten Commandments. This topic has been heavily debated on this forum on numerous occasions.

I'm a firm believer In what Jesus said:" I did not come to abolish the law, but to fullfil" God's Ten Commandments are just as valid today as they were when given at Mt. Sinai. The only difference today, is that when one comes to Christ in repentance....God's laws are written on one's heart.

It is interesting that many church's in America have a disdain for God's law; this is called antinominism (sp?) Yet when the commandment's monument is being attacked they get all riled up. Yes, there is a real inconsistency. However, the line is being drawn in the sand today.....Jesus wants to know; are we for him or against him?

Psalm 119


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: John the Baptist on August 22, 2003, 08:57:08 AM
John the Baptist,

If I'm reading you correctly, you are making a valid comment about other believers not believing in the law, and or Ten Commandments. This topic has been heavily debated on this forum on numerous occasions.

I'm a firm believer In what Jesus said:" I did not come to abolish the law, but to fullfil" God's Ten Commandments are just as valid today as they were when given at Mt. Sinai. The only difference today, is that when one comes to Christ in repentance....God's laws are written on one's heart.

It is interesting that many church's in America have a disdain for God's law; this is called antinominism (sp?) Yet when the commandment's monument is being attacked they get all riled up. Yes, there is a real inconsistency. However, the line is being drawn in the sand today.....Jesus wants to know; are we for him or against him?

Psalm 119

******
Thanks! It is good to know that all here are not being coverted to 'follow' saved4_[never] & his Gen. 3:4 Babylonian lieing CONFUSSION of his saved4_ever garbage! SEE Eze. 13:22!!


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Knox on August 22, 2003, 01:58:14 PM


This is about "love", and love of the Savior, and love of His law...

Symphony, I've seen your posts on homosexuality. You have some nerve talking about "love".


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Symphony on August 22, 2003, 02:55:23 PM

  (http://www.beautifulclipart.com/clipart/angels/anangel.gif)


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Symphony on August 23, 2003, 06:21:39 AM

Sean Hannity's talk radio program mentioned Judge Moore's stand on the Ten Commandments as a "pivotal" moment.

I heard last night one other radio commentator's reflection that the American public may just be getting tired of "all this
Christian stuff..."

I was thinking the Judge Moore thing could be pivotal in a way we hadn't thought--that is, if he is imprisoned, that could be seen as an approving precedent--for the gay movement(the topic of this thread here--that is, the beginning of the persecution of the Christians by the gay movement), and for the public generally as well, to begin to actually "silence" Christian "dissent".

I'm not looking for JUdge Moore to be imprisoned, but so far, his eight associates have overruled him, and the state's attorney general either.  He's been suspended, as chief justice.

If effect, the Judge Moore thing could backfire into actually a significant, major precedent for "silencing" Christian dissent in America--generally, not by just the gay agenda.

This new twist is actually what I was pointing to under my "Part II, Krystallnacht 1938" thread, where the ghetto-ization of Christians becomes violent(current examples given or to be added there).  But more accurately, this would fall under a possible "Part III, Krystallnacht...", which I haven't begun yet but am waiting to, where there is actually legislation, as in Nazi Germany against the Jews, to imprison Christians.

I know where I live my own "evangelization" could soon be seen as a "nuisance"--tolerated for a while but ultimately, finally silenced, perhaps even just by people generally--people who go to church, work, vacation, etc,--people who want things to continue "as they are" and have enough to contend with.

It might just be easier to regard the imprisonment of a currently key "Christian figure", such as Roy Moore, as all the fire power you need to begin to "shut them up once and for good".


(posted also under Prophecy-Current Events...)


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Saved_4ever on August 23, 2003, 08:29:05 PM
JTB you really have NO understanding of what you speak.  You claim loss of salvation, works for justification and you are simply wrong.  You do not understand and your lack of command over the english language seems to be a good reason why maybe you don't.


****
"And the Lord opened the mouth of the (dumb) ass, and she said ----" You are a women right?

And What does, "... be a good reason why maybe you don't." (&) Why maybe??? And no question mark??? ..Mean??? More Babylonian CONFUSSION.

John the Baptist

Knox:
Just wondering knox, if the spiritual ('Christian?) I.Q. of these ones can even find the correct 'thread' to post on??? (saved-4ever) Surely, the 'hanging' of the Master's Commandments in any form, or, the removal of them can not change ones salvation, huh? Hanging as in 'spiritial' character assination will! See Heb. 6:6.

Well look here, why would I place a question mark where no question was asked?   This is a statement not a question.  You do not understand and your lack of command over the english language seems to be a good reason why maybe you don't.

No wonder you have such a hard time.   ::)


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Symphony on August 26, 2003, 09:35:28 PM

In the last two days I've heard Judge Moore interviewed on three radio programs, Politics and Religion, at endtime.com(today), James Dobson at Focus on the Family, and hhhmmmm, Ive forgotten the third one...


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: John the Baptist on August 26, 2003, 09:45:51 PM

In the last two days I've heard Judge Moore interviewed on three radio programs, Politics and Religion, at endtime.com(today), James Dobson at Focus on the Family, and hhhmmmm, Ive forgotten the third one...

*******
Hi,
what is his testimony, keeping the statue in confession of belief, or living the law as they teach??


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Symphony on August 27, 2003, 08:26:51 AM

He testifies to Jesus Christ.  He views the Ten Commandments as integral to that.


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Symphony on August 27, 2003, 04:04:26 PM

A recent article, Aug 26, about why Judge Moore should obey "the rule of law", by David Limbaugh(Rush Limbaugh's brother), and remove the monument:

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2003/8/26/93856.shtml

And copy of a reply e-mail I sent to him today:

Part II to the Ten Commandments, by David Limbaugh

Dear Mr. Limbaugh:

Thank you for your second article concerning Chf. Justice Roy Moore.  Rush Limbaugh referred us to your article today.

If we classify Chf. Justice's Ten Commandments as just religion, then the point to your article, and Rush's point, is probably accurate--i.e., Judge Moore should obey the rule of law(man's law here, that is).

If the Ten Commandments are not religion, though--that is, they really were written with the "finger of God", as recorded there in Exodus...

So isn't the whole issue just simply whether the Ten Commandments really were given by the hand of God?  Isn't that what we're really talking about here?

Thank you.


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Psalm 119 on August 28, 2003, 07:11:00 PM
Having just returned from Alabama, I must say that there is so much disinformation regarding Judge Moore and the Ten Commandments. Let me try to clarify some things for some folks.

First, Judge Moore is a Bible believing born again Christian. He is a member of a Baptist Church.

Judge Moore never wanted the lime light. The ACLU and the Southern Poverty Leauge (strong anti-Christian organizations) came to him with a fight. It all began in 1995 with a simple wooden plaque(of the Ten Commandments) hanging on the wall of his courtroom when he was then  judge in Etowah (sp?) County in Alabama. He was later elected by the people of Alabama as a Chief Justice.

This issue is a states rights issue. Can a state acknowledge God? Can a federal judge have jursidiction over what a state chooses to display in their court houses?

This attack on the Ten Commandments is a small piece of the puzzle. What's at stake here is the public acknowledgment of God. For the past 40 years this is what has occurred....prayer taken out of schools (1963), the "legaliztion" of murder (abortion), now it's the display of any Christian symbols.

The question that needs to be posed is this "when is enough, enough". Will we sell out our birthright as Esau? Did our forefathers all die in vain? Is our nation and heritage worth protecting? Or will we one day resemble Russia and China?

The choice is ours, and the hour is late.

As for me and my house, "We will serve the Lord"

Psalm 119


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Knox on August 28, 2003, 07:49:48 PM
Oh give it up. This was never about the Ten Commandments, it's been about Roy Moore all along. I mean what a great gimmick. He now has the name recognition to be elected governor of Alabama. That's what this was all about. Roy Moore is no defender of Christianity, he's just another cynical, venal, corrupt politician.


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Symphony on August 28, 2003, 10:58:53 PM

Oh give it up. This was never about the Ten Commandments, it's been about Roy Moore all along. I mean what a great gimmick. He now has the name recognition to be elected governor of Alabama. That's what this was all about. Roy Moore is no defender of Christianity, he's just another cynical, venal, corrupt politician.


That might be unfair, Knox.

Judge Moore began this in 1992, as a circuit court judge in Alabama, with a wood engraving that he had done, of the TenCs, in 1980, he said, which he wanted to hang in his courtroom then.  Apparently, at least since then, or maybe later in 1995, the ACLU, and now other groups, have been suing him all the way up the chain of courts.  As Chf. Justice, he is an elected officer--that means the people of alabama want him there.

Moore is a Viet Nam decorated veteran, graduate of West Point Military Acadamy.   He only wanted the freedom to hang a copy of the Ten Commandments in his courtroom, for which apparently he's been challenged only by limited special interest groups at every turn, all the way up the chain.

And his only ability to fight has been b/c of contributions of believers all along the way, as I understand it.

What do you find so wrong with all of that?  What is so "Wrong" with the Ten Commmandments--thou shalt not steal, false witness....

What's so wrong with it?  You make Chf. Justice Moore out to be a common criminal, corrupt, "grand-standing" for his own advancement.

He's a family, he's elected by the people, he's advanced in his "craft".  No wrong-doing has been shown on his part, except to place the Ten Commandments where he does his business.  And he was elected there.


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Knox on August 28, 2003, 11:15:15 PM
No one is saying the Ten Commandments are 'wrong'.

By all accounts the other eight Justices, the ones who ordered the building staff to move the 'monument', are all fine upstanding Christian men. Why did they disagree with Roy Moore on this? Because they feel something is wrong with the Ten Commandments? I doubt it.

The legal community in Alabama must have been just horrified when a hayseed throwback like Roy Moore was elected Chief Justice!


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: sincereheart on August 28, 2003, 11:35:06 PM
I'm lurking and I'm trying to behave, really I am...  ;)
Oh give it up. This was never about the Ten Commandments, it's been about Roy Moore all along. I mean what a great gimmick. He now has the name recognition to be elected governor of Alabama. That's what this was all about. Roy Moore is no defender of Christianity, he's just another cynical, venal, corrupt politician.

I agree that this was never about the Ten Commandments. I agree that it's probably a gimmick. But I believe you're aiming in the wrong direction.

Quote
"Vote for Larry Darby"

Larry Darby for Attorney General Committee

P. O. Box 3905, Montgomery, AL 36109-0905

334-269-1885

Ah... but who IS Larry Darby?
http://www.angelfire.com/al4/larrydarby/darbyplatform.htm (http://www.angelfire.com/al4/larrydarby/darbyplatform.htm)
Quote
FOR IMMEDIATE DISTRIBUTION
MONTGOMERY, ALABAMA – March 12, 2003

Larry Darby, Alabama State Director for American Atheists, today decried the erosion of religious liberty in Alabama, citing both the recent Christian proselytization by Gov. Riley and the Alabama House’s passage of an amendment that would allow the posting of the Theistic Ten Commandments in government school classrooms.
Quote
Riley recently admonished government leaders: “Our job is to remember we are servants of the people and the Lord, Jesus Christ. Riley, who has called for “prayer soldiers,” also claimed that the U.S. was founded on a rock, “and that rock was our lord and savior Jesus Christ.” Riley revealed his Theistic mission: “If we are going to save this country, if we are going to re-establish that belief in God, it’s up to us. If we don’t do it, who will?”

Darby said, “These statements were from the same governor who instituted ostensibly voluntary Bible study classes at the taxpayer-owned Capitol and indicated he didn’t want to politicize his Bible studies; Riley has not only politicized his Theistic views, he has proselytized for Jesus whenever and wherever he could.”
http://www.angelfire.com/al4/larrydarby/ (http://www.angelfire.com/al4/larrydarby/)
http://www.atheists.org/al/rep02122003.html (http://www.atheists.org/al/rep02122003.html)
http://atheists.home.att.net/news/021004.htm (http://atheists.home.att.net/news/021004.htm)


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Knox on August 28, 2003, 11:46:58 PM
Sorry I don't get your point here. Some guy named Larry Darby wants to make a run for Attorney General. As an atheist, what do you think his chances are? lol.


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: sincereheart on August 30, 2003, 06:14:36 AM
Sorry I don't get your point here. Some guy named Larry Darby wants to make a run for Attorney General. As an atheist, what do you think his chances are? lol.

As a Christian, I hope his chances are slim to none.... No, check that; I hope his chances are none to none.  :P

'Some guy' is quoted in so many of the articles about Judge Moore that it caught my attention. The same said 'some guy' fails to mention on his 'vote for me' site that he is an atheist.
Quote
Many Darby family members had given names of George Washington, Benjamin Franklin, and Thomas Jefferson, clearly indicating their dedication to American values forged in history and our U.S. Constitution. Larry Darby holds to the same American values of great individual freedom with personal responsibility and limited government as did the early Patriots.
 :-X
But he is making quite a name for himself in the world of atheism and humanism.  ::)


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Knox on August 30, 2003, 05:18:07 PM
Sorry I don't get your point here. Some guy named Larry Darby wants to make a run for Attorney General. As an atheist, what do you think his chances are? lol.

As a Christian, I hope his chances are slim to none.... No, check that; I hope his chances are none to none.  :P


Actually, if he is the best qualified, I hope he wins. Doesn't seem too likely though. I really don't think a person's religious beliefs or lack thereof should carry all that much weight. A good man or woman of any persuasion will do the job to the best of their ability.


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Symphony on December 07, 2003, 03:44:19 PM

Hmm, well that is now more than three months ago.  

Just this last week(also alluded to under "Spin Doctors",under Prophecy forum, here):

Fed appeals for the "Wrath of God":

The 7a.m CBS radio news Friday morning mentioned, and I quote, that the Feds, are appealing to "the wrath of God" in apprehension of whoever  murdered an assistant Federal D.A. in the Pennsylvania fields Wednesday night.  The D.A. was apparently working on a plea bargain with defense attorneys of a pair of rapper thugs in jail on drug traffiking and other related charges.

The 8am report made no mention of the "wrath of God" quote.


So, it's okay for the Fed's to call down "the wrath of God" (which the media then subsequently edits out), when they need it, but when a state supreme court chief justice appeals to that same God's Ten Commandments (written "with the finger of God" Exodus 31:18, says), OH MY, HE'S JUST A RELIGOUS FANATIC.  OH MY, WE CAN'T HAVE THAT.  OH MY, WE CAN'T HAVE THE TEN COMMANDMENTS IN A PUBLIC BUILDING. OH MY, WE JUST CAN;T HAVE THAT.  OH THAT'S JUST TERRIBLE.  OH, WE CAN'T HAVE THAT.  SHAME ON THAT FUNDAMENTALIST PREAHCER SUPREME COURT JUSTICE.  SHAME ON HIM.  WHO DOES HE THINK HE IS??

But, strangely, it's okay for the same Fed themselves to "appeal" to "this wrath of God" when they need to.

No wonder the media edited it out, Friday morning, after the 7 o'clock new hour...

They all have to eat so much crow.

And then, when THEY get on THEIR death bed, they too will be screaming for God' mercy.

Oh, but not now.  We mustn't mention it now.  We mustn't say it now.  We mustn't permit it now.

Hehe.  We are absolutely two faced, insane people.  

We want it both ways.

We want the "wrath of God" when WE want it, but when we don't want it, we'll sue to get it erased.

We make ourselves God.






   


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Symphony on February 10, 2004, 06:13:40 PM
Hmm.  Well, that last post was two months ago.  

I missed this when it came out three weeks ago, Jan 20, on Martin Luther King day:
 

 City Hall Ten Commandments monument surfaces in North Carolina
Tuesday, January 20, 2004 Posted: 8:55 AM EST (1355 GMT)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

WINSTON-SALEM, North Carolina (AP) -- A granite monument to the Ten Commandments, placed in front of City Hall by a city council member, doesn't help unite people, the mayor said.

"Obviously, if you are going to do something like this, this is not the right way to do it," Mayor Allen Joines said Monday, hours after the monument was installed. "We are working hard to bring the city together. Actions like this tend to push people apart."

City Council member Vernon Robinson, who said he was inspired by Alabama's ousted chief justice, placed the 4-foot-tall granite block in front of City Hall on Monday while it was closed for the Martin Luther King Jr. holiday. He said he paid the $2,000 cost of buying and moving the monument himself.

The monument is inscribed on one side with the Ten Commandments and on the other with the Bill of Rights.

"He doesn't have the right to put it there," City Attorney Ron Seeber said. The..."
 
 http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/South/01/20/ten.commandments.ap/index.html


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Psalm 119 on February 12, 2004, 09:46:13 AM
Make no mistake about it.....this is all about the public acknowledgment of God. The "Ten Commandments" was just the catalyst that has exposed the evil thoughts of man.

For further proof please read this article. It's becoming more crystal clear everyday.

http://covenantnews.com/baldwin031115.htm

Knox,

Would you rather align yourselves with atheists, or with men of God?

Psalm 119


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Symphony on February 12, 2004, 06:25:58 PM

Thanks, Psalm.  I'll take a look at that link...


Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Symphony on February 14, 2004, 10:01:11 AM

Yep.

Now let me see I have this correct.


It's not okay for Judge Moore to disobey the higher court.


But it's okay for the City of San Francisco to disobey their higher law, in California (issuing marriage licenses to gay couples, "...I pronounce you spouse and spouse...").


So see, the homosexuals care nothing about any law.  They just want what they want, regardless.





Title: Re:Civil Disobedience and the Ten Commandments
Post by: Symphony on February 17, 2004, 02:56:49 PM

Just heard Rush Limbaugh referring to this as "eerie"(tho he didn't refer to Judge Moore).